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Naomi Osaka giving up U.S. citizenship to play for Japan at 2020 Olympics

Zabo

Member
Oct 30, 2017
739
Yeah which is why I'm not too confident she made the right decision. She's not going to be regarded as positive in Japan as she might hope.
If she continues to play well then she is solid. But if her games don't go well she will be denounced instantly. But at the end of the day, she will probably live in US so hopefully she can shield herself from most toxic parts of possible hatered.

Wait you cannot have dual citizen in the US?

The fuck?
You can. Japan doesn't allow dual citizenship.
 

guru-guru

Member
Oct 25, 2017
521
Canada
everyday life for half blacks in Japan unfortunately.
What I found somewhat nice and reassuring was that A LOT of people in Japan were heavily criticizing those comedians for their terribly racist comments, sending messages of support to Osaka, and talking about how and why those remarks are unacceptable towards black or half-black people. I was surprised by the reaction and was expecting mostly “I don’t see anything wrong with what those comedians said” comments.
 

JaseC64

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,356
Strong Island NY
Why does Japan do this? Is it a nationalistic thing? Another reason to hate nationalism I suppose.

You'd think Japan would be like the US letting their citizens keep both.
 

gdt

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,044
As a dual citizen from a tennis-obsessed 75% Asian household, this is going to be a thing all week. Still if you're ever gonna give up US citizenship without being booed at tournaments, now's probably the time to do it with panache and sympathy.

The US technically asks you to renounce your prior citizenship - but it's not enforced and the UK does not acknowledge it legally anyway, so no matter what you can always return to the old country, possibly with a bit of effing around at the Home Office or Passport office. I'm curious about what happens if Scotland secedes from the Brexit shitshow - and if my UK passport would automatically become a Scottish one, or if they'd honor prior traditions.
Isn't the old UK/Hong Kong passport still honored?
 

Mr. X

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,313
Being half black and taking Japanese citizenship seems like a bad long term decision for her mental health. Although I guess we have racism issues too.
It's harder now but will probably be better long term for her and other half japanese if she plans to use her status to pushback and make a difference.
 

NarohDethan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,555
Good on her but she doesn't speak Japanese? Damn good luck. Heard racism is pretty bad in Japan as well, but maybe she can help challenge that notion.

And yeah the USA allows dual citizenship. I always found it weird that some countries made you pick one. Of course my bias is that I am a dual citizen.
She speaks and understands Japanese but she has stated she isnt confident with speaking it all the time.
 

Korigama

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,028
Hm, the cutoff point for having to choose for those with dual citizenship in Japan is two years higher than I thought (I remembered incorrectly since I had assumed it was 20, which is the age when one officially becomes an adult there).

I already suspected that she had to deal with discrimination back in Japan as a result of being mixed (those examples cited were quite unfortunate). Can respect the choice if it's what she truly wants, though.
 

harSon

Member
Oct 30, 2017
3,814
Uh most Japanese people I know like her a lot.

Same with Rui Hachimura and Aska Cambridge. They're all over media.
They're culturally Japanese though and speak the language fluently given that they've predominantly lived in Japan. She's going to have a hell of a time penetrating Japan's racism and Xenophobia as someone whose culturally American and isn't proficient at Japanese.
 

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
17,327
Wait you cannot have dual citizen in the US?

The fuck?
You can. The article is talking nonsense. Even if Japan doesn't allow dual citizenship, her complying with Japanese law and choosing Japanese Citizenship doesn't necessarily mean she's no longer a citizen of the U.S. It just means the Japanese Government recognizes her as only being a Japanese Citizen.
 

Brotherhood93

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,663
She's live in the US since she was three, can't speak Japanese, but is giving up her US citizenship just so she can compete against the US at the Olympics? I mean...whatever makes you happy I guess.
She already represents Japan and, as far as I know, she has done all her career. It's ridiculous that Japanese law dictates she has to give up US citizenship now she's turning 22 but it's not like she just decided on a whim to represent Japan instead.
 

SolidSnakex

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,139
They're culturally Japanese though and speak the language fluently given that they've predominantly lived in Japan. She's going to have a hell of a time penetrating Japan's racism and Xenophobia as someone whose culturally American and isn't proficient at Japanese.
Seems like she may be doing a good job of it as it appears that the blow back of what those comedians said was strong enough that not only did they apologize for it, but their management did as well

 

Distantmantra

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,656
Seattle
She already represents Japan and, as far as I know, she has done all her career. It's ridiculous that Japanese law dictates she has to give up US citizenship now she's turning 22 but it's not like she just decided on a whim to represent Japan instead.
Yep. She's a really good tennis player but it will also be much easier to qualify for Olympic tennis under Team Japan than it would be for Team US with the competition. Japan also gets to automatically compete in everything since they're host country.
 

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
17,327
She's live in the US since she was three, can't speak Japanese, but is giving up her US citizenship just so she can compete against the US at the Olympics? I mean...whatever makes you happy I guess.
Again, that's not clear. The article doesn't state whether it requires individuals such as herself to actually formally renounce their former citizenship according to the laws of their State or whether they must simply choose under Japanese law to only be considered a Japanese Citizen. Unless she formally renounces her U.S. citizenship through the requirements under U.S. law, she will still remain a U.S. citizen, even if Japan doesn't recognize her dual citizenship.
 

Televator

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,636
Giving up citizen status is a stupid requirement for countries to have over a sport - of all things.
 

