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Next-gen PS5 and next Xbox speculation launch thread |OT7| - nm
- Thread starter Mecha Meister
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How do you guys think the SSDs will compare to current ones available to PC?
Microsoft claims 40x improvements over HDD and sony showed 15>0.8s improvement.. both are far far above anything we have for the PCs.
Even the available NvME SSDs with their 3GB/s speed are equivalent to normal Sata SSDs in loading times for the PCs.
Very interested to see how it will pan out for us PC folks.
Microsoft claims 40x improvements over HDD and sony showed 15>0.8s improvement.. both are far far above anything we have for the PCs.
Even the available NvME SSDs with their 3GB/s speed are equivalent to normal Sata SSDs in loading times for the PCs.
Very interested to see how it will pan out for us PC folks.
Seeing RDR2 performance analysis is interesting, navi seems to scale better than RTX cards, 5700XT only 2fps below the 2080 in 1080p Ultra setting.
By lowering the settings to a combination of high and ultra you can get the 5700XT to do 1440P at 60fps.
The game also uses up 6GB of VRAM on ultra settings, and i assume that on PC ultra its texture quality isnt far off from what we will see on early next gen.
If the GPUs on consoles really are >10TF navi and have 16GB of GDDR6 usable for devs it should be fine to run the game on PS5 patched to run at 4k checkerboard ultra at 60fps (hopefully with better checkerboard solution this time)
By lowering the settings to a combination of high and ultra you can get the 5700XT to do 1440P at 60fps.
The game also uses up 6GB of VRAM on ultra settings, and i assume that on PC ultra its texture quality isnt far off from what we will see on early next gen.
If the GPUs on consoles really are >10TF navi and have 16GB of GDDR6 usable for devs it should be fine to run the game on PS5 patched to run at 4k checkerboard ultra at 60fps (hopefully with better checkerboard solution this time)
the next gen consoles with their SSDs should be a massive improvement simply because games will be developed with their speeds in mind. At the moment, you can install ssds in your consoles and pcs and they might brute force better loading times due to speed, but games are not developed with them in mind. Next gen, devs have them as a baseline and can take the full speed into account.
This point : "there is a good business case to be made for patching PS4 games for PS5." ?
I don't think there is a good business to patch your BC game, no. That's the whole point of BC.
W3 is OK now, but it was not great... at all. I luckily find a story on this : https://kotaku.com/things-are-finally-looking-up-for-the-witcher-3-on-ps4-1826081330
You disagree, I got that much, but you still haven't explained why.
Patching is work devs are already partially doing, and that would make their games more competitive in a less crowded market.
If PS5 really touts "no loading" it'd be foolish to not at least try and patch support for the SSD.
Surely it depends on what kind of BC is offered? Will games run at their original framerates and resolutions, or can those be improved out of the box? If not, some 4K updates to older games could be a great way of generating interest and revenue from older titles and franchises.
That 15 to 0.8s improvement doesn't only come from the HDD. CPU is also important for decompressing data, which people tends to forget.
Agreed.
The implementation of BC is the biggest factor really. I doubt Sony's BC solution will (notably) improve things from the get go though.
That's your assumption and I am really not sure about that.
I thought I already explained why :
I take time and money to do it, probably more than what you think, and most devs doesn't have the time and money to spend on old games. Especially that we are talking about a medium who decrease in value so quickly.
And I already said that most early adopters already played all the games you cited.
I never said there won't have 4K updates, I doubt you will see a lot of free patches that do that.
Tbh, I'd rather have what Kleegamefan described running at Native 4K and 30 FPS then having RDR2 running 60 FPS but in 1080p or 1440p or 4K checkebroard.
Getting half of the FPS for something truly next-gen is more welcome than ruminating current gen games in double FPS.
This is for the PC enthusiasts only who are able to spend 4 times if not 5 times the price of a next-gen console to get that double FPS, since PC talk is brought here.
Sorry but I will settle for what we will get for next-gen with good and wiser use.
