Media Create Sales: Week 50, 2018 (Dec 10 - Dec 16)

Nov 7, 2017
1,645
How are we debating “core” software sales for the Wii in the year 2018.
Generally speaking if I see the terms casual gamer, core gamer or hardcore gamer featuring heavily in a discussion I know to immediately just ignore it. Nobody has ever actually quantified those terms which means the discussion goes around and around and constantly changes points of reference. That’s why the same arguments get rehashed so much.
 
Oct 27, 2017
33
Final Fantasy VII is coming to Switch next year. Snake isnt getting many games these days. Street Fighter collection came to Switch earlier this year, also USF2, 3DS got Street Fighter IV. Street Fighter V is moneyhatted away from the system.

We are literally getting FF7 on switch. Metal Gear 3 for the 3DS was close to Smash brawl. SF4 was before SF5 and 4 was on 3ds as well.
I'm talking about big mainline games like MGS5, FF7R and SFV. In the same vein, we're talking about the a new update to a mainline Persona game, not some 22 year old game that's been ported a dozen times already. We saw none of MGS5, FF7R and SFV announced on Wii, Wii U or Switch. I don't see how smash inclusion is any big give away whether P5R will on the Switch or not. These are bad examples to compare to.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,526
Canada
How are we debating “core” software sales for the Wii in the year 2018.
Your guess is as good as mine. I didn't consider it a terribly controversial statement now that the generation is over and we see how things panned out that Wii didn't have the core audience that the other consoles of the 7th generation did, but apparently it is still quite controversial and/or flat-out wrong and requires that such a statement be justified. *shrug*
 
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Chris1964

Chris1964

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Oct 25, 2017
3,955
Some here on ERA are underestimating the power of Super Mario Bros because it looks unexciting to their eyes compared something like the deluxe version of Mario Kart 8.
The simplicity and familiarity of the gameplay is part of SMB popularity.
I expect the deluxe version to sell > 10M worldwide.
I don't see it going so high, but something like 5m can happen. There are many 2d platformers on Switch and more are coming soon. Yoshi will be out less than 3 months later and Mario Maker 2 must not be very far. Mario Kart has literally no competition.

1m will be also be difficult in Japan.
 
Oct 27, 2017
919
Famitsu digital sales numbers for the period between October 29 and November 25 in Japan

Battlefield V number is pretty fantastic, especially compared relatively to Pokémon. That would mean BFV total is 205K+

With Famitsu digital, Call of Duty : Black Ops 4 is now above 628,692.
  • Pokemon: Let’s Go, Pikachu! and Pokemon: Let’s Go, Eevee! (Switch – released November 16) – 88,039 digital sales
  • Battlefield V (PS4, Xbox One – released November 9) – 70,396 digital sales
  • Puyo Puyo eSports (Switch – released October 25) – 65,985 digital sales
  • Fallout 76 (PS4, Xbox One – released November 14) _ 44,611 digital sales
  • Puyo Puyo eSports (PS4 – released October 25) – 42,784 digital sales
  • Call of Duty: Black Ops IIII (PS4, Xbox One – released October 12) – 23,098 digital sales
  • Dead by Daylight Special Edition (PS4 – released April 4) – 11,856 digital sales
  • Minecraft: Nintendo Switch Edition (Switch) – 10,924 digital sales
  • Undertale (Switch) – 9,275 digital sales
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,392
Your guess is as good as mine. I didn't consider it a terribly controversial statement now that the generation is over and we see how things panned out that Wii didn't have the core audience that the other consoles of the 7th generation did, but apparently it is still quite controversial and/or flat-out wrong. *shrug*
Many of us had to live with almost a decade of people coming into Media-Create threads and talking about “core” and “casual” sales as a way to slight Nintendo over a perceived lack of games that appealed to them personally even if the Wii and DS had plenty of games of all types. It’s a really tired argument and if you make that distinction in games you aren’t going to get many favorable responses.
 
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Chris1964

Chris1964

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Oct 25, 2017
3,955
The only way to compare difference at buying habits between Switch and previous Nintendo consoles is sales across the same franchises and how these lead to increase or decrease of third party support.

"Casual" and "hardcore" gaming are archaic terms that remind me of home and handheld console different markets.
 
