Le bizzarre avventure di GioGio: Vento Aureo Anime (JoJo P5) |OT| Sono cazzate, ma ci credo!

[Capra]

Gold Experience is literally just Araki making shit up every chapter with no consistent limit on its ability. You just accept that Giorno's gonna bullshit his way through whatever obstacle the plot throws at him so you turn your brain off to it.

By comparison I think King Crimson feels more confusing to people because it actually seems to have concrete rules that it's following, so they're actively trying to make sense of its mechanics. Also time manipulation is something people can more easily grasp and seek consistency in than "giving life to shit."

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

Gold Experience is literally just Araki making shit up every chapter with no consistent limit on its ability. You just accept that Giorno's gonna bullshit his way through whatever obstacle the plot throws at him so you turn your brain off to it.

By comparison I think King Crimson feels more confusing to people because it actually seems to have concrete rules that it's following, so they're actively trying to make sense of its mechanics. Also time manipulation is something people can more easily grasp and seek consistency in than "giving life to shit."

Click to shrink...

That's GE main issue, the lack of limits

 

[Deleted member 18857]

The thing that bothers me the most about the second turtle is that Giorno said he used some cells from the original turtle.
Why would that help? He never needed frog or snake or piranha cells to create the others. Is "GE+original cell" a special RPG recipe to create the stand of an animal? If so, when did you learn about that, Giorno? Did you read about that in a book in the library? Can you recreate The Fool and Stray Cats as well? Can it work on humans?

Honestly, I would have preferred "I gave life to the broach to make it a special species of turtle like Coco Jumbo. Now Coco Jumbo is a species, and all of them have this stand because I said so".

 

[fertygo]

Araki could just simply made Giorno hiding the stand turtle behind the Brooch (hell this is my assumption from the mangs) instead made the actual fucking clone. Jebus that shit is some galaxy brain stuff.

 

[Komii]

About logical consistency, dude runs on rule of cool lol

Click to shrink...

As much as i like building logic around Araki's fuckery, this is right

If i need something with no plot holes i read Hunter x Hunter

Araki could just simply made Giorno hiding the stand turtle behind the Brooch (hell this is my assumption from the mangs) instead made the actual fucking clone. Jebus that shit is some galaxy brain stuff.

Click to shrink...

GE cant turn living beings into objects, thats babyface's power
Deactivating GE is different than giving it the opposit power lol

 

[Lumination]

So is Bucciarati just a soulless husk that GE reanimated? Is Araki really about to tackle the meaning of a human soul?

King Crimson seems really straight forward to understand. The only thing that doesn't conform to the explanation is the original reveal where Bucciarati was able to see himself in the future. It also seems less powerful compared to The World because it's essentially the same thing but you're moving in "erased time" instead of frozen in stopped time. Dio wouldn't have been caught by surprise by Bucciarati's hidden intentions.

 

[VariantX]

First time I can sort of process what King Crimson does...ever.

Cant say if it erases time, but you seem to be on total auto pilot once the ability activates. Because of this you can't deviate in any way from whatever choice you made prior to activation and he can see what you can do ahead of time for free

 

[Komii]

First time I can sort of process what King Crimson does...ever.

Cant say if it erases time, but you seem to be on total auto pilot once the ability activates. Because of this you can't deviate in any way from whatever choice you made prior to activation and he can see what you can do ahead of time for free

Click to shrink...

Yes it erases that period of time, just as the stand said, and you nailed the rest of the explanation

 

[VariantX]

Yes it erases that period of time, just as the stand said, and you nailed the rest of the explanation

Click to shrink...

Which is why the stray cat walked across Giorno's lap. Stray cats tend to avoid humans or always keep a certain distance away. The cat was already headed that way and would have taken the long way around if it had control over it's faculties

 

[Komii]

Which is why the stray cat walked across Giorno's lap. Stray cats tend to avoid humans or always keep a certain distance away. The cat was already headed that way and would have taken the long way around if it had control over it's faculties

Click to shrink...

I've never put much thought into that bit, but it makes total sense, very interesting @-@ i wonder if that's also why Mista couldn't stop narancia from eating all the chocolate?

 

[Yagi di Hoshi]

I don't think Part 4 is just of associates. The dynamic of the entire group isn't as strong as passione, but there are definitely many strong friendships. I really feel the bonds from a lot of them. Okuyasu and josuke are great. Not all of them have the same level of friendship, but I don't think they need to for the group to still work (some of the main cast aren't even friends which I think is pretty cool, like how Rohan hates josuke).

