MGSV Pro Patch available tomorrow

Staticneuron · Nov 3, 2017

Gamer17 said:
Please do not spread misinformation. Downsampling needs no additional power. Why Sony is not implementing it like Ms is another question all together. But has zero to do with power of the console

It seems as if I wasn't clear enough. Most PS4 games have broken down into modes. Favoring resolution or those favoring performance. A few games have 1080p versions that have additional graphics. The console has to have the power to render the screen and the graphics at a higher resolution to Downsample. That requires power. Either you go with what is offered at 4K or go with the 1080p solution that may have other graphical enhancements. Those that want the downsample may lose out. Sony leaves that in the Developers hands. The X1X has more power which enables them to push the same effects at a higher resolution (which in turn effects what people expect to see after downsample)

From DF Tomb Raider comparison

The Pro's 'enriched' mode also makes an appearance on Xbox One X and seems to feature a very similar visual feature set, packing in more graphical upgrades ported over from the PC version. However, the big difference here is that it's presented as an alternative 4K mode, as opposed to PS4's 1080p presentation.

Like I posted above the desired end result is decided by dev and Sony is not going to force implementation. They just leave that in the Devs hands.

Gamer17 · Nov 3, 2017

Staticneuron said:
It seems as if I wasn't clear enough. Most PS4 games have broken down into modes. Favoring resolution or those favoring performance. A few games have 1080p versions that have additional graphics. The console has to have the power to render the screen and the graphics at a higher resolution to Downsample. That requires power. Either you go with what is offered at 4K or go with the 1080p solution that may have other graphical enhancements. Those that want the downsample may lose out. Sony leaves that in the Developers hands. The X1X has more power which enables them to push the same effects at a higher resolution (which in turn effects what people expect to see after downsample)

From DF Tomb Raider comparison

Like I posted above the desired end result is decided by dev and Sony is not going to force implementation. They just leave that in the Devs hands.

Point is when you choose resolution and ps4 pro is out putting higher resolution than 1080p it should down sample for people with 1080 TV. Just like rise of tomb raider down samples on 1080 p TV when u choose the 4k mode. Downsampling from a higher resolution than 1080 to 1080p needs no additional power

Staticneuron · Nov 3, 2017

Gamer17 said:
Point is when you choose resolution and ps4 pro is out putting higher resolution than 1080p it should down sample for people with 1080 TV. Just like rise of tomb raider down samples on 1080 p TV when u choose the 4k mode. Downsampling from a higher resolution than 1080 to 1080p needs no additional power

I have already explained post here

Staticneuron said:
Like I said I wasn't sure but I knew Sony left it up to the devs. The examples provided such as Horizon was handled by the devs. There is not one case where you can point do where it was done on OS level. Of course there have been no performance issues if the devs had a hand in it. I doubt we would see it if there were. I am speculating this is why they are silent and why we haven't seen an even implementation of it nor an OS level solution.

I am just pointing out that the console power may be the reason. Not only the power needed to run at 4k but the power to enable all the additional effects a dev may use for "quality" renders. If Sony could brute force it all, then they would do it and not worry about a negative effect on games. So yes it is correct in thinking that it doesn't need additional poer to downsample a 4K image but that isn't what has been happening ever since the pro was released. Few games are native, while others offer varying solutions.

kc44135 · Nov 3, 2017

Staticneuron said:
It seems as if I wasn't clear enough. Most PS4 games have broken down into modes. Favoring resolution or those favoring performance. A few games have 1080p versions that have additional graphics. The console has to have the power to render the screen and the graphics at a higher resolution to Downsample. That requires power. Either you go with what is offered at 4K or go with the 1080p solution that may have other graphical enhancements. Those that want the downsample may lose out. Sony leaves that in the Developers hands. The X1X has more power which enables them to push the same effects at a higher resolution (which in turn effects what people expect to see after downsample)

From DF Tomb Raider comparison

Like I posted above the desired end result is decided by dev and Sony is not going to force implementation. They just leave that in the Devs hands.

There are games that favor higher quality visuals/higher frame rate at 1080p, rather than Downsampling, which I think is fine. 1080p owners still benefit significantly in that case. However, that doesn't explain why some games (like MGSV) don't offer Downsampling, tho. MGSV on a 1080p TV running on a PRO has no benefits of any kind for 1080p TV owners, and it's not the only game that does this. There's no reason why that should be the case aside from, of course, a dev/publisher not wanting to put in whatever presumably miniscule effort is required to make the game Downsample. Hate to go there, but... what other explanation is there?

Unknown · Nov 3, 2017

Staticneuron said:
Downsampling requires power. The PS4 Pro is not powerful enough for Sony to assume that their solution will work evenly for all titles, so they leave that in the hands of the developers. The X1X is more powerful so it is afforded the same luxury to hit the target. It really isn't a difficult concept. But Sony does what they tend to do, leave it in the hands of the devs, and while that may annoy people who want to see it uniformly across all titles, it does allow for devs to experiment and some to stand out greatly.

This is incorrect. Downsampling is handled by a dedicated part of the system, it has no impact on GPU performance.
If the game outputs 2160, it'll downsample fine to any output resolution or colour format. This is a basic requirement of a console, as having to handle output conversion / scanout would be a massive pain.
Otherwise 1080p games would be slower on a 4K TV as the GPU would have to be upscaling (upscaling an image is actually quite a bit more expensive than downscaling).
For whatever reason certain developers choose to not allow 4K output on 1080p TVs.

Staticneuron · Nov 3, 2017

kc44135 said:
There are games that favor higher quality visuals/higher frame rate at 1080p, rather than Downsampling, which I think is fine. 1080p owners still benefit significantly in that case. However, that doesn't explain why some games (like MGSV) don't offer Downsampling, tho. MGSV on a 1080p TV running on a PRO has no benefits of any kind for 1080p TV owners, and it's not the only game that does this. There's no reason why that should be the case aside from, of course, a dev/publisher not wanting to put in whatever presumably miniscule effort is required to make the game Downsample. Hate to go there, but... what other explanation is there?

You are probably right in this case. Remember the entire team was let go after game was completed. I am surprised we even got a patch for it. Don't know who they have in konami that did it.

Unknown said:
This is incorrect. Downsampling is handled by a dedicated part of the system, it has no impact on GPU performance.
If the game outputs 2160, it'll downsample fine to any output resolution or colour format. This is a basic requirement of a console, as having to handle output conversion / scanout would be a massive pain.
Otherwise 1080p games would be slower on a 4K TV as the GPU would have to be upscaling (upscaling an image is actually quite a bit more expensive than downscaling).
For whatever reason certain developers choose to not allow 4K output on 1080p TVs.

I just clarified a few posts above.