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Kojima explains why he wants to make something that’s not easy to digest

RevengeTaken

RevengeTaken

Banned
Aug 12, 2018
1,711
Hideo-Kojima-BAFTA-2019-Interview.jpg

During his Death Stranding world tour, Kojima was interviewed at a BAFTA panel in London together with filmmaker Nicolas Winding Refn, who appears in the game as Heartman.

Kojima was asked about the complexity of his multilayered stories. He explained why he makes his games this way.

"I think simplicity is good, but it gets consumed very quickly. It's like food: anything that's really digestible, it just goes out. […] And it doesn't remain in the body. But something that's awkward, that is not really digestible, it remains in your body. And you don't know what it is. And human has this intellectual feeling that kind of lingers: what is this? Like for instance a movie, if that lingers in you, you watch it again over and over, or you talk with your friends about them, what was that about? Or maybe take time to rewatch again, or rethink of it again. And you kind of start to understand the real meaning. And it begins to be a real body, your blood and meat. And it remains in your body fluid, and not just comes out. And I want to create that kind of thing."

"I grew up watching movies or things like that, so I just do that in games. Everyone says it's complicated, but I think everyone should just keep it and maybe nourish it for five or ten years, and maybe they will start to understand. And I really want to create those kind of things."
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RedSparrows

RedSparrows

Prophet of Regret
Member
Feb 22, 2019
6,491
Simplicity does not necessarily mean superficiality (minimalism).
Complexity does not necessarily mean profundity (Lost).

It's good that we can have this kind of thing to talk about, imo: Kojima is evidently coming at this from a partiocular angle, and I don't think it's the only one possible.
 
Alak96

Alak96

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
306
I agree with him, but something that is not easy to digest is not automatically good.
 
Zvonimir Boban

Zvonimir Boban

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,523
There's a middle ground between easily consumed mass market fare and a tedious, pretentious mess that is so convoluted and unsure of itself that it requires 40 min exposition dumps masquerading as storytelling.

Maybe one day he'll get back there.
 
Van Bur3n

Van Bur3n

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
26,089
I more so applaud the creator that can say so much with so little, but that's just me, Kojima.
 
Truant

Truant

Member
Oct 28, 2017
6,759
I think the problem arises when people expect that every game should be this perfect middle ground between new and old, or different and familiar.

Some games should go all the way and at least try to shake things up. Sometimes they succeed, sometimes they don't.
 

srtrestre

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,970
So Death Stranding is essentially the gaming equivalent of constipation.
 
Firmus_Anguis

Firmus_Anguis

Member
Oct 30, 2017
6,116
I hope what Death Stranding will eventually lead to is more people taking risks. Following through on a vision they believe in, instead of following industry norms. It might lead to something terrible or something really great and unique. Something new. I've said it a couple of times, but it takes guts to do what Kojima's done and completely and unabashedly stray from the path.
 
monmagman

monmagman

Member
Dec 6, 2018
4,126
England,UK
Good for him.....I've not played one of his games but will be playing Death Stranding day one,it looks a lot different to me than most AAA games.....I look forward to digesting it over the coming weeks.
 
Jashobeam

Jashobeam

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,523
However, If you eat something that tastes bad, you spit it out immediately though, you don't eat the whole thing and then think about why you ate it all.
 
Lukemia SL

Lukemia SL

Member
Jan 30, 2018
9,384
Is he allowed to make this statement about food, does he have the right to?
This dude made me hungry.
 

Deleted member 32018

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 8, 2017
7,628
Firmus_Anguis said:
I hope what Death Stranding will eventually lead to is more people taking risks. Following through on a vision they believe in, instead of following industry norms. It might lead to something terrible or something really great and unique. Something new. I've said it a couple of times, but it takes guts to do what Kojima's done and completely and unabashedly stray from the path.
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You mean what indie devs have done forever?
 
Lyrick

Lyrick

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,818
But all Kojima games are easy to digest. For fucks sake he beats the obvious hooks into you throughout the entire game then reiterates them for even the most dense of individuals during extremely long cut scenes following every act.

Apparently in this current game he even names the fucking characters after their actual in game roles just in case players are too still challenged by Porter Bridges duties of delivering crap and creating connections.