Sorry, I just really disagreed with that. But like, I know everyone will connect to different groups in the jojo parts differently. I probably feel less interest in some friendships that others love or vice versa. I am not trying to say what is right or wrong!

I think with passione, you can really feel the dynamic of them more because they're more often all together. Plus, they all express so much care for each other, and I love it. I don't think every dynamic is on the same level as each other though, some friendships stand out way more than others. But as an entire group, it's easy to see why they are together, and why they fight for each other.

Click to shrink...

Part 4 definitely comprises my favorite cast, and the Gang-Stars do work together nicely

Pink Giorno was the best decision DP ever made

Click to shrink...

Araki has stated in some article piece that Giorno is indeed pink (& with the sky blue ladybugs)

Out of all the colors you see him in on the covers, that's the scheme he went with the most. And it appears that this may be an actual canon thing, so～

 

[Komii]

Part 4 definitely comprises my favorite cast, and the Gang-Stars do work together nicely


Araki has stated in some article piece that Giorno is indeed pink (& with the sky blue ladybugs)

Out of all the colors you see him in on the covers, that's the scheme he went with the most. And it appears that this may be an actual canon thing, so～

Click to shrink...

I thought no colors were canon in jojo, but this makes me happy -u-

 

[Yagi di Hoshi]

Yeah, so did I. But, guess it doesn't apply to Giorno at least?

Could be a testament to how out-of-this-world his stuff is

 

[Komii]

I think it might be just an homage to Prince, which is thematically adequate considering his enemy is a 'king'

 

[HStallion]

Here's how King Crimson works.

The Boss: KING CRIMSON!

*Araki shrugs his shoulders*

10 seconds are gone or something! Its the future though!

 

[Candescence]

I think The World is more broken than King Crimson, mainly because it required another stand with the exact same ability to counter it. Bites The Dust could be circumvented via forcing Kira to defend himself and requires a manual detonation to initially start up, and we've already seen potential for King Crimson to be overcome or tricked. But once Dio gets The World going, anyone in range aside from Jotaro is fucking dead.

But yeah, this and the last episode was a good mid-season turning point. One of the gang has been left behind, and while Giorno and Bruno have conspired to overthrow the Boss before, they've fully defected and are trying to figure out how to defeat King Crimson while inevitably fighting off the assassins coming after them. Also, there's the last member of La Squadra to worry about, so that's one last loose end left.

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

 

[RavenGear]

I think The World is more broken than King Crimson, mainly because it required another stand with the exact same ability to counter it.

Click to shrink...

Not really as shown in part 4 when Jotaro gets busted by Ratt and Sheer Heart Attack.

 

[Deleted member 198]

DIO is lifted up to a completely different level due to being a vampire.

 

[Stunner911]

Dio could spam the World

 

[Booki]

In DIO's defense, not many people can fuck with Jotaro when he's genuinely pissed off. Nine times out of Ten, that scenario ends with Star Platinum punching your skeleton into a powder.

If DIO was still around, most of his opponents would get bodied ala Kakyoin/Polnareff because THE WORLD hits another level of OP when its user is an immortal* Vampire with superhuman traits. If DIO wasn't BSing us, those 9-second time stops would continue to grow into minutes, if not hours, so that would've been a thing. 🤷🏾‍♂️

 

[Bard]

Not really as shown in part 4 when Jotaro gets busted by Ratt and Sheer Heart Attack.

Click to shrink...

In part this is because he didn't practice time stop so it always just stayed at only 1 second. Not much you can do with that admittedly. Dio was up to 9 seconds and his intent was to continue practicing until it just because infinite. Also he's an immortal vampire, neither of those two stands would have done much against him I think. Finally if things got really out of hand, he should have used SPACE RIPPER STINGY EYES and that subzero martial arts bullshit he apparently forgot in part 3.

 

[pirata]

In part this is because he didn't practice time stop so it always just stayed at only 1 second. Not much you can do with that admittedly. Dio was up to 9 seconds and his intent was to continue practicing until it just because infinite. Also he's an immortal vampire, neither of those two stands would have done much against him I think. Finally if things got really out of hand, he should have used SPACE RIPPER STINGY EYES and that subzero martial arts bullshit he apparently forgot in part 3.

Click to shrink...

DIO just doesn't want to deplete any of his precious bodily fluids.

