Magic the Gathering: Arena |OT| Tapped Out of Witty Titles

Chojin · Jan 23, 2020

Brian Damage said:
Depends what other colour(s) you're running. I quite like Alseid of Life's Bounty and Gods Willing in White.

Those are answers. For creatures. The insidious thing about Agent Thassa is any permanent meaning taking a land or two a turn from you is going to be one big snowballed inevitability.

Mana ramp is totally insane right now.

I may have to fight fire with literal fire. I'll brew up a living twister deck. Just deny the interaction all together. I may bring out my mothballed role reversal deck too. The omens make spicy fodder for thassa.

Deleted member 29682 · Jan 23, 2020

Chojin said:
Those are answers. For creatures. The insidious thing about Agent Thassa is any permanent meaning taking a land or two a turn from you is going to be one big snowballed inevitability.

Mana ramp is totally insane right now.

I may have to fight fire with literal fire. I'll brew up a living twister deck. Just deny the interaction all together. I may bring out my mothballed role reversal deck too. The omens make spicy fodder for thassa.

How about Mystic Repeal to put Thassa to the bottom of their library? Or does that just get countered?

Chojin · Jan 23, 2020

I've used it in my Hatred deck (golgari enchsntments silliness). I'm finding it useful against godly shenanigans and it usually makes white boggletron cry. Its a good stop gap and low in cmc to squeak on through. Originally i had return to nature as a swiss army knife too but testing out repeal. Depending on the flavor of Ball Fondling dimir or simic or worse sultai each card loses efficacy agaisnt the other. I may lean in on return to nature cause itll blow out embercleve while repeal does nothing for the aggro matchups.

Fook. I should just ladder bo3. I usually hate gaming the meta but bo1 is either ball fondling or hyper aggro. Yeah. I'll bite the bullet and sideboard.

Izzy · Jan 23, 2020

I guess someone got out a memo to every single red aggro player and reminded them that robber of the rich is still a card, that inexplicably has reach along with all its other text. Was all over my ladder matches tonight. I don't even care about the card theft, but the consistent extra pressure on turn 2 has been a real factor.

Draggyrider · Jan 24, 2020

oakenhild said:
Interesting, thanks for the info!

I think I can get close to building at least the Daxos deck from here:

https://www.channelfireball.com/all-strategy/articles/brawling-with-theros-beyond-death/

Or Anax from here:

https://www.channelfireball.com/all...get-zero-rare-decks-from-theros-beyond-death/

Will give it a go tonight.

Brawl-wise, its more important to find a commander you love. For example Daxos seems kind of boring to me, but if it looks fun for you, go for it! Will be a week before the queue is available. I don't recommend paying the price that Wizards is trying to extort for an always-on brawl queue, but definitely give it a try on Wednesday when its available for free.

For example here is my Mu Yanling Deck, which focus on protecting her till she can ult, and also has a Proliferate subtheme

Commander
1 Mu Yanling, Sky Dancer (M20) 68

Deck
1 Brineborn Cutthroat (M20) 50
19 Island (ANA) 62
1 Essence Capture (RNA) 37
1 Contentious Plan (WAR) 46
1 Narset, Parter of Veils (WAR) 61
1 Spectral Sailor (M20) 76
1 Faerie Vandal (ELD) 45
1 Faerie Duelist (RNA) 39
1 Stonecoil Serpent (ELD) 235
1 Negate (M20) 69
1 Aven Eternal (WAR) 42
1 Lazotep Plating (WAR) 59
1 Callous Dismissal (WAR) 44
1 Didn't Say Please (ELD) 42
1 Sinister Sabotage (GRN) 54
1 God-Eternal Kefnet (WAR) 53
1 Chemister's Insight (GRN) 32
1 Flux Channeler (WAR) 52
1 Clear the Mind (RNA) 34
1 Devious Cover-Up (GRN) 35
1 Kasmina's Transmutation (WAR) 57
1 Frogify (ELD) 47
1 Opt (ELD) 59
1 Pteramander (RNA) 47
1 Tale's End (M20) 77
1 Midnight Clock (ELD) 54
1 Bone to Ash (M20) 48
1 Commence the Endgame (WAR) 45
1 Gadwick, the Wizened (ELD) 48
1 No Escape (WAR) 63
1 Thought Collapse (RNA) 57
1 Ugin, the Ineffable (WAR) 2
1 Unsummon (M20) 78
1 Disdainful Stroke (GRN) 37
1 Vantress Gargoyle (ELD) 71
1 Jace, Wielder of Mysteries (WAR) 54
1 Mystic Sanctuary (ELD) 247
1 Blast Zone (WAR) 244
1 Karn's Bastion (WAR) 248
1 Mobilized District (WAR) 249
1 Cryptic Caves (M20) 244

