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Should we move to a new OT?

  • Yes

    Votes: 86 21.9%
  • No

    Votes: 80 20.4%
  • Wait until a couple weeks before E3

    Votes: 226 57.7%

  • Total voters
    392
  • Poll closed .
Status
Not open for further replies.

enMTW

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
894
You typed all this up and didn't bother to think once that maybe if this is truly how you felt, you could just stay out the thread?

It is my belief that threads like this do damage to the site that hosts the discussion and to the image of gamers at large. So I'm taking a shot at moving the community past arm chair analysis. Extremely unlikely to be successful, but worth trying anyway.
 

LoyalPhoenix

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,766
I gotta say, threads like this are massively stupid. Microsoft has a long history of hiring third parties to make titles for them. Even assuming that you actually know-know what the MS owned studios are working on, you still don't have a useful amount of information. That right there makes the actual OP of zero value whatsoever. Now, for what the thread actually is: backseat driving of Microsoft.

It's entirely possible that there is a single person on this site qualified to backseat drive a platform holder. But if that person exists, they have not presented themselves in this thread. So, maybe we can just stop pretending that internet forum posters are capable of having intelligent thoughts on what an impossibly big entity should do. There is just so much that is opaque that any takes, any thoughts that an amateur has are ill-informed by their very nature. The conditions under which the thoughts are had bares no relation to the actual world that the decisions are made in.

Right now we have three pages of people arguing over MS acquiring Playground Games, if that is a good idea or not, if they'll do it or not, blah blah blah. But no one here has even seen the Playground Games contracts. No one knows exactly how much control MS has. For all you know, PG is precluded from developing a racing title for any other publisher. You don't know if Playground Games is committed to develop, say, 3 more entries in the Horizon franchise. You do not have enough information to post intelligently.

And that's a massively simplified version of the pieces on the board. There are so many parts that one would need to have a deep understanding of to truly grasp any given situation. There is a reason that people who do this kind of thing professionally - analysts - are so very bad at their job.

How about we leave it to the pros? Threads like this mostly result in low effort concern trolling and little else. Nothing of value is created.
chill my dude
 

Smurf

Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,528
It is my belief that threads like this do damage to the site that hosts the discussion and to the image of gamers at large. So I'm taking a shot at moving the community past arm chair analysis. Extremely unlikely to be successful, but worth trying anyway.
what?

The rumored Fable game by PG leaked here first and then was quoted in several news articles, podcasts and etc.
 

Zeta Ori

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,102
NY
It is my belief that threads like this do damage to the site that hosts the discussion and to the general image of gamers at large. So I'm taking a shot at moving the community past arm chair analysis. Extremely unlikely to be successful, but worth trying anyway.

If you truly feel this is doing harm to the sites reputation (LOL) then why not take it up with the mods instead of coming in and complaining to people doing nothing but speculating and discussing their own opinions and ideas with each other?

Not to mention its an open forum, your more than welcome to make your own thread for the exchange of objective information concerning what ever it is you want to discuss.
 

enMTW

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
894
what?

The rumored Fable game by PG leaked here first and then was quoted in several news articles, podcasts and etc.

That is not enough information available to have an intelligent discussion about Microsoft acquiring Playground Games, which is what is happening here.

If you truly feel this is doing harm to the sites reputation (LOL) then why not take it up with the mods instead of coming in and complaining to people doing nothing but speculating and discussing their own opinions and ideas with each other?

Not to mention its an open forum, your more than welcome to make your own thread for the exchange of objective information concerning what ever it is you want to discuss.

To be clear, this is a moderated forum. There is nothing open about it. I was making the case that this kind of discussion should not be allowed on the grounds that the discussion is never meaningful, thoughtful, intelligent. Nothing useful is ever produced. Message board posting doesn't lend itself to thoughtful analysis of corporate decision making. Even if enough information was available to do that analysis. Which it is not.

That's really all I'm going to add here. My post is there, if staff wants to act on the suggestion: feel free.
 
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LoyalPhoenix

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,766
to the image of gamers at large
you need to step off your high horse and realize this is just merely a discussion thread of said gamers talking about what they think and what they would like to see in the future from Microsoft.
no one is ordering anything, no one is insulting anyone.