Click to shrink...

 

[Komii]

Not really as shown in part 4 when Jotaro gets busted by Ratt and Sheer Heart Attack.

Click to shrink...

Some people said Jotaro just "nerfed" himself in order to help Josuke learning some skills, in the final fight he ended up using the shots after all ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Frozen Viper]

My take is KC and The World would be an interesting fight, as if I understand correctly KC can predict some seconds in the future, and then take action, deleting those seconds from everyone's memories right? However, when The World stops time, if KC is caught in the radius if he tried to delete time, it wouldn't delete anything, as time for him has not moved so there's nothing to delete? To KC, it would be like watching DIO, then DIO suddenly dissapearing. KC would delete time, but he wouldn't gain anything as for KC he would just be deleting zero as there was no time passed (Or at least no time passed to his senses).

Or I could be completely off on my thinking.

 

[Xpike]

I think The World wins, KC relies entirely on time passing as normal and then skipping that time, if DIO activates The World and kills KC in that time KC cannot skip time that technically never existed.

 

[Tunahead]

Some people said Jotaro just "nerfed" himself in order to help Josuke learning some skills, in the final fight he ended up using the shots after all ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Click to shrink...

I think it works thematically better if Jotaro just straight got bodied by a rat. A wild animal with a Stand is more dangerous than DIO, because the wild animal will strike to kill, whereas DIO is driven to pose, and gloat, and seek acknowledgement as a real big baller from everyone, even his enemies. Similarly, the only things stopping Kira from killing the entire Duwang Gang with his entirely undetectable bombs once he had assumed the identity of Kosaku Kawajiri were his obsession with maintaining specific routines, and his arrogance that he'd never be caught.

For this reason, the boss of Passione is probably one of the most intriguing things about Part 5 to me so far. He's very cautious, and doesn't leave things to chance. JoJo always reinvents itself in some way with every new Part, and this time it feels like the villain is a big part of it. Usually a Stand's weaknesses are less important than the Stand's user's weaknesses, but both of those things seem like an uphill battle now.

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/review/jojo-bizarre-adventure-golden-wind/episode-21/.144093

"This is probably the most straightforward I've ever seen JoJo's Bizarre Adventure tackle "the power of friendship" in a traditionally Shonen Jump sense. It's not just that friendship is good and some kind of ethereal power that connects us all, it's about how it plays into our heroes' risk-taking and conviction.This sequence is amazing, honestly. It should feel emotionally broad and Shonen Jump-like, but it comes across grounded and realistic instead "

I completely agree with this, the fact that they handled the power of friendship in a realistic and well integrated manner in the story is certainty better then a lot of Shonens.

 

[tsampikos]

Imo King Crimson beats the world when it is active.

King Crimson peers into the future as a passive ability but when its active, when time becomes "erasable", all movement becomes a blur of superimposition. This should include movement made in stopped time. It shouldn't make any difference to him whether or not time is stopped while the ability is active.

So what ends up happening is that he sees that Dio is about to instadonut him he activates his ability to avoid it and tear through Dio instead.

 

[Dreamboum]

Imo King Crimson beats the world when it is active.

King Crimson peers into the future as a passive ability but when its active, when time becomes "erasable", all movement becomes a blur of superimposition. This should include movement made in stopped time. It shouldn't make any difference to him whether or not time is stopped while the ability is active.

Click to shrink...

I understand the argument but there are factors at play.

How can King Crimson know that time is stopped ?
King Crimson surely cannot activate his ability under the influence of time stop
King Crimson also doesn't seem to have omniscient view of the future, he has to activate it
In a circumstance where The World wouldn't telegraph his ability, he has high chances to win, and that's wondering if King Crimson can even move even during the timeline of events he messes with if the pre-ordained future dictates that Time Stop is activated

Let's say The World activates Time Stop at 4 seconds for 6 seconds, KC sees it, uses epitaph, can he move only for the four seconds before it is activated, or does he have free reign even in the next 6 seconds where Time Stop has been decided to be activated by the current course of events ?

I think The World would win in many cases, but KC has a fighting chance.

 

[Haruko]

So now that i'm finally caught up fully on the anime,

is Bruno

Spoiler

undead now? Is that what the lack of pain/blood symbolized? Though his stand's zippers disappeared from Trish and then reappeared...

 

[tsampikos]

I understand the argument but there are factors at play.

