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Nothing Loud

Literally Cinderella
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,975
Hey Era.

I don't want to share too many details because it's private and it hurts, but my dad passed away last month.

I have a family member (with whom I don't have a close relationship with, haven't talked to him in many years besides this last year when I had to coordinate with him to care for my dad) doesn't seem to like me. I've known him since childhood to be a liar and legally sneaky, greedy person.

Well I live in another state, and he went and collected my dads body from hospice back in my home state with a couple of funeral home representatives. He refuses to tell me where my dads body is at because he seems to want to deny me and my sister a chance to hold any kind of service or memorial. The caregiver said they don't know where he took them and they're ignoring my calls too. My family member is ignoring my texts and has a busy schedule. It's been a month. He said he plans to repatriate the body to his home country against our wishes and not give us a chance to interfere.

I called over 30 funeral homes in the county. None of them have him. I called and spoke with 3 lawyers and they said they couldn't do anything to stop him, unless I want to pay legal fees and open probate with the will, which will take months to sort out anyway. They said police probably wouldnt do anything to help me. 2 attorneys told me to not even bother with police. The county reports no probate has been opened yet. No county coroner has him. No death certificate has been made. I have no proof or record my dad died and I can't mourn him while I'm angry at my family member that he's probably in a freezer somewhere without anybody knowing where he is.

does anybody here have any ideas on what else I should try to find my dad? My family member has no legal right to solely claim my dads body like he is doing but the system doesn't seem set up to solve these kinds of family disputes easily. I normally don't post personal stuff like this here because people are vicious and voracious for personal details but I'm running out of ideas.

im trying to get info from the hospice company but they are ignoring my calls.

update:
Update: I was finally able to obtain a death certificate (after the county tipped me on a special city phone number I could call), which listed the funeral home on it. Apparently he has been cremated already by my family member's direction.

I called them today and they said my family member had instructed them to not give any information to anyone but him. So they won't tell me if my dad is still there or not, and where/when he is being sent if not, which is what I want to know.

Does anyone know how I can get the funeral home to comply with me? Surely I have equal claim to the body as my family member. I have my birth certificate with my dads name on it, a medical power of attorney he signed for me last year, and a will where I am the executor.
 
Last edited:

BDS

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,845
I would recommend posting this on /r/legaladvice, you'll be asked to provide basic information about your state (as laws vary) and they'll be able to give you much better and more accurate information.

Or just call an actual attorney.
 

Bio

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,370
Denver, Colorado
You need to speak with an attorney. Immediately. Unless there's a lawyer here who specializes in that sort of thing, I doubt anyone here can offer any legit, legally viable advice that will help you.

Call a lawyer, find out what your options are.
 

Geoff

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,115
I dunno...I mean where would you store a body for so long?

Either he took him to a funeral home in which case the body is cremated or buried already. Or he didn't because he wants to repatriate it...so....does he have a chest freezer at home? I don't think funeral homes just let you store corpses if you aren't going to use the service and if he was going to use the service he would have used it by now.
 

Wishbone Ash

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 29, 2017
3,828
Michigan
You need to speak with an attorney. Immediately. Unless there's a lawyer here who specializes in that sort of thing, I doubt anyone here can offer any legit, legally viable advice that will help you.

Call a lawyer, find out what your options are.

The OP has plenty of detail. He called multiple lawyers.
 

Joshua

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,711
I would recommend posting this on /r/legaladvice, you'll be asked to provide basic information about your state (as laws vary) and they'll be able to give you much better and more accurate information.

Or just call an actual attorney.
I was gonna come in here to suggest legaladvice too. This is way above ERA's pay grade. They'll likely suggest the attorney route as well.

Very sorry for your loss OP, and hope you get closure on this.
 

oreomunsta

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
4,341
Holy shit, OP. I'm sorry you have to go through that. Sounds horrendous :(

I wish you luck and an outcome you can be at peace with
 
OP
OP
Nothing Loud

Nothing Loud

Literally Cinderella
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,975
You need to speak with an attorney. Immediately. Unless there's a lawyer here who specializes in that sort of thing, I doubt anyone here can offer any legit, legally viable advice that will help you.

Call a lawyer, find out what your options are.

ive been speaking to 3 lawyers specialized in probate and family law and they say there's nothing I can do to "find" the body, they keep getting caught up in disbelief in why or how my family member is doing this to us. They told me police likely wouldn't help in this matter. They just tell me if I want to enact the will I have to open probate, pay legal fees, and wait for it to sort out weeks to months from now. But I'm a student and can't afford a probate dispute, especially with this family member, who has significant money and he has always been jealous of me and my dads relationship.

thanks for the advice though. I'll try reddit as well
 

djplaeskool

Member
Oct 26, 2017
19,735
Unfortunately, Probate may be the only way you're going to reliably make any progress if you are unable to get any info from your relatives or the hospice.
I'm sorry you're having to go through such a shitty situation.
 

xxracerxx

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
31,222
Why not call the cops and see if they will do anything. There is no harm in asking them.
 

