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Sesha

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Oct 25, 2017
9,802
I think there are problems in DmC (the threesome and the cut "as am [your bitch]" line. But Vergil is pretty clearly a dangerous misogynist/spot on Julian Assange parody, so I don't feel stuff like Lilith getting sniped in the gut reflects misogynistic intent by the work as a whole.

As Ninja Theory observed, Original Recipe Dante is kind of absurd. He's basically an adolescent power fantasy who lives in a world where people don't really do bad things and the answer to any crisis is to go apeshit on Satan with a broadsword. I found him charming enough to beat DMC3 and watch the anime, but he's not a person I can relate to in any way and if he existed in real life he'd be genuinely harmful. By the end of DmC, New Dante is a genuinely respectable character. The shots DmC takes at DMC are 100% totally earned, the way it subverts the cod-Shakespear of the original games with the fuck you contest is incredibly refreshing. The original DMC games have weird writing! It doesn't mean they're calling the original games shit, they're just pointing out they're only easily relatable from the perspective of anime fandom... and that's punk.

Now Danime returns and Ninja Theory are apparently critical darlings who can keep making games on their own terms, so everyone's a winner.

Also I thought the combos were fun

When was DmC Dante not an adolescent power fantasy? The DMC cast are intended to be larger than life. I didn't find DmC's cast particularly relatable either. And writing-wise I think it has all the same flaws as the old games.
 

Jimmy Wrong

Member
Nov 20, 2017
321
Who is threatened? My point is classic Dante should spend 5 seconds wrecking Donte as that's all the time and effort they should spend referencing DmC.

Yeah I mean this is my point, it seems like the only way someone could still be carrying that level of animus for a four year old game is if there's some level of threat there, like the digs DmC makes at DMC had real purchase. I don't feel threatened that they're making a DMC over a DmC, I'll always have DmC. It's cool to let different people enjoy different things sometimes!

The mop scene in DmC also reflects the character at his most antisocial and immature and by the end of the game he has platinum white hair, so it's actually foreshadowing how he has to transcend his churlish behavior to save the world?
 

Petran

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,034
I want as many people to play DMCV as possible.
So
50tqbqF.gif

love you SoS
lol heartless
 

HStallion

Member
Oct 25, 2017
62,212
Yeah I mean this is my point, it seems like the only way someone could still be carrying that level of animus for a four year old game is if there's some level of threat there, like the digs DmC makes at DMC had real purchase. I don't feel threatened that they're making a DMC over a DmC, I'll always have DmC. It's cool to let different people enjoy different things sometimes!

The mop scene in DmC also reflects the character at his most antisocial and immature and by the end of the game he has platinum white hair, so it's actually foreshadowing how he has to transcend his churlish behavior to save the world?

You're reading into what I said way too much. I don't want them wasting time directly referencing DmC because there is little point to and if they do make it a short joke scene.
 

Sesha

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,802
I remember being called a loser, entitled and a basement dweller by Tameem and games press for wanting 60 fps and for not liking the new direction.
 

MrCarter

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,509
Maybe it skipping the Switch could be seen as a loss, but it's not like Devil May Cry games ever showed up on Nintendo systems in the past, anyway. Don't get me wrong, DMCV on the Switch would be awesome. But I wasn't exactly getting my hopes up for it happening.

That's not happening. I doubt the Switch will be able to get that game upto 60fps or even sell well on it. DMC has always been on a PlayStation platform since the PS2 days too.
 

Village

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,807
But Vergil is pretty clearly a dangerous misogynist/spot on Julian Assange parody,
So like you have hit a point here right. I would rather not one of the coolest characters in video games be turned into that, I want him to be fucking virgil. This isn't problem, a lot of adaptations of franchises go through this where folks think they are creating new edgy interpretations that everyone will like, and no one liked it. The DC cinematic universe for a while was that. And something related to me Sonic Boom of all things, which seems like a weird active rejection of its source material in a lot of ways instead of embracing the stupidity of it all, and... it didn't work out.

Changing people's favorite characters in to statements about writing, or life is a thing you can do, you can do it extremely well. The punisher netflix show did it again, but if you fuck it up, like DmC did , you will fuck up hard and piss everyone off. You might get it right and piss everyone off. I'm all for interesting uses of characters to tell interesting stories about life, or the medium they are in, but not every character or brand is built for that. People didn't want virgil to be Julian Assage, they wanted him to be cool guy with a katana.
 

