Michael Cohen testifies on Capitol Hill (over)

lacer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,720
For the record: The convicted criminal lawyer showed more decorum and level headedness than the totally innocent Supreme Court nominee.
this is kind of the craziest thing to me; i hate to admit this, but for a guy who represented Trump, a man who has surrounded himself with detestable, charisma-vacuum dipshits, for over a decade, Cohen came across as strangely likeable? not likeable in the literal sense, but likable in the 'Paulie is likable when you compare him against Richie Aprile" sense
 

Replicant

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,300
MN
Domestic terrorists are a lot easier, as they typically have DLs, SS numbers, social media histories, criminal histories, tax records, known family... it's not like trying to chase down people in a place like Afghanistan, where they are phantoms by comparison.

And while I don't know this for sure I'd guess a domestic terrorist is FAR more likely to be identified/turned in by a citizen than an insurgent overseas.
Not mention it would be a lot more than military involved domestically. All law enforcement agencies would be.
 

Jiminy

Avenger
Mar 29, 2018
2,939
There’s such a doubleplusgood mentality from the GOP concerning Trump’s “best people” and how complicit they’ve all proven to be. This was Trump’s “fixer”, but they won’t entertain the notion he fixed some things for Trump?

“You’re a bad person... who was also hired by Potus and employed for ten years. You did a lot of bad things... just never anything bad for your biggest client.”

I mean, we know why, it’s just such an obvious disconnect.
Bang on, it's a robust display of doublethink
 

Netherscourge

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,091
The Dems know history is being made now, that's why they are more professional about things. Your kids will study this in history classes one day and the Dems will be shown as the liberators and prosecutors.

GoP is just embarrassed and desperate about being on the losing team. They have been suckered into Trumpland and are sinking with him into their own swamp. Best they can do is deflect and delay and project and distract. But history will show them as the enablers and deniers.
 
Nov 14, 2017
2,173
I mean, I haven’t even seen the clip and I’m not taken aback by Dems using this opportunity to score political points and be grandiose. That can be the case and this can simultaneously be about Cohen being genuinely apologetic for his own admitted wrongdoings.
You should watch Cumming's closing remarks. It's straight up liberal 'return to normalcy' vomit. I mean sure, if they want to take that line right now then whatever. I just think anyone who honestly believes that stuff isn't the sharpest tool in the box. It's not inspirational or moving.

That depends on what you mean by realpolitik. There was a clear agenda behind this testimony, to bring forward to the public the wrongdoings that their President has been involved in and has been covering up delivered from the very man who assisted him in carrying them out. If you're suggesting this was for the sole benefit of the Democratic party or had partisan intentions, then I don't agree at all. While it does benefit them, it also benefits the US people in helping them understand the extent of corruption and the character of their President, who is not fit for his position and is causing lasting damage to the US' political landscape by normalising behaviour which up until now was considered unacceptable.
Like, I'm not disagreeing with any of that, except for the normalcy part. Trump is, at the very least, pretty open. For all that he lies, everyone knows he's doing it. Even most Trump supporters would admit that he lies - I know several who think that. All politicians lie though, is what they'd say.

So, are you arguing that it would be better to go back to how things were before? When you had presidents who acted 'normal', but lied about torture or WMD? Or waged endless drone wars while failing to investigate massive financial crime? What came before is what created the conditions for Trump. The only way to stop anything like Trump again is to change those conditions. We shouldn't want to go back to how things were.
 

Seik

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,820
Québec City
Hes literally pleading with a nation to get their shit together. I can feel him, watching an entire lifes worth of draining political work be fucking annihilated in no time flat must be amazingly hard to watch. I give him props for not exploding like a bomb and instead, saying exactly what the country needed him to say in that moment. People who use their voice for others like Cummings has/does are my heroes.
It was insane, as his speech went on you could feel the tension and the passion ramping up. Then comes the part talking about the children and the legacy we're building for them going to shit, Cohen tears up, Cumming chokes...this was so heavy.

The only part that felt wrong was 'A better Donald Trump.' because I don't believe Trump can ever be better. I can't conceive that no matter how hard I try with my brain lol.

