Liam Neeson's real-life rape/revenge tale (See Staff Post)

[jjreamPop]

Here's a thought for you:

My mother has said in the past that she nearly raped by a man who was black. Since then, she's harbored some racism against black people due to that incident. How do you begin to unpack that without either giving racism a pass, or being a victim blamer?

I've talked with her a bit on this and I've somewhat successfully tried to defuse her racism because she's always made it clear to me that it's something she's deeply ashamed of. Trauma is going to make people behave in irrational ways. This isn't to say that her racism or Liam's racism in this case should be condoned but if we want to fix this problem then we need people to open up about it. He shouldn't be rewarded for his honesty, but nor should he be utterly vilified for it.

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Calling someone out for being racist and calling someone out for almost being raped are not the same.
Being traumatized and actively going outside to kill an innocent person are also not the same.

Your anecdote, personal as it is, isn't adding anything to the conversation.

 

[TheGhost]

I get it, someone rapes someone you know, you got murder on the mind. Cops should be stationed outside your house to make sure you don't go out looking for revenge because you'll end up getting into it with whomever wants to be a tough guys that night.

If that happens to someone I love like a daughter or wife I would beg the cops for a therapist immediately, because yeah....I would be in a mood to seriously hurt someone and I need to be brought down out of that revenge high.

 

[MasterSummerSmith462]

Wow, pretty dark time for him back then...

Hope everyone knows that he is admitting to something extremely wrong he did and the point is highlighting the awful racism and prejudices of the past and to continue to fight it.

 

[Deleted member 835]

 

[Surfinn]

Wow, pretty dark time for him back then...

Hope everyone knows that he is admitting to something extremely wrong he did and the point is highlighting the awful racism and prejudices of the past and to continue to fight it.

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Citation needed

 

[PaulloDEC]

Messed up story. I hope he's a very different man now.

The "forgive or don't forgive" thing is a bit weird to me; I have nothing to do with the man or the situation, it isn't my place to do either.

Admitting to past bias and reflecting on how misguided, ignorant and dangerous it was shouldn't be frowned on, imo.

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Agree with this. Terrible PR for sure, but I think it's valuable for people to recognise and discuss their mistakes.

 

[Celine.D.Sykes]

Yes, that is racism. I agree. He thought and acted on impulse and was going to hurt black people in anger for a rape. He admits it was disgusting behaviour, he isn't seeking sympathy. But to label the man as a racist because of something stupid 50 years ago? Damn.

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He didn't admit the racist part of his actions were disgusting, just the murdering intent.

 

[Jessie]

Here's a thought for you:

My mother has said in the past that she nearly raped by a man who was black. Since then, she's harbored some racism against black people due to that incident. How do you begin to unpack that without either giving racism a pass, or being a victim blamer?

I've talked with her a bit on this and I've somewhat successfully tried to defuse her racism because she's always made it clear to me that it's something she's deeply ashamed of. Trauma is going to make people behave in irrational ways. This isn't to say that her racism or Liam's racism in this case should be condoned but if we want to fix this problem then we need people to open up about it. He shouldn't be rewarded for his honesty, but nor should he be utterly vilified for it.

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There are some key differences between Liam Neeson and your mother.

1. Your mother was an actual victim.

2. Your mother didn't spend a week trying to kill innocent black people.

Her racism is irrational and based off of trauma, which fucks up your brain chemistry. It sucks, but any professional would understand right away what she's going through. Liam Neeson trying to kill an innocent black person? He deserves to be vilified for it.

 

[Casualmom]

I just cant see the racism angle aside from the assailant being black. Liam dosen't want to hurt every black person. He wanted to hurt a specific person. When he could not find that person, his need for revenge went to the next closest target.

Help me out here... how are you jumping immediately to "Hes a racist!" while blissfully ignoring a black man raped his friend?

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Dawg. No. If any person hurts anyone you know, recklessly attacking anyone who even looks remotely similar to the perpetrator is incredibly unhealthy and vile behaviour. Even if its a compulsion you feel, the rage, fucking stalking the streets to look for a fight is a fucking whole other level. Dont know how you can excuse that. And to be clear Ive known people who experienced trauma and my initial compulsion was to not go attack anyone that looked like them. And again he seems to be telling people to not give in to these "urges". I think thats his point, its unhealthy. And the point was poorly made.

