Now I'm imagining letting prisoners have "game only" phones that let them use the money they use for snacks for in game purchases.
-
Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
-
We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.
'My son spent £3,160 in one game' (BBC article looking at exploitative MTXs)
- Thread starter oni-link
- Start date
Now I'm imagining letting prisoners have "game only" phones that let them use the money they use for snacks for in game purchases.
Stop devoting thousands of hours of design labor per project focused on manipulating kids into doing it, making it quick and painless, and making it easy to do by accident. Have you been reading the thread?
From the article:
"It generated a big debate about whether parental controls are sufficient, how much responsibility lies with mum and dad"
The father of the adult with the cognitive ability of a seven year old is surely the financial power of attorney, which means the father is responsible for handling the finances, while £3,160.58 was spent over a 15-month period. I think in the UK the power of attorney has to make annual filings with the government, so if he was the PoA he should have known about this a lot sooner.
"It generated a big debate about whether parental controls are sufficient, how much responsibility lies with mum and dad"
The father of the adult with the cognitive ability of a seven year old is surely the financial power of attorney, which means the father is responsible for handling the finances, while £3,160.58 was spent over a 15-month period. I think in the UK the power of attorney has to make annual filings with the government, so if he was the PoA he should have known about this a lot sooner.
No one is batting for corps tho lol
If the parents made "mistakes" they have to deal with their mistakes, we can all agree about how evil and bad the likes of EA and friends are, but if you let your kids free access to PCs and consoles while at the same time let your bank account or CC connected to the platforms, well, you are irresponsible as a parent. Parental controls exist and they are not hidden, if the parents don't care about the warnings and they lose money because of this, well, it's your fault.
The 3k spending lasted for over 15 months, 15 months, you gotta be kidding me if you didn't notice all the payments come on lol
So it's all about shitting on unsuspecting parents?
I think I would actually prefer people going to bat for corps.
Because criticizing the lack of attention of parents is shitting on them?
When the tools that is tricking them is willfully obfuscating the controls they can have on it?
Yeah.
If that's the best analogy you can come up with, it's terrible.
The issue still is the same, parents who have no control over their finances. You can easily apply this to ANY digital sale since data doesn't have logistic constraints as a physical sale. You can keep buying until your bank says it's enough. Should we bundle MTX along with steam sales, psn sales, amazon sales, etc. ? I bet if we dig too deep, we will also find cases where people spent way more than they should have. While those stories are sad, it's difficult to see if they are fringe cases (10s in a population of millions) or something more alarming.
Also, what kind of parent controls exist in those games and any digital storefront ? Are they enough ?
And why did those kids never learned the basics on how to use money ? How they get access to a credit card ? To me those are far more shocking than the actual spending, really.
It is, dude. What do you think parents' lives are like? Do you think theyre neglecting their kids because the kid plays candy crush sometimes? Have you ever had to support or care for anybody else? have you ever had to work a job to pay for your living expenses?
what is with teenage gamers having an utter lack of respect for everybody else on the planet and thinking they must be better than them.
This is bullshit. You're basically expecting everybody in society to have the same tech-literacy that you do. And that is simply not how human beings work. Good for you that you have the know-how, but that doesn't give you the right to kick downwards on people who don't. As far as I'm concerned you're very much batting for the corps with the very post where you state the opposite.
yep, that's how it happens
$5 here, $10 there. you don't notice it until you add it up a year+ later.
$5 here, $10 there. you don't notice it until you add it up a year+ later.
Parents are responsible for there kids and how they spend money - this isnt news.
Parental control exists, it's not hidden, there's nothing obfuscating.
Adults are at risk as well...
I knew someone who blew 5000 euros on world of tanks to remain on the ranks a few years ago. Not a rich man by any means, it was his addiction, to be ranked well in that game. considering the trends in the industry, i hope he didn't try to keep up.
I knew someone who blew 5000 euros on world of tanks to remain on the ranks a few years ago. Not a rich man by any means, it was his addiction, to be ranked well in that game. considering the trends in the industry, i hope he didn't try to keep up.