Teysa is also fairly popular (I think she's in one of the starting decks). You can go for a token theme, doubling death triggers, etc. Here I go for making lots of vigilant-lifelinking angels

Commander
1 Teysa Karlov (RNA) 212

Deck
1 Gods Willing (M20) 19
6 Swamp (ANA) 63
1 Castle Ardenvale (ELD) 238
1 Dawn of Hope (GRN) 8
1 Prison Realm (WAR) 26
1 Conclave Tribunal (GRN) 6
1 Divine Visitation (GRN) 10
1 God-Eternal Oketra (WAR) 16
1 Castle Locthwain (ELD) 241
1 Gutterbones (RNA) 76
6 Plains (ANA) 61
1 Ugin, the Ineffable (WAR) 2
1 Spark Harvest (WAR) 105
1 Dreadhorde Invasion (WAR) 86
1 Orzhov Enforcer (RNA) 79
1 Murderous Rider (ELD) 97
1 Midnight Reaper (GRN) 77
1 Blood for Bones (M20) 89
1 Vindictive Vampire (RNA) 90
1 Cavalier of Night (M20) 94
1 God-Eternal Bontu (WAR) 92
1 Syr Konrad, the Grim (ELD) 107
1 Liliana, Dreadhorde General (WAR) 97
1 Hero of Precinct One (RNA) 11
1 Cruel Celebrant (WAR) 188
1 Despark (WAR) 190
1 Ministrant of Obligation (RNA) 16
1 Pitiless Pontiff (RNA) 194
1 Mortify (RNA) 192
1 Oath of Kaya (WAR) 209
1 Godless Shrine (RNA) 248
1 Orzhov Guildgate (RNA) 252
1 Seraph of the Scales (RNA) 205
1 Ethereal Absolution (RNA) 170
1 Sorin, Vengeful Bloodlord (WAR) 217
1 Kaya's Wrath (RNA) 187
1 Witch's Cottage (ELD) 249
1 Idyllic Grange (ELD) 246
1 Tithe Taker (RNA) 27
1 Corpse Knight (M20) 206
1 Blast Zone (WAR) 244
1 Cryptic Caves (M20) 244
1 Evolving Wilds (M20) 246
1 Field of the Dead (M20) 247
1 Gateway Plaza (RNA) 247
1 Order of Midnight (ELD) 99
1 Command Tower (ELD) 333
1 Arcane Signet (ELD) 331
1 Priest of Forgotten Gods (RNA) 83

Some of the decks are a little rare heavy, but most of the rares can easily be replaced with something equivalent. Brawl is usually more of a casual place (with the exception of Golos / NivMizzet Reborn players)

noquarter · Jan 24, 2020

Is there any good primers for getting into Arena as someone that used to play a lot of paper? I'm playing the ranked drafts since they seem the cheapest way to build up some cards, but seems like the grind is real unless you fork out some real money.

Used to play a lot of Modern, some legacy, and commander, along with drafting every FNM, but turned off on paying $70 for digital packs I cant trade. I prefer the interface of Arena to MODO, but might just put money back into MODO since it seems like they are going to support it for some time (I guess it is support) and I could build some decks on there cheaper.

Edit: probably not too interested in standard, but wouldn't mind trying the new non-rotating format.

Evolution of Metal · Jan 24, 2020

noquarter said:
Is there any good primers for getting into Arena as someone that used to play a lot of paper? I'm playing the ranked drafts since they seem the cheapest way to build up some cards, but seems like the grind is real unless you fork out some real money.

Used to play a lot of Modern, some legacy, and commander, along with drafting every FNM, but turned off on paying $70 for digital packs I cant trade. I prefer the interface of Arena to MODO, but might just put money back into MODO since it seems like they are going to support it for some time (I guess it is support) and I could build some decks on there cheaper.

Edit: probably not too interested in standard, but wouldn't mind trying the new non-rotating format.

While I don't know your ranked skills, I dont think that ranked draft is a good way to build the collection on average.