 

[Enzom21]

This is a disgusting post and you should be ashamed of yourself.

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Is it or is it 100% correct? You would have this same energy if this was a black man? You have in posts in your history here to support that?
I bet this is the only thread you have ever posted in involving racism directed at black people and you defended someone's racism.

 

[Deleted member 26372]

Your brain is not working.

The scenario you're describing is not what's being discussed.

Liam went out looking for any "black bastard" to get into an altercation with, not the specific assaulter. Hence the backlash.

Go back and read the actual quote and leave your fictional mental gymnastics for the trolls unless that's your goal in the first place.

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There were 1,136 Black people in Northern Ireland in 2001. Subtract the women and children. How many black people do you think walked openly through his small town in Ballymena in the 70s? In a whole week he never seen 1. Now in his young naivety and messed up logic, what do you think the odds of finding the culprit may have been to him? I'm willing to bet, he thought they were high.

Please do not misconstrue my posts. A rape set him off, he profiled the attacker and went hunting for him "or anyone like him" in the hope for some ill concieved attempt at revenge. It's bloody stupid and I do not condone or support his actions one bit. He sounded like a fucking thug, lets be honest.

 

[DigitalOp]

Here's a thought for you:

My mother has said in the past that she nearly raped by a man who was black. Since then, she's harbored some racism against black people due to that incident. How do you begin to unpack that without either giving racism a pass, or being a victim blamer?

I've talked with her a bit on this and I've somewhat successfully tried to defuse her racism because she's always made it clear to me that it's something she's deeply ashamed of. Trauma is going to make people behave in irrational ways. This isn't to say that her racism or Liam's racism in this case should be condoned but if we want to fix this problem then we need people to open up about it. He shouldn't be rewarded for his honesty, but nor should he be utterly vilified for it.

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You have to understand that while one can be empathtic to your mother's trauma, that's still highly irrational. It's not even fair to anyone else to assume an entire race of people are rapists. Like the crimes against her are inexcusable but how can that be attributed to all Black Men?

Imagine if Black People attributed any racist discretion they've ever experienced to All White People they ever see moving forward, we couldnt even operate in a world like that because it would interfere in a day to day operation with paranoia.

He's being vilified because he never confront this racist behavior. He doesn't even acknowledge it, he only mentions his list for revenge.

There's a huge dichotomy between white poster thinking such a story is worth commending when it puts Liam at a net negative trying to get back to a neutral 0 of being a decent person.

Minorities arent going to applause people who have a breakthrough in realizing hunting others by race is wrong

 

[EdibleKnife]

In that short interview yes. If you think the only question asked was is he black ...then you performed a opinion already without thinking.

First question anyone, police civilian military whatever, asks is.. what skin color? Followed by height and weight then what were they wearing.

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And yet he didn't go searching for a person matching a description. He goes searching for any black person that might accidentally piss him off.

 

[Surface of Me]

Hi s actions were motivated by his girlfriend being raped. Let's get it right.

He stalked around town for a week and a half because he couldn't sleep next to his partner who had been raped while he was abroad.

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I know you're bring quoted to hell and back, but look at it this way. The way he acted shows he had preconceived notions about black people being thugs and rapists(which many posters have pointed out makes sense him growing up in NI in the 70s), he finds out his partner was raped by a black man. His confirmation bias at the time likely went "I knew it! All these black bastards are bad people! And now I have proof, one of them raped someone I know!". Then he goes to the streets to "clean up" the "black bastards". Do you not see how racism plays a part in his motivation?

 

[Ashane]

Dawg. No. If any person hurts anyone you know, recklessly attacking anyone who even looks remotely similar to the perpetrator is incredibly unhealthy and vile behaviour. Even if its a compulsion you feel, the rage, fucking stalking the streets to look for a fight is a fucking whole other level. Dont know how you can excuse that. And to be clear Ive known people who experienced trauma and my initial compulsion was to not go attack anyone that looked like them. And again he seems to be telling people to not give in to these "urges". I think thats his point, its unhealthy. And the point was poorly made.

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Agreed however those urges would have been exactly the same regardless of race is my point.

