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Luigi's Mansion 3 |OT| ScareBNB

Luigi or Gooigi?


  • Total voters
    767
Nov 26, 2017
87
Tbh the game has all the elements needed to make an absolutely fantastic Metroidvania to the point that im surprised it isn't the angle the devs went with for the game.

You could easily gate off progression and collectibles behind the various abilities (Burst, Blow, Dark Light, Suction Shot, Gooigi) and allow players to explore the mansion in a somewhat nonlinear order, with more rooms of the mansion opening up as you unlock these abilities. Hell, the beginning of the game is kind of structured this way, with numerous collectibles that you'll be able to see but can't obtain yet due to not possessing the needed item. It was a lot of fun going back and using my new tools to get these items (and hell the first few floors are even naturally interconnected like a typical Metroidvania) and it makes me wish the game took this approach.
 

Hybris

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,049
Tbh the game has all the elements needed to make an absolutely fantastic Metroidvania to the point that im surprised it isn't the angle the devs went with for the game.

You could easily gate off progression and collectibles behind the various abilities (Burst, Blow, Dark Light, Suction Shot, Gooigi) and allow players to explore the mansion in a somewhat nonlinear order, with more rooms of the mansion opening up as you unlock these abilities. Hell, the beginning of the game is kind of structured this way, with numerous collectibles that you'll be able to see but can't obtain yet due to not possessing the needed item. It was a lot of fun going back and using my new tools to get these items (and hell the first few floors are even naturally interconnected like a typical Metroidvania) and it makes me wish the game took this approach.
Wow, I want this so badly now
 

Solfa

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5
Question: can I play co-cop from the start or does it unlock at some point during the game?
I'm going to play this with my friend and I don't want to start without her, but we can't see each too often so I don't want to waste hours on forced solo play while we're together either...
 

K' Dash

Member
Nov 10, 2017
1,926
Question: can I play co-cop from the start or does it unlock at some point during the game?
I'm going to play this with my friend and I don't want to start without her, but we can't see each too often so I don't want to waste hours on forced solo play while we're together either...
it unlocks after an hour into the game, maybe less if you rush a bit.
 

Dark Cloud

Member
Oct 27, 2017
35,636
Nobody is talking about how floor 10 is the best level so far! Great puzzles and it had a difficulty increase.
 

Derpot

Member
Nov 18, 2017
335
France
Finished it! Just need to get the gems tho. What's the reward for it?

I enjoyed the game a lot, I think the
pianist
was my favorite fight. It was the first fight that made me go "wow", was kinda challenging too since I almost died lol
My favorite ghost was
the cat, I love her design and her transformation was a "Holy shit" moment. Too bad her fight was more like a "play cat and mouse" thing (haha).

I would have liked some new abilities at some point in the game though. I really wanted to use something new, the
upgrade we get
was disappointing (but kinda fun to use when we can).

As for the final boss, he was very good, but tbh I expected more. He was still quite challenging, but I remember L'sM2's final fight being more varied and crazier.
 

anaa

Member
Jun 30, 2019
57
Tbh the game has all the elements needed to make an absolutely fantastic Metroidvania to the point that im surprised it isn't the angle the devs went with for the game.

You could easily gate off progression and collectibles behind the various abilities (Burst, Blow, Dark Light, Suction Shot, Gooigi) and allow players to explore the mansion in a somewhat nonlinear order, with more rooms of the mansion opening up as you unlock these abilities. Hell, the beginning of the game is kind of structured this way, with numerous collectibles that you'll be able to see but can't obtain yet due to not possessing the needed item. It was a lot of fun going back and using my new tools to get these items (and hell the first few floors are even naturally interconnected like a typical Metroidvania) and it makes me wish the game took this approach.
i would have loved this, but i know metroidvania style isn't everyones cup of tea. as a counter point, there were certain gem puzzles that i solved through persistent effort (because i KNEW it had to be able to be solved), that i probably would have given up on and assumed i didnt have the right 'gear' for if the game gave abilities at various points. maybe this is a good thing if i came back later and had the 'aha' moment then?
 

carlosrox

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,666
Vancouver BC
After like 5 or 6 hours I'm at Floor 3 and it is amazing.

Just recently got Gooigi and I think the graphics on Gooigi may be my GOTY lol!

For me LM3 and RE2 are easily GOTY so far.
 

SpokkX

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,808
This is GOTY material in pretty much every way. Best looking Switch game also

Seriously this game is Mario Odyssey quality across every are, even in variety! This even surpasses most of Retro Studios work

I have 1 (ONE) complaint: there should be more to do with the money/treasure you find. The secrets are really cool in themselves but what you find is rarely that exciting (i guess this mirrors Zelda and Mario-style though..)
 
Oct 27, 2017
444
Floors 11, 12, and 13
That Captain Fishhook fight was the business! The battle on his ship makes the bosses before him and the boss after him feel like total “breather bosses” (Nikki, Lindsey, and Ginny were pretty tense though. Especially when compared to Johnny deepend). There were so many exciting moments; like, I loved the part when he tipped over the entire ship by possessing it and Luigi is just looking down at a gaping purple maw as he hangs by a plunger string.
 