Sealed is really good if you want new set cards. However, opening boosters normally gives you wildcards, where opening boosters for competitions doesn't. Wildcards is what you really need for the precise deck building.

Mastery Pass is by far the biggest value. Redeem all the free codes like Playtheros (google them). Get all the pre-release codes for 6 boosters.

You kind of have to start and hunker down for a month of two. The collection will come.

noquarter · Jan 24, 2020

Appreciate it. It seems to have a very different 'collecting' mentality than any other way of playing I've done.

Havent been to a prerelease in awhile, will start going again hopefully, especially if it comes with some Arena packs as well.

Seems like the basics are:
Complete daily challenges (can play free bot games, or use decks and play matchmaking)
Use coins to enter events that have coin entries (Drafts or Events if playing constructed) and win packs and gems
Use gems for sealed or drafts (dont know which is better) and get packs and gems
Open packs.
Repeat.

For cards, if you end up getting more than four from limited, you just lose them? Or do they get turned into 'dust' or something so you can get wildcards?

Hope this kind of makes sense. I have stayed away since my paper collection was stolen, but think I want to start playing again and this or MODO will probably be my way. Thing that really got me to try Arena again was the GameAwards event with Power 9 in it. Hoping they do more stuff like that.

Deleted member 29682 · Jan 24, 2020

noquarter said:
Complete daily challenges (can play free bot games, or use decks and play matchmaking)

Just to clarify, I think you only get progress on daily challenges from bot games when you're just starting out. At some point you'll only get them from matchmaking in non-Historic formats.

Evolution of Metal · Jan 24, 2020

noquarter said:
Appreciate it. It seems to have a very different 'collecting' mentality than any other way of playing I've done.

Havent been to a prerelease in awhile, will start going again hopefully, especially if it comes with some Arena packs as well.

Seems like the basics are:
Complete daily challenges (can play free bot games, or use decks and play matchmaking)
Use coins to enter events that have coin entries (Drafts or Events if playing constructed) and win packs and gems
Use gems for sealed or drafts (dont know which is better) and get packs and gems
Open packs.
Repeat.

For cards, if you end up getting more than four from limited, you just lose them? Or do they get turned into 'dust' or something so you can get wildcards?

Hope this kind of makes sense. I have stayed away since my paper collection was stolen, but think I want to start playing again and this or MODO will probably be my way. Thing that really got me to try Arena again was the GameAwards event with Power 9 in it. Hoping they do more stuff like that.

This part is really not that great unless you expect to have like 70% win rate. I have seen a lot of youtubers or reddit posts recommending drafting, but it is a sure way to slow-down the progress even if you win half of the games.

Everyone in era is a hobo and nobody is giving free prerelease codes :( I bought mine at cardmarket.eu, worked out at less than $1 per 6 boosters. Can only redeem one code per set.

Limited duplicates are salvages into gems, but the ratio is really bad. Opening boosters normally has a duplicate protection re-rolling 5ths into a different rare automatically.

noquarter · Jan 24, 2020

Thanks again for all the help.

Im usually not too great at limited, but usually see it as a fun way to open boosters, which is why I was looking at it. Will see what else I can do until I actually get something that might be competitive constructed wise

And yeah, looks like bot matches dont go for the Daily Win Challenge, but they seem to get the other ones that refresh.

Evolution of Metal · Jan 24, 2020

noquarter said:
Thanks again for all the help.

Im usually not too great at limited, but usually see it as a fun way to open boosters, which is why I was looking at it. Will see what else I can do until I actually get something that might be competitive constructed wise

And yeah, looks like bot matches dont go for the Daily Win Challenge, but they seem to get the other ones that refresh.

This shit deck should be capable of winning dailies and you don't need a single rare.

https://www.mtggoldfish.com/archetype/arena_standard-r-102179#paper

Or the Cauldron Cat Oven garbage :(

Draggyrider · Jan 24, 2020

noquarter said:
Appreciate it. It seems to have a very different 'collecting' mentality than any other way of playing I've done.

Havent been to a prerelease in awhile, will start going again hopefully, especially if it comes with some Arena packs as well.

Seems like the basics are:
Complete daily challenges (can play free bot games, or use decks and play matchmaking)
Use coins to enter events that have coin entries (Drafts or Events if playing constructed) and win packs and gems
Use gems for sealed or drafts (dont know which is better) and get packs and gems
Open packs.
Repeat.

