Netherlands: Meat substitutes on the rise (+51%), meat sales are falling (beef, pork down 9%)

shira

Community Resetter
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,993
Numbers are since 2017:

Meat substitutes: +51%
Beef, pork, game meat: -9%
Chicken: +2% since 2017, but -0.4% in the past six months

Also, vegetarian options have risen by 33 percent since 2016 to over 100 different products at the two biggest super markets

Some perspective though: even if the meat market contracted, total revenue of the meat industry is still 2.6 billion euros here, of which 123 million was spent on meat substitutes, only 4.5 percents.

Dutch article: https://nos.nl/artikel/2297492-vleesvervangers-bezig-met-snelle-opmars-verkoop-vlees-daalt.html
Google translation: https://translate.google.com/#view=home&op=translate&sl=nl&tl=en&text=https://nos.nl/artikel/2297492-vleesvervangers-bezig-met-snelle-opmars-verkoop-vlees-daalt.html

Great news imo and according to the article, the meat industry is getting a bit worried and some of them are even starting to get into meat substitutes themselves. Personally I've noticed a lot of new products and improved products popping up left and right, it's never been easier to be a vegetarian.

As I said in some earlier threads: this is why our actions do matter by letting our money talk. The government didn't do this, the government won't do this, but every dollar spent on a meat replacement instead of on actual meat hurts this industry and will make those companies change even if they don't want to.

Let's hope this'll turn into a snowball effect with meat replacements getting cheaper and meat getting more expensive simply through a change in demand.
Pig Ebola in China is going to have huge ramifications when China start running out of their frozen stocks.

 

MartinB105

Member
Nov 8, 2017
1,744
Albert Heijn has Quorn 'meat slices' for on bread here, not sure about their dinner meat alternatives in our local store. Dirk nearby us does have a couple of them.
It's the stuff for using as an alternative to chicken when making a curry that I'm looking for. For now I've been using mushrooms, chickpeas, and lentils sometimes instead of chicken or minced beef.

My local supermarkets are Lidl and Jumbo, so I don't often go to Albert Heijn or Dirk van de Broek, so I'll have to check them out sometime (I liked Dirk on the odd occasion that I've been there, AH on the other hand seemed really expensive).
 
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UltimusXI

Member
Oct 27, 2017
188
It's the stuff for using as an alternative to chicken when making a curry that I'm looking for. For now I've been using mushrooms, chickpeas, and lentils sometimes instead of chicken or minced beef.

My local supermarkets are Lidl and Jumbo, so I don't often go to Albert Heijn or Dirk van de Broek, so I'll have to check them out sometime (I liked Dirk on the odd occasion that I've been there, AH on the other hand seemed really expensive).
Ah alright, not sure if they have those here. We usually throw these in a curry, although they're already seasoned (and are probably less healthy?): https://www.vivera.com/nl/product/vivera-wokreepjes-gekruid

Albert Heijn is expensive indeed, although if you have a personal AH Bonus card, they offer you weekly personal bonus products and if you buy mostly vegetarian products, Quorn is one of the brands that appears a lot in the discounted items, most of the time with 25 % discount on all or most of their products.
 

Wackamole

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,267
Great!. But The Netherland still has a long way to go to become more sustainable. We're the worst when it comes meeting the climate change goals.

But yeah, we eat a lot less meat here at home. And the meat we do eat is from animals that had a good life. Better quality and more tasty with less hormones and anti biotics and shit. It's more expensive so also a good reason to eat less of it.

I've never been a fan of meat-substitutes, I much prefer to replace meat with stuff like mushroom, tempeh or tahoe.
Not even that. veggies and mushrooms are great. Can't stand Tempeh or tofu. No idea what people like about that. I do like soja beans on their own though..
 

Nappael

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,253
Tofu is fine, but not as a meat replacement. The obsession with making it as close to meat as possible never made any sense to me. There are much better plant based alternatives, and tofu is best when left as a spongy flavour absorber and not as a fake meat.
 

Dr. Mario

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,158
Netherlands
Interesting.
The PR from De Vegetarische Slager (the vegetarian butcher) definitely helped I think. It's not quite as good as meat and very expensive, but I find myself buying it quite often as a animal friendly alternative.

I would imagine the most important change however is that animal welfare quality seal.



I made it a point to not buy any meat without at least 1*, and I would be interested to see which sectors are hit hardest, if more people have started doing this.

It also helped recognizing that everything below 3* is still very cruel. Buy as little pork as possible.

Also the rest of the world needs to get in on this animal welfare seal as quickly as possible.
 

clemenx

Member
Oct 27, 2017
463
Venezuela
As the first world keeps moving into Eating weird stuff it means that we're gonna have a meat surplus down here in our shitty countries? Becoming cheaper yay.