Mandos

Member
Nov 27, 2017
7,130
Just finished the story and got all gems and boos! ‘‘Twas a blast
Also did my first scarescraper 5 fl. Makes me wonder what the paid dlc will be, personally I want more characters. Has there been any data mining on that front yet?
 

noomi

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,720
New Jersey
So I was battling the
maid boss and couldn't figure out how to beat hear so she just kept moving into different rooms, eventually she went to the last room and then went through the front door and now I can't find her anywhere :( where did the maid boss go???
 

thecouncil

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,882
So I was battling the
maid boss and couldn't figure out how to beat hear so she just kept moving into different rooms, eventually she went to the last room and then went through the front door and now I can't find her anywhere :( where did the maid boss go???
This I do not know. Maybe leave the floor and come back?
 

thecouncil

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,882
I beat the game.

I used an old save to collect gems
and boos
. is there any reason to beat the final boss again?
 

Creamium

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,657
Belgium
I'm disappointed they did Polterkitty again. Even this game has some moments of padding. Luckily it doesn't take long to complete but it's not that fun, especially a second time. Up to floor 14 now and Luigi doing the Justin Hammer dance is the cutest thing
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,080
Hit the end credits today with 92/102 gems, 90k in the bank, an A rank, and over 29 hours played. I expected there to be some kind of money-based ranking system but didn't know what the benchmarks were, so I played the whole game while never spending any money—not on bones, not on hint locations. It feels very well tuned for experienced players this way. Obviously I'm not finished yet, as I still want to collect all the gems and I haven't even looked at the new ScareScraper, but after doing a full pass through every floor to mop up what I could, I thought I would succumb to impatience and see the final boss now rather than later.

This is an exemplary game. The highest compliment I can pay Luigi's Mansion 3 is that even though I put in nearly 30 hours, much of which consisted of revisiting floors to scrub every corner, it felt half as long, as it was just so pacy in delivering one idea after another from room to room: no padding, no downtime, just one lock-and-key mini-dungeon stacked upon another. (Despite the linearity of the room-to-room progression in most floors, LM3 may actually sport the best traditional Zelda dungeon experience on the Switch so far: just pretend the whole game revolves around the Gust Bellows, the Eye of Truth, and the Command Melody, and you're set.) Any sense of sluggishness or tedium is down to your own pace and acuity as an explorer. We commonly say that games are "packed" with content to say they have a lot of content—but no, LM3 really is packed, in the sense of cramming all of this so tightly with little to no interruption, apart from the rare occasions when E. Gadd forces you to head back to the lab, which I can count on one hand.

*

I think LM3 is one of the strongest cases I've ever seen for how interesting you can make a game without any kind of power progression. I love the key-item structure of Zelda dungeons or Metroid games, and initially, as your toolkit comes in piece by piece, it might look as though LM3 is setting up for something similar (acquire a power, go back to another floor to acquire a gem)—but what makes this game such a distinctive experience is that, with a few isolated exceptions, the collectibles aren't locked around powers or story triggers. They're locked behind observation; behind understanding how to read the environments, how to spot interactive or hidden objects, and how to use your Poltergust in ways that may not have been explicitly instructed by that point in the game.

There were a few gem locations on the lower floors where I initially thought, "Maybe this is locked behind a new power; I'll come back later"—but once I pushed through the middle floors with all gems collected on the first pass, and didn't see anything new come in after the major bosses, it dawned on me that LM3 is relentlessly fair about telling you: no, you're not missing a key-item or power—you're missing an insight.

Likewise, the 99-health limit (if you don't acquire any bones beyond the first one you get for free) and damage numbers feel reliable and balanced the whole way through. Your power progression in this game comes from your soft skills at problem-solving in the face of new environmental mechanics, one room after another, not from anything hard-coded. It's closer to what you might expect of a point-and-click adventure or a game like Zack & Wiki, and compared to LM1, here we see this concept stretched out over a long, long scale and tested to the limit: how diverse and varied can you make a puzzle-exploration game, LM3 seems to ask, with a static playable character?

*

The controls were my main reservation from start to finish. I worked with them, but I didn't love them. I completely understand the desire to keep menus and options lean and tidy for a relatively low-execution game designed to be so approachable for beginners, and I'm grateful for the options we do have, like the horizontal lock on the R-stick so my vertical movement was motion-only (a scheme that served me very well, despite the regrettable lack of motion-aiming on the horizontal axis, up until the final boss, where the timing windows for quick and accurate aiming were a little too tight for comfort), but the whole way through the controls felt less than ideal.

That goes for everything from your directional control while aiming the Poltergust to the binding of the Gooigi swapping to the R-stick. This game was a strong reminder of why I've always hated everything to do with clickable sticks; I've never encountered a situation where I liked them, and quite often, as here, they are outright bad. "Press once to swap, press twice to cancel Gooigi" is unreliable enough as it is in the heat of anything intense. But what's even worse is the difficulty of pressing the R-stick without nudging it, a problem for this game specifically when certain puzzle interactions require you to fire the Poltergust at an object with one character while swapping to the other. Eventually, playing on detached Joy-Cons, it got to the point where the most accurate way of doing this, I found, was reaching over to the R-stick with my left thumb while still holding the left Joy-Con in my left hand, while holding ZR with my right hand.

The combination of (a) support for single Joy-Con co-op and (b) redundancy of inputs between the face and shoulder buttons (necessary for pointing at things while turning with the R-stick, but ideally mitigated with better support for motion aiming) does a number on the available number of buttons, which is why we see so many cramped or overlapping solutions—press ZL+ZR for this, press L+R for that, click once or twice for this. I'm not sure I have a better default scheme in mind, but allowing the user to remap certain buttons away from these redundancies would have helped a lot.

