Motorcycle-Era |OT| Two are better than four

Fallout-NL

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,660
I'll cop to glancing at the occasional storefront window to see what my bike and I look like in the reflection...
 

Dougald

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,860
I'm more of a Tuono guy myself. I really wish that Aprilia had better British dealship support.

To be honest though if I was going for a poorly-supported Italian bike, it would probably be a Guzzi V85.
 

Dougald

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,860
Triumph has been going that way for a while (the Bonneville has been built in thailand for over a decade now), but yeah its very sad to see.

I know I'm not sure I'd want to spend out for a new R1250 if it wasn't made in Germany, for example. These are premium brands and shouldn't need this level of cost-cutting.
 

Fallout-NL

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,660
I know I'm not sure I'd want to spend out for a new R1250 if it wasn't made in Germany, for example. These are premium brands and shouldn't need this level of cost-cutting.
This right here. There's no way I'd buy a Speed Twin at that price if it was made in Thailand. I think they're underestimating how powerful the actually-made-in-Britain-or-Germany-or-USA thing is - especially when it comes to vehicles.
 

Dougald

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,860
This right here. There's no way I'd buy a Speed Twin at that price if it was made in Thailand. I think they're underestimating how powerful the actually-made-in-Britain-or-Germany-or-USA thing is - especially when it comes to vehicles.
Exactly. BMW, Harley and Triumph have been able to get away with producing their entry level bikes abroad, but imagine if your new €15k Harley wasn't made in the USA, regardless of the quality of the manufacturing facility it was made in. That's 90% of the brand.
 

Fallout-NL

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,660
Yeah, just... pack it up, you're done.

This industry can only exist with just in time logistics at this point and the Brexit isn't helping. Many producing industries will be affected.
And I'm not discounting the Brexit related difficulties they're facing. But if this is the solution, I don't expect them to last much longer as a premium brand. Frankly I find it baffling they would even consider doing this. I would have expected them to ask for government help in a "you caused this mess, surely you don't want one of your top manufacturers moving its business abroad?" kind of way before doing this.
 

Dougald

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,860
I suspect this is perhaps less Brexit-focused than the complete loss of Honda manufacturing was. But it definitely doesn't help.

The owner of Triumph is actually a fairly large Conservative party donor, though, so I'm sure he could have lent on Boris Johnson a little if needed...
 

Dougald

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,860
Hah didn’t know this. Very interesting.
Most large business owners here are, and Triumph is absolutely owned by one guy. Actually it is an interesting story, he went to buy the land the old factory stood on when they went bankrupt in the 80s, and ended up with the company - the revival of Triumph as a brand was a pretty big achievement, look at what happened with Norton.
 

Axelotl

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
1,698
Hamm, Germany
Most large business owners here are, and Triumph is absolutely owned by one guy. Actually it is an interesting story, he went to buy the land the old factory stood on when they went bankrupt in the 80s, and ended up with the company - the revival of Triumph as a brand was a pretty big achievement, look at what happened with Norton.
In light of this the support for brexit makes less sense. Will be interesting so see this unfold. I’m still thinking about buying a Triumph in the future but the made in Britain Badge isn’t a relevant factor in this decision.
 

Arucardo

Member
Oct 28, 2017
75
Damn, first round of MotoGP in Qatar is cancelled because of travel restrictions caused by the Corona virus. Moto 3 and 2 are not cancelled since all the teams are already there for testing. Round 2 in Thailand is also in danger of being cancelled.
 

prophetvx

Member
Nov 28, 2017
1,721
This right here. There's no way I'd buy a Speed Twin at that price if it was made in Thailand. I think they're underestimating how powerful the actually-made-in-Britain-or-Germany-or-USA thing is - especially when it comes to vehicles.
All of Triumph's twins are manufactured in Thailand. It was only the Speed, Street Triple and Rocket produced at Hinckley, I think the Tigers are also there but not 100% sure. The modern classic segment has been a huge success for them even though it is built in Thailand.

To be honest, minus a gear linkage issue for which there was a recall, the build and finish on my Speed Twin has impressed the hell out of me. However, I think with modern classics most people will overlook minor quirks, with a performance bike like the Speed or Street Triple they better be damn sure moving their manufacturing because if they get it wrong it could absolutely tank their stellar reputation there.

Made in England doesn't really matter that much to markets outside of Europe and you're not going to see people move to Japanese bikes in lieu of that. Triumph Triples are a class of their own, there really is no direct competitor that people will just switch to.
 
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Axelotl

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
1,698
Hamm, Germany
new signals!

And I finally installed the new exhaust


The old exhaust was really heavy in comparison to the Akra. Might have lost 5 kg.


The catalyst nearly made it impossible to Install the exhaust with the center stand.