I'm all for that. Even if we have to lose all our avocados to you guys.
 

DrROBschiz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,683
Progress!

Though I would still love meat available to me in lab grown form. Still very much support the reduction and dependence on mass production of livestock slaughter
 

Seik

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,204
Québec City
Yes, hope this trend propagates on the global scale.

Chicken however...I love it so much. I could live a beefless life with what the Beyond brand has created, it's a neat placebo. Chicken though, it's my sacred meat.
 

MartinB105

Member
Nov 8, 2017
1,744
Something must be off or wrong with that research.

I've been to enough different supermarkets over the last 15 years in the Netherlands to know which ones are costing me less or more money. This is especially true for Lidl and Jumbo, as I still shop at both regularly, and no-one will ever convince me that that Jumbo is cheaper than Lidl, because it definitely isn't.
 

lazygecko

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,864
Can't wait for the meat industry to really ramp up their lobbying war against the substitutes.
 

Tempy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,038
Anecdotally, but I've definitely seen more vegetarian/vegan options in the supermarkets and snack bars, and it seems to be doing fine, so there's obviously a market.

Off-topic; don't care about frikandel, but I'm having a real hard time finding smulrol (horse meat).
 

Tence

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,696
Something must be off or wrong with that research.

I've been to enough different supermarkets over the last 15 years in the Netherlands to know which ones are costing me less or more money. This is especially true for Lidl and Jumbo, as I still shop at both regularly, and no-one will ever convince me that that Jumbo is cheaper than Lidl, because it definitely isn't.
So because of your anecdotal evidence, a yearly Kassa research is off or wrong?
Do you buy similar products at Jumbo and Lidl? Because that is the premise of the reasearch. If you buy 27 common basic budget products at those supermarkets, Aldi and Lidl are most expensive and Dirk is cheapest. They even explain why in the article.

https://kassa.bnnvara.nl/nieuws/budgetboodschappen-goedkoper-dan-in-2018

Edit: It is entirely possible that for products you personally usually buy to pay less at Lidl. But if you want the cheapest, basic groceries, it is not the cheapest at all.
 
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johan

Member
Oct 29, 2017
864
kroket > frikandel

Also I can highly recommend paying the Vegan Junk Food Bar a visit, they serve sorta traditional Dutch snack food with good ingredients and great fake meat.
 

MartinB105

Member
Nov 8, 2017
1,744
So because of your anecdotal evidence, a yearly Kassa research is off or wrong?
Do you buy similar products at Jumbo and Lidl? Because that is the premise of the reasearch. If you buy 27 common basic budget products at those supermarkets, Aldi and Lidl are most expensive and Dirk is cheapest. They even explain why in the article.

https://kassa.bnnvara.nl/nieuws/budgetboodschappen-goedkoper-dan-in-2018
Yes I've bought many similar products at Jumbo and Lidl. In fact, I used to only shop at Jumbo, then I switched to Lidl because I saved money by shopping there instead. The main reason I still sometimes go to Jumbo is just because of the longer opening hours, and it always ends up being more expensive.

Sorry, but if the "research" conflicts with my own first-hand personal experience, then I have to side with my own experience, and that experience is that Lidl is cheaper than Jumbo.
 
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UltimusXI

Member
Oct 27, 2017
188
So because of your anecdotal evidence, a yearly Kassa research is off or wrong?
Do you buy similar products at Jumbo and Lidl? Because that is the premise of the reasearch. If you buy 27 common basic budget products at those supermarkets, Aldi and Lidl are most expensive and Dirk is cheapest. They even explain why in the article.

https://kassa.bnnvara.nl/nieuws/budgetboodschappen-goedkoper-dan-in-2018
The test is not wrong, but when I personally go to Aldi or Lidl, I'm more likely to pick up the items that actually are used in this test, while at other super markets, I'm more likely to pick up at least some of the more expensive alternatives, even if I don't care much about brands. Reactions to the test also mention that when it comes to quality for price, Aldi / Lidl are still king for the most part.

Dirk however does have great prices as well. Jumbo / AH are the super markets where it happens to me most often that I'm negatively surprised about the price when I'm at the checkout.
 

Tence

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,696
Yes I've bought many similar products at Jumbo and Lidl. In fact, I used to only shop at Jumbo, then I switched to Lidl because I saved money by shopping there instead. The main reason I still sometimes go to Jumbo is just because of the longer opening hours, and it always ends up being more expensive.