*

There is one thing about the map design that felt like a bit of an unfulfilled ambition: the general lack of interaction between floors. It's nice to return to a contiguous, open format where you can run around the mansion at your leisure, without the constant interruption or fragmentation we saw in Dark Moon, but the "floors" (by which I mean the zones separated by elevator buttons) are pretty conspicuously compartmentalized, in a manner similar to Metroid II/Samus Returns: separately designed, separately loaded. Initially, from floors B1 to 2, you see a bit of light interaction where you can drop in from one floor to grab a gem in another—and it was unfortunate that this vertical connectivity was totally dropped after that. You do see some verticality in the sub-floor structure within the major numbered floors to emphasize the 3D-ness of the play space, most memorably on 7 and 10, but other than that, I think the game underuses the structure of a tower.

I'm not forgetting about the Polterkitty chases, mind you; what I'm saying is that I would have liked to see more inter-floor connections in the overall traversal of the mansion and the gem hunts—more of the unexpected stitching between zones that often makes for the best moments in Metroid, and something I vaguely remember being present back in LM1.

*

B2's boss was simultaneously unforgettable and frustrating. I don't mind fights that are so unorthodox, and I like that it rewards you for some light spatial reasoning, like firing the boss in a direction that allows you to get out of the water and reach him in time. But the rubber ducky traversal of B2 doesn't give you nearly enough practice for this. It's rare enough that you use the Poltergust to expel and propel with ZL, and the directional aiming/rotation with the sticks leaves much to be desired across the whole game, but on top of that you have to accustom yourself to the counterintuitive notion of pointing the stick toward the spiked wall that you want to push against, which is difficult to do in an emergency manoeuvre. The whole fight is like playing in a mirrored environment.

13's boss (the swimming pool) gave me a lot of grief because it took me ages to get the timing down for Gooigi to get to the valve with enough of a safety window to shut it off. I don't know that I ever felt like I was properly reading or manipulating the boss pattern, and every time Gooigi was spat on, it was a long walk back.

I died a few times to the final boss, including once to the timer on the final phase, and it was almost entirely because the timing windows for firing a bomb at the correct King Boo (which I only understood how to identify on my last, successful attempt) were so tight. Since the background behind King Boo is the blankness of space, you can't really follow a targeting reticule and adjust—you just have to point at him and hope you locked on. Perhaps there is some trick to the fight I never picked up, but unlike many other boss fights in the game, there wasn't much of an opportunity to be proactive—to make a risky and aggressive play to speed things up or strategically time your slams. Here, you just dodge and dodge and hope the pattern eventually comes around to giving you a bomb to lob back. In the final phase, if you have the health pool to do it, it's actually advantageous to take damage to cut off certain patterns, if your concern is beating the timer. It was neat to figure that out, but I'm not convinced it's great design.

Not many grievances otherwise. I'm being picky here, but most of the bosses throughout the game are terrific—top-tier work by Nintendo standards when it comes to their overall creativity, mix of problem-solving and execution, and phase-by-phase escalation.

Every now and then, an entry from one of Nintendo's off-and-on secondary series demands a seat at the big table. LM3 is one such moment. I think I last experienced that with Yoshi's Woolly World—and since we're on the subject of Next Level Games, that's also how I felt about their previous high watermark, Mario Strikers Charged, in relation to the Mario sports spinoffs on the whole. 2019, for the Switch, has been one of those years where a platform's exclusive library really comes into its own and defines its personality for a long time to come. LM1 was one of several games (alongside Pikmin, TTYD, and so forth) that did that work for the long-term legacy of the GameCube, and I have no doubt that ten or twenty years from now, LM3 will remain a fixture of the same conversation with respect to the Switch. It's such a high point for both its series and its developer that I can see it enduring for a good long while as the consensus model for what Luigi's Mansion should be.
 
Last edited:

Vampirolol

Member
Dec 13, 2017
2,120
Finished with all the gems.
I would like to say many things in the hope that someone from Next Level Games is reading this, but I'll just say that this game surpassed the first one in my heart. Which, basically means nothing but does to me.
No need to talk about how great gameplay, artstyle and graphics are. I even loved the music! Floor 13 theme is surprisingly good. But my favorite floor overall is 10. Or 8. Or B2? Ok all of them.
 

AfropunkNyc

Member
Nov 15, 2017
2,173
Game is great but i haven't played it in a couple of days. Job and the fact i get a few days off keeps me from playing video games. :( Hate being an adult.
 

Kaze.

Member
Sep 17, 2019
70
I'm disappointed they did Polterkitty again. Even this game has some moments of padding. Luckily it doesn't take long to complete but it's not that fun, especially a second time. Up to floor 14 now and Luigi doing the Justin Hammer dance is the cutest thing
i agree. chasing the polterkitty around the mansion was unnecessary and boring.
 

matrix-cat

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,362
I'm sure this has been asked, but do you ever unlock new items for the Shop? Collecting all this money, seeing the Shop icon greyed out in the Lab, thinking about how much I'd like an upgraded vacuum or whatever and then finally unlocking the Shop and finding out that... there's just nothing there has really taken the wind out of my sails. I enjoy exploring and solving puzzles, but if there's nothing to do with all this cash and gold it really makes a lot of the hidden stuff pointless.
 