I have to give props to Cohen, too. He felt genuine the whole time. I do think he wants to be a better man and if he lied, well I'll just assume that I fell for it and think that he should become an actor because he was a good one today. I truly hope that's what he'll be looking for after he does his time in jail.
 

thesoapster

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,515
MD, USA
Bill Maher has been saying this for months. It might prove to be more difficult than we thought if hundreds or thousands of Trump supporters decide to arm up at Trump order.
I don't recall Maher ever saying that supporters are going to do that - only that he believes Trump will not leave office willingly, based on his behavior. And, to my recollection, virtually all his guests disagree and say one way or another he'll be leaving.
 
Nov 14, 2017
2,173
Here it is in case no one else hooked you up.

You guys need to sort your shit out and get her installed as president like, now. I saw that whole stream, and she was easily the most prepared with the most pertinent questions, with zero bullshit.

Like, she can do it in 6 years. So either after two term Bernie, or let Bernie retire after 1 term and change your constitution.
 

SpottieO

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,770
You guys need to sort your shit out and get her installed as president like, now. I saw that whole stream, and she was easily the most prepared with the most pertinent questions, with zero bullshit.

Like, she can do it in 6 years. So either after two term Bernie, or let Bernie retire after 1 term and change your constitution.
She’ll definitely be President one day but:

A) it’s too soon
B) lol Bernie as president
 
Jul 18, 2018
2,022
You guys need to sort your shit out and get her installed as president like, now. I saw that whole stream, and she was easily the most prepared with the most pertinent questions, with zero bullshit.

Like, she can do it in 6 years. So either after two term Bernie, or let Bernie retire after 1 term and change your constitution.
She's good at her job. However she hasn't shown us yet that she is ready to be a President, nor is she ready. When the time comes, but we need to slow down atm.
 

Eatin' Olives

Member
Oct 29, 2017
4,215
I believe Cohen but don't for one second consider him an "ally". He desperately wants a "redemption arc" to play out in the public media but if he hadn't been stabbed in the back by Trump he would, to this day, still be acting as a shitty thug, aiding and abetting all the gross, immoral shit he did before.

I'm not going to wish him ill will, but some shit just can't be forgiven and forgotten. He'll carry the shit he did for the rest of his days and no one should give him a pass just because he's anti-Trump now (not that I'm calling anyone out on here, just the general sentiment).
 

HammerOfThor

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,075
You guys need to sort your shit out and get her installed as president like, now. I saw that whole stream, and she was easily the most prepared with the most pertinent questions, with zero bullshit.

Like, she can do it in 6 years. So either after two term Bernie, or let Bernie retire after 1 term and change your constitution.
She's great, and shes young and hungry. But she's nowhere near ready to be president.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,172
United States
She's good at her job. However she hasn't shown us yet that she is ready to be a President, nor is she ready. When the time comes, but we need to slow down atm.
She literally cant be yet. Too young. Theres an age requirement.

People say too soon because of experience but in my opinion, it's too soon simply because I'd rather her stay right where shes at. She is making waves like I havent seen a senator do since before any of us were alive. If this is the power of the Senate, then let her dismantle the machine from the inside. If we get a president to actually coordinate with her, holy shit, watch the fuck out.
 

Window

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,586
You should watch Cumming's closing remarks. It's straight up liberal 'return to normalcy' vomit. I mean sure, if they want to take that line right now then whatever. I just think anyone who honestly believes that stuff isn't the sharpest tool in the box. It's not inspirational or moving.


Like, I'm not disagreeing with any of that, except for the normalcy part. Trump is, at the very least, pretty open. For all that he lies, everyone knows he's doing it. Even most Trump supporters would admit that he lies - I know several who think that. All politicians lie though, is what they'd say.