How can King Crimson know that time is stopped ?
King Crimson surely cannot activate his ability under the influence of time stop
King Crimson also doesn't seem to have omniscient view of the future, he has to activate it
In a circumstance where The World wouldn't telegraph his ability, he has high chances to win, and that's wondering if King Crimson can even move even during the timeline of events he messes with if the pre-ordained future dictates that Time Stop is activated

Let's say The World activates Time Stop at 4 seconds for 6 seconds, KC sees it, uses epitaph, can he move only for the four seconds before it is activated, or does he have free reign even in the next 6 seconds where Time Stop has been decided to be activated by the current course of events ?

I think The World would win in many cases, but KC has a fighting chance.

Click to shrink...

He doesnt have to know that time is stopped. He sees an undesirable future and he activates his ability before it happens because precognotion is passive for him. You should know this because you called this ability out by name.

And while its active all actions are superimposed... whether time is stopped or not. It makes no difference... time does not continue normally when KC is activated. Its this weird blur world where time is being erased and he sees everything happening at once and only he has free will to change the outcome.

If The World activates during King Crimson's active time Bossman should still see the full extent of The World's actions on top of the outcome because KC erases real time and regardless of how long The World is active it will always be an instant of real time.

 

[Lumination]

The real question is why another big bad has a time stand. Bites the Dust was awesome because of how it warped the plot around it, but as of now, King Crimson hasn't shown enough difference vs The World, regardless of who would win. Maybe I'm just not Araki-ing hard enough to imagine the different implications.

 

[KujoJosuke]

The real question is why another big bad has a time stand. Bites the Dust was awesome because of how it warped the plot around it, but as of now, King Crimson hasn't shown enough difference vs The World, regardless of who would win. Maybe I'm just not Araki-ing hard enough to imagine the different implications.

Click to shrink...

Araki likes his main villains to have time powers

 

[Sou Da]

Araki likes his main villains to have time powers

Click to shrink...

I was about to argue against this but I can't.

 

[Tunahead]

The way I see it, King Crimson can only perceive time normally, but ahead of everyone else. If that's true, the Boss wouldn't be able to see what DIO does inside the frozen time, because those events take place outside the regular linear progression of time. He'd just perceive that sometime in the future knives would suddenly materialize out of thin air or something. I guess ultimately it doesn't really matter either way though, because he'd still just dodge it.

 

[Komii]

So now that i'm finally caught up fully on the anime,

is Bruno

Spoiler

undead now? Is that what the lack of pain/blood symbolized? Though his stand's zippers disappeared from Trish and then reappeared...

Click to shrink...

Best thing I can say is pay attention to the details and take your own conclusions about it

 

[Tunahead]

Araki likes his main villains to have time powers

Click to shrink...

Araki seems really into the idea that villains should be emotionally weak, because emotionally strong people wouldn't become villains. He also seems really into constantly escalating, dramatic, high stakes action. I think this leads to a kind of inevitability.

JoJo villains are shitty people, and the conflict between them and the protagonists stems from a disagreement about whether or not there should be consequences for being a shitty person. Time manipulation is pretty much the ultimate narrative tool when it comes to consequence avoidance. Sure, you could do other things, but once you come up with time powers, why stop?

I think Araki will keep using time powers for his villains for as long as he can come up with new ones, and if King Crimson is any indication, he's not gonna run out any time soon. It's not a difficult Stand to understand, but it is difficult to describe concisely. The World stops time. Killer Queen's Bites The Dust turns back time. But if you wanted to spoil King Crimson to someone against their will, you'd need to tie them to a chair and make them watch your PowerPoint presentation, Clockwork Orange style. It truly is the perfect Stand, with no weaknesses.

 

[TheShampion]

There is a potentially cool concept around the idea that time powers are the ultimate power, and with ultimate power comes ultimate corruption, but that seems to be perhaps giving Jojo too much credit.

I would write it up to time powers being something that can look cool and work in a manga, where the person writing and drawing has to do a bunch of time management panel to panel already that comes with the medium.

 

[Komii]

There is a potentially cool concept around the idea that time powers are the ultimate power, and with ultimate power comes ultimate corruption, but that seems to be perhaps giving Jojo too much credit.

Click to shrink...

Honestly, you kinda nailed it. In a series that's all about destiny and how we're fated to trail it, Time manipulation is the ultimate power as it's the only way to try to break/control its flow o_o
The villains using time stands is not a random theme

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

[TR][TD]

Araki seems really into the idea that villains should be emotionally weak, because emotionally strong people wouldn't become villains. He also seems really into constantly escalating, dramatic, high stakes action. I think this leads to a kind of inevitability.