Nocturnowl

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,571
Well, you get something for getting all the boos, they don't tell you but I found it...It's still not great.
I assume it was the boo flashlight

if there's one major gripe I have with this game it's that the collectables are almost worth hunting for some of the smart puzzles and entire side rooms you wont see otherwise, but they're also basically worthless which puts a damper on the whole process.
cash is everywhere but with nothing to truly work towards the process of scooping up cash starts feeling like busy work, yeah there's a ranking ala the original game but the original 's shorter length and variety of gems tucked away in the smaller space lend it to a much better high score game, LM3 is funnily enough too long to pull that angle off.

I can't remember entirety how LM2 worked here, though I recall boos and gems having the same basic pointlessness (though each area got one sorta lacking bonus mission), but money...did it lead to upgrades of sorts? If so I'm surprised they dropped it.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,080
My eyes aren't fooling me, right? Is there really no option anywhere to copy data from one save slot to another?

I think the postgame save is the auto-save before the point of no return (marked in the save selection as "Story Checkpoint" with a yellow flag on it); my most recent auto-save by timestamp is right at the start of the final boss and probably safe to wipe, by the looks of it.

Interestingly, loading up the file with the yellow flag as a completion stamp, there isn't anything in the file itself to indicate that I've cleared the game once—nothing in the lab or gallery, and no cosmetics like there is for capturing all the Boos.

I'm planning to take ScareScraper for a spin, and it asks you to load a specific save (to log your achievements to the correct file, I'm guessing) even when you launch it from the main menu. The pre-boss autosave (past the point of no return) is inaccessible here, so in general it looks like selecting ScareScraper from the menu just skips the middleman (E. Gadd) and goes right to the multiplayer options just as if you had selected them normally from the lab. Not sure if this is the most intuitive setup.

Well, you get something for getting all the boos, they don't tell you but I found it...It's still not great.
I assume it was the boo flashlight

if there's one major gripe I have with this game it's that the collectables are almost worth hunting for some of the smart puzzles and entire side rooms you wont see otherwise, but they're also basically worthless which puts a damper on the whole process.
cash is everywhere but with nothing to truly work towards the process of scooping up cash starts feeling like busy work, yeah there's a ranking ala the original game but the original 's shorter length and variety of gems tucked away in the smaller space lend it to a much better high score game, LM3 is funnily enough too long to pull that angle off.

I can't remember entirety how LM2 worked here, though I recall boos and gems having the same basic pointlessness (though each area got one sorta lacking bonus mission), but money...did it lead to upgrades of sorts? If so I'm surprised they dropped it.
I collected all the Boos as soon as the option to grab the last one was available, so I got to enjoy plenty of time with the bonus you get for that, and I actually rather liked it. I would have appreciated more cosmetic swaps like that.

I do think the abundance of pointless cash in this game, serving as nothing other than a high score counter and OCD bait for scrub-everything players like myself, doesn't have much of a purpose besides acknowledging that you checked a spot. Far too often, I thought I had uncovered something incredibly clever that must be the last gem on the floor—only to find a treasure chest with more cash. If you know that LM had a ranking system in the past, you look at this and say, "Aha, a reason to never spend any money!" but I don't think that's communicated at all. It's nice that a good rank indirectly correlates with forgoing bones and hints, though, if I correctly understand how it works.

I still haven't looked up anything about this game so the empty Rare Ghosts rack is still staring me in the face. And while I still have 10 gems missing, I'm not sure it particularly matters to me if there isn't anything functional at the end of 100%. I would have liked to see playable postgame content or even content per completed floor open up somehow, but didn't expect it from this game (despite what a good fit it would have been for a marathon arcade survival finale like the one in Captain Toad).
 

giallo

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,431
Shanghai/Seoul/Vancouver
Hit the end credits today with 92/102 gems, 90k in the bank, an A rank, and over 29 hours played. I expected there to be some kind of money-based ranking system but didn't know what the benchmarks were, so I played the whole game while never spending any money—not on bones, not on hint locations. It feels very well tuned for experienced players this way. Obviously I'm not finished yet, as I still want to collect all the gems and I haven't even looked at the new ScareScraper, but after doing a full pass through every floor to mop up what I could, I thought I would succumb to impatience and see the final boss now rather than later.

This is an exemplary game. The highest compliment I can pay Luigi's Mansion 3 is that even though I put in nearly 30 hours, much of which consisted of revisiting floors to scrub every corner, it felt half as long, as it was just so pacy in delivering one idea after another from room to room: no padding, no downtime, just one lock-and-key mini-dungeon stacked upon another. (Despite the linearity of the room-to-room progression in most floors, LM3 may actually sport the best traditional Zelda dungeon experience on the Switch so far: just pretend the whole game revolves around the Gust Bellows, the Eye of Truth, and the Command Melody, and you're set.) Any sense of sluggishness or tedium is down to your own pace and acuity as an explorer. We commonly say that games are "packed" with content to say they have a lot of content—but no, LM3 really is packed, in the sense of cramming all of this so tightly with little to no interruption, apart from the rare occasions when E. Gadd forces you to head back to the lab, which I can count on one hand.

