I think it's a crapshoot as well. One thing Sony has shown is that they try and cram as much power per pricepoint as possible even if it means they cut corners in certain areas.
PS4 Pro, despite being weaker, was still a very good value at $100 less
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Next gen PS5 and next Xbox launch speculation - Secret sauces spicing 2019
- Thread starter Phoenix Splash
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I think it's a crapshoot as well. One thing Sony has shown is that they try and cram as much power per pricepoint as possible even if it means they cut corners in certain areas.
PS4 Pro, despite being weaker, was still a very good value at $100 less
It would be a negligible difference either way. Both are gonna be using the same AMD parts.
It depends on many.. many factors...how much those companies want eat cost? What type of gimmick they introducing? For example the Reddit leak was talking about camera on the DualShock if I'm not wrong . *Shrugs* people saying that differences between x and pro are negligible too...and according to multiple DF comparation we now know that isn't the case......the reality is that this isn't a mid gen refresh where all the big marketing part is all well and done.....this is the starting line of a new gen and we saw (with og PS4 vs Xbox) what type of echo chamber a 500 gflops difference can generate.
He didn't say that, the $499 is associated with Anaconda not PS5. The punctuation makes it kind of confusing
Well then I would lose all of my money ))
To come back on topic if Lockhart exist and is truly 299 or 399 and Sony have just one sku....I don't see them go to 499 route at all
Because Microsoft has made it quite clear with the Xbox One X that they're not planning on giving up the Powerhouse throne any time soon and going into next-gen they're going to make sure to stay on top of that.
Hence why they're making 2 versions one priced lower for an average consumer/casual and another one for a hardcore gamer/I want maximum dick size.
PS4 Pro was priced at $399 and it was a shit tier console for the price that you pay. Xbox One X at $499 was much more worth it and is capable of quite many feats such as 4K Native RDR 2 and things of that nature. I own both of these consoles and PS4 Pro is nothing more than a better 1080p machine with some exceptions here and there.
They're getting arrogant again because they're ahead of the race. They're staying super quiet for a long time and most of all they refuse to do cross-platform and come up with bullshit excuses. You all remember the Fortnite cross-platform fiasco, it got to the point where Sony had no choice but to cave in after the massive backlash and quite honestly if they do not open up their platform in the future they will start going down the drain.
This is starting to be the repeat behavior of the PlayStation 3. The only thing that's keeping Sony doing well are their games, but if they refuse to do full on BC and full on cross-platform they will fall apart. Things are changing and its time for them to go with the flow.
The PS4 Pro was launched a year earlier and 100$ cheaper. You can't just directly compare the two like you just did, at all.
And your 'arrogant' spiel is just hilarious.
Explain to me how the "arrogant" spiel is hilarious, do enlighten me?
Not sure where to begin with this one.
For starters, Microsoft can claim they want to stay on top of the power category all they want, but the realities of economics means that if the two consoles are priced identically and both are aiming for as much power per cost, they will end up with almost identical specs to the point where having the power crown will be less of a relative difference than anything we've witnessed this gen.
Further, I think Sony is better at cost optimization. They also have the advantage of being the console leader, so they have better leverage by pricing out components at bulk volume than Microsoft can, and similarly if they go with a single SKU that means less costs associated with supply chain and logistics.
I think some people are going to be in for a rude awakening if they expect MS to win at power with price parity.
The more interesting item to discuss for me is just how close Sony can get if they end up pricing PS5 $50-100 less and launch at the same time.
Also, calling PS4 Pro a shit tier console is really disingenuous. I still think it has the best looking games due to the strength of their exclusives. And it's much more than a better 1080p machine. There's a huge difference in quality through cb 4k.
Bottom line is that it's a very good console for a great pricepoint. Xbox X is a premium console and it costs more as a result.
It wasn't just 500 GFlops difference (1.84 TF vs 1.31 TF) that made the power difference for PS4. It was also PS4 GPU having double the amount of ROPs of XBone's GPU resulting in PS4 outputting twice the pixels per GPU clock cycle, so PS4 had nearly twice the fillrate.
(PS4 - 32 rops x 800 mhz = 25.6 billion pixels/s vs Xbox One - 16 rops x 853 mhz = 13.6 billion pixels/s)
Then there was the 8GB of GDDR5 with much more easily usable memory bandwidth compared to XBone's DDR3 + ESRAM memory architecture.
All these things combined to make PS4 hardware a greater bang for the buck over Xbox One. On top of that, the icing on the cake, PS4 was $100 less expensive to purchase, since Xbox One had Kinect tied as an albatross around its neck for a good while before Microsoft cut that string in May 2014.