Sorry, but if the "research" conflicts with my own first-hand personal experience, then I have to side with my own experience, and that experience is that Lidl is cheaper than Jumbo.
Like I said in the edit, It is entirely possible that for products you personally usually buy to pay less at Lidl. But if you want the cheapest, basic groceries, it is not the cheapest at all. So saying AH is the most expensive is factually wrong. It might be most expensive for the type of groceries YOU buy though.
 

MartinB105

Member
Nov 8, 2017
1,744
Like I said in the edit, It is entirely possible that for products you personally usually buy to pay less at Lidl. But if you want the cheapest, basic groceries, it is not the cheapest at all. So saying AH is the most expensive is factually wrong. It might be most expensive for the type of groceries YOU buy though.
Well, I didn't say Albert Heijn was the most expensive; I just said that it's more expensive, which it is, based on my 15 years of actual continuous real world experience in grocery shopping from a range of far more than just 27 items (vs. Kassa's "research", which is literally nothing more than an (easily manipulated) snapshot).
 

Tence

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,696
Well, I didn't say Albert Heijn was the most expensive; I just said that it's more expensive, which it is, based on my 15 years of actual continuous real world experience in grocery shopping from a range of far more than just 27 items (vs. Kassa's "research", which is literally nothing more than an easily manipulated snapshot).
Edit: never mind. This discussion is useless.
 
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Surakian

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
753
We gotta get that number down even more. Meat substitutes have been great for me. I stopped eating beef for awhile and when I started eating it again it was way too harsh on my stomach and made me sick. If I eat beef now, it is usually as a special treat like going to get KBBQ. I can still eat pork but I hate pork. Beyond meat, seitan (but I try to limit this since it is gluten), and other meat-like products have allowed me to enjoy foods I can’t eat or dislike eating again.

Meat substitutes are definitely the future we should be investing in. Less methane, less animal cruelty. Everybody wins.
 

fallingedge

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,083
What do these replacement meat products taste like? And what texture are they?
They taste okay and offer a great substitute but it definitely doesn't taste the same. If you eat meat, I don't think they taste good enough to sway you away.

Out of curiosity, anyone know the nutritional value of the substitutes compared to the real thing?
 

Sec0nd

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
517
The meat substitutes are great here and definitely makes it incredibly easy to be vegetarian. The shwarma substitute is an absolute godsent.
 

Tremorah

Member
Dec 3, 2018
903
I think its fucking great that in that part of the world where there are abundance of ways for people to get their daily protein and calories people are eating less harmfully for the environment

I hope those numbers keep on rising in the coming decades across europe
 
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TheLostBigBoss

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
8,538
They taste okay and offer a great substitute but it definitely doesn't taste the same. If you eat meat, I don't think they taste good enough to sway you away.

Out of curiosity, anyone know the nutritional value of the substitutes compared to the real thing?
It doesn't taste exactly like beef, but it does have the texture of ground meat and has a more gamey flavor to it.

Depending on the brand of substitute meat, if someone told you it's just a gamey meat that has been turned into a burger, nobody would argue.

The fact we're already so close to having a near 1:1 imitation is a major step forward that tells me replacement red meat is going to completely disrupt the beef industry, and it's going to be brutal and swift like many disruptive technologies.

Also, the substitute stuff is not healthy. But you're eating burgers, it's not supposed to be.
 

TheLostBigBoss

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
8,538
We gotta get that number down even more. Meat substitutes have been great for me. I stopped eating beef for awhile and when I started eating it again it was way too harsh on my stomach and made me sick. If I eat beef now, it is usually as a special treat like going to get KBBQ. I can still eat pork but I hate pork. Beyond meat, seitan (but I try to limit this since it is gluten), and other meat-like products have allowed me to enjoy foods I can’t eat or dislike eating again.

Meat substitutes are definitely the future we should be investing in. Less methane, less animal cruelty. Everybody wins.
That's a normal response, if you stop eating red meat for a long while and start eating it again, your body hasn't re-adjusted to breaking down the proteins.
 

KeinPlanB

Member
Aug 6, 2019
56

KeinPlanB

Member
Aug 6, 2019
56
It doesn't taste exactly like beef, but it does have the texture of ground meat and has a more gamey flavor to it.

Depending on the brand of substitute meat, if someone told you it's just a gamey meat that has been turned into a burger, nobody would argue.

The fact we're already so close to having a near 1:1 imitation is a major step forward that tells me replacement red meat is going to completely disrupt the beef industry, and it's going to be brutal and swift like many disruptive technologies.

Also, the substitute stuff is not healthy. But you're eating burgers, it's not supposed to be.
To replace a burger is much easier than to replace a steak. We‘ll probably need synthetic meat to do so, I can‘t see a perfect steak made from peas anytime soon.