*

I think LM3 is one of the strongest cases I've ever seen for how interesting you can make a game without any kind of power progression. I love the key-item structure of Zelda dungeons or Metroid games, and initially, as your toolkit comes in piece by piece, it might look as though LM3 is setting up for something similar (acquire a power, go back to another floor to acquire a gem)—but what makes this game such a distinctive experience is that, with a few isolated exceptions, the collectibles aren't locked around powers or story triggers. They're locked behind observation; behind understanding how to read the environments, how to spot interactive or hidden objects, and how to use your Poltergust in ways that may not have been explicitly instructed by that point in the game.

There were a few gem locations on the lower floors where I initially thought, "Maybe this is locked behind a new power; I'll come back later"—but once I pushed through the middle floors with all gems collected on the first pass, and didn't see anything new come in after the major bosses, it dawned on me that LM3 is relentlessly fair about telling you: no, you're not missing a key-item or power—you're missing an insight.


Likewise, the 99-health limit (if you don't acquire any bones beyond the first one you get for free) and damage numbers feel reliable and balanced the whole way through. Your power progression in this game comes from your soft skills at problem-solving in the face of new environmental mechanics, one room after another, not from anything hard-coded. It's closer to what you might expect of a point-and-click adventure or a game like Zack & Wiki, and compared to LM1, here we see this concept stretched out over a long, long scale and tested to the limit: how diverse and varied can you make a puzzle-exploration game, LM3 seems to ask, with a static playable character?

*

The controls were my main reservation from start to finish. I worked with them, but I didn't love them. I completely understand the desire to keep menus and options lean and tidy for a relatively low-execution game designed to be so approachable for beginners, and I'm grateful for the options we do have, like the horizontal lock on the R-stick so my vertical movement was motion-only (a scheme that served me very well, despite the regrettable lack of motion-aiming on the horizontal axis, up until the final boss, where the timing windows for quick and accurate aiming were a little too tight for comfort), but the whole way through the controls felt less than ideal.

That goes for everything from your directional control while aiming the Poltergust to the binding of the Gooigi swapping to the R-stick. This game was a strong reminder of why I've always hated everything to do with clickable sticks; I've never encountered a situation where I liked them, and quite often, as here, they are outright bad. "Press once to swap, press twice to cancel Gooigi" is unreliable enough as it is in the heat of anything intense. But what's even worse is the difficulty of pressing the R-stick without nudging it, a problem for this game specifically when certain puzzle interactions require you to fire the Poltergust at an object with one character while swapping to the other. Eventually, playing on detached Joy-Cons, it got to the point where the most accurate way of doing this, I found, was reaching over to the R-stick with my left thumb while still holding the left Joy-Con in my left hand, while holding ZR with my right hand.

The combination of (a) support for single Joy-Con co-op and (b) redundancy of inputs between the face and shoulder buttons (necessary for pointing at things while turning with the R-stick, but ideally mitigated with better support for motion aiming) does a number on the available number of buttons, which is why we see so many cramped or overlapping solutions—press ZL+ZR for this, press L+R for that, click once or twice for this. I'm not sure I have a better default scheme in mind, but allowing the user to remap certain buttons away from these redundancies would have helped a lot.

*

There is one thing about the map design that felt like a bit of an unfulfilled ambition: the general lack of interaction between floors. It's nice to return to a contiguous, open format where you can run around the mansion at your leisure, without the constant interruption or fragmentation we saw in Dark Moon, but the "floors" (by which I mean the zones separated by elevator buttons) are pretty conspicuously compartmentalized, in a manner similar to Metroid II/Samus Returns: separately designed, separately loaded. Initially, from floors B1 to 2, you see a bit of light interaction where you can drop in from one floor to grab a gem in another—and it was unfortunate that this vertical connectivity was totally dropped after that. You do see some verticality in the sub-floor structure within the major numbered floors to emphasize the 3D-ness of the play space, most memorably on 7 and 10, but other than that, I think the game underuses the structure of a tower.

I'm not forgetting about the Polterkitty chases, mind you; what I'm saying is that I would have liked to see more inter-floor connections in the overall traversal of the mansion and the gem hunts—more of the unexpected stitching between zones that often makes for the best moments in Metroid, and something I vaguely remember being present back in LM1.

*

B2's boss was simultaneously unforgettable and frustrating. I don't mind fights that are so unorthodox, and I like that it rewards you for some light spatial reasoning, like firing the boss in a direction that allows you to get out of the water and reach him in time. But the rubber ducky traversal of B2 doesn't give you nearly enough practice for this. It's rare enough that you use the Poltergust to expel and propel with ZL, and the directional aiming/rotation with the sticks leaves much to be desired across the whole game, but on top of that you have to accustom yourself to the counterintuitive notion of pointing the stick toward the spiked wall that you want to push against, which is difficult to do in an emergency manoeuvre. The whole fight is like playing in a mirrored environment.

13's boss (the swimming pool) gave me a lot of grief because it took me ages to get the timing down for Gooigi to get to the valve without enough of a safety window to shut it off. I don't know that I ever felt like I was properly reading or manipulating the boss pattern, and every time Gooigi was spat on, it was a long walk back.