The only thing hard to digest issue is why the fuck one would make an interactive media whose least enjoyable parts are the interactive bits?
 
julia crawford

julia crawford

Took the red AND the blue pills
Member
Oct 27, 2017
35,271
Quick reminder that art games with similar feelings about the experiences of play have been a mainstay of independent development since the 80's.
 
pswii60

pswii60

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,673
The Milky Way
I love that he tried to do something so different with DS, and I'm excited about whatever he will do next. Nobody can criticise Kojima for not trying, and if not a complete success, I'd rather play a flawed masterpiece, or even admirable failure, than another predictable middle of the road and by the numbers game from many other developers. At least it's interesting.
 
NotLiquid

NotLiquid

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
34,766
Lyrick said:
But all Kojima games are easy to digest. For fucks sake he beats the obvious hooks into you throughout the entire game then reiterates them for even the most dense of individuals during extremely long cut scenes following every act.

Apparently in this current game he even names the fucking characters after their actual in game roles just in case players are too still challenged by Porter Bridges duties of delivering crap and creating connections.

The only thing hard to digest issue is why the fuck one would make an interactive media whose least enjoyable parts are the interactive bits?
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Yeah, I mean, it's not like Kojima is Swery, or pre-NMH Suda51 or anything. His biggest driving inspiration is Hollywood productions which are some of the easiest thing for viewers to understand, and if Kojima's games were hard to swallow then he wouldn't have been the global sensation he is today. The only thing that's really hard to "digest" is his bloated writing. In Death Stranding, that seems to have extended to game play tedium, which is probably the one thing I could never really fault his games for that much up until recently.
 
malcolmx

malcolmx

Banned
May 20, 2018
243
That's a really deep fake response. I think people get caught up in the mythos of Kojima but forget he's the same guy who objectified the bloody hell out of women and then had an awful reasoning for it(if I recall correctly).

I mean that's not a reason for having missions that are repetitive. Fallout did it, guess that was a deep game too.
 
Palette Swap

Palette Swap

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
11,210
Complexity and depth aren't the same thing. I love the MGS series, but except for MGS2, every other game isn't so much multi-layered as it generally overwritten and very verbose. I don't mind it at all obviously, it's part of the charm, but I've never mistaken this for depth.
 
DoubleTake

DoubleTake

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,529
Zvonimir Boban said:
There's a middle ground between easily consumed mass market fare and a tedious, pretentious mess that is so convoluted and unsure of itself that it requires 40 min exposition dumps masquerading as storytelling.

Maybe one day he'll get back there.
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Can we just copy paste this everywhere from now on?

I find it it so hilarious that he says to let his game sit for 10 years before people will TRULY find it decipherable as if that's something that needs to be said and wont happen on it own assuming its warranted. Lol
 
Bony Manifesto

Bony Manifesto

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,587
I feel the developers of Final Fantasy XIV missed a trick by not pitching the opening 40-odd hours of interminable fetch quests as nourishment for the soul. Instead, they're planning on patching the game to get new players to the good bits faster. What hacks...
 

Deleted member 32018

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 8, 2017
7,628
Firmus_Anguis said:
For fucks sake, I was obviously referring to tripple-A development. I guess I have to spell it out
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Shouldn't the talk about risks be about Sony then? They funded the game and gave Kojima their engine. Kojima just acted like any other indie dev out there, he's just lucky that his name has the pull it does and he knows it.
 
Servbot24

Servbot24

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
43,115
steviejd1 said:
Shouldn't the talk about risks be about Sony then? They funded the game and gave Kojima their engine. Kojima just acted like any other indie dev out there, he's just lucky that his name has the pull it does and he knows it.
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I don't know if lucky is exactly the right word since he has been working for 30 years to earn that reputation. There is some luck involved, but that applies to every well known person.
 
DoubleTake

DoubleTake

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,529
I love how EVERY kojima fanboy never comments on the ridiculousness of his statements when they're related to his storytelling ability. This comment is clearly talking about the storytelling aspect of his games because he relates it to movies, not his "revolutionary" gameplay ideas.
 
Jonathan Lanza

Jonathan Lanza

"I've made a Gigantic mistake"
Member
Feb 8, 2019
6,809
"I grew up watching movies or things like that, so I just do that in games. Everyone says it's complicated, but I think everyone should just keep it and maybe nourish it for five or ten years, and maybe they will start to understand. And I really want to create those kind of things.
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This fucking dood
 
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