Oct 26, 2017
7,540
I'm talking about big mainline games like MGS5, FF7R and SFV. In the same vein, we're talking about the a new update to a mainline Persona game, not some 22 year old game that's been ported a dozen times already. We saw none of MGS5, FF7R and SFV announced on Wii, Wii U or Switch. I don't see how smash inclusion is any big give away whether P5R will on the Switch or not. These are bad examples to compare to.
I think the difference between P5 and FF7R is that FF7R simply cannot run on Switch while P5 can run on it easily. I'm sure at some point when Nintendo make a console that is powerful enough, games like MGSV and FF7R will be on it as well.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,526
Canada
Many of us had to live with almost a decade of people coming into Media-Create threads and talking about “core” and “casual” sales as a way to slight Nintendo over a perceived lack of games that appealed to them personally even if the Wii and DS had plenty of games of all types. It’s a really tired argument and if you make that distinction in games you aren’t going to get many favorable responses.
I understand it's a contentious bone to pick, but there was a contingent of people who were buying Wii consoles who fled the market immediately after the 7th generation and they weren't likely picking up Resident Evil when they browsed the aisle, so the shorthand stayed with me. It's not a slight against those games or the people who played them, and I'm not one of those loonies who tried to claim most Nintendo franchises fit the description of a "casual game" or anything like that, but that demographic I mentioned doesn't defy categorization and needs a shorter name. I'm open to hearing other suggestions.

The only way to compare difference at buying habits between Switch and previous Nintendo consoles is sales across the same franchises and how these lead to increase or decrease of third party support.
Can't say I didn't try to do that. It apparently didn't pass muster because I used Nintendo franchises to do it, the only constant across Nintendo hardware releases, which was... bad apparently?
 
Oct 25, 2017
244
Things will go wild with PlayStation Classic price drops after holidays. It barely sells and there's still a lot of stock.
Didn't you say Japanese retailers rarely ever discount hardware when it underperforms, since they lose money from the discount? That must mean that the situation for the PSC is really dire.
 
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Chris1964

Chris1964

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Oct 25, 2017
3,955
Didn't you say Japanese retailers rarely ever discount hardware when it underperforms, since they lose money from the discount? That must mean that the situation for the PSC is really dire.
I said deep discounts for hardware are rare because of limited profit unless something ultra bombs. PlayStation Classic is heading to that category.
 
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Chris1964

Chris1964

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Oct 25, 2017
3,955
Can't say I didn't try to do that. It apparently didn't pass muster because I used Nintendo franchises to do it, the only constant across Nintendo hardware releases, which was... bad apparently?
There are many examples from third party games that appeared at both Wii and Switch at their first two years.
 
Oct 25, 2017
592
Canada
I think the difference between P5 and FF7R is that FF7R simply cannot run on Switch while P5 can run on it easily. I'm sure at some point when Nintendo make a console that is powerful enough, games like MGSV and FF7R will be on it as well.
Of course it cannot run on Switch. It doesn't exist yet.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,392
I understand it's a contentious bone to pick, but there was a contingent of people who were buying Wii consoles who fled the market immediately after the 7th generation and they weren't likely picking up Resident Evil when they browsed the aisle, so the shorthand stayed with me. It's not a slight against those games or the people who played them, and I'm not one of those loonies who tried to claim most Nintendo franchises fit the description of a "casual game" or anything like that, but that demographic I mentioned doesn't defy categorization and needs a shorter name. I'm open to hearing other suggestions.
Well sure, there certainly was a different audience, but did it detract from the system? Like the example you just gave with Resident Evil is a bad one as a late port of Resident Evil 4 sold way better on Wii than the original game did on GameCube.

As Chris said, the best way is to directly compare series you are talking about generation to generation and not make generalizations that might not hold up upon further scrutiny.
 
Feb 26, 2018
2,648
I think the difference between P5 and FF7R is that FF7R simply cannot run on Switch while P5 can run on it easily. I'm sure at some point when Nintendo make a console that is powerful enough, games like MGSV and FF7R will be on it as well.
FFVIIR is an UE4 game just like DQ11.

mgsV was a ps3/360 game and yet they didn't put it on wii u.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,526
Canada
There are many examples from third party games that appeared at both Wii and Switch at their first two years.
Unless they're the same franchise and genre and the same number of titles, it's a bit less clear-cut, isn't it? The best I can think of is RE4 next year being a complete one-to-one comparison and that's not without its faults, since it's a re-release from a decade ago. I could compare MH games, but comparing a new entry to a late up-rezzed port that was upstaged by a new entry on other hardware has so many holes in it that most people would know it's a poor comparison to make. And after that, I run out of titles to make the comparison with one-to-one without it becoming a bit of a reach.