For cards, if you end up getting more than four from limited, you just lose them? Or do they get turned into 'dust' or something so you can get wildcards?

Hope this kind of makes sense. I have stayed away since my paper collection was stolen, but think I want to start playing again and this or MODO will probably be my way. Thing that really got me to try Arena again was the GameAwards event with Power 9 in it. Hoping they do more stuff like that.

Are you the kind of person who would be happy with one or two competitively top-tier decks, or more of the brewer kind who builds 'jank' decks?

For both, the key is to basically clear all your daily quests and try to get at least 4 wins a day for the majority of the gold and XP.

Then look for a budget deck you like and start opening packs from the sets where most of the cards you want come from.
Keep doing this if you just want a couple of decks, using wildcards to fill in whats missing.

If you are a brewer and want most of the cards for collection AND am passable at draft, start saving gold once you have a couple of budget decks and then only use gold for ranked draft (5K gold each). Then rare-draft while still trying to build a good draft deck. If you can go about even, you are basically getting packs at half price, but not getting that many wild cards (since draft packs don't contain those, and don't contribute to the one you get every 6 regular packs). You should also save your regular packs because of this feature called duplicate protecton( which prevents you from getting rares/mythics you already have a playset of) and open them all at once at the end. Basically if you draft till you are X rares short of a playset, and open X packs, you should complete the collection (if we disregard mythics), while the opposite is not true. Its definitely delayed gratification, but it is pretty effective in getting a collection

Evolution of Metal · Jan 24, 2020

Tried that red 1/1 hobo deck.

Pretty good, I am a gold scrub, but won 3 out of 3 games. It is definitely not for BO3 because it loses against board wipes or early-blockers, but catches many slower decks unprepared and punishes greedy hands.

Definitely worth having to collect daily welfare paychecks until you build some collection.

Coyote Starrk · Jan 24, 2020

So I have a question as a new player.

Is it normal for ranked to just stop being any kind of fun at a certain point and become devoid of any and all variety? Because I had an absolute blast getting my way to platinum and ran into so many fun and crazy decks but now that I am here I just keep playing the same three or four decks with very little variation and not only is it very boring it is also incredibly frustrating. Because all of these decks that I'm going up against are just better than anything and everything that I have and since I only just got started I don't have enough wild cards to make a properly powerful deck. Which really sucks because I thought I was doing rather well leading up to this point and now I seem to have hit a wall and it's just not even fun anymore. It's just frustrating.

Xequalsy · Jan 24, 2020

Coyote Starrk said:
So I have a question as a new player.

Is it normal for ranked to just stop being any kind of fun at a certain point and become devoid of any and all variety? Because I had an absolute blast getting my way to platinum and ran into so many fun and crazy decks but now that I am here I just keep playing the same three or four decks with very little variation and not only is it very boring it is also incredibly frustrating. Because all of these decks that I'm going up against are just better than anything and everything that I have and since I only just got started I don't have enough wild cards to make a properly powerful deck. Which really sucks because I thought I was doing rather well leading up to this point and now I seem to have hit a wall and it's just not even fun anymore. It's just frustrating.

Take a quick break from ranked for now if you aren't having fun there.

Once you get to Plat+, you stop seeing varied decks and people converge onto 3-5 of whatever is the best deck. It's only once you hit Mythic rank that people start experimenting and playing whatever again.

You CAN take a weaker deck all the way to Mythic, but it all depends on streaks (and it'll also be easier later in a ranked season when the ranks are a little more inflated).

Alternatively, it's all about mindset. If you don't stress as much about climbing out of Plat (you're not exactly missing out on a lot more rewards), you might have more fun.

Coyote Starrk · Jan 24, 2020

Xequalsy said:
Take a quick break from ranked for now if you aren't having fun there.

Once you get to Plat+, you stop seeing varied decks and people converge onto 3-5 of whatever is the best deck. It's only once you hit Mythic rank that people start experimenting and playing whatever again.

You CAN take a weaker deck all the way to Mythic, but it all depends on streaks (and it'll also be easier later in a ranked season when the ranks are a little more inflated).

Alternatively, it's all about mindset. If you don't stress as much about climbing out of Plat (you're not exactly missing out on a lot more rewards), you might have more fun.

I'm not stressing out at all over it. my thing is mostly just having to play against the same decks over and over and over again is just not fun. The lack of variety takes a way a certain amount of surprise and planning.