In the end it was about 45 minutes of work. I cleaned everything and wanted to start the engine and witnessed the break down of the battery. Two winters outside weren't so good for it. ;D


So any lithium battery recommendations?
 
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Subpar Scrub

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,368
Looking awesome man, I always used an Aussie brand of battery iirc so I don’t have a recommendation but yeah, good stuff 🤙🏼
 

Fallout-NL

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,660
Looks great Axelotl - I'm looking forward to a little video footage so we can hear it.

With regards to li-ion batteries: I have that new one in the Ulysses, but I'm still not completely sold on it. Doesn't start with that much conviction. Could be due to (semi) cold weather (I mean it's not even that cold), but honestly, I don't really like to have to baby the goddamn battery that much. I just need it to work. There's one li-ion battery that came in one of the Buells we bought a few years ago that's still going strong. (Different brand than the Shido ones I'm not sold one.) I can't remember what brand it was, will check and report back (it's parked at my dad's).

All of Triumph's twins are manufactured in Thailand. It was only the Speed, Street Triple and Rocket produced at Hinckley, I think the Tigers are also there but not 100% sure. The modern classic segment has been a huge success for them even though it is built in Thailand.

To be honest, minus a gear linkage issue for which there was a recall, the build and finish on my Speed Twin has impressed the hell out of me. However, I think with modern classics most people will overlook minor quirks, with a performance bike like the Speed or Street Triple they better be damn sure moving their manufacturing because if they get it wrong it could absolutely tank their stellar reputation there.

Made in England doesn't really matter that much to markets outside of Europe and you're not going to see people move to Japanese bikes in lieu of that. Triumph Triples are a class of their own, there really is no direct competitor that people will just switch to.
I hadn't realised that. That definitely speaks to how well they're made there! But it still doesn't make that much of a difference to me. I recognise that the feeling I have on the subject is something akin to nationalism - and while I absolutely despise nationalism elsewhere - this is the one area where I'll allow myself a tiny smidgen of it. Maybe nationalism isn't the right word since I'm not at all British, perhaps it's the romantic notions associated with craftsmanship and legacy and other nonsense terms like that. But bikes for me are 90% about emotion and - to name just one example - selling me a Ducati that didn't roll off the line in Bologna would be a pretty hard goddamn sell indeed.

That's one thing that annoys me about my Boxster as well. It's made in Uusikaupunki, not in Zuffenhausen.

Having said all that. I'm still totally lusting after a Speed Twin. Just..., yeah, the odds of buying one have gone down a little since you told me that. Not that it matters all that much. There's still some more Buell years left in me I think.

Made in England doesn't really matter that much to markets outside of Europe
I don't have the numbers obviously, but I imagine they do most of their business in Europe, right?

the build and finish on my Speed Twin has impressed the hell out of me.
Yeah, it looks great. No doubt.
 
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Arucardo

Member
Oct 28, 2017
75
Both of those fit the bike perfectly imo. I wonder how that exhaust sounds compared to the stock one. Also, that license plate is huuuge :D.

The thing that's been keeping me from a getting a lithium battery so far is the need for a lithium specific charger and the fact that I haven't had a bike long enough now to develop any battery problems.
 

Fallout-NL

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,660
so far is the need for a lithium specific charger
That is kind of annoying, yeah. Got one last year. But my dad's borrowed it now and I really don't feel like buying two.

/edit:

Who are li-ion batteries not for?

Those who live or ride in cold climates.
As a result of their unique chemistry, lithium batteries are known to slow down in cold weather, and will behave as though they are dying (they actually don’t lose power, they just discharge it more slowly.) There is an easy solution for this – simply “warming up” the battery by running the headlights for 30-60 seconds before starting – but many riders feel uneasy with a battery that becomes finicky, especially in the cold.
Yeah that's me. I also tried that btw, letting the headlights run for a bit, but eh, it seemed even less enthusiastic after that. Anyway, I'll see how it does this year (the Shido battery) and let you guys know.
 

Axelotl

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
1,698
Hamm, Germany
Both of those fit the bike perfectly imo. I wonder how that exhaust sounds compared to the stock one. Also, that license plate is huuuge :D.
Sounds are coming when I got power back :D

Yeah it got even a little bigger then anticipated.
The „two letters/three numbers“ combination blew it up. 2/2 would have been better. Burning comparison to the USA they are still very big.
My stepfather has a Harley and was able to get a designated small license plate.
 

Arucardo

Member
Oct 28, 2017
75
Just for reference, look how small Estonian motorcycle plates are (not a whole lot of bikes in that tiny country though)

 

Axelotl

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
1,698
Hamm, Germany
Our license plate system has to work for about 80 Million vehicles. I really like those small ones :)
Most look the same but some of the newer Louise shops here really look nice.
 

Dougald

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,860
Running a tiny plate like that is asking for trouble here. My friend was fined £200 for having one just an inch smaller than regulations

My bike is sitting overnight at Bahnstormer BMW. All serviced and ready for spring!
 