You see the trouble with what you're suggesting, right? It doesn't exactly dis-invite further scrutiny from people looking to find some, depending on what you compare. The only way I can see around that is a broader volume comparison with an array of like titles that have the same sales expectations around them, a bulk sampling to get around individual hiccups like I described above, but not the whole library, since it invites the conversation that was had earlier. I'm open to inviting a comparison under those parameters. Not sure how I'd go about getting that data, is the issue.

That's why I compared Nintendo franchises in the first place, particularly Zelda, since they perfectly align: both were cross-gen from lower-selling hardware, Twilight Princess was previously the franchise's best-selling title ever, they appealed to the same demographic, both were launch titles... you couldn't ask for a more one-to-one comparison if you tried. Odyssey and Galaxy also have many similar characteristics that make it hard not to make the comparison to find shifting demographics.
And it's not as though Nintendo themselves aren't immune to changes in the demographics that buy their hardware; the Labo discussion that was had earlier alludes to that, as does sales of 1-2-Switch.

But if it must be 3rd-party titles, I can live with that, so long as the data collected works to factor out variables that would taint the result in either direction.
 
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Oct 25, 2017
3,743
Italy
There doesn't exist any internal rule which dictates that Persona must be a Sony exclusive franchise and SMT must be a Nintendo exclusive franchise. Atlus is not a big company and minimize risk. Developing on more than one platform might seen as risky especially considering the fact that until some time ago its franchises weren't big outside Japan.

Persona has always appeared on Sony platform where Atlus cultivated the fanbase. SMT was a smaller franchise and Atlus followed a low cost approach by choosing 3DS, after some good results on DS.
 
Dec 5, 2017
1,603
I'm talking about big mainline games like MGS5, FF7R and SFV. In the same vein, we're talking about the a new update to a mainline Persona game, not some 22 year old game that's been ported a dozen times already. We saw none of MGS5, FF7R and SFV announced on Wii, Wii U or Switch. I don't see how smash inclusion is any big give away whether P5R will on the Switch or not. These are bad examples to compare to.
It doesn't really matter, main FF games (even we talking about old ports) are coming to Switch, also we had MGS2 on GC and MGS3 on 3DS.
But for comparison, Joker from Persona 5 like Smash DLC is totally weird announcement, its not very strong IP and its not famous character outside game itself,
so that announcement doesn't make too much sense, unless Persona 5 doesnt comes to Switch, than all totally makes sense.

Also there is good point that every main Persona game had re-release later on handheld, and with point that Vita is dead and Switch new king of Japan,
Switch release sound more believable.
 
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Wescoast76

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Sep 22, 2018
260
I said deep discounts for hardware are rare because of limited profit unless something ultra bombs. PlayStation Classic is heading to that category.
When you say the playstation classic is looking to be an "ultra bomb" what do you mean by that? Are there any products we can compare it to?
 
Oct 26, 2017
7,540
Sure, I wouldn't expect a Playstation 5 game to run on Switch.
FF7R will be a current gen game or cross gen at best if PS5 is really releasing in late 2020 like most expected. Also believe it or not, a lot of PS5 games will run on Switch. It's not about what platform the game is on, it's about what exactly this game is.
 
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Chris1964

Chris1964

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Oct 25, 2017
3,955
When you say the playstation classic is looking to be an "ultra bomb" what do you mean by that? Are there any products we can compare it to?
Big amounts of unsold stock. Before Famicom and Super Famicom Mini, retro consoles were niche products with very limited prints. There isn't something equivalent in the past.
 

Wescoast76

Tried to circumvent ban with an alt-account
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Sep 22, 2018
260
Big amounts of unsold stock. Before Famicom and Super Famicom Mini retro consoles were niche products with very limited prints. There isn't something equivalent in the past.
Wow. That's insane. So sony will lose a lot of money on this hardware?
 
Oct 26, 2017
7,540
Atlus is also the company that releases Catherine Full Body on Vita in 2019. It's also the company that hates PC. The only reason a Switch port won't happen is that it makes too much sense.

