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Lionel Messi wins Ballon d'Or 2019

Puroresu_kid

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,359
Kinda feels like they should just have separate awards for positions since attackers are basically the only one with a big Chance to win this thing.
It will change when Messi and Ronaldo are no longer playing. No other attacker will be putting up those numbers. Messi's numbers for 2019 are just ridiculous, you just can't argue against those.
 

Carl2291

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,518
Anyway as someone who can't stand Liverpool, it was VVD's year. He's been dominant, he won the Champions League and his Liverpool side are currently untouchable in the Premier League.

Raheem Sterling being outside the top 10 while Mahrez makes it is a travesty and Lewandowski being lower than Ronaldo, Mané, Salah and Mbappé based on 2019 form is equally as puzzling.

Ballon Dor continues to just be a popularity contest.
 

McMoneyman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,275
Sweden
Anyway as someone who can't stand Liverpool, it was VVD's year. He's been dominant, he won the Champions League and his Liverpool side are currently untouchable in the Premier League.

Raheem Sterling being outside the top 10 while Mahrez makes it is a travesty and Lewandowski being lower than Ronaldo, Mané, Salah and Mbappé based on 2019 form is equally as puzzling.

Ballon Dor continues to just be a popularity contest.
He also took a pretty average Netherlands(by their standards) into the UEFA Nations League final last summer.
 

Puroresu_kid

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,359
I'm not buying this you must win the champions league to take the award.

If Spurs would have won it we saying Harry Kane should win the Ballon d'Or?
 

cw_sasuke

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,572
It will change when Messi and Ronaldo are no longer playing. No other attacker will be putting up those numbers. Messi's numbers for 2019 are just ridiculous, you just can't argue against those.
Mbappe could overtake when he makes the move to a even bigger club and shapes that Era.

Perez probably working overtime to make it happen.
 

Puroresu_kid

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,359
Mbappe could overtake when he makes the move to a even bigger club and shapes that Era.
Yes but still can't match the dribbles, assists, freekicks, goals etc.

Messi is the complete package and is just a freak where goals are only 1 piece of the package.

Lewondowski for example is brilliant and if we simply looked at goals you have one hell of a striker but it's really a false comparison when one tries to argue Messi winning is simply down to the amount of goals he scores and its always going to a player who scores the most. His game is so much more than goals.
 

Zasa

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,625
Should've been Virg, He won the Champs League and got 97 league points to finish second and Finals of the Nations League. No defender will have that good a season again and while theres no doubt Messi is class his goals come against mickey mouse teams in Spain he would never get that many week in week out against the likes of Dunk Mings and Evans. Favouritism award but expected by FIFA at this point.
So were those PL teams he’s scored & assisted against in the CL each season also a bunch of “farmers”?
 

Absolute

Member
Nov 6, 2017
934
Messi had by far the best stats of any attacking player last season. He destroyed everyone. I think it is fair that he won.

I would’ve liked to see VVD win to see a top defender win the award but second place beating c.ronaldo is great recognition from his peers.

5 Liverpool players in the top 10. ABL’s mad 🥴
 

cw_sasuke

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,572
Yes but still can't match the dribbles, assists, freekicks, goals etc.

Messi is the complete package and is just a freak where goals are only 1 piece of the package.
I didn't say he would be better than Messi...just that he could run his era - Ronaldo also wasn't as good in as many things....but he was great in scoring goals. You don't need to be a Allrounder like Messi to get these rewards.

Also Mbappe won and was a mayor part of World Cup - something that Messi nor Ronaldo manged in their era....he will enter his prime 2 years from now.

Messi is a once in a lifetime player....unless they change the football rules in some mayor way I doubt we will see as complete of a player ever again. Dude is literally real life Tsubasa Ozora in a good day...lol.
 

Puroresu_kid

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,359
I didn't say he would be better than Messi...just that he could run his era - Ronaldo also wasn't as good in as many things....but he was great in scoring goals. You don't need to be a Allrounder like Messi to get these rewards.

Also Mbappe won and was a mayor part of World Cup - something that Messi nor Ronaldo manged in their era....he will enter his prime 2 years from now.
I know. Just making the point that the awards will be a lot more spread out once the two greats go.

Mbappe will be amazing just doing it year in year out at that level is unheard of.
 

JayCeeJim

Member
Jan 3, 2019
133
Don't look at this award to make logical sense. The day Iniesta was fucking robbed is when you could write this off wholesale.
This is one of the more ridiculous ideas that have seemed to get traction with time. Messi scores 62 goals in 2010. It was probably his peak season as a pure striker (the following years he would lower slightly his goals but improve a lot in play making).