Draggyrider · Jan 24, 2020

Coyote Starrk said:
I'm not stressing out at all over it. my thing is mostly just having to play against the same decks over and over and over again is just not fun. The lack of variety takes a way a certain amount of surprise and planning.

I have the same issues as you, which is why I usually don't bother ranking at all, since rank rewards are pretty minimal. I usually just mess around in Play Queue and do Limited, which I find much more fun. In case you are wondering, I end up in Silver in Constructed and Gold in Limited most seasons.

Coyote Starrk · Jan 24, 2020

Draggyrider said:
I have the same issues as you, which is why I usually don't bother ranking at all, since rank rewards are pretty minimal. I usually just mess around in Play Queue and do Limited, which I find much more fun. In case you are wondering, I end up in Silver in Constructed and Gold in Limited most seasons.

I have seen limited mentioned a few times now what exactly is limited and how do I do it?

jph139 · Jan 24, 2020

Coyote Starrk said:
I have seen limited mentioned a few times now what exactly is limited and how do I do it?

Limited is just a blanket name for stuff like drafts and sealed - any format where you're "limited" to whatever you pull from a set number of packs.

Coyote Starrk · Jan 24, 2020

jph139 said:
Limited is just a blanket name for stuff like drafts and sealed - any format where you're "limited" to whatever you pull from a set number of packs.

Oh okay. Yeah I tried draft and it was terrible. I am not any good at building a deck when I know exactly what I have let alone when it's random.

I just wish I could have permanently stayed in silver. I was having way more fun.

Deleted member 29682 · Jan 24, 2020

Coyote Starrk said:
Oh okay. Yeah I tried draft and it was terrible. I am not any good at building a deck when I know exactly what I have let alone when it's random.

I just wish I could have permanently stayed in silver. I was having way more fun.

Draft has a different skillset and approach to constructed, with certain constructed staples being near useless and cards you wouldn't dream of putting in a constructed deck being gamewinners in draft. I used to hate it but it's pretty much all I spend my gold on these days. It did take a few rough goes and a good understanding of each set before I got to grips with what cards I should be taking, when to pivot to a different colour and what synergies to aim for. One of the big draws is that it's apparently a level playing field, but there's a world of difference between a experienced drafter and a new one. It's something you can only really get better at by doing more of it, but I completely understand that it's a shitty feeling to spend 5000 gold on some iffy cards and 3 losses.

Coyote Starrk · Jan 24, 2020

Brian Damage said:
Draft has a different skillset and approach to constructed, with certain constructed staples being near useless and cards you wouldn't dream of putting in a constructed deck being gamewinners in draft. I used to hate it but it's pretty much all I spend my gold on these days. It did take a few rough goes and a good understanding of each set before I got to grips with what cards I should be taking, when to pivot to a different colour and what synergies to aim for. One of the big draws is that it's apparently a level playing field, but there's a world of difference between a experienced drafter and a new one. It's something you can only really get better at by doing more of it, but I completely understand that it's a shitty feeling to spend 5000 gold on some iffy cards and 3 losses.

Yeah it kind of sucked losing the 5000 gold but since I was a new player I did end up getting a whole bunch of cards still. which was nice but I wish I would have known a bit more going into it that way I could have actually maybe won a match or two.

But I am working on being a better deck builder. I have spent the last two days taking the default decks and playing with them as much as I can in order to make them better. And it worked like a dream for the rakdos deck because that particular version of the deck is what carried me to platinum.

Deleted member 29682 · Jan 24, 2020

Coyote Starrk said:
Yeah it kind of sucked losing the 5000 gold but since I was a new player I did end up getting a whole bunch of cards still. which was nice but I wish I would have known a bit more going into it that way I could have actually maybe won a match or two.

But I am working on being a better deck builder. I have spent the last two days taking the default decks and playing with them as much as I can in order to make them better. And it worked like a dream for the rakdos deck because that particular version of the deck is what carried me to platinum.

Well it's always there if you fancy another go, even if the sets rotate every now and then. The next best option for variety would be Brawl, though that's only free on Wednesdays.

Draggyrider · Jan 24, 2020

Currently working on a budget UW Tempo build using Faerie Vandal + Staggering Insight, with Kalametra's Blessing to protect against irritating spells. Definitely the shell of something there, though its a lot more fair compared to some of the other decks out there

Since I opened 2 of the Pegasus Maker, its also in the deck as the plan B.