Black Bastard, White Fucker, Asian Asshole.. whatever it may be, his outrage would have been directed at that specific group.

 

[jjreamPop]

Is it or is it 100% correct? You would have this same energy if this was a black man? You have in posts in your history here to support that?
I bet this is the only thread you have ever posted in involving racism directed at black people and you defended someone's racism.

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You inspired me to do a cursory three-second check and... woof.

How else has Nemesis commented on bigotry? Let's check the "Gay Cake" fiasco thread.

Homophobic? Idiots? *rolls eyes* having some nobody off the street, walk into YOUR business and demand you make a cake pushing some controversial agenda/slogan that you as a person or a business may accept on a morality level, but don't approve of on a religious and personal basis .. lol let me stop you right there, that's not how this world works.

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[ZeroDotFlow]

Calling someone out for being racist and calling someone out for almost being raped are not the same.
Being traumatized and actively going outside to kill an innocent person are also not the same.

Your anecdote, personal as it is, isn't adding anything to the conversation.

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My anecdote and the entire point of it is that people behave irrationally under trauma. Everyone likes to think that they'd behave 100% perfectly when they're under duress but the reality is that people can and do harbor very, very dark thoughts when facing dark moments in their lives. If you want to solve that irrationality then you need to confront it, and in order to confront it people need to admit to it. Otherwise you end up with people stewing in those thoughts and potentially actually acting on them.

You have to understand that while one can be empathtic to your mother's trauma, that's still highly irrational. It's not even fair to anyone else to assume an entire race of people are rapists. Like the crimes against her are inexcusable but how can that be attributed to all Black Men?

Imagine if Black People attributed any racist discretion they've ever experienced to All White People they ever see moving forward, we couldnt even operate in a world like that because it would interfere in a day to day operation with paranoia.

He's being vilified because he never confront this racist behavior. He doesn't even acknowledge it, he only mentions his list for revenge.

There's a huge dichotomy between white poster thinking such a story is worth commending when it puts Liam at a net negative trying to get back to a neutral 0 of being a decent person.

Minorities arent going to applause people who have a breakthrough in realizing hunting others by race is wrong

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This entire interview is him confronting his racist behavior. Acting like he's not acknowledging it giving his behavior in the interview is just objectively wrong. You're more than welcome to hate the man for his racist behavior and I wouldn't blame a black man for thinking less of him. But let's not act like he's passing this around as if it's meant to be a funny anecdote or anything like that given how much weight he seems to give to it.

 

[Deleted member 26372]

Is it or is it 100% correct? You would have this same energy if this was a black man? You have in posts in your history here to support that?
I bet this is the only thread you have ever posted in involving racism directed at black people and you defended someone's racism.

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This is the only thread I bothered to post in because I felt I could offer some insight being from the same island as him. I don't condone violence of any kind on anyone. My uncle was blown up on a boat In 1997 by white men. My mother was held at gun point when white men kicked our door in and wanted to know where my dad was. We got petrol bombed and had to move twice. POC have never, ever done anything bad, nasty, upsetting to me or anyone in my family. So fuck off with your concern trolling.

 

[Chrome Hyena]

Question, who here is actually black? I'd like to hear your point of views. Also, not necessarily African American, I mean dark lol. We all kind of get lumped together anyways.

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Well i'm black. And my first reaction was holy shit. This guy is a POS for even thinking that. But then I decided to look into that time period a bit more, to understand how one could come to that kind of "kill-em all" mindset. In Northern Ireland, the folks there grew up and were raised basically in a constant state of "war", everyone was on edge constantly, small skirmishes resulted in stabbings and shootings, you were raised to dish out revenge and get "whoever wronged you". Couple that with the obvious race issues and I understand why, in the 70s or 80s in Northern Ireland a young dude who's friend/gf was raped by a black man would go out looking for a "black man" to get revenge on. It's how they were raised to do things and how they DID do things, ask any of the 3500 people killed during that time, or the numerous maimed and left scarred for life.

I choose to believe he no longer harbors such views, he did say he was ashamed after all. And for that, I can move on from it, but it DID offer a fucked up viewpoint at another culture during a really fucked up time.

So to sum it up: It's fucked up he would think that way, but with all the environmental factors and everything else going on, I can understand it and I'm glad he moved past it.

