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Feb 16, 2018
2,680
Okay, so I went to a FNM draft event a bit back, and I wanted to ask everyone's thoughts on two of the things this one guy said.

First, and bigger: I'm... honestly not a very good shuffler, I don't think. I can think I'm doing a real thorough shuffle, then end up drawing like the exact same hand after a mulligan fairly often. So as a result, I've gotten into the habit of having my normal shuffle be doing that thing where you divy out your cards into piles and then shuffle them together. ...

if it's just a draft deck, it might be simpler to just allow your opponent to shuffle it however they want after you're done with your own shuffling
 

Deleted member 2809

User requested account closure
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Oct 25, 2017
25,478
Always pile shuffle 2-3 times. I've had people complain about my show shuffle and then they draw 6 lands in a row and whine. Bitch please.

Always extend the hand after a match.
 

Imperfected

Member
Nov 9, 2017
11,737
I mean, if your cards are properly randomized, you will sometimes draw six land hands. You will sometimes draw the exact same hand you just put back. (For a Standard deck with 4-ofs it's not even that unusual.)

That's how randomization works. If you're always getting good distributions or always getting something different, what you're doing isn't actually random at all.
 

Deleted member 2809

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
25,478
I mean, if your cards are properly randomized, you will sometimes draw six land hands. You will sometimes draw the exact same hand you just put back. (For a Standard deck with 4-ofs it's not even that unusual.)

That's how randomization works. If you're always getting good distributions or always getting something different, what you're doing isn't actually random at all.
Nevermind people getting their lands together at the end of the game and then doing some weakass shuffling. What's the most likely you think ?
 

SmokeMaxX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,336
Always pile shuffle 2-3 times. I've had people complain about my show shuffle and then they draw 6 lands in a row and whine. Bitch please.

Always extend the hand after a match.
I mean, pile shuffling can't help with mana screw/flood. The point of shuffling is to randomize your deck. If it leads to less mana screw/flood than expected from actual randomization, then it's legitimately cheating.
 
Feb 16, 2018
2,680
randomize is a useless phrase

what you want is the location of each card to be statistically independent of the location of each other card

after you just slap your graveyard/hand/battlefield back on top your library, the locations of observed cards are highly dependent on each other. mashing halves of your library together a few times doesn't make them statistically independent

on the other hand, pile shuffling this new library combined with some other shuffling technique is much more likely to result in unpredictability of card locations
 

Tizoc

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,792
Oman
Ya know I COULD'VE won this last match in Constructed if the game GAVE ME LEGION LIEUTENANT FIRST AND A NOT BLOODY LAND CARD WHEN I ALREADY HAVE 10 OF THEM
 

Firemind

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,530
I usually don't shake hands when it's prerelease or FNM. It just feels weird to congratulate someone when the stakes are so casual lol

Edit: holy crap what a P1P1

modo108j7czj.png


Edit2: P2P1 Vraska what the actual fuck

Edit3: went 3-0 with this pile ggs

modo109u6i6g.png
 
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Oct 25, 2017
3,771
I always do one pile shuffle at the start and after side boarding. It helps me count for sure, and otherwise I get paranoid about my graveyard/battlefield cards sticking together. After that, just mash.
 
Oct 28, 2017
6,119
I usually let the person who lost lead the way with the post match. If someone wants to stew after a loss I'm not gonna butt in there. If nothing gets said silk sometime say "thanks for the games" as I stand up. If I lose I'll shake and say good game basically always. The only exception is if the other player was a real jerk bag. (I'm mostly thinking of one player at my LGS who is just ugh.)

It'd be nice if everyone playing this game could be nice and respectful enough for a handshake and a bit of pleasantries towards someone else after playing a game you both like, but sadly that is not the case.

I usually just say good game no matter the outcome in the most pleasant and polite way possible. I'm not interested in pretending to be down when I win, especially when I'm always happy and excited for the other person when I lose.
 
Oct 28, 2017
6,119
Okay, so I went to a FNM draft event a bit back, and I wanted to ask everyone's thoughts on two of the things this one guy said.

First, and bigger: I'm... honestly not a very good shuffler, I don't think. I can think I'm doing a real thorough shuffle, then end up drawing like the exact same hand after a mulligan fairly often. So as a result, I've gotten into the habit of having my normal shuffle be doing that thing where you divy out your cards into piles and then shuffle them together. Not in the middle of games, mind you, but between games and stuff I do it pretty often. So I admittedly took the questionable-ish approach of starting to do it before drawing a mulligan from an all-land hand, because I knew I'd surely end up drawing the same damn stack of lands otherwise. Now, the guy said "you're only supposed to do that once at the start, to technically count out your cards. Otherwise it's cheating, because you're purposefully influencing the distribution." Now, I can see that for when you take a mulligan... but would it still be thought of as such say, between games in a match? Just worried about it because (as mentioned), I suck at shuffling, but also don't want to come off as scummy. Oh, and I usually ask my opponents between games too, because I know it takes a bit longer.