Wow. That's insane. So sony will lose a lot of money on this hardware?
Retailers will lose a lot of money on these things.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,802
Tokyo
FF7R will be a current gen game or cross gen at best if PS5 is really releasing in late 2020 like most expected. Also believe it or not, a lot of PS5 games will run on Switch. It's not about what platform the game is on, it's about what exactly this game is.
You shouldn't question SE's ability to rework a title making it exclusive for the console after they announced it for. It's kind of their Schtick.
 
Oct 29, 2017
1,886
FF7R will be a current gen game or cross gen at best if PS5 is really releasing in late 2020 like most expected. Also believe it or not, a lot of PS5 games will run on Switch. It's not about what platform the game is on, it's about what exactly this game is.
Judging by SE track record, we can't rule out FF7R episode 1 to release in 2023.
 
Oct 26, 2017
7,540
You shouldn't question SE's ability to rework a title making it exclusive for the console after they announced it for. It's kind of their Schtick.
Judging by SE track record, we can't rule out FF7R episode 1 to release in 2023.
No seriously. I believe they will show FF7R in 2019, and when they show it it will be in a state that is close to release. I believe they planned to show it in 2018 but retracted to leave the spotlight to KH3.
 
Mar 20, 2018
2,347
By the time FF7R finishes its development, there will be a nintendo device strong enough to play it.
Granted by then we will be playing DQ13 and Pokemon Gen 11, but it will happen.
 
Did Japan get the Fortnite Switch bundle?
Yup, but it was My Nintendo Store exclusive, so not tracked by anyone.

Has the inclusion of a series in smash ever indicated the arrival of it on the same console? We’ve seen Snake, Cloud and Ryu and yet none of their mainline games have come to a Nintendo console afterwards. Not that it isn’t possible to see P5 on the switch, but this “joker in smash” thing is a red herring.
Usually, I would completely agree with you, but this time it's different.

The fact that Nintendo themselves hand-picked the DLC characters themselves is proof the Joker announcement is more than meets the eye. Persona series is nowhere near as big and influential as the other 3rd-party series, and what's more, it's never appeared on Nintendo platforms before (with the exception of a moderately popular spin-off series... and no, they didn't pick Joker to promote Persona Q2 on 3DS of all platforms).

It wouldn't make sense for Nintendo to pick Joker as DLC character (not to mention reveal it during a major events with million of viewers worldwide) if not because of something bigger. There's tons of other characters they could've gone with instead (from both 1st and 3rd-party series).

As I said, I usually don't buy into this kind of stuff at all, and generally remain pretty skeptical, but this time it's too big to be mere coincidence. But it looks like we might not have to wait too long before finding out, so let's just wait and see.
 
Oct 31, 2017
5,670
It's never too late to discuss the Wii and the game cubes. Never forget always remember.


Because that's what Principate was using as his basis to say Wii sold a lot of core software. If there's an issue with that, take it up with him. I tried using hard numbers with the only consistent data we have on core game sales, but they were Nintendo sales compared across consoles, so they couldn't be used to measure changes in console demographics, apparently, despite "Nintendo core franchises" being the only true constant on every piece of Nintendo hardware.
Your still doing this? Ok then, notice how you completely ignored responding to my last post because you didn't have an arguement against it put proving my point anyway about complaining rather than posting evidence and engaging. Tie ratio or totals your point is incorrect since the two are linked. It's far more impressive for system with a far higher total hardware to sell similar or lower than the game cubes tie ratio. In comparison to other way around. Tie ratio increase normally decrease the longer the system sells at high quanties.
 
Oct 26, 2017
2,339
Japan
No seriously. I believe they will show FF7R in 2019, and when they show it it will be in a state that is close to release. I believe they planned to show it in 2018 but retracted to leave the spotlight to KH3.
Didn't they have to largely start over after CC2 was pulled from the project? Wouldn't that explain 2018?

Define "close."
 
Oct 26, 2017
2,339
Japan
Within in 18 months. Basically, I think FF7R will come out in 2020, or maybe early 2021, either way it won't be next gen exclusive.
Well I want this to be true.

They just started development in like May 2017... Five years gives 2022 which seems reasonable.

I'm pretty sure they threw all of CC2's stuff away.
I'd imagine they'd be able to reuse the assets?