I find it amusing that some take the rather obvious and perfectly sensible idea of "parents should strive to show more due diligence in understanding what their kids are doing on their phones/tablets/etc. and take appropriate measures to protect their children and themselves" and use it as a blunt-force weapon to deflect from the extremely obvious and predatory ways that companies are using these lapses of judgment to introduce and later reinforce addictive habits in their customers for their own profit.
I don't think I'd go so far as to call it victim-blaming (the victims of these companies are the children, not the parents. The parents, if anything, are victims of theft) but it is rather disingenuous nonetheless.
I don't think I'd go so far as to call it victim-blaming (the victims of these companies are the children, not the parents. The parents, if anything, are victims of theft) but it is rather disingenuous nonetheless.
The games we're talking about are specifically designed to exploit weak and vulnerable minds, like people with mental illness or kids. The root of the issue are not the parents, no matter hoy you paint it
I know several families that neglect their kids and they don't give a fuck about them
Yes, i supported and cared several peoples in my lifetime and yes i have a job and i live alone in my own house.
And no i'm not a "teenage gamer", but you tried.
In this day and age if you are a parent and you have access to phones, mobiles, consoles and PCs i do expect from you a little bit of attention; not leaving your own cc or bank account available to your kids is nothing out of the ordinary and parental control exist.
If the parental controls are not set up in an idiot proof wizard at the 1st startup of the machine, it is by definition something that is going to go over a huge swath of the population and WILL not be used by a non insignificant part of the user base.
That is the reality of the tech use in the public.
The fact that game devs are willfully putting gambling mechanics in their games to trick kids into purchasing more should definitely be very concerning but hey who cares there's parental controls in the settings on page 25 of the manual.
You may not be but you certainly act like one.
I don't think the parents in every case this has ever happened to have all acted flawlessly, in some instances, mistakes may have been made, or they might not have been aware of how these games or tech in general operate
I'm not saying the parents are 100% absolved of all responsibility, but neither are the developers of these games
If bad parenting and children being reckless is just something that has always been the case, what kind of things were kids in the 90s, or 80s, or 70s, blowing thousands and thousands of their parents money on?
To hand wave away how these games are designed, and to put all the blame on the parents, is just weird, in that it's clearly not just a parenting issue
I don't understand why so many posters here have such a hard on for ignoring that these games are literally desiged to extract an unlimited amount of money from their players. Posters couldn't be happier to discount that completely and put all the blame onto something else
It's just weird. If good parenting is all that stands between a child blowing all their families money on digital JEPGs, then maybe that is worth looking into
Please name a single reason for virtual currency to exist aside from obfuscating individual purchases and spending habits.
So despite having acquired actual life experience you still have zero empathy to other people's experiences, despite your own struggles?
With the benefit of wisdom, you decide to go online and talk shit about people you've never met because their kids bought mtx?
yeah dude I tried to give you the benefit of the doubt
It's so weird.
There's a reason why we banned kids from smoking or taking alcohol at a young age, even when you know, they have parents or guardians to supervise them.
Plenty of things are designed to exploit children - this doesnt mean that parents get a free pass and can put all the responsibility to devs or law makers. At the end of the day they are responsible to make sure that their Kids dont engage with games and content that will result in these kind of stories.
MTX is dumb af and shouldn't be a thing, but how the fuck do you not teach your kids about money and spending using credit cards? When I was 7, I used my granddads card to buy a months membership on RuneScape which was only like £5, he noticed, and calmly explained to be why I can't do that and all that shit. 7. How the fuck are 16 year olds this stupid lmao.
Except the options for kids to spend money are totally different from just 10 years ago. It's not just sneaking off with some spare change to the goddamn candystore anymore. There are storefronts hidden away in apps and games across multiple always accesible platforms. On the phone, ipad, computer and game console. Each tied to a separate billing system with their own optional parent control settings hidden away somewhere. And you are honestly stating that less tech-savvy parents should have the cognitive energy to keep track of all these different and often hidden stores, all the while maintaining their jobs, houshold responsibilities and actually, y'know, raising their kids.
I call bullshit. Stop defending these companies.