So, are you arguing that it would be better to go back to how things were before? When you had presidents who acted 'normal', but lied about torture or WMD? Or waged endless drone wars while failing to investigate massive financial crime? What came before is what created the conditions for Trump. The only way to stop anything like Trump again is to change those conditions. We shouldn't want to go back to how things were.
I didn't say all previous US presidents never lied or didn't make decisions which were morally questionable. But you kind of are already proving my point. "All politicians lie" you say, but "at least (Trump) pretty open". Do you not see any difference between the magnitude and frequency of Trump's lies and those of other politicians? What does it mean to openly lie? To acknowledge that you lied and keep going? I can't ever recall Trump acknowledging that he's lied. Or is it just to lie with great frequency even in the face of great evidence to the contrary? Is that how things have always been in the US? Most certainly the US in the past has looked the other way to many (many) wrongdoings committed by them but has it ever been so blatant? Have US presidents in the recent past so easily reaped financial benefits from their time as President while still in office? Have US presidents allowed members of their family to dominate and lead policy agendas in a clear sign of nepotism? Have US presidents made implicit public threats to witnesses? I'm not even going to bring up his actual actions and policies because of course he would push for the positions of his party but even then is he actually sticking to the Republican agenda (one would think the Republican party would be pro free trade)? All of these set bad precedents for others to follow down the line. There may very well have been worse Presidents than him in the past (including Bush) but that doesn't mean that one cannot demand for higher standards than what Trump is displaying right now.
 

mutantmagnet

Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,363
It's not like our military has a great track record with terrorists. Innocent civilians will likely suffer if they are needed.

That's not their job. At the federal level, That is the job of the intelligence agencies to prepare us and intercept them.
A far-right militia would never get treated as a terrorist group.
It depends on the group. Parts of the FBI do treat them as terrorists. The rest and most of the news media don't.


Can people use their brains for once before they freak out about these fantasies?

Do you really think Trump supporters, which mainly consist of a bunch of rural white dudes, are going to grab all their guns, mobilize all the way to Washington, invade the White House to keep Trump in there should he lose in 2020?

Ofcourse they would. We already saw them move to the border during Trumps national guard stunt.

What matters is that the numbers that willing are insufficient to matter.
 

Window

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,586
People glorifying AOC but ain't putting respect on Khanna and Gomez for the layup
Yep, that very much felt like a coordinated set of questions between them all starting from establishing that Trump has been involved "garden variety" financial fraud to the need to release tax return + perform audits to confirm these crimes + getting to the history and associates involved in the crimes.
 
Nov 14, 2017
2,173
She’ll definitely be President one day but:

A) it’s too soon
B) lol Bernie as president
She's good at her job. However she hasn't shown us yet that she is ready to be a President, nor is she ready. When the time comes, but we need to slow down atm.
She's great, and shes young and hungry. But she's nowhere near ready to be president.
I mean, anyone can be president really. Trump has shown that. Having them have some actual good ideas and be pure 🔥 is just a bonus.

Also, if you don't believe me: Belgium didn't have a government for 589 days and it was fine.

And yea, shouts to Gomez and Khanna too.
 

Tya

Member
Oct 30, 2017
902
She literally cant be yet. Too young. Theres an age requirement.

People say too soon because of experience but in my opinion, it's too soon simply because I'd rather her stay right where shes at. She is making waves like I havent seen a senator do since before any of us were alive. If this is the power of the Senate, then let her dismantle the machine from the inside. If we get a president to actually coordinate with her, holy shit, watch the fuck out.
She's not a senator, dude. She just a house rep.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,172
United States
Right, he was saying after the next term, which she would be old enough to be. But right now she doesn't show anything worthy to be running for a president nomination yet
I dunno about that. I'd say shes at least shown to never underestimate her and she can hit WAY above her pay grade. The fact that she isnt corrupt yet and still full of fire might be a benefit. And honestly, you never know what one is capable of until you let them try. Shes proving us all wrong about what she can do everyday.
 

BlueTsunami

Member
Oct 29, 2017
3,612
“Ready to be president”

The bar is currently set well below the benchmarks of “criminal”, “adulterer” and “racist”
Honestly anyone with a good moral compass would do. AoC has that and more. Hopefully she stays in congress long enough, and maintains the fire, to consider a presidential run down the line.
 

Jmdajr

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,330
people spent time trying to downplay AOC and I had no expectations for her, but I’ll be damned if she wasn’t the most productive congress member today. No grandstanding, just asking questions with purpose and getting the answers that she wanted.

She is legit
I was impressed. No bullshit talking points.
 

Granadier

Member
Nov 4, 2018
976
Brooklyn
AOC expertly extracted all of the information needed to request a subpoena of Trump's tax returns, holy shit.