Microsoft

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,049
47.639318, -122.128373
Spring is almost here isn't it? My bike is pretty much ready to go. It's already clean and all. No need for any service. The SV650 just needs chain clean/adjustment and the inspection/emissions to be up to date. Which will be taken care of tomorrow. My cousin will finally get his driver's license as well with the motorcycle endorsement and some fun rides are to be had!
 

prophetvx

Member
Nov 28, 2017
1,721
I hadn't realised that. That definitely speaks to how well they're made there! But it still doesn't make that much of a difference to me. I recognise that the feeling I have on the subject is something akin to nationalism - and while I absolutely despise nationalism elsewhere - this is the one area where I'll allow myself a tiny smidgen of it. Maybe nationalism isn't the right word since I'm not at all British, perhaps it's the romantic notions associated with craftsmanship and legacy and other nonsense terms like that. But bikes for me are 90% about emotion and - to name just one example - selling me a Ducati that didn't roll off the line in Bologna would be a pretty hard goddamn sell indeed.

That's one thing that annoys me about my Boxster as well. It's made in Uusikaupunki, not in Zuffenhausen.

Having said all that. I'm still totally lusting after a Speed Twin. Just..., yeah, the odds of buying one have gone down a little since you told me that. Not that it matters all that much. There's still some more Buell years left in me I think.



I don't have the numbers obviously, but I imagine they do most of their business in Europe, right?
I think the success of the modern classics regardless of manufacturing location, a line that would be the most likely to invoke nationalism was obviously the tipping point. How many people are actually knowledgable about where they are manufactured is an unknown and that's absolutely a risk they face in moving 100% of operations to Thailand, there is no longer any doubt.

As for the market, ~50% of Triumph sales are Europe, 15% of overall sales are in the UK. They may take some of a hit in doing this but I doubt it will offset the savings. Strategically it's not just build quality but factory location, Asia is a major emerging market for larger capacity motorcycles and it's obviously central to Australia and the Americas.

It's a bold move for sure, it'll be interesting to see how it plays out. I'm sure it will upset quite a few Triumph fans but I don't think they're the type to jump to another brand given how loyal they can be and in the absence of a competitor (Norton for example).

Ultimately, if their build quality doesn't suffer which it doesn't appear to have, shorter term they may take a hit but anything that helps the higher end brands stay afloat in what is a tougher, declining market is a net positive IMO.
 

BriareosGAF

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,299
Did you uh buy a BMW by the way?
Nah. If anything I actually think I'm going to sell/donate the SV650 this year, it's just taking up space and my wife is never going to ride it.

Rained hard earlier last week (in February in Maine, wtf) and people were out riding this weekend when it was in the 30s (0-3C). Supposed to be in the low 50s tomorrow (~11C), tempting.
 

Mengy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,591
It was in the low 60's here today so I rode in to work (it was 30° on the ride in, lol). Went for a half hour ride around a lake over lunch, and then took the long way home turning a 10 mile trip into a 73 mile one, hah.

Good day.
 

Hawkijustin

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
375
Iowa
Weather was nice so I finally got around to putting on a set of new commander 3 touring tires on my Harley ultra limited. $430 for tires and $216 for labor later my wallet is crying but they are on and ready for spring!
 

Fallout-NL

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,660
Nah. If anything I actually think I'm going to sell/donate the SV650 this year, it's just taking up space and my wife is never going to ride it.
I'm not one to talk. But fewer bikes is actually always better. Especially if they're not ridden.

Weather was nice so I finally got around to putting on a set of new commander 3 touring tires on my Harley ultra limited. $430 for tires and $216 for labor later my wallet is crying but they are on and ready for spring!
Ooof yeah. Good investment though.

It's a bold move for sure, it'll be interesting to see how it plays out.
Indeed, not sure if this plays here, but it's still a videogame forum :P.
 

Axelotl

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
1,698
Hamm, Germany
Yesterday I bought a new battery and killed the main and the 7,5V fuse. -.- am glad that amazon ships so fast. The new battery survived and I now have two spare 50A main fuses.

I’ve placed the battery wrong and minus and plus had contact to the counter poles.The fuse dies before I realized my mistake. Rookie mistake. I’m glad that nothing died expect the fuses.
 

Fallout-NL

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,660
May be a good idea to check if your battery's measuring at 13+ volts when revving the engine a little to verify the stator or voltage regulator wasn't cooked. Probably not considering the fuses went.
 

Patriiick

Member
Oct 31, 2018
592
Grimsby, GB
new signals!

And I finally installed the new exhaust


The old exhaust was really heavy in comparison to the Akra. Might have lost 5 kg.


The catalyst nearly made it impossible to Install the exhaust with the center stand.