JoJo villains are shitty people, and the conflict between them and the protagonists stems from a disagreement about whether or not there should be consequences for being a shitty person. Time manipulation is pretty much the ultimate narrative tool when it comes to consequence avoidance. Sure, you could do other things, but once you come up with time powers, why stop?

I think Araki will keep using time powers for his villains for as long as he can come up with new ones, and if King Crimson is any indication, he's not gonna run out any time soon. It's not a difficult Stand to understand, but it is difficult to describe concisely. The World stops time. Killer Queen's Bites The Dust turns back time. But if you wanted to spoil King Crimson to someone against their will, you'd need to tie them to a chair and make them watch your PowerPoint presentation, Clockwork Orange style. It truly is the perfect Stand, with no weaknesses.

Click to shrink...

[/TD]
[TD]

[/TD][/TR]
[TR][TD]
I frequently get the comment that the "Enemies" in JoJo Part 4 are "Weak." I think my response to this criticism is quite clear from the work itself, but since I've heard the same complaint from the editorial staff, I'll answer it explicitly: I constructed Part 4 around the theme of mental and emotional weakness. The Stands were created by exaggerating the viewpoints of characters consumed by their own flaws.

I was thinking about how strong enemies show up in manga. After them, an even stronger enemy shows up, and after them, an even stronger one... so what happens at the very end? It's kind of like thinking about the edges of the universe. Once you look about the world, you realize that what it really means to be a "strong" person is not to do bad things.

"An enemy who does bad things" is a person who has "a spiritual weakness," and what's truly scary is when someone takes that weakness and uses it to lash out against others - Hirohiko Araki

So yeah your right on the money
[/TD]
[TD]

[/TD][/TR]

 

[Moara]

Just saw the episode.I think I get how King Crimson works, but what I don't get is his radius. Does the time he deletes effect the world around him? He was talking about Bruno being in his radius or something but then Giorno and the gang were feeling the effects like a mile away

 

[KujoJosuke]

Just saw the episode. I I think I get how King Crimson works, but what I don't get is his radius. Does the time he deletes effect the world around him? He was talking about Bruno being in his radius or something but then Giorno and the gang were feeling the effects like a mile away

Click to shrink...

Usually when someone mentions their range they mean their effective attack range. KC is a short range stand so it has a range of a few meters. Its power however expands much further, but he can't do anything to you if you're outside of his limited physical range.

Kinda like how Star Platinum likely has universal time stop but SP can only move like 3 meters from Jotaro

 

[Moara]

Usually when someone mentions theirbrange they mean their effective attack range. KC is a short range stand so it has a range of a few meters. Its power however expands much further, but he can't do anything to you if you're outside of his limited physical range.

Click to shrink...

So his power works on a universal scale, huh? It's fun thinking about the world collectively feeling like some weird shit happened every time he activates his power

 

[Lumination]

So his power works on a universal scale, huh? It's fun thinking about the world collectively feeling like some weird shit happened every time he activates his power

Click to shrink...

But no one has ever realized the skip happening until now. Until the show tells me otherwise, there's no reason to assume the range isn't just maybe tens of meters.

 

[Moara]

But no one has ever realized the skip happening until now. Until the show tells me otherwise, there's no reason to assume the range isn't just maybe tens of meters.

Click to shrink...

That's because this power literally didn't exist until this very episode. Araki doesn't plan ahead like that lol

 

[Komii]

But no one has ever realized the skip happening until now. Until the show tells me otherwise, there's no reason to assume the range isn't just maybe tens of meters.

Click to shrink...

You gotta remember the dude is so isolated from everyone he doesn't need to use the stand very often

 

[Parshias]

People in JoJo are pretty dumb. Considering some of the things that have happened and will happen, masses of bystanders simply not noticing that ten seconds got deleted isn't exactly out of place in JoJo.

This is the series that gave us "the rain sounds like Josuke" after all. Even if you're a plot-important character, expect your IQ to go negative if you're not directly involved in a confrontation. Nameless bystanders are even worse.

 

[KujoJosuke]

I can't believe Bruno is both dead, alive, AND horny

 

[Tunahead]

I think the rain sounding like Josuke is definitely more plausible than a jellyfish in Giorno's mouth successfully preventing him from drinking piss.