The architecture is RDNA though. Navi is its implementation, similar to how Polaris and Vega were implementations of GCN, 4 and 5 respectively.
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Next-gen PS5 and next Xbox speculation launch thread |OT5| - It's in RDNA
- Thread starter Mecha Meister
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this is the 360 again. a hybrid chip using curent gen as a base with some next gen stuff, in this case rt.
No. The first studio to implement CBR was Ubisoft Montreal, for Rainbow 6 Siege. It was inspired by Guerrilla's TIR from Killzone: Shadowfall. Which was in turn an extension of previous accumulation techniques for things like shadows, etc.
Is it too early to nominate "throwing dog shit on screen and telling us it's chocolate" for the next thread title?
I am curious as to why Sony and MS are quiet on the RT stuff. Maybe as a favor to AMD so they can sell some 5000 series cards?
Not including a HW RT (especially after both using the same techs: NAVI, Zen 2 , SSD, 8K support, 120 FPS etc..) will be more surprising than including it.
We have a wise man here.
Maybe, maybe not. Seems odd that they wouldn't have specified that in the wired article though.
They bring something small normally, HW RT will take an extra 10% die space & raise the costs, it's not something they can just add.
Software ray-tracing is technically achievable on current-gen hardware... There would be no reason to mention ray-tracing as a feature if it's software based.
Please tell them. The Tomorrow Children is almost a fully ray-traced game.
They're quiet about everything outside of the basics right now.
Probably didn't think he needed to.
Sure there would, especially if they knew that the competition was going to make a big deal about Ray tracing.
We don't know how much die area it would add because we don't know what their solution is.
Anandtech's Editor in chief Ryan Smith on B3D just answered this:
"Is RDNA 2 the arc that will be featured in consoles?"
"My understanding (emphasis on that term) is that the consoles are Navi + some custom extras. Mainly, the RT hardware. I do not know if it'll be the same RT hardware as in RDNA 2. AMD doesn't talk about future products and they definitely don't talk about customers' semi-custom silicon."
"Is RDNA 2 the arc that will be featured in consoles?"
"My understanding (emphasis on that term) is that the consoles are Navi + some custom extras. Mainly, the RT hardware. I do not know if it'll be the same RT hardware as in RDNA 2. AMD doesn't talk about future products and they definitely don't talk about customers' semi-custom silicon."
That "The Most Powerfull Console Ever" talk from Microsoft really fucked with the conversations about console hardwares. Any news suggesting that something better might appear on a non-Microsoft console seems to create a new reality where that simply could't happen.
They didn't give specifics because it is not final yet. HW RT is not something you can add later on, it has to be planned. Obviously there is something up as to why either hasn't committed if its SW or HW based. Much different than something like SSD in-house tech which both of them have allegedly figured out.
I expect neither to budge when it comes to CPU/GPU specs until early 2020 so debate on this thread will be rather thin on facts.
Look. The PS5 will have HW RT by 99.999999999%. We are just having an infertile discussion for nothing due to unnecessary FUD. I just left you an infinitesimal percentage of uncertainty.
anexanhume on B3D some people are disappointed with Navi 251 mm2 size("terrible numbers for 7nm"),what do you think?
And you came to this percentage based on?
MS confirmed HW accelerated Ray Tracing though.
I don't think Ms is that quiet, they said that they will have next gen raytracing (the wording picked my eye, but after today, perhaps they were alluding to next gen RDNA), in real time because it's hardware accelerated, and then showed a demo that was pretty much a ray tracing showcase.
Are we expecting both consoles to have the exact same customizations?
No need for that, Nvidia is gonna make sure they don't sell lmao.
I must've missed it, in that scenario there's absolutely no reason to believe that Sony are going to ship PS5 with a GPU which won't provide HW RT. Unless, you're trying to insinuate that it's really difficult to achieve and MS engineers have it figured out and Sonys' haven't?
By user ToTTenTranz:
"Ryan's piece on Navi cards:
https://www.anandtech.com/show/14528/amd-announces-radeon-rx-5700-xt-rx-5700-series
Turns out it's 251mm^2. The packaging might be adding a couple of mm in each direction."
From reading this thread it sounded like that wasn't expected to be the case.
I 100% agree that SSD saves on RAM, but an SSD is more like a modifier for the RAM. If developers would be able to get 64GB of RAM, they would love it. So yeah, with an SSD 16GB will act closer to 24GB but it doesn't mean that 16GB is "enough". It's never enough and we are not even close to being at the "enough" point. The more the merrier and an SSD is an awesome way to save on RAM and make whatever the given amount of RAM next gen will have to "act bigger" :)
Thanks.
Now this is the first time I heard there is a game clock for a GPU. Is this just a RDNA feature? It seems the Tflop count is calculated based on the highest boost clock speed. Why can't get games get access to boost clock speeds and stop at this game clock speed?
Probably not the same customizations but both will have made sure to get HW RT going.
In comments below that:
"Wow... these are some terrible numbers for 7nm. It's a good thing Nvidia likes its high margin business and both Sony and MS want backwards compatibility.
Severely disappointed in AMD is an understatement. They had all the opportunity in the world with Turing offering so little in terms of price vs performance and performance per mm. And this is all they deliver?"
"By far my biggest disappointment is price a 250mm die with 8gb memory , last time AMD had one of those it sold for $240 USD."
These are mostly price/performance complaints i guess.
Given Sony have explicitly mentioned it - I doubt it's the software only RT devs are already able to do, and has been used in a handful of titles this gen.
Hardware Accelerated Ray Tracing is not a fixed/defined thing though. It's entirely possible and likely that AMDs implementation will differ from nVidia's. And it's also possible that MS and Sony have each implemented their own HW system/s to accelerate Ray Tracing functions completely separate to AMDs planned implementation.
We may end up comparing HW Ray Tracing implementations/results in next gen. I think Digital Foundry is gonna be busy.
AMD's "boost clock" is maximum achievable clock, NV's "boost clock" is typical gaming clock. AMD's "gaming clock" = NV's "boost clock". They are just somewhat bridging the terminology here and manage our expectations as thinking that 5700 will run at its rated boost clock is unrealistic.
Game clock="typical clocks" when gaming. Base clocks are basically "stress test, heavy load" clocks. GPU is under a lot more stress when running benchmarks than when you're gaming. And boost clock is max "short burst" achievable clocks.
"Game clock" is just the usual clock you'll get when playing, which is why it's between base and max boost clock. It's like listing average fps alongside min or max.
From that same thread
Ryan Smith - Its his understanding that both consoles have hardware RT
Not sure if that was already mentioned here
Thanks for the explanations.
I think people are reasonably upset about the cost, but that's how this market works.
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For those worried about VRS, MS has a patent on it from 2016 with their lead GPU architect on it. I would bet Scarlett has it.
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