If you want to protect that "image" how about not going into a peaceful thread that is having legit conversation and spouting out how useless this all is and how we are all trying to declare something we dont know. (we have literally all mentioned everything is a rumor and we are discussing said rumors.)
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,942
I mean, each Forza Horizon game has reviewed and sold better than the one before it. That certainly seems like a guaranteed touchdown to me at this point.
That's why you have contracts with companies. If you have a contract for X number of Forza Horizon games and Fable reeboot, playground is stuck essentially. There's no reason to buy them. Same with Undead labs. MS signed a multi game publishing deal with them in 2014. For the foreseeable future they are gonna be making Xbox games so there's no reason to buy them
 

MCD

Honest Work
Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,747
As long as MS keep making stupid ass moves by canceling their products again and again and promising again and again, I see no reason why we can't criticize or backseat them.
 

daTRUballin

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,138
Portland, Oregon
It is my belief that threads like this do damage to the site that hosts the discussion and to the image of gamers at large. So I'm taking a shot at moving the community past arm chair analysis. Extremely unlikely to be successful, but worth trying anyway.

I'm failing to understand what's so wrong about simply speculating about things and discussing about what we want to see from Microsoft in the future. Nobody is claiming they know exactly what's going on at Microsoft or anything like that (unless they're a verified insider).

I think you're taking things a bit too seriously.
 

Judge

Vault-Tec Seal of Approval
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
5,135
That is not enough information available to have an intelligent discussion about Microsoft acquiring Playground Games, which is what is happening here.



To be clear, this is a moderated forum. There is nothing open about it. I was making the case that this kind of discussion should not be allowed on the grounds that the discussion is never meaningful, thoughtful, intelligent. Nothing useful is ever produced. Message board posting doesn't lend itself to thoughtful analysis of corporate decision making. Even if enough information was available to do that analysis. Which it is not.

That's really all I'm going to add here. My post is there, if staff wants to act on the suggestion: feel free.
This is a discussion based forum and this thread has proven to be very beneficial and useful to those who come here to discuss information with fellow gamers. I'd like to think 113 pages of healthy discussion is a testament to that.

If you don't wish to partake in it then you don't need to.

But what you are doing is thread whining when you could simply ignore this thread if you don't like it and don't think the content warrants discussion.
 

zedox

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,215
Well we are at the end of the week, the first two weeks of January has been good to this thread, i wonder what will happen next week.
 

Chettlar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,604
I gotta say, threads like this are massively stupid. Microsoft has a long history of hiring third parties to make titles for them. Even assuming that you actually know-know what the MS owned studios are working on, you still don't have a useful amount of information. That right there makes the actual OP of zero value whatsoever. Now, for what the thread actually is: backseat driving of Microsoft.

It's entirely possible that there is a single person on this site qualified to backseat drive a platform holder. But if that person exists, they have not presented themselves in this thread. So, maybe we can just stop pretending that internet forum posters are capable of having intelligent thoughts on what an impossibly big entity should do. There is just so much that is opaque that any takes, any thoughts that an amateur has are ill-informed by their very nature. The conditions under which the thoughts are had bares no relation to the actual world where the decisions are made.

Right now we have three pages of people arguing over MS acquiring Playground Games, if that is a good idea or not, if they'll do it or not, blah blah blah. But no one here has even seen the Playground Games contracts. No one knows exactly how much control MS has. For all you know, PG is precluded from developing a racing title for any other publisher. You don't know if Playground Games is committed to develop, say, 3 more entries in the Horizon franchise. You do not have enough information to post intelligently.

And that's a massively simplified version of the pieces on the board. There are so many parts that one would need to have a deep understanding of to truly grasp any given situation. There is a reason that people who do this kind of thing professionally - analysts - are so very bad at their job.

How about we leave it to the pros? Threads like this mostly result in low effort concern trolling and little else. Nothing of value is created.

Lmao talk about incapable of intelligent discussion. This post is monumentally bad.

You are acting like you have come across speculation for the first time in your life. And contrary to your claim, given a lot of the leaks being laid out, there is actual basis to make that speculation. Those who are not making educated speculation are interacting with those who can help them shape that speculation more intelligently. The purpose of this thread isn't to stroke egos, (lmao??); it's 1. to help condense leaks out there and help people have realistic expectations about them, because there's a lot of Xbox fans here hungry for news and want to digest the info we have, and 2. like... because it's fun.