I died a few times to the final boss, including once to the timer on the final phase, and it was almost entirely because the timing windows for firing a bomb at the correct King Boo (which I only understood how to identify on my last, successful attempt) were so tight. Since the background behind King Boo is the blankness of space, you can't really follow a targeting reticule and adjust—you just have to point at him and hope you locked on. Perhaps there is some trick to the fight I never picked up, but unlike many other boss fights in the game, there wasn't much of an opportunity to be proactive—to make a risky and aggressive play to speed things up or strategically time your slams. Here, you just dodge and dodge and hope the pattern eventually comes around to giving you a bomb to lob back. In the final phase, if you have the health pool to do it, it's actually advantageous to take damage to cut off certain patterns, if your concern is beating the timer. It was neat to figure that out, but I'm not convinced it's great design.

Not many grievances otherwise. I'm being picky here, but most of the bosses throughout the game are terrific—top-tier work by Nintendo standards when it comes to their overall creativity, mix of problem-solving and execution, and phase-by-phase escalation.

Every now and then, an entry from one of Nintendo's off-and-on secondary series demands a seat at the big table. LM3 is one such moment. I think I last experienced that with Yoshi's Woolly World—and since we're on the subject of Next Level Games, that's also how I felt about their previous high watermark, Mario Strikers Charged, in relation to the Mario sports spinoffs on the whole. 2019, for the Switch, has been one of those years where a platform's exclusive library really comes into its own and defines its personality for a long time to come. LM1 was one of several games (alongside Pikmin, TTYD, and so forth) that did that work for the long-term legacy of the GameCube, and I have no doubt that ten or twenty years from now, LM3 will remain a fixture of the same conversation with respect to the Switch. It's such a high point for both its series and its developer that I can see it enduring for a good long while as the consensus model for what Luigi's Mansion should be.
Fantastic insight, and I can't agree with you more, especially the bolded part. LM3 throws you all of your gadgets right from the get-go. It's up to you to figure them out how to use them to uncover all of the secrets on each floor.
 

Nocturnowl

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,571
.
I collected all the Boos as soon as the option to grab the last one was available, so I got to enjoy plenty of time with the bonus you get for that, and I actually rather liked it. I would have appreciated more cosmetic swaps like that.

I do think the abundance of pointless cash in this game, serving as nothing other than a high score counter and OCD bait for scrub-everything players like myself, doesn't have much of a purpose besides acknowledging that you checked a spot. Far too often, I thought I had uncovered something incredibly clever that must be the last gem on the floor—only to find a treasure chest with more cash. If you know that LM had a ranking system in the past, you look at this and say, "Aha, a reason to never spend any money!" but I don't think that's communicated at all. It's nice that a good rank indirectly correlates with forgoing bones and hints, though, if I correctly understand how it works.

I still haven't looked up anything about this game so the empty Rare Ghosts rack is still staring me in the face. And while I still have 10 gems missing, I'm not sure it particularly matters to me if there isn't anything functional at the end of 100%. I would have liked to see playable postgame content or even content per completed floor open up somehow, but didn't expect it from this game (despite what a good fit it would have been for a marathon arcade survival finale like the one in Captain Toad).
Lol, the whole finding more money when searching for a floors last gem was cruel every time, especially when they could feel like taking more work than some gems.

i think rare ghosts are tied to scarescraper which is something I'll have to look into myself before I pop the cart back out.
this is the kind of game that does everything pretty dang well across the board, which leaves me in an odd position of not being sure why I just liked it as opposed to loved it.
oh well, I still very much enjoyed my time with it and it made good on the ideas introduced in 2 without that games structure flaws and excessive interruptions.

I think it's klepak's review on waypoint which resonates with me the most on my own impressions.
https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/a35qmp/luigis-mansion-3-is-hardly-ambitious-but-hey-its-really-fun
 

Benzychenz

Member
Nov 1, 2017
3,988
Australia
B2 question.

After you lower the water level, is there any way to get Gooigi back through this area? My vaccuum won't reach this to open the pipe up. There's a fuse box around to the left of the upper level I didn't open. I assume it's just money in it but I can't be certain.

 

Firebrand

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,080
B2 question.

After you lower the water level, is there any way to get Gooigi back through this area? My vaccuum won't reach this to open the pipe up. There's a fuse box around to the left of the upper level I didn't open. I assume it's just money in it but I can't be certain.

I had to doublecheck I wasn't replying to myself as I posted a near identical screenshot earlier in the thread, haha. I never found a way to get back up there, but it's not a gem or an achievement at least.
 

Durden

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
4,158
Did you unlock the Poltergeist upgrade? If so, destroy that wall behind the electrical socket and use the tv to find the. Gem in a bag of popcorn
I’ve already gotten that one. I’m not sure which color it is off the top of my head. I’ll probably just go ahead and try a gem finder
 

sleepnaught

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,539
I’ve already gotten that one. I’m not sure which color it is off the top of my head. I’ll probably just go ahead and try a gem finder
Check the bathroom on the left side
did you get both the gems in the left side bathroom? There's one in then toilet and another at the sink, which requires you to use your dark light
 

Pineapple

Member
Mar 26, 2019
169
does anyone have a list of the rare ghosts that you encounter through the scarescrapper thing?

Not sure how much longer I can try to play this with randoms lol
 

matrix-cat

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,362
This game's boss design is waaaay too heavy on the 'wait around until you're allowed to hit them' phase. I just beat the Floor 6 Knight guy, and I literally just stood in the middle of the arena for 90% of the fight, waiting. Waiting. Take two steps in one direction to dodge a projectile. Waiting some more. OK, now he's doing the one attack I can exploit to get him into his vulnerable state, whomp him a few times, then back to waiting. Waiting.