And I have experience with such things. My father watched his brother get beat to death during the civil rights movement in America. He told me stories of how him and his cousins DID INDEED go looking for revenge, not just on those cops, but any white dude who looked at them wrong/said something crazy to them. Revenge does shit to people. He no longer harbors that and told me point blank it was dumb, and ignorant of him to think such things, but in the moment, at that time in history it was what you thought. you can't separate someone's environment from their actions. And no, my father is not racist, and has no issues with white people now.

 

[MasterSummerSmith462]

Citation needed

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Granted I only have knowledge of US social history how things were that many decades ago.

Though is there a reason to doubt what other users are saying about Ireland back then?

 

[jjreamPop]

My anecdote and the entire point of it is that people behave irrationally under trauma. Everyone likes to think that they'd behave 100% perfectly when they're under duress but the reality is that people can and do harbor very, very dark thoughts when facing dark moments in their lives. If you want to solve that irrationality then you need to confront it, and in order to confront it people need to admit to it. Otherwise you end up with people stewing in those thoughts and potentially actually acting on them.

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Neeson wasn't traumatized. He wasn't the one raped. He was just angry. And he did act on his anger, by going out with a weapon and wanting to kill the first Black Bastard he could pick a fight with.

[QUOTE="ZeroDotFlow, post: 17583209, member: 19201"This entire interview is him confronting his racist behavior. Acting like he's not acknowledging it giving his behavior in the interview is just objectively wrong. You're more than welcome to hate the man for his racist behavior and I wouldn't blame a black man for thinking less of him. But let's not act like he's passing this around as if it's meant to be a funny anecdote or anything like that given how much weight he seems to give to it.[/QUOTE]

He didn't confront his racist behavior. He confronted his vengeful behavior. He made no remarks about his own racism.

 

[Trufflesguy Law]

I think it would be hard to know how anyone would feel if someone we were close to told us they were raped. That's some heavy shit that would inspire irrationally in myself.

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(so I just wanna say that in reading over this before I actually post it, I'm not like coming down on you or addressing this to you in particular, this just ended up being a jumping off point for my post)

From Washington Post - Dear dads: Your daughters told me about their assaults. This is why they never told you.

To the father of the teenager who was raped at a party. You don't know about this, because she was certain that if you knew, you would kill her attacker and go to prison, and it would be her fault.

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To all the fathers of all the silent victims: Your children are quietly carrying these stories, not because they can't handle their emotions but because they're worried that you can't. They are worried that your emotions will have too many consequences. Or they fear you won't think of them the same way. Or that you'll be distraught because you didn't protect them.

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This is what we're seeing here, only now it's compounded by long-held racist ideas about black men. The difference is that with this case, Neeson was not only profiling based on race, but was prepared to murder someone based on race. The stereotype of black men being sexually aggressive towards white women has existed for a long time, and has been used to justify the violent actions of white men for just as long. Neeson eve This is the same set of prejudices that led to the murder of Emmett Till in 1955. And the murder of Emmett Till was not an isolated incident. It's not enough that Neeson ultimately didn't do anything. Because the fact that he even entertained the same thought that led to the deaths of multiple black men sets off so many alarms.

 

[Deleted member 26372]

You inspired me to do a cursory three-second check and... woof.

How else has Nemesis commented on bigotry? Let's check the "Gay Cake" fiasco thread.

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I took my ban for that, and realised I was insensitive. Nice try.

 

[Surfinn]

Granted I only have knowledge of US social history how things were that many decades ago.

Though is there a reason to doubt what other users are saying about Ireland back then?

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He doesn't mention a single thing about being sorry for the racism. Just the violent desire for revenge.

 

[Deleted member 835]

 

[jjreamPop]

I took my ban for that, and realised I was insensitive. Nice try.

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Thanks! Maybe you should realize your problem in here, too!

 

[Jessie]

If your clean, safe, gated neighbourhood had a street stalker prowling around at 3AM with a baseball bat, hoping to kill the first white person he sees, would you dedicate time and effort defending him because of his mental health issues? Remember, during his week-long rage he could've killed one of your family members. One of your friends. You. All of your lives were at risk.

 

[SweetNicole]

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