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That you're falling hook, line and sinker for the narrative that Sony is sitting there arms folded, as if they haven't been delivering great games and hardware for years now. Cross platform play is a not a huge 'fiasco' anywhere other than as fodder for platform wars on enthusiast forums. And even then they are taking steps to change their decisions. It's not in any way related to the Playstation 3 era either and the fact that you're already implying them to 'refuse' backwards compatibility shows how coloured your views are. PS5 will have PS4 BC, bank on it.
I think it's completely overblowing the cross platform issue, for one.
And it's not like Microsoft wouldn't do the exact same thing if they were the industry leader.
To compare that to Sony's position with PS3 is a huge stretch, imo.
Man, i cant wait for the reveals of each console. this is going to be so exciting and sweet.
Colored my views are? Holy shit dude good way to judge I guess. I spent more hours on my PlayStation 4 than I did on Xbox this gen due to their games. And nowhere in my post did I say they have horrible games or that they have been doing bad. I am simply stating that their exclusives are not gonna carry them into victory going and that they will be forced to adapt going into next-gen.
wasn't my point. I was talking about the echo chamber generated that whatever difference negligible or not in power. What I was meaning is that for the mass market there will be just one think. One more powerful console and one less. 99.9% of the people don't know what flops or rops are
A perfectly competent 1440p machine is "shit tier." Really just sounds like console wars BS, and that, combined with the vaguely combative attitude leads me to believe nothing will be lost by putting yet another wannabe insider on my ignore list.
I honestly don't think the vast majority knew there was a difference in power between Xbox One and PS4.
Mass market gamers really aren't clued into what a teraflop even is, I think these platform decisions come down to price and ecosystem more than anything.
Obviously if they don't have BC on the PS5 it will be a blunder, especially if the next Xbox has it. Cross-play is a different story however, as whoever is trailing the gen will want it and the leader doesn't want it as it helps their competition more than it helps them. See MS last gen doing the same thing as Sony is doing now.
i think you are mixing up with internet world and real world .
outside of internet forum and website , ps4 owners care less, don't even know or need to play cross platform.
they have more than enough game coming out and there is always exclusives and recent years they killing it.
the silence is hurting PS is kinda lame and good content for youtubers . it will be the same marketing like PS4 announcement . they will hype the announcement then 6 months of full force marketing before releasing .
C'mon James we both know that the power difference have been talked everywhere , forums ,magazines , YouTube ..websites etc etc every media know it before the launch and that difference escalated in the resolution gate after the launch. Price point is very important but perception of power too ..probably the second most important thing. It generate consensus
A lot of this thread sounds like theorizing backed by fanboy bullshit wishful thinking. I guess it depends on 1) Which side you are on and 2) What's your breaking point. Personally I try to mentally filter posts and posters that concentrate so hard on why one just has to be better than the other without ever seeing any merit in an opposing views. Just wait until we get actual leaks lol. Gonna be ridiculous!
Yes, and the common sentiment at the time was that even though they weren't well versed in specs and policies the enthusiasts chatter would trickle down. Reading YouTube comments of people who boasted about the PS4 being more powerful with zero explanation as to why, they might have been right.
Yes every media talked about it before and after the launch . On PS4 pro they was taking about "most powerful console" in their ads
Every company does
Oh lol! Arrogant Sony is back... lol.
Sorry but there is no reasonable argument for 1 single console SKU being bad... like at all. It's quite the contrary.
Multiple console SKUs are actually a terrible idea in my mind, especially when one is significantly weaker than the high end SKU. At the very least it's holding back the development baseline for next-gen games, i.e. developers design for lowest common denominator (cannot be understated and many are intentionally overlooking this because of who is rumoured to be launching two SKUs). Dividing up the player base, putting more pressure on devs to have to target even more platforms — at launch devs will have to design, optimise and test for PS4, Pro, XB1, XB1X, PS5, Lockheart, Anaconda, PC and perhaps even Switch; it's a nightmare that will sap a heck of a lot of dev resources.
Totally agree with the view that BC is bankable next gen... Sony really can't expect all their VR early adopters to wave bye-bye to their VR libraries.
By Sony not being at E3.. marketing rights for a game like COD, hows that going to play out at E3? There's usually a huge blowout of info at whoever has marketing rights for the next game conference. , showcase for it there. Especially if there is a Next Gen version of it being made.
Thats why I think Sony may have a reveal at some point before E3.
Thats why I think Sony may have a reveal at some point before E3.
If is 499 and it risk @50% to not be the most powerful console and on the market there's another full HD console that play the same multiplat big hits games for 299 or 399 ..well then...there are lots of things that doesn't work in one sku console strategy
So there's no validity to the idea that the 2 SKUs may output at different resolutions to offset the discrepancy in GPU power?
Pretty much this and it's what I was trying to say.