Honestly I've been pretty down on this game since finding out that there's nothing worth buying with the gold. I feel like it just took all the fun out of giving everything the succ, knowing that the little hidden doodads and secrets and gold ghosts and bats and rats and stuff are just making a meaningless number at the bottom of the screen go up. I don't even bother picking it up any more.
 

Megasoum

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,858
Hmm... I'm stuck on the 7th floor?

I got to the bathroom on level 3... I see a wheel you can turn behind the bench... The wheel gets a platform in and out of the wall but I'm not sure what else to do?
 

MrSaturn99

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,683
I live in a giant bucket.
Hmm... I'm stuck on the 7th floor?

I got to the bathroom on level 3... I see a wheel you can turn behind the bench... The wheel gets a platform in and out of the wall but I'm not sure what else to do?
This stumped me too! It was only by a stroke of luck that
I stuck a plunger onto that one empty plant holder, then realized I could just slam it onto the toilet. Viola! Dunno what's up with that weird wheel, though.
 

Xaszatm

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,646
Hit the end credits today with 92/102 gems, 90k in the bank, an A rank, and over 29 hours played. I expected there to be some kind of money-based ranking system but didn't know what the benchmarks were, so I played the whole game while never spending any money—not on bones, not on hint locations. It feels very well tuned for experienced players this way. Obviously I'm not finished yet, as I still want to collect all the gems and I haven't even looked at the new ScareScraper, but after doing a full pass through every floor to mop up what I could, I thought I would succumb to impatience and see the final boss now rather than later.

This is an exemplary game. The highest compliment I can pay Luigi's Mansion 3 is that even though I put in nearly 30 hours, much of which consisted of revisiting floors to scrub every corner, it felt half as long, as it was just so pacy in delivering one idea after another from room to room: no padding, no downtime, just one lock-and-key mini-dungeon stacked upon another. (Despite the linearity of the room-to-room progression in most floors, LM3 may actually sport the best traditional Zelda dungeon experience on the Switch so far: just pretend the whole game revolves around the Gust Bellows, the Eye of Truth, and the Command Melody, and you're set.) Any sense of sluggishness or tedium is down to your own pace and acuity as an explorer. We commonly say that games are "packed" with content to say they have a lot of content—but no, LM3 really is packed, in the sense of cramming all of this so tightly with little to no interruption, apart from the rare occasions when E. Gadd forces you to head back to the lab, which I can count on one hand.

*

I think LM3 is one of the strongest cases I've ever seen for how interesting you can make a game without any kind of power progression. I love the key-item structure of Zelda dungeons or Metroid games, and initially, as your toolkit comes in piece by piece, it might look as though LM3 is setting up for something similar (acquire a power, go back to another floor to acquire a gem)—but what makes this game such a distinctive experience is that, with a few isolated exceptions, the collectibles aren't locked around powers or story triggers. They're locked behind observation; behind understanding how to read the environments, how to spot interactive or hidden objects, and how to use your Poltergust in ways that may not have been explicitly instructed by that point in the game.

There were a few gem locations on the lower floors where I initially thought, "Maybe this is locked behind a new power; I'll come back later"—but once I pushed through the middle floors with all gems collected on the first pass, and didn't see anything new come in after the major bosses, it dawned on me that LM3 is relentlessly fair about telling you: no, you're not missing a key-item or power—you're missing an insight.

Likewise, the 99-health limit (if you don't acquire any bones beyond the first one you get for free) and damage numbers feel reliable and balanced the whole way through. Your power progression in this game comes from your soft skills at problem-solving in the face of new environmental mechanics, one room after another, not from anything hard-coded. It's closer to what you might expect of a point-and-click adventure or a game like Zack & Wiki, and compared to LM1, here we see this concept stretched out over a long, long scale and tested to the limit: how diverse and varied can you make a puzzle-exploration game, LM3 seems to ask, with a static playable character?

*

The controls were my main reservation from start to finish. I worked with them, but I didn't love them. I completely understand the desire to keep menus and options lean and tidy for a relatively low-execution game designed to be so approachable for beginners, and I'm grateful for the options we do have, like the horizontal lock on the R-stick so my vertical movement was motion-only (a scheme that served me very well, despite the regrettable lack of motion-aiming on the horizontal axis, up until the final boss, where the timing windows for quick and accurate aiming were a little too tight for comfort), but the whole way through the controls felt less than ideal.

That goes for everything from your directional control while aiming the Poltergust to the binding of the Gooigi swapping to the R-stick. This game was a strong reminder of why I've always hated everything to do with clickable sticks; I've never encountered a situation where I liked them, and quite often, as here, they are outright bad. "Press once to swap, press twice to cancel Gooigi" is unreliable enough as it is in the heat of anything intense. But what's even worse is the difficulty of pressing the R-stick without nudging it, a problem for this game specifically when certain puzzle interactions require you to fire the Poltergust at an object with one character while swapping to the other. Eventually, playing on detached Joy-Cons, it got to the point where the most accurate way of doing this, I found, was reaching over to the R-stick with my left thumb while still holding the left Joy-Con in my left hand, while holding ZR with my right hand.