Secondly: I've been trying to get into the habit of being polite and shaking someone's hand and saying "good game" after a match. This guy retorted with a "I only say good game when it actually IS a good game, but we just kind of took turns being mana screwed/flooded." I still feel like I'll keep on saying it regardless... but do you guys "good game" people even when it is not, in fact, a good game?

I think, honestly, you should spend 30 minutes learning how to shuffle some day and then you'll never have to worry about it again. It's not really a tough skill, and that's not me trying to put you down as many people don't know how -- it's not intuitive, but it can certainly be learned! Are you using card sleeves? If you're not, you could invest $9 in some Dragon Shields and start sleeving your draft decks. It only takes a couple minutes and it makes shuffling incredibly easy. Plus you get the bonus of protecting the value of any valuable cards you got. If you're playing sleeveless you're pretty much guaranteed to take your cards from near mint to lightly played.
 

Metal Slugger

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,424
St. Cloud, MN
If you side shuffle right you'll never have to do the pile thing. Double-sleeved Commander decks can be an exception but I usually just side shuffle each half then split and shuffle etc. Never fails.
 

onpoint

Neon Deity Games
Verified
Oct 26, 2017
14,929
716
I personally find glossy Dragon Shields stick together, matte sleeves for life! I actually really like the SCG ones when I play in tournaments. I have less problems with sticking and the shuffle is buttery smooth.
 
Oct 28, 2017
6,119
I personally find glossy Dragon Shields stick together, matte sleeves for life! I actually really like the SCG ones when I play in tournaments. I have less problems with sticking and the shuffle is buttery smooth.

I had always gone for glossy Dragon Shields because I liked the colors and the way they felt, but after hearing all the praise for matte, went ahead and bought some. Matte lovers are right. Dragon Shield matte sleeves are amazing.
 

onpoint

Neon Deity Games
Verified
Oct 26, 2017
14,929
716
I had always gone for glossy Dragon Shields because I liked the colors and the way they felt, but after hearing all the praise for matte, went ahead and bought some. Matte lovers are right. Dragon Shield matte sleeves are amazing.
I liked the colors too, and they're great for Commander decks. But once I got two warnings at a tournament because my cards were sticking together and coming off two at a time. I called the judge myself. Sleeves were brand new, was just super unfortunate. I just went in between rounds and replaced them. Never had another problem that day or since.
 
Oct 28, 2017
6,119
I liked the colors too, and they're great for Commander decks. But once I got two warnings at a tournament because my cards were sticking together and coming off two at a time. I called the judge myself. Sleeves were brand new, was just super unfortunate. I just went in between rounds and replaced them. Never had another problem that day or since.

I believe it. My latest set of normal sleeves stuck badly on my commander deck to the point that I had to replace them. That's when I first turned to matte.

Also, this conversation made me realize they just announced three more colors coming by the end of the year. They're all lighter and I don't like them, but some may be interested. Mist, Lilac and Baby Blue: http://www.dragonshield.com/standard-sleeves/matte-100

And speaking of sleeves, what is the sparkle effect on sapphire and jet like?
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,686
I usually don't shake hands when it's prerelease or FNM. It just feels weird to congratulate someone when the stakes are so casual lol
It's not congratulating people, it's just showing basic adult politeness and illustrating that no matter what happened in the game, one is willing to touch the other person, acknowledge them as a human worthy of basic respect, and move on.

Honestly it would probably be better for people's behavior if it was mandatory to shake hands before AND after games. I think there was some random card game that specified that. Afterwards is a decent compromise though.
 
Oct 28, 2017
6,119
It's not congratulating people, it's just showing basic adult politeness and illustrating that no matter what happened in the game, one is willing to touch the other person, acknowledge them as a human worthy of basic respect, and move on.

Yup. It's a sign of mutual respect, not a congratulation. Though I also don't see why you wouldn't congratulate someone on winning. Everyone at FNM wants to win, even if their #1 goal is having fun above all else.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,686
Those custom events sound terrible...
They sound intriguing enough for me to at least try once. It's nice to have options, and people who don't want funky modes can ignore them so it should be a win-win.

The biggest challenge to MTGA will be for us as a community not to turn into Hearthstone. It's basically a tradition on any given week, despite 20+ custom game modes a year, for people to complain that although all tavern brawls are the worst, the current tavern brawl is even WORSE.
 

Ultron

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
2,765
My only concern with weird formats (and this was always true for Hearthstone too) is that it encourages the use of Wildcards on cards that aren't constructed viable, which is a tough sell. It's different from paper, I'm totally willing to buy a dollar mythic for some dumb deck to play a few times, but in this that dumb Mythic that's only good on "everything has Convoke day" is the exact same cost as an Assassin's Trophy (Edit: I now remember that Trophy isn't a mythic).
 
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Oct 25, 2017
3,686
My only concern with weird formats (and this was always true for Hearthstone too) is that it encourages the use of Wildcards on cards that aren't constructed viable, which is a tough sell. It's different from paper, I'm totally willing to buy a dollar mythic for some dumb deck to play a few times, but in this that dumb Mythic that's only good on "everything has Convoke day" is the exact same cost as an Assassin's Trophy.
Maybe, but on the flip side if I got stuck with that random mythic, I could be happy getting use it out of it since I'm behind on the lucrative money earning competitive card front.
 