Iniesta was injured for most of the 2009-2010 season. In fact he barely made it for the World Cup, where he indeed played well and scored two goals. Spain's play was not as brilliant as the previous Euro 2008 win (they won all the rounds 1-0 IIRC).

Xavi had more reasons to claim the trophy probably (although Messi's win was really fair IMO).
 

JuanLatino

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,336
Should've been Virg, He won the Champs League and got 97 league points to finish second and Finals of the Nations League. No defender will have that good a season again and while theres no doubt Messi is class his goals come against mickey mouse teams in Spain he would never get that many week in week out against the likes of Dunk Mings and Evans. Favouritism award but expected by FIFA at this point.
so by your definition Arsenal, City, Manutd, Chelsea and Liverpool are Mickey Mouse Clubs?
 

coldsagging

Member
Oct 27, 2017
572
Would have been nice for our big Virg to win it, and good for a defender to win it for a change.

Can hardly complain that Messi has won it again though, he's still the best player on the planet by a comfortable margin.
 

Nerokis

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,068
Ronaldo as Messi's foil worked because he was also an alien of football, because his playstyle was different enough to speak to football's abstractions, and because to some extent these rewards will always factor in team accomplishments - it all came together to create a beautiful competition between the two of them. Moving to Juventus and going through a stretch of poor form has grounded him a significant amount, creating an imbalance in the competition for these rewards, because no one else is even competitive with Messi on an individual level.

Modric winning the Ballon d'Or last year reflected that imbalance. Seeking out a new foil, the relevant parties underemphasized individual ability, and gave it to him. Giving it to Messi this year in the face of Virgil's incredible season, which didn't include a WC final but did include more consistent individual performances across the board, is an attempt to correct for that mistake.
 
Dec 15, 2017
778
I'm Argentinean so I may hold a grudge against Messi at times for his performance on the national team. But... what the have done to him last year was just disrespectful. How can you say with a straight face that the guy was just the 5th best player of the world?

The last 2 seasons he has been CARRYING Barcelona just like Hakeem Olajuwon carried the rockets to 2 rings. Barcelona should build him a statue as large as camp now. These guys were a small time club compared to Madrid. Messi made them compete with Madrid and will close the gap significantly in leagues while increasing it in cups and H2H.
 

Fularu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,044
This award going once again to Messi is a joke

He won nothing, has a whole team built around serving him and him only (as seen by their complete ostracizing of Griezman ever since he joined), has missed almost two months on injury this year but he still wins?

While Mané is actually a team player? Helps others and the team reach their goal and doesn’t solely think of his own stats? Has won the Champion’s League and went to the CAN final? And he’s behind Ronaldo of all people?!

What a complete disgrace
 

cw_sasuke

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,572
This award going once again to Messi is a joke

He won nothing, has a whole team built around serving him and him only (as seen by their complete ostracizing of Griezman ever since he joined), has missed almost two months on injury this year but he still wins?

While Mané is actually a team player? Helps others and the team reach their goal and doesn’t solely think of his own stats? Has won the Champion’s League and went to the CAN final? And he’s behind Ronaldo of all people?!

What a complete disgrace
...you think Messi isn't a team player ? lol

Mane is great though.
Griezmann has been a bit underwhelming at Barca ...even while Messi was gone - don't think you can blame Messi for the team mates to have more trust in his skill .
 

Puroresu_kid

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,359
This award going once again to Messi is a joke

He won nothing, has a whole team built around serving him and him only (as seen by their complete ostracizing of Griezman ever since he joined), has missed almost two months on injury this year but he still wins?

While Mané is actually a team player? Helps others and the team reach their goal and doesn’t solely think of his own stats? Has won the Champion’s League and went to the CAN final? And he’s behind Ronaldo of all people?!

What a complete disgrace
The La Liga title doesn't count then?

There is no ostracizing of Griezman? Griezman needs to perform better.

If you think Messi isn't a team player you clearly do not watch him.
 

JuanLatino

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,336
This award going once again to Messi is a joke

He won nothing, has a whole team built around serving him and him only (as seen by their complete ostracizing of Griezman ever since he joined), has missed almost two months on injury this year but he still wins?

While Mané is actually a team player? Helps others and the team reach their goal and doesn’t solely think of his own stats? Has won the Champion’s League and went to the CAN final? And he’s behind Ronaldo of all people?!

What a complete disgrace
let me repeat, just for you

Most goals in Europe, Most goals in UCL, Most assists, Most Free kick goals, Most successful dribbles, Most chances created, Most key passes , IFHHS best play maker award, UEFA best froward, Fifa best player award, most MOTM awards in UCL/ Liga/Europe, 53 games, 45 goals, 17 assists in the calendar year.
 