Claiming that there is no intelligent discussion going on in here, especially when honestly the whole purpose of it is pretty much that it's fun, is like. I don't have a nice word for that. Like dude what. ...chill.

"YOU GUYS DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT SO JUST SHUT UP AND STOP HAVING FUN." Except said over a long wordy post.

Like...lmao yes, we know?
 

daTRUballin

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,138
Portland, Oregon
Guys

Guys get this

Guys

Kinect 3.0

vader.jpg


Sea of Thieves cancelled. Rare put on Kinect Sports 4. Spencer fired, Mattrick returns.
 

Startropper

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,001
That is not enough information available to have an intelligent discussion about Microsoft acquiring Playground Games, which is what is happening here.

It's a continued cycle, news or pr statements will drop some info, often times vague.

And when it's vague people are going to try to fill in the pieces. They'll take the truth of the vague statement then use it to push their own subjective narratives. That's why when news slows usually wild speculation crops up more, then debunked when Phil Spencer gives an interview.

It's a continued cycle that I've seen time and time again on the old site.

The question is no ones forcing you to participate, you can pick and choose what to comment on, so I don't understand what the issue is.

And why do you get to determine whats acceptable speculation and what isn't, seems like a rather grey area that would never be implemented well.
 

Zeta Ori

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,102
NY
That is not enough information available to have an intelligent discussion about Microsoft acquiring Playground Games, which is what is happening here.



To be clear, this is a moderated forum. There is nothing open about it. I was making the case that this kind of discussion should not be allowed on the grounds that the discussion is never meaningful, thoughtful, intelligent. Nothing useful is ever produced. Message board posting doesn't lend itself to thoughtful analysis of corporate decision making. Even if enough information was available to do that analysis. Which it is not.

That's really all I'm going to add here. My post is there, if staff wants to act on the suggestion: feel free.

I'm curious if this is the only thread your doing this in...
 

MCD

Honest Work
Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,747
Two Viva pinata games under Matrick. Sounds like the better leader.

3 if you count that mini game spinoff.
 

daniel77733

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,639
*scrolls through this page of posts*

Let's discuss something important -

Where the hell is my State of Decay 2 info and gameplay videos that were rumored to be shown this week??? Anyone know if anything will be shown soon or just no info yet? Thanks.
 

LoyalPhoenix

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,766
*scrolls through this page of posts*

Let's discuss something important -

Where the hell is my State of Decay 2 info and gameplay videos that were rumored to be shown this week??? Anyone know if anything will be shown soon or just no info yet? Thanks.
It will probably have something next month or by the end of this one.
rumors are rumors dont take em to heart until proven otherwise
 

daTRUballin

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,138
Portland, Oregon
Two Viva pinata games under Matrick. Sounds like the better leader.

3 if you count that mini game spinoff.

Viva Pinata 1 was before Mattrick, but sure, VP2 was under him. Probably greenlit before him though.

This "better leader" is also the same leader that put Rare to work on Kinect Sports and avatars for about 5 years, so..........I guess if you're fond of that era, then you're probably fond of Mattrick lol.
 

Gundam

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
12,801
I gotta say guys, you better stop talking about something I don't like. It's so useless and unintelligent.


lol what the fuck was that


I've always thought that if Microsoft wanted to make a single acquisition to bolster their lineup and break into overseas markets, all they gotta do is buy Sega and label Xbox 4 as the Dreamcast II.
It would never happen, and I'm sure the mere idea of it pisses some people off, but it's not like Sega's doing anything with their properties anyway.
 

Synth

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,202
I gotta say guys, you better stop talking about something I don't like. It's so useless and unintelligent.


lol what the fuck was that


I've always thought that if Microsoft wanted to make a single acquisition to bolster their lineup and break into overseas markets, all they gotta do is buy Sega and label Xbox 4 as the Dreamcast II.
It would never happen, and I'm sure the mere idea of it pisses some people off, but it's not like Sega's doing anything with their properties anyway.