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SigmasonicX

SigmasonicX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,474
Getting into the card tie in manga/anime game too late. Though the fact that this takes place in the 90's means this can't be used for advertising new sets. Weird. Then again, I suppose Stranger Things didn't involve current DnD.

And of course, from the art, this seems more like a romance series that includes Magic playing rather than a series about playing Magic.
 

Angry Grimace

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
11,539
Getting into the card tie in manga/anime game too late. Though the fact that this takes place in the 90's means this can't be used for advertising new sets. Weird. Then again, I suppose Stranger Things didn't involve current DnD.

And of course, from the art, this seems more like a romance series that includes Magic playing rather than a series about playing Magic.
I hope they randomly reference using the batch to resolve spells, or the main girl quitting when Urza's Saga comes out and everything is busted
 

Firemind

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,530
Yup. It's a sign of mutual respect, not a congratulation. Though I also don't see why you wouldn't congratulate someone on winning. Everyone at FNM wants to win, even if their #1 goal is having fun above all else.
Last time I went to FNM was years ago, but I think I rarely shake hands at FNM because I rarely lose lol. If my opponent doesn't want to take the initiative to shake hands after conceding then whatever.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,686
Last time I went to FNM was years ago, but I think I rarely shake hands at FNM because I rarely lose lol. If my opponent doesn't want to take the initiative to shake hands after conceding then whatever.
And this is why it's a good habit to have -- in this situation, it becomes a show of domination where the loser may feel they're forced to humiliate themselves if they want to shake hands, so they just slink away instead.

If you're the winner and you offer to shake hands, you're putting yourself at risk of being turned down and making yourself vulnerable, which is a good thing. You won! You can afford to show respect and vulnerability.
 

Bigkrev

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,307

Getting into the card tie in manga/anime game too late. Though the fact that this takes place in the 90's means this can't be used for advertising new sets. Weird. Then again, I suppose Stranger Things didn't involve current DnD.

And of course, from the art, this seems more like a romance series that includes Magic playing rather than a series about playing Magic.

This is the same artist behind the Manga's Molester Man and Onani Master Kurwosawa, so naturally i'm really freaking excited about this.
He's also done art for Hareyuya in the past for their store and website, and he follows some of the Japanese pro players, so he's pretty familiar with the game as well
 

Angry Grimace

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
11,539
This is the same artist behind the Manga's Molester Man and Onani Master Kurwosawa, so naturally i'm really freaking excited about this.
He's also done art for Hareyuya in the past for their store and website, and he follows some of the Japanese pro players, so he's pretty familiar with the game as well
I've read both of those but I find it totally sounds bizarre to promote something based on being from the writer of "Molester Man" and "Masturbation Master Kurosawa" because it sounds like some kind of really weird porn.
 

Bigkrev

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,307
I've read both of those but I find it totally sounds bizarre to promote something based on being from the writer of "Molester Man" and "Masturbation Master Kurosawa" because it sounds like some kind of really weird porn.
I know my younger brother would love Molester Man, but he refuses to read it because of the name alone!
I get tired of typing "Molester Man (which is NOT what you think it is)"
 

Firemind

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,530
If it changes anything, I do offer advice to novices on what cards not to play, mana bases and sometimes their plays if I know what was in their hands.
 
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SigmasonicX

SigmasonicX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,474
This year's holiday card
DqYlAvNWwAAUO6s.jpg:small


They're also testing out a new product with Ravnica Allegiance

"Collector Booster"
MSRP $12.99
15 cards - 2 foil of any rarity, 3 rares or mythic rares, 10 uncommons

Triple the price of a normal booster seems like a bit much for no commons, but I don't know, maybe the math works out.
 

Bigkrev

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,307
This year's holiday card
DqYlAvNWwAAUO6s.jpg:small


They're also testing out a new product with Ravnica Allegiance

"Collector Booster"
MSRP $12.99
15 cards - 2 foil of any rarity, 3 rares or mythic rares, 10 uncommons

Triple the price of a normal booster seems like a bit much for no commons, but I don't know, maybe the math works out.
So for 2 cents more than 3 boosters, you get 1 extra uncommon, 30 less commons, and something like 1.5 more foils on average

This sounds like something that will rot on LGS shelfs for years, but might not be the worst idea for Target/Walmart
 
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SigmasonicX

SigmasonicX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,474
So for 2 cents more than 3 boosters, you get 1 extra uncommon, 30 less commons, and something like 1.5 more foils on average

This sounds like something that will rot on LGS shelfs for years, but might not be the worst idea for Target/Walmart
It sounds like it's targeted for an uncle/aunt that wants to get a gift and remembers their niece/nephew is a Magic collector, so they see this at Walmart and think it sounds perfect.
 

onpoint

Neon Deity Games
Verified
Oct 26, 2017
14,929
716
Honestly if I were gonna crack random packs I'd probably pick up one of those here or there.

I hate getting all that junk.
 
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