The combination of (a) support for single Joy-Con co-op and (b) redundancy of inputs between the face and shoulder buttons (necessary for pointing at things while turning with the R-stick, but ideally mitigated with better support for motion aiming) does a number on the available number of buttons, which is why we see so many cramped or overlapping solutions—press ZL+ZR for this, press L+R for that, click once or twice for this. I'm not sure I have a better default scheme in mind, but allowing the user to remap certain buttons away from these redundancies would have helped a lot.

*

There is one thing about the map design that felt like a bit of an unfulfilled ambition: the general lack of interaction between floors. It's nice to return to a contiguous, open format where you can run around the mansion at your leisure, without the constant interruption or fragmentation we saw in Dark Moon, but the "floors" (by which I mean the zones separated by elevator buttons) are pretty conspicuously compartmentalized, in a manner similar to Metroid II/Samus Returns: separately designed, separately loaded. Initially, from floors B1 to 2, you see a bit of light interaction where you can drop in from one floor to grab a gem in another—and it was unfortunate that this vertical connectivity was totally dropped after that. You do see some verticality in the sub-floor structure within the major numbered floors to emphasize the 3D-ness of the play space, most memorably on 7 and 10, but other than that, I think the game underuses the structure of a tower.

I'm not forgetting about the Polterkitty chases, mind you; what I'm saying is that I would have liked to see more inter-floor connections in the overall traversal of the mansion and the gem hunts—more of the unexpected stitching between zones that often makes for the best moments in Metroid, and something I vaguely remember being present back in LM1.

*

B2's boss was simultaneously unforgettable and frustrating. I don't mind fights that are so unorthodox, and I like that it rewards you for some light spatial reasoning, like firing the boss in a direction that allows you to get out of the water and reach him in time. But the rubber ducky traversal of B2 doesn't give you nearly enough practice for this. It's rare enough that you use the Poltergust to expel and propel with ZL, and the directional aiming/rotation with the sticks leaves much to be desired across the whole game, but on top of that you have to accustom yourself to the counterintuitive notion of pointing the stick toward the spiked wall that you want to push against, which is difficult to do in an emergency manoeuvre. The whole fight is like playing in a mirrored environment.

13's boss (the swimming pool) gave me a lot of grief because it took me ages to get the timing down for Gooigi to get to the valve without enough of a safety window to shut it off. I don't know that I ever felt like I was properly reading or manipulating the boss pattern, and every time Gooigi was spat on, it was a long walk back.

I died a few times to the final boss, including once to the timer on the final phase, and it was almost entirely because the timing windows for firing a bomb at the correct King Boo (which I only understood how to identify on my last, successful attempt) were so tight. Since the background behind King Boo is the blankness of space, you can't really follow a targeting reticule and adjust—you just have to point at him and hope you locked on. Perhaps there is some trick to the fight I never picked up, but unlike many other boss fights in the game, there wasn't much of an opportunity to be proactive—to make a risky and aggressive play to speed things up or strategically time your slams. Here, you just dodge and dodge and hope the pattern eventually comes around to giving you a bomb to lob back. In the final phase, if you have the health pool to do it, it's actually advantageous to take damage to cut off certain patterns, if your concern is beating the timer. It was neat to figure that out, but I'm not convinced it's great design.

Not many grievances otherwise. I'm being picky here, but most of the bosses throughout the game are terrific—top-tier work by Nintendo standards when it comes to their overall creativity, mix of problem-solving and execution, and phase-by-phase escalation.

Every now and then, an entry from one of Nintendo's off-and-on secondary series demands a seat at the big table. LM3 is one such moment. I think I last experienced that with Yoshi's Woolly World—and since we're on the subject of Next Level Games, that's also how I felt about their previous high watermark, Mario Strikers Charged, in relation to the Mario sports spinoffs on the whole. 2019, for the Switch, has been one of those years where a platform's exclusive library really comes into its own and defines its personality for a long time to come. LM1 was one of several games (alongside Pikmin, TTYD, and so forth) that did that work for the long-term legacy of the GameCube, and I have no doubt that ten or twenty years from now, LM3 will remain a fixture of the same conversation with respect to the Switch. It's such a high point for both its series and its developer that I can see it enduring for a good long while as the consensus model for what Luigi's Mansion should be.
About 13's boss

Did you stun the ghost with the volleyball? If you do that you should have plenty of time to drain the pool.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,080
About 13's boss

Did you stun the ghost with the volleyball? If you do that you should have plenty of time to drain the pool.
I attempted that, as I thought all the balls must be available in the pool for a reason (I tried firing them elsewhere as a distraction at first), but I couldn't seem to land a hit, so I moved on instead of realizing that I could get off a stun. In the end, my method was to use Luigi to bait a long pattern from the boss where he has to throw the ball for a cycle instead of spit, since I figured out that the boss reacts to which character you are actively controlling. The window felt tight enough that I definitely had the impression I was missing something.
 

HotHamBoy

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,831
I hate the designs for the ghosts. They're all so ugly. They look like knock-off Casper movie ghosts. They aren't congruent with the Mario cast at all.

I beat the game. It was charming but it didn't floor me. The controls are a headache and money is just busywork. There's a lot of good, clever design in this game but I just never really fell in love with it.

Charles Martinet is a god damned treasure, though.
 

Limabean01

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,188
WA, australia
I just entered floor 3 and suddenly the minimap is taking over the whole screen and I can’t figure out how to get rid of it?!?! This is rly frustrating me pls help