But people seem to love to defend their favorite console and then call other fanboys :/ lol. I guess it's impossible to have conversations with people on this forum sometime. I was simply giving my opinion on what I think. I enjoy both consoles for different reasons and if they want to succeed next-gen then they need to make sure they have BC and I feel that cross-platform will be an important aspect as well, but again that's just an opinion its neither right or wrong. And as you all know I have no knowledge or anything on Sony's plans.
Oh don't worry it happen everyday ...and I would add also that is silly to think that if someone know "more" can't have a personal idea or preference ..and need to be just impartial ..just because
You could know lots of "insider" things and prefeer Sony console and would be perfectly right ...same if you prefeer the green team
Ps. With this I'm not implying that you have a preference at all
How is Google going to do when it comes to development of exclusive titles to try and differentiate their platform from all the rest? Will they have nothing to show for it because they do not have decades of cultivation?
This is a point that I think is sometimes overrated, even looking at this generation, Microsoft had done well in almost every genre bar action adventures in the third party space, where Sony has shines but does not have the quality to match when it comes to shooters, racing games or titles like Ori or Cuphead.
The higher end consoles are likely to target 4K or checkerboard versions of it. Microsoft has to pursue it because they think that Sony will, and Sony will because they also have a television business. Most gamers are on 1080p sets, and that will still continue to be the case for a majority of next generation. Having a cheaper option with less RAM, weaker GPU is a way to try and lower the barrier of entry. It would also be gaming going a route which is common place when it comes to all forms of products, their production and how they are marketed. It might work, it might not, but going by how every other product is tiered to cater for different price points, it is a risk worth taking when you are not the market leader.
This point is overrated. If Ninja Theory, Obsidian, The Initiative come out with games that are rated 83 or higher, and Playground, Turn 10, 343, The Coalition, InXile improve or hold their own standard.......this would be a first party development team that can compete with any in the business. This is before you look at some of their other studios. Rare could go back to the quality they had with Kameo and Viva Pinata too.
A lot will also depend on how Google and other competitors are doing when it comes to getting development talent.
If the CPU is the same and all they are supposed to differ on is resolution, then how is that holding anything back?
GPU's did not hold back games this generation, it was CPU's. And developers are comfortable developing for multiple systems, Sony and Microsoft have shown with the PS4 Pro and XB1X that they have solutions that make it extremely easy to port for different versions. Not to mention that anyone that is making games for PC is already used to doing this. The issue is not a two tier approach where resolution might be the biggest differentiating factor between two versions of the same console, it is cross gen stuff that looks to hedge bets and limit risk by leveraging already established installed base against a generation that is simply starting up.
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I've always felt cross play is overblown, but that's just me. However, I do wonder how the whole cross play issue will play out with game streaming. Should I be demanding to be able to play against Xbox players or PlayStation players if I'm a Stadia subscriber? I personally like to use 1st party controllers, so I don't love the idea of playing against an Xbox player with an official pro controller. But that's just me making excuses if I lose, somebody on PlayStation may be using a pro controller too.
BC though, that for me is essential going into next gen. That's going to be the difference between me buying the console day1 or one/two years later. There are still so many PS4 games I have yet to play.
I'm not quite buying your "people seem to love to defend their favorite console and then call other fanboys" cover. I quite frankly don't understand how you can on on a rant spewing rhetoric about Sony and then get "oh poor me the fanboys attacking me" when someone calls you on it.
lol, the guy literally put me on ignoring list simply for me stating my opinion - what does that tell you? I don't put people on ignore lists if someone disagrees with me. Rant spewing rhetoric? Someone asked me why I think Sony is arrogant and I answered so I am not sure what you're going about there, my friend.
Cross play is a huge feature in my opinion. I have a lot of friends that only game on the Playstation, having a way to play third party games with them without having to invest in new hardware would be huge. It is not that the tech is not there, it is simply platform holders trying to keep everything gated in their platform.
Astounding that while we have zero new info this thread still is growing fast. Imagine we get real legit leaks ....
I think MS will try to be the most powerful, but at the end of the day they don't have complete control over that, especially if there's a price parity and they're launching around the same time.
The Pro's CB rendering allows it to punch well above its weight class and for the improvement it gives in Sony's exclusives alone it's a worthwhile purchase for me. Outside of that there are plenty of games that benefit from its additional power, even if they're not native 4K:
https://www.gamesradar.com/ps4-pro-confirmed-games-list/
Also worth keeping in mind that although the 1X does play a lot more games in native 4K it does still resort to dynamic resolution in many other games. Here's the One X's list for comparison:
https://www.gamesradar.com/every-xbox-one-x-enhanced-game-4k-hdr-framerates-and-features-explained/
Also worth keeping in mind the Pro provides superior quality experiences across the board over the base PS4 on PSVR. So yeah factor in all of those enhancements over being a "better 1080p machine" for third party and especially for exclusives, the fact that it came out 1 year earlier and $100 less and the improved VR experience and I think it's wrong to call the Pro a shit tier console for the price you pay.