Zoe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,139
Giving up citizen status is a stupid requirement for countries to have over a sport - of all things.
The only reason sports is part of the discussion is because of the timing. Everybody with Japanese citizenship and one other, athletes and non-athletes, needs to decide by 22.
 

thediamondage

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,345
I wonder if she'd actually do it or just fake it. Specifically, she would have to fill out some forms at a US consulate including an oath of renunciation, but the US consulate wouldn't "tell" Japan she did that, that kind of info isn't shared between governments usually. She could walk in, drink some soda and sign autographs for an hour, and walk out and its all the same as far as Japan knows.

but yeah this seems like a very japanese specific thing, there are tons of US olympic athletes who hold multiple citizenships just like many other countries, its very common for US based athletes as well to compete for other countries. The only rule the Olympic committee has is that the athlete must be a citizen of the country they are competing for, they don't have any rules about dual citizenship etc.
 

TickleMeElbow

Member
Oct 31, 2017
1,953
They're culturally Japanese though and speak the language given that they've predominantly lived in Japan. She's going to have a hell of a time penetrating Japan's racism and Xenophobia as someone whose culturally American and only speaks English.
She already speaks a little Japanese and is studying it like mad. Japanese shows are constantly covering her "new phrase of the week" or whatever. Like she'll pick up a new Japanese phrase, use it in a interview, and the media goes nuts.
 

Zabo

Member
Oct 30, 2017
739
You can. The article is talking nonsense. Even if Japan doesn't allow dual citizenship, her complying with Japanese law and choosing Japanese Citizenship doesn't necessarily mean she's no longer a citizen of the U.S. It just means the Japanese Government recognizes her as only being a Japanese Citizen.
edit. maybe I'll just post this instead: https://features.japantimes.co.jp/dualcitizenship/
Dual citizenship in Japan
A “don’t ask,
don’t tell” policy
leaves many
in the dark

so while they haven't enforced the laws, they can actually revoke your Japanese nationality if you have dual citizenship.
 
Last edited:

so1337

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,161
Suisse
I know when I visit with my even further mixed children, that we will be okay (My Mom's side of the family is huge etc), but still. My mom used to tell me all the stories of mixed children that were orphaned, and how hard it was for them to be adopted in South Korea, so they helped many of those kids come find families in the United States.
Sounds rough, man. There‘s still a lot of work to do, it seems.
Seems like she may be doing a good job of it as it appears that the blow back of what those comedians said was strong enough that not only did they apologize for it, but their management did as well

Atta girl! Shitty comedians stay losing.
 

mrmoose

Member
Nov 13, 2017
7,319
Other American citizens have done the same thing to compete in the Olympics. I remember last time around there was an American guy who's wife is Russian so he became a citizen to ski for them.

edit: Alpine snowboarder Vic Wild
Aren't those mainly people who would otherwise not make the US team? I thought Osaka would be able to make it but I'm not up to date with tennis rankings or anything.
 

Jon Carter

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,443
My son is a triple citizen. When he turns 22, technically he’d have to choose between being Japanese or French and American. The Japanese government apparently doesn’t really check these things so I think we’ll just not say anything.
 

Zefah

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,798
My son is a triple citizen. When he turns 22, technically he’d have to choose between being Japanese or French and American. The Japanese government apparently doesn’t really check these things so I think we’ll just not say anything.
They don't, and the law technically only requires "an effort be made to forfeit foreign citizenship." "Effort" is not clearly defined, so it's easy to operate with multiple citizenships as long as you don't aspire to be a public figure or politician or something.
 

TheBryanJZX90

Member
Nov 29, 2017
1,227
They're culturally Japanese though and speak the language fluently given that they've predominantly lived in Japan. She's going to have a hell of a time penetrating Japan's racism and Xenophobia as someone whose culturally American and isn't proficient at Japanese.
I think that actually works in her favor. It's kind of like the uncanny valley. If you're a minority born in Japan you have it very rough, you act 99% Japanese but they won't ever get over your appearance. You're a Japanese person that does not fit in. If you're culturally American and are trying to add some Japanese flavor, then you are a curiosity and they appreciate you taking an interest. But otoh you will always be a side show and never actually considered Japanese.
 

Raging Spaniard

Artist at EA Star Wars
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
1,962
The US permits dual citizenship for adults both in general and for the olympics
Kiiind of. I just went through it last year, I only get to keep my Spanish nationality because Spain is cool with it

 

Inigo Montoya

Member
Nov 6, 2017
580
She's live in the US since she was three, can't speak Japanese, but is giving up her US citizenship just so she can compete against the US at the Olympics? I mean...whatever makes you happy I guess.
Money is probably a big part of her decision. If she does well, she has a huge opportunity for Japanese sponsorship.

There is a Japanese male player (Kei Nishikori) who makes more money than Nadal from sponsorships.
 

cinch

Member
Feb 17, 2019
84
Good for her. The USTA didn't see much potential in her when she was younger; even Chris Evert didn't invite her to her academy to train until Naomi was 18. By that time though, she was already representing Japan. So sounds like Japan was the best choice for her.
 

Razgriz417

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,159
I think that actually works in her favor. It's kind of like the uncanny valley. If you're a minority born in Japan you have it very rough, you act 99% Japanese but they won't ever get over your appearance. You're a Japanese person that does not fit in. If you're culturally American and are trying to add some Japanese flavor, then you are a curiosity and they appreciate you taking an interest. But otoh you will always be a side show and never actually considered Japanese.
being famous prob helps too
 

Mesoian

Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,549
I'm surprised Japan is letting her become a citizen. I thought they were strict with regards to that? Like you would need both your maternal and paternal grandparents to be citizens themselves in order to qualify.
Sure, there are rules.

Unless you can make them a shit ton of money through marketing and promotion.

That being said, I don't have a problem with this.
 

Zefah

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,798
I'm surprised Japan is letting her become a citizen. I thought they were strict with regards to that? Like you would need both your maternal and paternal grandparents to be citizens themselves in order to qualify.
What? She was born in Japan to a Japanese mother and has been a citizen of the country (I assume) since birth.