And Cummings' closing statement was one of the most powerful speeches I've heard since the Obama-era, holy shit. Seeing his fervor and anger over the disgusting state that the current admin has brought the US into, and with Cohen simultaneously visibly coming to terms with just how damaging his actions have been.

Phew, brought some onions into the room.
 

schwifty

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
276
You guys need to sort your shit out and get her installed as president like, now. I saw that whole stream, and she was easily the most prepared with the most pertinent questions, with zero bullshit.

Like, she can do it in 6 years. So either after two term Bernie, or let Bernie retire after 1 term and change your constitution.
Just because she does something correctly doesn’t mean she should become President.
 

BoboBrazil

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,448
When Cohen lists a couple of names and one of them is "Matthew Calamari" it all really just sounds like straight out of a movie/show.

Matthew Calamari.

Just....just damn.

Edit:


Holy shit he even looks the part
This is the guy rumored to threaten Stormy Daniels in the parking lot when she was going to go public I think back in 2011
 

Klyka

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,718
Germany
Too many people in the US are too focused on "we need a new President".
Yes you do. But it's not the main priority.
Your main priority is "We need to fix our political system from the ground up".
You can cut off the head of the snake as much as you want, it won't help you outside of a short break because the head will just grow back again and again and the fangs will be more poisonous every time.
 
Nov 14, 2017
2,173
I didn't say all previous US presidents never lied or didn't make decisions which were morally questionable. But you kind of are already proving my point. "All politicians lie" you say, but "at least (Trump) pretty open". Do you not see any difference between the magnitude and frequency of Trump's lies and those of other politicians? What does it mean to openly lie? To acknowledge that you lied and keep going? I can't ever recall Trump acknowledging that he's lied. Or is it just to lie with great frequency even in the face of great evidence to the contrary? Is that how things have always been in the US? Most certainly the US in the past has looked the other way to many (many) wrongdoings committed by them but has it ever been so blatant? Have US presidents in the recent past so easily reaped financial benefits from their time as President while still in office? Have US presidents allowed members of their family to dominate and lead policy agendas in a clear sign of nepotism? Have US presidents made implicit public threats to witnesses? I'm not even going to bring up his actual actions and policies because of course he would push for the positions of his party but even then is he actually sticking to the Republican agenda (one would think the Republican party would be pro free trade)? All of these set bad precedents for others to follow down the line. There may very well have been worse Presidents than him in the past (including Bush) but that doesn't mean that one cannot demand for higher standards than what Trump is displaying right now.
I don't think any of that matters. In fact, in many respects it's actually quite helpful - it lays bare the true nature of US power and how the ruling class in the USA really behaves. After Trump, anyone who tries to argue that the office of the president or the constitution are somehow imbued with any kind of inherent integrity or virtue should be laughed at for being naïve. It's such a simplistic view of politics and power held by people who watched The West Wing and somehow thought it was real.
 
Oct 26, 2017
5,039
South Carolina
"C'mon people; we can't do it all here. You saw what was shown. You heard what was said. Now do what the country needs of you."

The Dems know history is being made now, that's why they are more professional about things. Your kids will study this in history classes one day and the Dems will be shown as the liberators and prosecutors.

GoP is just embarrassed and desperate about being on the losing team. They have been suckered into Trumpland and are sinking with him into their own swamp. Best they can do is deflect and delay and project and distract. But history will show them as the enablers and deniers.
Thought: the closer we get to the inevitable collapse (before or after the inauguration), the more crazy and reckless a GOP congresscritter/talking head gets, the more likely they are not just playing a part or trying to save what Individual-1 is dragging into the abyss with him, but culpable of their own crimes. You don't do this when you're comfortable or risking mere inconvenience. This is fight or flight.

Watch.

I believe Cohen but don't for one second consider him an "ally". He desperately wants a "redemption arc" to play out in the public media but if he hadn't been stabbed in the back by Trump he would, to this day, still be acting as a shitty thug, aiding and abetting all the gross, immoral shit he did before.

I'm not going to wish him ill will, but some shit just can't be forgiven and forgotten. He'll carry the shit he did for the rest of his days and no one should give him a pass just because he's anti-Trump now (not that I'm calling anyone out on here, just the general sentiment).
From last year when his shit was raided and he was getting squeezed: "If he delivers the conspiracy and its players, I will be OK with him not dying in prison."