Sony's mostly staying quiet because they blew their load early and don't have as many big things to announce to close out this generation. They've still got plenty on their plate for what they have announced though and possibly a couple more things in the oven if rumors are true (but those rumors also state those could either be cross-gen or bumped to next gen). Regardless though, "arrogant" Sony has been supporting 2 platforms in the PS4 and the PSVR quite nicely and has opened up a new mode of communication with fans in State of Play.
The crossplay topic has been done to death at this point. Personally for me it's not that big a deal, but I understand where others are coming from on the subject. Regardless, Sony have begun steps to open up crossplay with their direct competitors. I don't think we'll hear any major news on this front until next gen and they'll keep it in the "beta" stage until then.
On the subject of BC, it's my personal belief that the PS5 will have full BC with the entire previous PS console library if only due to PS Now. My logical deduction on the matter is as follows:
- For PS Now as it stands they have to have PS3 and PS4 hardware in their datacenters to accommodate PS Now users. This means double the hardware for each user and that they have to keep Cell production alive if they want to keep going this route. This is grossly inefficient and they'll want to improve this ASAP
- Enter the PS5. If the PS5 has full BC capability then they can then install that hardware in PS Now datacenters. No need for PS3 or PS4 hardware, just one unified platform to run everything. Think about it, if the PS5 isn't fully BC then that means PS Now datacenters will need to have PS3, PS4 and PS5 hardware for each and every user, which is simply ridiculous. The sheer amount of money they'd save by having a unified platform over having to install 3 generations worth of hardware in datacenters and keep ancient legacy hardware manufacturing alive is more than reason enough for them to push for the hardware to be capable of it
- So now we have a pretty reasonable bit of logic to conclude they will build the PS5 hardware and software to support full BC, hence why I believe the console itself will support it.
There're plenty of reasons to believe the PS5 would have BC beyond PS Now, but I like to trot out that example because it's a step that would save them dump trucks full of money and there's no reason at all they wouldn't want to save money. Most other reasons involve not wanting to upset owners or earning goodwill, and they're valid but performing a relatively simple act that would save tens, if not hundreds of millions of dollars long term? That's the sort of action I would expect any company to take.
Since things have become derailed somewhat, I thought I'd post this article from semiengineering.com on single vs multi-patterning EUV,which may become relevant to the next mid-gen upgraded consoles, should they happen.
Full article at the link: https://semiengineering.com/single-vs-multi-patterning-euv/
Full article at the link: https://semiengineering.com/single-vs-multi-patterning-euv/
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Oh it will be f'ing crazy. Also I hope Era is prepared for the onslaught when next gen reveals happen. I remember the old site being hell to try and load during those times.
Brad Sams: Xbox Anaconda and Lockhart summary
I'm posting it again, many users already have forgotten that we were given actual info about Xbox Anaconda by a genuine insider.
Brad Sams(xbox insider) talks about Anaconda and Lockhart. [starts @1:35]
I recommend watching the video.
Quick Summary.
--According to Brad Sams, Microsoft's idea is to match PS5 in power/price with Anaconda.He never said Anaconda will be
priced higher than PS5.
-Lockhart will provide entry level next gen gaming at much lower price than PS5. He also says Lockhart will be more powerful than XBOX ONE X (Starts at 2:24)
Brad Sams(xbox insider) talks about Anaconda and Lockhart. [starts @1:35]
I recommend watching the video.
Quick Summary.
--According to Brad Sams, Microsoft's idea is to match PS5 in power/price with Anaconda.He never said Anaconda will be
priced higher than PS5.
-Lockhart will provide entry level next gen gaming at much lower price than PS5. He also says Lockhart will be more powerful than XBOX ONE X (Starts at 2:24)
Ok, saw this on the old forum but I don't know anything about the site reporting this:
https://segmentnext.com/2019/03/27/rumor-ps5-to-introduce-ps-plus-premium/
Yeah... umm... discuss? lol
https://segmentnext.com/2019/03/27/rumor-ps5-to-introduce-ps-plus-premium/
Yeah... umm... discuss? lol
Your post read like "fan smack talk" to me and I felt (at least the one person questioning) was appropriate. I called it "spewing rhetoric" just because it was dense and at the same time read like you're trying to persuade someone without something more concrete as opposed to just stating your opinion . Moreover, I should of worded my reply better.
Sorry to all, didn't mean to derail the thread further.
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