Deleted member 8752

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
10,122
I w
ive been speaking to 3 lawyers specialized in probate and family law and they say there's nothing I can do to "find" the body, they keep getting caught up in disbelief in why or how my family member is doing this to us. They told me police likely wouldn't help in this matter. They just tell me if I want to enact the will I have to open probate, pay legal fees, and wait for it to sort out weeks to months from now. But I'm a student and can't afford a probate dispute, especially with this family member, who has significant money and he has always been jealous of me and my dads relationship.

thanks for the advice though. I'll try reddit as well
That is bad legal advice. I would still call the police.

You may also need to hire a private investigator.
 

Geoff

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,115
Unfortunately, Probate may be the only way you're going to reliably make any progress if you are unable to get any info from your relatives or the hospice.
I'm sorry you're having to go through such a shitty situation.

Can't get probate without a death certificate.

Is there any money riding on this or just the body?
 

xxracerxx

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
31,222
Call hospice and ask them which funeral home picked up your dad's body. They should have a record of it.
 
OP
OP
Nothing Loud

Nothing Loud

Literally Cinderella
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,975
Can't get probate without a death certificate.

Is there any money riding on this or just the body?

there might be money hidden in bank accounts in the country where my dad is from, which may be why he's trying to repatriate the body—to claim that money for himself.

I guess my next step is to keep badgering hospice (they keep taking voicemails and not calling back), then talk to my lawyer again and try calling the police.

I even contacted a private investigator and they wanted to charge a $1000 retainer to follow my family member to the funeral home. So I had to decline.
 

Saganator

Member
Oct 26, 2017
7,007
Wow that's terrible, OP. Really sorry you have to deal with this. Not much advice to offer, but I do know it's not cheap to keep a body in a freezer, so if that's the case then it's costing your family member a pretty penny. Does your family member have money?
 

djplaeskool

Member
Oct 26, 2017
19,735
Can't get probate without a death certificate.

Oh geez, I missed that.
So there's no body, no death certificate filed, and the hospice refuses to assist?
I know there are attorneys out there that specialize in probate and estate disputes, but I think you really need to press the hospice company. Denial of information requests can be disputed and appealed. You're essentially asking for medical records of a deceased relative, so you should have recourse if they deny that information to you.
 

Reckheim

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
9,374
there might be money hidden in bank accounts in the country where my dad is from, which may be why he's trying to repatriate the body—to claim that money for himself.

I guess my next step is to keep badgering hospice (they keep taking voicemails and not calling back), then talk to my lawyer again and try calling the police.

I even contacted a private investigator and they wanted to charge a $1000 retainer to follow my family member to the funeral home. So I had to decline.
it wont be cheap regardless of what you want to do.

you gotta ask your self, are you willing to spend a shit load of money for this? Especially if you are going up against someone that can out lawyer you.
 

C.Mongler

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
3,880
Washington, DC
Sorry you're going through this OP; sounds like a shit situation that I could not imagine being in. Unfortunately I think there's really only one path to recourse here and that's through legal counsel/representation. I know you've said you don't have money for it, which is why it's a shitty answer, but I don't think there's going to be like a free hotline you can call that will get you a solution quick, cheap, and easy. From what I understand, family disputes after deaths are generally a lengthy, messy process that has to play out in the courts.

I am confused about how there is no death certificate though; from my understanding that's kind of a basic legal requirement once you die. At least if you die "on the books" anyway. When my mother-in-law passed recently that was the first thing that was immediately taken care of. There's no way that this family member is fucking with you about your father actually passing on, is there?
 

greepoman

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,958
I'm wondering if you could somehow interfere with his plans to repatriate the body? My understanding is that it takes a lot of coordination and a chain of people. If you were to contact possible people in this chain and explain your story and subtlety infer you are bringing legal action and would have to involve them if they took part in the process. Or maybe something like you ask them to call you and the police if he contacts them wanting to do so.
 

Dbltap

Member
Oct 31, 2017
784
Woodinville, WA
I'm so sorry this is happening to you. I couldn't find my fathers ashes for 30 years. Hey OP, who has power of attorney regarding your Dad?
 
Oct 27, 2017
15,020
One thing I would definitely not recommend is, when you find where this piece of shit is, absolutely definitely do not put on a balaclava and beat the fucking snot out of him!
 

Cat Party

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,411
You need a lawyer. If you can't afford one, your state should have some sort of free legal aid type system that you can at least try to use. Contact your state bar to see if they can point you somewhere.
 

eso76

Prophet of Truth
Member
Dec 8, 2017
8,106
Call the police and tell them you believe this person might have murdered or kidnapped your father?
I mean, this sounds stupid but if he's the only person who knows where his body is and there's no death certificate...
 

eternalblue

Member
Oct 27, 2017
165
Not having a death certificate sounds really shady and doesn't seem like it would be legal? I don't think it's possible to move bodies across state lines, let alone out of the country without one.
 