Jimmy Wrong

Member
Nov 20, 2017
321
Were you just as bothered by this, by any chance?

Also, pretty sure that Donte wasn't established as bisexual in DmC (no, NT just did what they could to make him look cool by having him sleep with as many women as possible).

One of the bosses accuses him of having deviant sex and he replies "best kind, right?". Since bisexuality isn't a 50/50 split of people bisexuals want to sleep with, its been canon in my head ever since. Absolutely one of my favourite details in the game.
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,612
God damn I can't get any work done today!!!

Wait who is the actress next to Lady?
 

Anton

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
671
Who are they going to get for Lady this time? She's been done by like three different actresses now
 
Oct 25, 2017
14,741
One of the bosses accuses him of having deviant sex and he replies "best kind, right?". Since bisexuality isn't a 50/50 split of people bisexuals want to sleep with, its been canon in my head ever since. Absolutely one of my favourite details in the game.
Maybe I'm the one forgetting something, but aren't you mixing up two unrelated scenes?

Bob Barbas says Dante is "a known sexual deviant" in a TV broadcast, and later, in the Sparda mansion, he says "I like it rough" as a sexual joke to Kat when she says it'll be rough once he gets into Limbo.
 

Jimmy Wrong

Member
Nov 20, 2017
321
DmC is far more sexist and crass than any DMC, I don't even know how that would be a point of contention.

There has never been a character that has been so removed of agency as Kat is. A minor plot contrivance that was spit back immediately : "hmmmm should we kill her ? Should we let her be shot to death ? She's human, so useless waaaaaah so edgy"

The other character ? Shot in the navel as an abortion procedure by marksman Vergil.

Kat's not a fighter because she's human, but in terms of division of labour stuff she's absolutely Dante's equal and has indispensable abilities neither of the two brothers can handle. I can see how the plot caters to masculine players and I think that's a totally valid criticism, but it's the first space in the franchise where women aren't fetishised one way or the other. She's not there to hook up with.

And in contrast, when Dante gets one of the demon arms in DMC 4, he borders on a rape joke smashing up a stone tablet. Yeah.
 

Sesha

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,802
Someone made a JP translation of the OP details: https://twitter.com/Re_Karuto_Sou/status/935017558654140417

Kat's not a fighter because she's human, but in terms of division of labour stuff she's absolutely Dante's equal and has indispensable abilities neither of the two brothers can handle. I can see how the plot caters to masculine players and I think that's a totally valid criticism, but it's the first space in the franchise where women aren't fetishised one way or the other. She's not there to hook up with.

And in contrast, when Dante gets one of the demon arms in DMC 4, he borders on a rape joke smashing up a stone tablet. Yeah.

She's not there to hook up with, but she's walking around with a cleavage and the smallest shorts ever for no particular reason, and her and Dante do seemingly hook up at the end. Also the last thing we see from in the campaign is Dante grabbing her butt.

Rape joke? Now you're making stuff up.
 

Deleted member 11093

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
9,095
This game might be Capcom's biggest project this gen if the rumors regarding open world, online element, longer cutscene running time are true.
MHW is huge, but DMC5 seems a bigger project from what we're hearing, hope it all works out and it sells well.
 
Oct 25, 2017
13,246
Here's my view on the exclusivity thing:

I want lots of people to be able to play DMC5.

But I also want DMC5 to be fairly high budget.

If exclusivity is the price for that, I happily welcome it.
 

MrCarter

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,509

Lulu

Saw the truth behind the copied door
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
26,680
Out of darkness is a fitting song right now, huh?
 

Adamska

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,042
Yes, but not from an alternative reality.

Always a first, man.
I remember being called a loser, entitled and a basement dweller by Tameem and games press for wanting 60 fps and for not liking the new direction.

I feel bad that Tameem went to your house (or sent a text) to say those things to you. I was under the impression he just made a (damn fine) game.
Devil May Cry 1, 2 and 3 were PS exclusive. So it's nothing new for a DMC game to be PS exclusive.

I don't think it's something that Capcom would actually pursue on their own, they have clearly tried to launch their games across most platforms nowadays. Then again, DR3 and 4 had Microsoft money, so if it has Sony money, the exclusivity becomes plausible.
This game might be Capcom's biggest project this gen if the rumors regarding open world, online element, longer cutscene running time are true.
MHW is huge, but DMC5 seems a bigger project from what we're hearing, hope it all works out and it sells well.