The time for that really was back when they first entered the console market. I would have solved basically every problem they've run into since then. They would have been able to release the Xbox as a Sega branded console in Japan, they'd have had shit like Virtua Fighter as an exclusive, which was still a huge draw in Japan at the time. They wouldn't have had failed mascots Blinx, or struggle to convince Rare's prior audience to follow them, because they'd have Sonic the fucking Hedgehog pre-Sonic '06 (which almost certainly would then not have happened). Rather than trying to find success with new RPGs like Lost Odyssey and Blue Dragon, they'd own frickin' Phantasy Star, Shining Force and Skies of Arcadia...

I find it kinda amazing that they actually looked at Sega back then, and came to the conclusion "nah, we're good without".
 

Novocaine

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,946
As long as MS keep making stupid ass moves by canceling their products again and again and promising again and again, I see no reason why we can't criticize or backseat them.

You say that like they were all sitting around one day and went "lol let's can Scalebound".

Games getting canceled is an unfortunate and unavoidable part of the business and not exclusive to Microsoft.

Of course they should still be open to criticism but be realistic about it.
 

Chettlar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,604
There definitely is an issue with Microsoft doing it more than most. Whatever they do that gets them there needs to be looked at internally.

It sounds like they are producing way more so their lineup is not as anemic if a cancellation happens, but that doesn't address the issue with how many cancellations they have a history with, and I hope that is getting addressed. Like, they need to be catching these issues before it just becomes apparently a better idea to just throw out millions of dollars and time that could have been spent doing something useful.
 

LoyalPhoenix

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,766
You say that like they were all sitting around one day and went "lol let's can Scalebound".

Games getting canceled is an unfortunate and unavoidable part of the business and not exclusive to Microsoft.

Of course they should still be open to criticism but be realistic about it.

Also if I may add, saying they are stupid moves sounds kinda ignorant. They can completely be criticized for it for sure.

For all we know that cancellation saved them a shit ton of money. Some of that which is going to the rumored Fable and PD for example. They have all the numbers and quite frankly smarter people than people here including myself so what they did is what they thought was going to be better outcome for the company and brand. And as stated, its part of the business. Business aint always pretty.
 

LoyalPhoenix

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,766
they need to be catching these issues before it just becomes apparently a better idea to just throw out millions of dollars and time that could have been spent doing something useful.
I think that is a big reason for them pushing for a smaller announcement/release window.

I think everyone can agree Scalebound was announced way way too soon. leaving it back in the shadow to keep on cooking could have maybe saved it seeing how they would have to worry about trailers or creating demos to show off.
Scalebound tho is kind of a mess for that reason among others like, PG working on like a million projects with most of em actually being kinda bleh (seriously look at the games released and announced within a year before Scalebound announcement and year of cancellation, rumor that apparently some at MS thought money to the project was being used for games like Nier etc.
 

Nightengale

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,708
Malaysia
This is a moderated forum, but this is also a community-driven forum.

Outside of the what's listed in ResetERA's terms of service, and any other instances that require a significant consideration of moderation or administration oversight, we're not trying ( to the best of our ability, we're not perfect and we've made mistakes along the way ) to be tone or content police.

I've always thought that if Microsoft wanted to make a single acquisition to bolster their lineup and break into overseas markets, all they gotta do is buy Sega and label Xbox 4 as the Dreamcast II.
It would never happen, and I'm sure the mere idea of it pisses some people off, but it's not like Sega's doing anything with their properties anyway.

The thing about publisher-level acquisitions is that we have to ask : "what changes at a portfolio management level once a publisher is acquired by a bigger publisher?"

Is MS going to double or triple their AAA-release output upon acquisition of a bigger publisher? The reason why publisher-level acquisitions are rare is because in this day and age, AAA publishers are focused more on lean and profitable line-ups, instead of broad, quantity-heavy line-up that do mediocre sales across the board.

MS themselves are not doing much with niche IPs in their portfolio, as they're refocusing on expanding or reviving the ones that are/were big. The inclusion of SEGA IPs into MS's portfolio would bolster their big IPs family with Sonic, Total War, and stuff, but it also serves to make the niche properties even less likely to be given a chance unless there is a conscious effort or desire for them.
 
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