Thrill_house

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,610
Call the police and tell them you believe this person might have murdered or kidnapped your father?
I mean, this sounds stupid but if he's the only person who knows where his body is and there's no death certificate...

I would go with this and contacting a lawyer. You are a good person OP. You are trying to stay level headed and handle this correctly. I won't lie, i probably wouldn't
 
Oct 27, 2017
17,973
I'm really sorry OP. My wife's grandmother just passed, and it cost $600 alone to transport and hand off her from the hospital in New York state to a funeral home in New Jersey. I don't know what kind of windfall this relative expects but they're probably shelling out just to do this. And without an estate executor or spouse, the home is probably satisfied enough someone related came to collect him at all. I wish I could offer something helpful here.
 
Nov 17, 2017
12,864
What the hell? If it's not too much to ask, what is the relation of this family member to your dad? That's an awful thing to do. I'm sorry OP.
 

Landy828

Member
Oct 26, 2017
13,395
Clemson, SC
Do you know for a fact that he died while in care at the facility? Do you know for a fact he was handed over to a funeral home?

If they have no record of him dying, I'd go straight to the police/law-enforcement...and tell them that. Tell them you have no record of him dying, and he was last handed over to this man.

You imply you know he died, but I just wanted to know where your info came from that he did.

Some gaps here we need information on, haha.

Also, I'm guessing this person is the executor?
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,885
This story is so wild you might even want to try contacting a news publication or channel.

Edit: Especially to put the squeeze on the hospice care place, tbh.
 

Vapelord

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,826
Montreal
No death certificate probably means family member X is still collecting any pension etc... meant for your father. Lawyer up.
 

Slappy White

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,205
Something very fishy is going on here. When a patient dies in a hospital they have to submit that to the coroner who issues a death certificate. Those are typically issued within 2-3 days by law I believe depending on the state. Then they keep record of which funeral home they release the body to.
 

Bleu

Banned
Sep 21, 2018
1,599
i don't get why police would not do anything, body snatching and unlawful dealing in dead bodies are serious offenses everyfuckingwhere.
That plus no death certificate ? something fishy is going on.
call the police.
 

greepoman

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,958
No death certificate probably means family member X is still collecting any pension etc... meant for your father. Lawyer up.
See now this would make more sense.... I was trying to figure out how repatriating the body would allow him to get money in another country but the simpler answer you suggested makes more sense.

Contacting all the benefits (pension, ssa, etc) agencies and alerting them to the father's death seems like one low cost solution. If the money is cut off them he'll have no use for the body.
 

-PXG-

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,186
NJ
EDIT

After some thought...

This "family" member might be trying to collect on whatever pension/ retirement/ social security payments your father may have had. If he's a co-signor, POA or executor on any of his assets/ accounts, this would make sense why there isn't a death certificate.

Get a lawyer, ASAP.
 
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Horns

Member
Dec 7, 2018
2,515
I would recommend posting this on /r/legaladvice, you'll be asked to provide basic information about your state (as laws vary) and they'll be able to give you much better and more accurate information.

Or just call an actual attorney.

This. It's such a good resource. OP, include the state your in and where your dad's body was/is.
 

TyrantII

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,365
Boston
[
EDIT

After some thought...

This "family" member might be trying to collect on whatever pension/ retirement/ social security payments your father may have had. If he's a co-signor, POA or executor on any of his assets/ accounts, this would make sense why there isn't a death certificate.

Get a lawyer, ASAP.

This.

And if there's no death certificate, he's officially missing.

I'd talk to the police about filing a missing persons report since there's no documentation of his death. At the least it would probably force this individual to start the process legally.
 

vodalus

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,220
CT
I realize this is a tough time, OP, but I'm still unclear what you have to gain from recovering the body.
 

-PXG-

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,186
NJ
Even if I'm correct (I hope I'm wrong), someone at the hospice should have made sure a death certificate was issued. The fact there isn't one filed, after a month, is very odd. The only legitimate reason I know is that the cause of death has yet to be determined/ an autopsy has yet to be completed, thus, a death certificate cannot be finalized. But it's been a month and your father was in the care of medical professionals.

Again, get a lawyer. TODAY!
 

ned_ballad

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
48,219
Rochester, New York
When my grandparents died, there was no chance that no death certificate was made. It was just part of the process for the funeral home. I'm not sure they would have even taken them without issuing one.
 

jb1234

Very low key
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,224
The lack of a death certificate is very fishy to me and I agree with others it may be that this person is collecting your Dad's money. My dad died a few weeks ago and I know how difficult at least that part is. I'm deeply sorry for your loss and hope that this all gets settled.