Evolution of Metal · Jan 25, 2020

Losers at Wizards couldn't get emotes into the game, 17 months after the open beta we still have the lazy and pointless communication system.

Already had more fun with a couple of stock emotes on Runeterra, and that game has just came out in the open beta. Oh, and the progression system is soooooooooo much better: defeats give you half of the XP wins do. Even if you get unlucky a few games in a row, you still progress through the game.

oakenhild · Jan 25, 2020

Evolution of Metal said:
Losers at Wizards couldn't get emotes into the game, 17 months after the open beta we still have the lazy and pointless communication system.

Already had more fun with a couple of stock emotes on Runeterra, and that game has just came out in the open beta. Oh, and the progression system is soooooooooo much better: defeats give you half of the XP wins do. Even if you get unlucky a few games in a row, you still progress through the game.

I have no interest in emotes in magic, but the Runeterra progression does sound nice. Once you do your daily quest in Arena, the progression becomes annoying rather than fun. Playing is fun, in general, but there being no progression for losing a 25 minute match is a bummer.

Evolution of Metal · Jan 25, 2020

oakenhild said:
I have no interest in emotes in magic, but the Runeterra progression does sound nice. Once you do your daily quest in Arena, the progression becomes annoying rather than fun. Playing is fun, in general, but there being no progression for losing a 25 minute match is a bummer.

Duelyst had a very nice emote system. F

I think once you get used to the emotes, it is just fun to use and increases communication/banter.

Coyote Starrk · Jan 25, 2020

I have a quick question. Is intentionally making a very very frustrating deck to play against a legitimate strategy or is it considered poor form?

Because I just got done playing around with my cards and created a blue white deck that is downright toxic. I am talking pacifism, frogifys, kasmina transformations, dungeon geists, and more spell counters than you can shake a stick at. It's basically the living nightmare of anyone who hates control decks. And this is intentional on my part because it allows me a grotesque amount of freedom to play my cards because more than likely I will be able to cancel out almost any creature that they summon. And also there is the distinct possibility that the person might get so frustrated with what I'm doing that they just leave.

So is that a legitimate strategy? Or am I kind of just being a dick?

Deleted member 29682 · Jan 25, 2020

Coyote Starrk said:
So is that a legitimate strategy? Or am I kind of just being a dick?

Yes to both. Though without an actual win condition, anyone with enough patience that can play a threat more or less every turn (think Green or Gruul) will eventually run you over, so such decks never really make it when people are actually playing competitively.

Nexus of Fate was often used as a key component of such decks, since it effectively prevented the opponent from even being able to play and just cycled an endless loop till they gave up. In paper Magic, you'd need to demonstrate an actual win condition in such a loop or you wouldn't get the win. So competitive Nexus decks would play something like Dawn of Hope to generate infinite tokens over infinite loops as a legitimate win condition.

Coyote Starrk · Jan 25, 2020

Brian Damage said:
Yes to both. Though without an actual win condition, anyone with enough patience that can play a threat more or less every turn (think Green or Gruul) will eventually run you over, so such decks never really make it when people are actually playing competitively.

What do you mean by win condition?

Sande · Jan 25, 2020

Coyote Starrk said:
I have a quick question. Is intentionally making a very very frustrating deck to play against a legitimate strategy or is it considered poor form?

Because I just got done playing around with my cards and created a blue white deck that is downright toxic. I am talking pacifism, frogifys, kasmina transformations, dungeon geists, and more spell counters than you can shake a stick at. It's basically the living nightmare of anyone who hates control decks. And this is intentional on my part because it allows me a grotesque amount of freedom to play my cards because more than likely I will be able to cancel out almost any creature that they summon. And also there is the distinct possibility that the person might get so frustrated with what I'm doing that they just leave.

So is that a legitimate strategy? Or am I kind of just being a dick?

If you're not playing ramp, you're automatically one of the good guys.

However, like Brian said, hoping your opponent gets bored is not a great win con. Dream Trawlers are neat in UW if you got the wild cards.

Coyote Starrk said:
What do you mean by win condition?

You don't win by removing all your opponent's threats. You have to kill them somehow.

Deleted member 29682 · Jan 25, 2020

Coyote Starrk said:
What do you mean by win condition?

