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Lawyer Michael Avenatti: 2020 Democratic nominee "better be a white male."

Anthony Mooch

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,791
You gotta look at the long game. If trump wins in 2020 hes nominating 3 50 year old republican supreme court judges and then you can cry about every issue you want and it wont matter because that court is that way for 40 years at least. But the moral victory is all that matters right now the 40 year of damage
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,954
Racoon City
I get what he's saying, because studies do show a certain segment of America is more receptive to campaign promises made by white men.

But with that stated, yea hard pass on keeping the position of Preisdent of the United States (ironically this argument yet again proves meritocracy ain't a thing in addition to the fact Trump is your President), white male because said segment is scared. We really REALLY gotta stop coddling this segment of America who continually fucks themselves over because of their irrational fears.

While on the subject I'm REALLY tired of media, and democrats alike pushing this patently false narrative that these conservative voters have been "forgotten" by our two political parties. Shit is the biggest lie going in this damn country and it's all bullshit.
 

Midnight Jon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,837
Ohio
"You gotta look at the long game, where Trump's absolutely gonna win and there's absolutely no way he loses under any circumstances and there's absolutely no way I'm saying this to get people riled up"
 
OP
OP
Autodidact

Autodidact

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,683
You gotta look at the long game. If trump wins in 2020 hes nominating 3 50 year old republican supreme court judges and then you can cry about every issue you want and it wont matter because that court is that way for 40 years at least. But the moral victory is all that matters right now the 40 year of damage
You could perhaps wait to see the results in MI, PA, and WI this year before making such an assertion.

But you're not really arguing.
 

Air

User-Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,262
Lol identity politics.
Blah blah

haha yeah let's just piss away every nonwhite part of our governing coalition so we can appeal to all the dipshits who saw the racist sexist sexual assaulting six-time-bankrupt syphilitic shitgibbon and decided they wanted to vote for him

alternately, like seemingly every candidate who's won a special election or is leading in next next week's general, let's not do that
There's a difference between state and local elections and the presidency. I already said if a better candidate comes and they can get people moving in on board. But right now, with how the country is polarized, that's the only way out I can see relibly. That could change with the midterms or sometime in the future, but we know that those who voted for Trump did so because of racism and sexism. All I'm saying is we have to be aware of that and turn it into a competitive advantage to get Trump out. If Kamala Harris runs and inspired record turnout, sure let's do it, but do you really believe a strong black women is going to appeal to more demographics in this country than a cool liberal white dude?
 

Mesoian

Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,951
I get why he would say that.

He's an idiot for saying it.

But I get why he would say that.
 

Mona

Member
Oct 30, 2017
16,137
what resetera wants as president is pretty fucking irrelevant to. Since this place is far from the majority of what most voters want or will vote for.
i think alot of time people forget that elections are decided largely by independent voters, 30% of the people who voted in 2016 were independents
 

Ramjag

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,142
You gotta look at the long game. If trump wins in 2020 hes nominating 3 50 year old republican supreme court judges and then you can cry about every issue you want and it wont matter because that court is that way for 40 years at least. But the moral victory is all that matters right now the 40 year of damage
You’re saying a white man has to run or a white hispanic. Others are open to it being the best candidate and I’ve seen no one claim that it HAS to be a woman or person of color. That’s ignorant as hell. Give it a rest.
 

Thorrgal

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,017
I think we need to watch the 2018 results first.

The guys from "Pod Save America" said as much"

PS: Tbf Jon did. Tommy said no to Avenatti

Edit: Speaking about what type of candidate we need to win. Go high or go low..

Edit 2: Regarding the OP I think Michelle would win so no
 

Midnight Jon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,837
Ohio
Yep.

Andrew Gillum about to win Florida governors race and has been running ahead of a venamint racist in a state that turn out for Trump so hard in 2016 and people here are saying just ignore that pretty much.
and to be clear, this is the same Gillum who was already running approximately 3% ahead of the Extremely White and Milquetoast Gwen Graham before winning that primary

Hahahaha

No.

Jesus, Gabbard is bullshit
Well, they're not wrong about Gabbard being an easy win, just not for the Democrats
 

pigeon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,181
but we know that those who voted for Trump did so because of racism and sexism. All I'm saying is we have to be aware of that and turn it into a competitive advantage to get Trump out.
Because what's important is not reducing racism and sexism. What's important is winning, even if we reinforce racism and sexism in order to do it.

Martin Luther King Jr. warned me about guys like you.
 

Anthony Mooch

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,791
Yep.

Andrew Gillum about to win Florida governors race and has been running ahead of a venamint racist in a state that turn out for Trump so hard in 2016 and people here are saying just ignore that pretty much.
parkland has a lot to do with that. With the terrible way that guy treated the parkland kids after the shooting.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,048
All I know is that there needs to be a large field of candidates in the democratic Primary leading up to the General. None of this fielding 2 candidates with one in mind nonsense. Let the base figure out who is best and most relateable. It will become apparent.
 

Kyra

The Eggplant Queen
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,289
New York City
You're right, but that's why we have heuristics. If a white male argues that an intersectional coalition needs to promote and support white males to succeed, I'm going to put him down as "probably racist and sexist" because it's just quicker. If he changes my mind later, good for him.
What if he was a statistician stating that the odds of a white male becoming president was greater than a person of another gender or race becoming president. what would people think then? It would be a much less famous tweet that's for sure.