I am absolutely sure that MHW has more money and resources to its development than any DMC game.
Capcom saw DMCV as a risk. Wanted to partner up with someone.

Hey, do you know of anything in regards to Ninja Theory or DmC? I mean, were they ever involved with a sequel?
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,880
I've always wondered just how immortal Dante and Vergil actually are. My guess would be decapitation being the only thing to truly kill them.

At this point, do Capcom themselves even know lol
 

Jimmy Wrong

Member
Nov 20, 2017
321
So like you have hit a point here right. I would rather not one of the coolest characters in video games be turned into that, I want him to be fucking virgil. This isn't problem, a lot of adaptations of franchises go through this where folks think they are creating new edgy interpretations that everyone will like, and no one liked it. The DC cinematic universe for a while was that. And something related to me Sonic Boom of all things, which seems like a weird active rejection of its source material in a lot of ways instead of embracing the stupidity of it all, and... it didn't work out.

Changing people's favorite characters in to statements about writing, or life is a thing you can do, you can do it extremely well. The punisher netflix show did it again, but if you fuck it up, like DmC did , you will fuck up hard and piss everyone off. You might get it right and piss everyone off. I'm all for interesting uses of characters to tell interesting stories about life, or the medium they are in, but not every character or brand is built for that. People didn't want virgil to be Julian Assage, they wanted him to be cool guy with a katana.

Virgil is a guy with severe megalomania, a katana, renchcoat and domineering anger issues coupled with relative impotence. In anime, he's Vergil the dark slayer. In a more grounded interpretation, he's the meme guy who masters the blockchain while everyone else is partying. I'll never forgive them for losing the dorky hat in the so called "Definative Edition".

In the real world, people shouldn't be like Vergil. I appreciated their take.
 
Oct 31, 2017
669
The main one for me was the pic with Dante from DMC4 on Brokeback Mountain. Implying that it was gay and the implication of being gay is a bad thing. It left a really bad taste in my mouth.

OPGYEdn.jpg


I can't believe this is real.

Like, fuckin' why?


Alright. This makes me happy. Double dip unless the PC version comes out a month or so after the PS4 version.
From the conference:

The context of this picture was that Capcom asked NT to "Imagine Dante in a western movie," and then they showed the brokeback mountain picture, because it technically is a western movie so it was mostly a play on words, and the fact that the movie is about homosexuallity between two cowboys was probably used to make a joke out of old dmc4 womanizer dante because he's dressed in a full leather cowboy outfit in that game and in western culture that is sometimes associated with gay culture(something you would see at a gay pride for example), I don't see it as them saying that gay is bad at all, just that the old dante's look and identity would feel out of place and could be misunderstood in a western context, in fact after that they showed a picture of dante next to brad pitt in fight club
dante3.jpg

and how they used Pitt's look as reference because that's what they thought would better fit a western context.
 

Deleted member 11093

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
9,095
I've always wondered just how immortal Dante and Vergil actually are. My guess would be decapitation being the only thing to truly kill them.

At this point, do Capcom themselves even know lol
If their regeneration abilities are anything like Deadpool/Wolverine then even decapitating them won't cut it.
 

Village

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,807
Virgil is a guy with severe megalomania, a katana, renchcoat and domineering anger issues coupled with relative impotence. In anime, he's Vergil the dark slayer. In a more grounded interpretation, he's the meme guy who masters the blockchain while everyone else is partying. I'll never forgive them for losing the dorky hat in the so called "Definative Edition".

In the real world, people shouldn't be like Vergil. I appreciated their take.
In the real world people can't mate with demons and produce platinum blond children that can wield weaponry that allows them to slice people from a room away. Its almost as if DMC isn't the series that should be reflective of reality, in that sense.

I want the cool guy with a katana. That's it.
 

HStallion

Member
Oct 25, 2017
62,212
I've always wondered just how immortal Dante and Vergil actually are. My guess would be decapitation being the only thing to truly kill them.

At this point, do Capcom themselves even know lol

In cutscenes Dante's nearly unstoppable and takes massive amounts of bodily harm without even flinching including being impaled multiple times in a single scene and brushing it off like he scraped his knee. It honestly seems like only other highly powered demons and opponents of that nature can actually hurt him in serious fashion.
 
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