Fularu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,044
let me repeat, just for you

Most goals in Europe, Most goals in UCL, Most assists, Most Free kick goals, Most successful dribbles, Most chances created, Most key passes , IFHHS best play maker award, UEFA best froward, Fifa best player award, most MOTM awards in UCL/ Liga/Europe, 53 games, 45 goals, 17 assists in the calendar year.
So?

« le palmarès doit être prit en considération pour le choix du ballon d’or »

His palmarès outside of « La ligua » is void. He failed the two most important trophies this year and as such, shouldn’t win.

Otherwise with your long list he should have won in 2018 too
 

cw_sasuke

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,572
I think Messi isn’t a team player, I think the team has to play for Messi yes and it’s absolutely obvious
Yeah ..every team is gonna push their strengths - imagine having Messi in your team and not using him whenever possible. If I'm a player and have the choice between passing freaking Messi and whoever else....what do you expect me to do ? Imagine looking up his goals and assists an thinking that the players are making the wrong choose here.

That's like saying Lewandowski ist selfish because players and the coach design their game around him as the main fw.

If at all....he would be in a much better place with less jobbers at Barca and a top tier coach....hell he is more or less the only reason why they are still always considered a CL win candidate.
 

JuanLatino

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,336
So?

« le palmarès doit être prit en considération pour le choix du ballon d’or »

His palmarès outside of « La ligua » is void. He failed the two most important trophies this year and as such, shouldn’t win.

Otherwise with your long list he should have won in 2018 too
trophies alone are not the ultimate requirement when it comes to the judgment of individual award

he should have been at least in the top 3 last year
 

Fularu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,044
imagine actually thinking this lmaoooooooooooooo
Ahh yes, the great Team Player that leo is

So much so that he doesn’t do anything with the National team. You join Barca to ensure Messi wins trophies, it’s been made very clear by current and former Barça players over the past 10 years

But sure, let’s reward Messi with yet one more golden goal and not reward the actual best players this year (who were all part of Liverpool’s squad)
 

Geist 6one7

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,078
MASS
Dec 15, 2017
778
I'll never understand that logic of "he won X trophies this season, he should be ballon d or" Individually Messi and Ronaldo are the best players of the last 11 years by a wide margin. Only Barcelona Ronaldo/Romario, invincibles Henry and prime Maradona come close to the level they had.

That's why these awards are questionable. One year they measure trophies won and in others sheer talent/stats.
 

MrCibb

Member
Dec 12, 2018
980
UK
Congratulations to Messi. He's an incredible footballer and it's well deserved, but can he lay down a rap like John Barnes? I don't think so. Barnes 1, Messi 0.
 

Fularu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,044
I'll never understand that logic of "he won X trophies this season, he should be ballon d or" Individually Messi and Ronaldo are the best players of the last 11 years by a wide margin. Only Barcelona Ronaldo, invincibles Henry and prime Maradona come close to the level they had.

That's why these awards are questionable. One year they measure trophies won and in others sheer talent/stats.
I refer you to Liverpool’s coach answer

« if the ballon d’or is here the reward the best player ever, just always give it to Messi. If it’s to reward the best player for the calendar year, then Van Djuik (I would have said Mané) should win because he was the best »

It’s a rigged contest when past wins have such a heavy influence on all journalists. It should be reformed
 

Sei

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,616
LA
Van Dijk got robbed, but defenders never get the same support.

Messi winning is ok though, he's shown he's on a class of his own as a creative mid fielder. But definitely was not the best player of the Year. Just give Messi a lifetime award and be done with it.
 
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correojon

Member
Oct 26, 2017
754
They should give 2 Balon d´Ors every year: One to Messi and then another one to the best human player that year. There is no one even close to his level.
 

sinny

Member
Oct 28, 2017
628
Van Dijk got robbed, but defenders never get the same support.

Messi winning is ok though, he's shown he's on a class of his own as a creative mid fielder. But definitely was not the best player of the Year. Just give Messi a lifetime award and be done with it.
who was the best player of the year? I ask because this year was maybe the time he won more easily
 

cw_sasuke

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,572
Van Dijk got robbed, but defenders never get the same support.

Messi winning is ok though, he's shown he's on a class of his own as a creative mid fielder. But definitely was not the best player of the Year. Just give Messi a lifetime award and be done with it.
Do you have any player specific stats to back up your final statement ?

Not saying your are wrong or can't have you own opinion....but when you are making this kind of definitive statement you must have some data to back it up ?
As someone who doesn't watch it follow anything soccer related....what kind of Data would show that Messi definitely wasn't the best player of the year ?