If a question someone has is "why would we give a shit what a statistician thinks or says" i would ask how much that person cares about winning an election.
 

pigeon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,181
People who say that Avenatti is the best chance for Dems to win by leveraging racism and sexism should consider that if the Democrats follow up Trump by nominating a self-described racist and sexist people like me will literally vote for Ralph Nader.

A Democratic Party that embraces racism is a party that isn't getting my vote.

So how many racists do you think you're going to pick up, compared to the people of color and women you're going to lose?
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,193
Ehhhh I dont think his intent matches how it is framed here. Hes got a point, statistically speaking, as fucked as it is.
He really doesn't. The United States has huge problems with racism and sexism, yes. But that does not necessitate, or in any way mean we should nominate a white man to run against Trump for specifically those reasons. That's neither necessary or what we absolutely should do, and in no way an appropriate response to those issues, or a necessary one in any way whatsoever. That's what he's 100% absolutely wrong about and immediately makes me raise an eyebrow that he thinks in that type of fashion.

That's just not how you deal those problems. And I especially ain't going to take it from he himself, a *shock* white man who's *shock* planning to run in 2020 as a Democratic candidate right now. Kind of have a huge conflict of interests there, don'tcha think? It specifically benefits him to think that way, and so of course it's a conclusion that he would arrive at. Why would he even ever say anything else?

It's still sexist logic at it's core. "No ladies, don't run, or at least don't win, because I don't win. I'm not saying that because I want that to be the case, but because it's for your own good, don't you see? You need me, a white man, to fight on your behalf. You could never do it by yourselves. So you'd better know your place and let be win, or else we lose." ie, so-called "benevolent sexism." And benevolent sexism, sexism argued for "women's benefit," for "their own good, even if they don't realize it" is still sexism all the same and something that's going to make me raise a huge eyebrow, as it does here.

He's right in so far that the United States does nonetheless have huge issues with racism and sexism but he's completely off-base with the conclusion he arrives it, and I'm going to be mighty skeptical of anyone touting that kind of logic or justification, and for damn good reason. Because it's nonsense, and that's all there is to it.
 

Nicktals

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,370
Makes sense to me.

There are other qualities and characteristics that matter more, but if you had 3 candidates that had similar characteristics and qualities (Well spoken, qualified, charismatic, etc...) and one was a white man, one was a women, and one was a PoC, the white dude stands the best chance to win a federal election.

What he said to me sounds like recognition of white male privilege.

However, if those qualities aren't equal, then none of the rest should factor.
 
OP
OP
Autodidact

Autodidact

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,683
the entire way the republican party of florida responded to the parkland shooting. Parkland reaction is a key favor of why the dems will do well in flordia.
So when Republicans win, it's the natural order of things. They know how to appeal to ~~~real Americans~~~. They never need last-minute assists from FBI directors or collaborations with hostile foreign powers.

When Democrats win, they had to have help from some external event or source. It can't be that they ran good, inspiring, issue-focused campaigns.
 

pigeon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,181
What if he was a statistician stating that the odds of a white male becoming president was greater than a person of another gender or race becoming president. what would people think then? It would be a much less famous tweet that's for sure.
A statistician would never make that claim because it would be comically ridiculous. There have only been 45 presidents and for most of them the president legally had to be a white male!

In the general case, sure, if he was disinterested, that would change things. But he's not disinterested. They're literally interviewing him about his presidential candidacy and he's offering a rationale. There is no reason to pretend that he is disinterested and read his comment in the most positive possible light.
 

Ferrio

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,634
Thought experiment. Let's say a white male comes out infront of all the other candidates and becomes the Dem canidate. A PoC/woman splits off as an independant, but has a much less chance of winning. Who do you vote for? Are we going to bernie or bust ourselves again?
 

pigeon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,181
Thought experiment. Let's say a white male comes out infront of all the other candidates and becomes the Dem canidate. A PoC/woman splits off as an independant, but has a much less chance of winning. Who do you vote for? Are we going to bernie or bust ourselves again?
Is the white male one of the good ones, or is he no angel

Also, there is still no evidence that Busters mattered relative to baseline!
 

Psychoward

Member
Nov 7, 2017
19,939
Thought experiment. Let's say a white male comes out infront of all the other candidates and becomes the Dem canidate. A PoC/woman splits off as an independant, but has a much less chance of winning. Who do you vote for? Are we going to bernie or bust ourselves again?
Complete nonsense strawman.
 

Ramjag

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,142
So when Republicans win, it's the natural order of things. They know how to appeal to ~~~real Americans~~~. They never need last-minute assists from FBI directors or collaborations with hostile foreign powers.

When Democrats win, they had to have help from some external event or source. It can't be that they ran good, inspiring, issue-focused campaigns.
That what’s it sounding like. The rest of us don’t deal with “real Americans”. Hell, I can’t remember the last time I saw a person from my lonely tower.
 

Rendering...

Member
Oct 30, 2017
9,229
In this racist as fuck country he might not be wrong that white male voices carry more weight. At least among the majority of currently active voters. Republicans still haven’t untwisted their panties about Obama’s term.

I wouldn’t vote for Avenatti though. He comes off as a little too slick.
 

Morrigan

Armoring
Moderator
Oct 24, 2017
12,580
Please refrain from slinging accusations towards other members. You can disagree with one another without resorting to that.