In the end it was about 45 minutes of work. I cleaned everything and wanted to start the engine and witnessed the break down of the battery. Two winters outside weren't so good for it. ;D


So any lithium battery recommendations?
In that second photo for a brief moment I thought you had a multicoloured undertray and I was kinda into it!

In other news i'm already bored of waiting for next week's delivery and i've even downloaded the Aprilia app that I can't connect anything to. This waiting period is a dangerous time as i'm already skint but looking at parts I want to fit. Haven't even sat on it yet and comfort is the first thing that comes to mind being a tall bloke. Rearsets are looking might tempting next payday.

Edit* Final note, the weather is looking a lot nicer in the north east of England at the moment! The roads are absolutely caked in salt though so i'm in no rush.
 

Microsoft

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,049
47.639318, -122.128373
I went back to NeoGAF to find some of my pictures I posted there. Man, what a ride through memory lane. I can't believe it has been 4 years. I was 23 when I got my first motorcycle. Feb 2016, I bought the bike before I was licensed to ride it. It took me less than a month to become licensed before I could ride. There's a lot of history on that website. From Dougald's misaligned red Ducati Monster tank, to Fallout-NL's awesome pictures, and everything in between. I'm just sad I'm, I'm... getting old. Anyway, here is my first bike, the day I bought it.
 

Axelotl

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
1,698
Hamm, Germany
But 27 isn’t old...


Made a little video, but the bass seems to be completely missing in comparison to what I heard.

Oh yeah check engine light is on. Everything works, ABS / TCS, lights. So it could be something that went overboard after the battery incident or the lamda sensor got kind of damaged somehow. But at least the bike runs well :)
Ordered an ODB2 reader with a Yamaha Adapter to see the error code.
 
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Fallout-NL

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,660
Made a little video, but the bass seems to be completely missing in comparison to what I heard.
Still sounds very good.

Ordered an ODB2 reader with a Yamaha Adapter to see the error code.
Ah great, yeah I was about to recommend something like that. Likely just a matter of clearing the mishap with the fuses, though if it's something else it'll point you in the right direction at least.

I went back to NeoGAF to find some of my pictures I posted there. Man, what a ride through memory lane. I can't believe it has been 4 years.
Yeah, I've spent a pretty amazing length of time there, more than a decade I think. Still, this is pretty the much the same place in all but name.
Interesting how well executed that little coup was. Can imagine this forum being a fairly profitable enterprise.

The roads are absolutely caked in salt though so i'm in no rush.
Ha! A fellow believer, excellent.
 
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Arucardo

Member
Oct 28, 2017
75
But 27 isn’t old...


Made a little video, but the bass seems to be completely missing in comparison to what I heard.

Oh yeah check engine light is on. Everything works, ABS / TCS, lights. So it could be something that went overboard after the battery incident or the lamda sensor got kind of damaged somehow. But at least the bike runs well :)
Ordered an ODB2 reader with a Yamaha Adapter to see the error code.
Could be the O2 sensor or the ECU is not liking the new exhaust without a tune, even with the catalytic converter inside it.

Also, that sound made me miss my Speed Triple, love the sound of an inline 3, even with the "whine".
 

Axelotl

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
1,698
Hamm, Germany
Before I had the battery situation and after the exhaust change the machine started once without engine check light.

Yeah I love the triple whine. So good
 

Microsoft

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,049
47.639318, -122.128373
But 27 isn’t old...


Made a little video, but the bass seems to be completely missing in comparison to what I heard.

Oh yeah check engine light is on. Everything works, ABS / TCS, lights. So it could be something that went overboard after the battery incident or the lamda sensor got kind of damaged somehow. But at least the bike runs well :)
Ordered an ODB2 reader with a Yamaha Adapter to see the error code.
I have a skewed sense of what old means.
Is that a "cruise control" thing on your motorcycle? Do those work well?
Still sounds very good.



Ah great, yeah I was about to recommend something like that. Likely just a matter of clearing the mishap with the fuses, though if it's something else it'll point you in the right direction at least.



Yeah, I've spent a pretty amazing length of time there, more than a decade I think. Still, this is pretty the much the same place in all but name.
Interesting how well executed that little coup was. Can imagine this forum being a fairly profitable enterprise.



Ha! A fellow believer, excellent.
Damn, a decade? That's awesome, time sure does fly doesn't it?

Here's to many more decades.
 

Dougald

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,860
Ahh I remember that first KLR like it was yesterday, when Microsoft were just a young lad!

I'm £290 lighter and the RS is ready to be my commuter once more. Bless BMW and their door to door delivery service, because the roads are too cold and salty for me still.

Yeah, I've spent a pretty amazing length of time there, more than a decade I think. Still, this is pretty the much the same place in all but name.
It's not the same to me :-( But maybe I just have rose-tinted glasses for the 00's...

At least we'll always have the bike thread!