Something that will cause your opponent to lose without them conceding (get their life to 0, mill their entire library etc.).

acheron_xl · Jan 25, 2020

Coyote Starrk said:
I have a quick question. Is intentionally making a very very frustrating deck to play against a legitimate strategy or is it considered poor form?

Because I just got done playing around with my cards and created a blue white deck that is downright toxic. I am talking pacifism, frogifys, kasmina transformations, dungeon geists, and more spell counters than you can shake a stick at. It's basically the living nightmare of anyone who hates control decks. And this is intentional on my part because it allows me a grotesque amount of freedom to play my cards because more than likely I will be able to cancel out almost any creature that they summon. And also there is the distinct possibility that the person might get so frustrated with what I'm doing that they just leave.

So is that a legitimate strategy? Or am I kind of just being a dick?

You haven't tasted Magic misanthropy until you play prison/mana denial strategies.

If your goal is to win, everything is fair game.

Sande · Jan 25, 2020

acheron_xl said:
If your goal is to win, everything is fair game.

I'd say roping isn't. That's one of the reasons I like best of 3, you just eventually lose by roping.

Coyote Starrk · Jan 25, 2020

Sande said:
If you're not playing ramp, you're automatically one of the good guys.

However, like Brian said, hoping your opponent gets bored is not a great win con. Dream Trawlers are neat in UW if you got the wild cards.

You don't win by removing all your opponent's threats. You have to kill them somehow.

Brian Damage said:
Something that will cause your opponent to lose without them conceding (get their life to 0, mill their entire library etc.).

Oh! No I have creatures of my own to do damage. Its not just spells. My strategy is to disable or delay whatever they are doing while my creatures hammer them to death.

I'm not just throwing spells hoping they concede out of frustration. I was just saying that it's a possibility hi the nature of what i am doing.

acheron_xl · Jan 25, 2020

Sande said:
I'd say roping isn't. That's one of the reasons I like best of 3, you just eventually lose by roping.

Of course. That's not very sporting. I don't like shady play in paper either.

Draggyrider · Jan 25, 2020

Coyote Starrk said:
I have a quick question. Is intentionally making a very very frustrating deck to play against a legitimate strategy or is it considered poor form?

Because I just got done playing around with my cards and created a blue white deck that is downright toxic. I am talking pacifism, frogifys, kasmina transformations, dungeon geists, and more spell counters than you can shake a stick at. It's basically the living nightmare of anyone who hates control decks. And this is intentional on my part because it allows me a grotesque amount of freedom to play my cards because more than likely I will be able to cancel out almost any creature that they summon. And also there is the distinct possibility that the person might get so frustrated with what I'm doing that they just leave.

So is that a legitimate strategy? Or am I kind of just being a dick?

Its a legitimate strategy, and is basically what Blue-White / Azorious Control does, assuming you are shutting down their creature and then playing one big threat to end the game. If you are playing small creatures and then shutting down their creatures, then that is considered a Tempo / Aggro-control strategy.

Try googling Mono-Blue Tempo (A deck last rotation), which sounds like it will be right up your alley.

Coyote Starrk · Jan 25, 2020

Draggyrider said:
Its a legitimate strategy, and is basically what Blue-White / Azorious Control does, assuming you are shutting down their creature and then playing one big threat to end the game. If you are playing small creatures and then shutting down their creatures, then that is considered a Tempo / Aggro-control strategy.

Try googling Mono-Blue Tempo (A deck last rotation), which sounds like it will be right up your alley.

Will do! Thanks!

EDIT: I need a this as a chat option.

"You only won because you got lucky as fuck and drew the one card that saved your sorry ass despite the fact that I just beat you like a fragile snare drum for 9 turns straight. Do not mistake your luck as skill you moron. Stop spamming Oops and Good Game at me you fucking child"

Please and thank you.

Alucrid · Jan 26, 2020

if you banishing light a prison realm then whatever permanent was exiled by prison realm is returned to the field, right? it doesn't just stack?

Hassansan · Jan 26, 2020

Alucrid said:
if you banishing light a prison realm then whatever permanent was exiled by prison realm is returned to the field, right? it doesn't just stack?

Yes, the exiled permanent comes back, because exile effects trigger Prison Realm's "until Prison Realm leaves the battlefield" .