Yeah or even if the parents just removed the credit card information from the device that the kids have frequent access too. Yes it's a pain in the ass, but you know what else sucks? Being out 3k because you didn't take the extra time to wipe the credit card info. Because that's money you are probably never going to get back. Yes I get the problem is not necessarily what the parents or kids are doing but rather the predatory nature of these store, making kids think they're not even spending real money on items is messed up.
Because now criticizing the lack of attention of parents means shitting on them? If this is what you think i have nothing more to add
My favourite publisher, Square Enix, does this with their FF apps and it makes me ashamed of them. These apps are often aimed at kids.
Keep on exposing these guys, Im sick of this. I can't even play a game on Battlefield (after buying the deluxe or whatever the flagship version was at launch) and see mtx F it up, yes, weapons aren't as MTX, but I feel I bought half a game next to BF4, 3 etc with the amount of skins you could unlock for free in game.
Yeah we should let children gambling, smoke, drink and do drugs, then let "good parenting" protect them from that
If any other children get harmed, who cares, right? We can blame the parents
Large predatory corporations who hire psychologists to try to manipulate you or kids into buying things vs parents who give their kids their ipad to play a game not realizing that it could cost them thousands. The poster you quoted basically said they grew up in a different era but doesn't understand why it isn't the same when they were a kid.
Sorry but this is pure bullshit. My autistic son has done this to me on the Microsoft store (talking tom app) that @ the time (don't know if the option is available now) had no password required @ checkout option and I'm clearly not going to set-up my child with his own access to the internet so he used mine. So please explain to me how it is my fault.
It has also happened to me that when I have password @ checkout enabled and something would update on the phone/tablet and I have to reactivate the password @ checkout.
These corporations are huge and they know exactly what the hell they're doing with these predatory transactions, that's why they are called predatory transactions.
By the way, this isn't only @ the people I've quoted it's @ everyone defending these multi-billion Euro companies and hammering parents (especially parents with children with special needs) when being a parent is one of the hardest (and most rewarding) jobs in the world.
Give any game with microtransactions or gacha an AO rating, I say. I don't know how much the Apple Store and Google Play Store adhere to the ESRB in North America, but at least for consoles, that'd work.
Like, yeah, we as adults should be able to make our own decisions with respect to gambling. It's the law of the land. Yes, adults (and I've struggled with this myself) can cripple under the weight of gambling addiction, but that's the society we live in. No one below the age of majority is allowed in a casino, so... I don't see why the ESRB doesn't step up.
Like, yeah, we as adults should be able to make our own decisions with respect to gambling. It's the law of the land. Yes, adults (and I've struggled with this myself) can cripple under the weight of gambling addiction, but that's the society we live in. No one below the age of majority is allowed in a casino, so... I don't see why the ESRB doesn't step up.
Then, looking at the societal strata as a whole, I'd argue you have incredibly unrealistic expectations of parents.
Could someone please explain the point of defending the use of clearly predatory game design by large corporations (that don't even need to use these predatory techniques to keep the lights on)? Parents shouldn't have had their cards linked to the kid's phone/device but putting the blame solely on them is just classic victim blaming. These corporations made an active choice to target vulnerable people in society for profit and I have zero empathy for them.
Aye. A lot of us are lucky. I was a handful, but my parents were pretty strict with money.
Doesn't change the fact that I managed to find my way to play CS at LAN cafes without them knowing though.
When you are freely shitting on the parents and you have nothing to say in devs/publishers who implement such predatory practices? Yes, you are clear as water.
Maybe they didn't have a friendly gramp that had that one talk to them when they were 7?
And the fun part is that you were aware of this issue because you ran into this problem when you were 7 and that was actually way harder to pull that off.
How can you not see that this could have happened on a much larger scale to quite a number of people?
And that's without taking into account that games are designed to trick you into spending money now.
Yeah I am a parent and have that stuff locked down as well. I think the two main problems are parents not being savvy to all these new ways to get charged through their devices, and then the radio silence they get when they realize what happened and try to get their money back. We are parents that frequent a videogame/tech consumerism message board, but we're in a minority here lol.
I think it'd be a different conversation all together if the whole process weren't designed to make it as easy as possible to spend money and as hard as possible to get it refunded if a mistake was made.