Alucrid · Jan 26, 2020

Justumhm said:
Yes, the exiled permanent comes back, because exile effects trigger Prison Realm's "until Prison Realm leaves the battlefield" .

thanks, that's what i thought but had two ways to win a game so i just exiled a creature instead to be sure

Chojin · Jan 26, 2020

The mana ramp is insane. Burning my op in the face for 40 on turn 5 is dumb. Still that mana so addictive.

Coyote Starrk · Jan 27, 2020

Okay so after quite a bit of trial and error I think I finally have a deck that can actually compete in Platinum and actually have a decent shot at winning.

Its a mono black deck centered around Underworld Dreams, ill Gotten inheritance, and Revenge of Ravens. I also have 4 grey merchants thrown in as well. Is there a name for a deck that just holds the opponent at bay while you slowly bleed them dry?

Nacho · Jan 27, 2020

Coyote Starrk said:
Okay so after quite a bit of trial and error I think I finally have a deck that can actually compete in Platinum and actually have a decent shot at winning.

Its a mono black deck centered around Underworld Dreams, ill Gotten inheritance, and Revenge of Ravens. I also have 4 grey merchants thrown in as well. Is there a name for a deck that just holds the opponent at bay while you slowly bleed them dry?

That's just a control deck. Was thinking about doing a deck like that, I love underworld dreams as jank as it is, I could never fit it in a mono black deck even tho its great at adding more devotion for gary. There's just so many better 3 drops that one leaves you behind in standard I feel like. But i guess thats the solution, is just to load up on removal and other small pings like ill-gotten inheritance and just commit to the cause haha.

Coyote Starrk · Jan 27, 2020

Nacho said:
That's just a control deck. Was thinking about doing a deck like that, I love underworld dreams as jank as it is, I could never fit it in a mono black deck even tho its great at adding more devotion for gary. There's just so many better 3 drops that one leaves you behind in standard I feel like. But i guess thats the solution, is just to load up on removal and other small pings like ill-gotten inheritance and just commit to the cause haha.

Ive had several people just straight up quit when I put down a second Underworld Dreams or I get Dreams, inheritance, and revenge of ravens down.

Once they see what I'm doing it's like they just say "No thanks" lol

Nacho · Jan 27, 2020

Coyote Starrk said:
Ive had several people just straight up quit when I put down a second Underworld Dreams or I get Dreams, inheritance, and revenge of ravens down.

Once they see what I'm doing it's like they just say "No thanks" lol

Yeah, when I was running it in my mono black deck, against a more traditional azorious control deck, resolving teh underworld dreams is a huge win. They can no longer just stall and draw reliably. Granted they likely have a t3feri or brazen borrower to keep it off the board, having 2 of them makes their life so much harder. I've had some insta concededs in those match ups specifically.

Coyote Starrk · Jan 27, 2020

Nacho said:
Yeah, when I was running it in my mono black deck, against a more traditional azorious control deck, resolving teh underworld dreams is a huge win. They can no longer just stall and draw reliably. Granted they likely have a t3feri or brazen borrower to keep it off the board, having 2 of them makes their life so much harder. I've had some insta concededs in those match ups specifically.

My favorite is when I play Duress and they instantly quit before I even see their hand lol

keeblerdrow · Jan 27, 2020

Troll decks. You're just playing troll decks. Which, when you're playing anonymous on Arena and people can just head-explode and move on with their day, is a valid strategy and a good way to rack wins. I think it benefits more from the online format and would suffer from social consequences in something in paper setting. We had a guy that would always show up with troll decks at FNM. His win percent was low (because people are more apt to play it out and beat you) and no one really talked to him cause a) they didn't want to hear his beats stories and b) they'd likely been victim to his decks in the past and painted him with a broad brush based on that experience. He eventually stopped and just started playing control decks.

BentMyWookiee · Jan 27, 2020

I just started playing MTG Arena now that it popped up on the Epic Game Store. I hadn't played MTG in nearly 2 decades and am having fun so far playing the game (the rules come back pretty easily; like riding a bike). Are there any real tips for somebody new to Arena on what I should spend my coins on? There are so many different types of booster packs and I'm not sure if it's smarter to go for one pack over an another. Should I get packs from Theros, or stick with the core 2020 set or some other one?

Is there a source of beginner information for somebody who isn't as familiar with current day MTG?

The game is definitely scratching the itch I've missed in the many years I haven't played MTG. Though I don't really want to spend real money on the game until I know that I'll end up sticking with it in the long run.

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