Whether or not patching BC games is good business is wholly dependent on the work needed to patch and how much additional revenue and goodwill you get from that.
Most games are already developed with assets at higher fidelity than they're finally implemented, so there wouldn't be much work there.
For annualized series it makes no sense, for serialized games that are active and getting sequels it makes much more sense.
Most games are already developed with assets at higher fidelity than they're finally implemented, so there wouldn't be much work there.
For annualized series it makes no sense, for serialized games that are active and getting sequels it makes much more sense.
Or from the decompressor on the SSD like in the Sony patent. On MS side it seems for loading they use the GPU to decompress data, it is faster.
In any case, it's not only the result of a faster drive. It's a combination of multiple elements.
I never said it is not the case. I just say they use something else than the CPU to do the decompression.
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Don't tell me you don't have a capable hardware to run this with the PS5. With PS5 you can run 5 versions of this game simultaneously.
It will probably get the Nioh treatment. The game comes out next gen and is notably different.
I still hope they will use their Panta Rhei engine. Please don't tell me RE is fine and stuff LIKE that, Panta Rhei engine had so much poetntial tbh, with voxel based dynamic GI and voxel based dynamic fluids, procedural generating locations and many other aspects. S-E didn't give up on Luminous Engine eventhough it was that clumsy and they instead starting using UE4 for their othEr games, on the contrary, they are still upgrading it with path tracing even for next-gen.
Panta Rhei could benefit so much from RT which could be harnessed with the RT hardware and being less demanding than their old methods that they couldn't run well for this gen.
I still it will stay F2P and will be a successful type of F2P like Fortnite and Warframe.
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Well, you have to be careful I guess, because whilst the loading went from 15 to 0.8, loading a game isn't solely utilising the storage drive. The biggest gains can be made by speedier storage, yes, but functions are executed, memory is populated and read from etc so in other words if you planted the PS5 storage solution into a PS4 you wouldn't expect to see the same result, which is why you might think crickey that's way beyond the typical benefits I see when I put a good SSD into a PC.
Further, we won't be playing PS4 games on the PS5, we'll be playing PS5 games. They'll have larger texture files, higher quality audio etc which would negate some of the gains you have from the improved hardware and so I wouldn't expect to be able to load Spider-Man 2 in 0.8 seconds.
So most early adopters have already played the games... but CP2077 is getting a full price remaster.
From a studio that famously dedicates most of its attention to one game at a time and took years to patch W3.
By your own logic, that makes no sense at all.
You said " I don't think there is a good business to patch your BC game, no. That's the whole point of BC. " I assume you mean patch BC games with further 4K updates. Did you mean just patching basic BC into in general?
you need to go watch the star citizen DF video. That game is designed around SSD's and doesn't run well on HDDs. Next gen games will be the same
Deep down, I really thought this game would release this gen. Glad to hear it's not (quite) vapourware.
Well me too, I don't recall any F2P game that is graphical intensive tbh except maybe skyforge which imo has the best graphics in any F2P game to date.
Destiny 2 would probably want to have a word with you, lol.
Oh i forgot it became F2P because it was commercialised as a paid AAA game in the beginning. thanks for reminding me this. :p
The game you are listing, yes. CP 2077 is a 2020 game and my take since the begining is "no older than 2019". You can in Era some sub who ask the question "wether people will wait an eventual next gen version instead of the (probably) shitty actual gen version". And lot will wait or said they will doubled dip to play an other class / build. And don't forget they planed DLC and maybe multiplayer, so the game will still live in 2021.
We know all games are BC between PS4 and PS5 like all games are BC between PS4 and PS4 Pro. How many games older than 2 years prior to Pro and XBX launch had a free patch (and not first party of course) ? Really not a lot if any. Even games released the same year.
So I don't see any reasons to spend time and money to make a free patch of an older game who probably have not much value.
So, months ago I had the theory that the then unnamed 5000 series would probably be pretty close to what ends up in both next gen consoles but I'd like to revise that to say .... it'll be the 6000 series instead. I feel we will see a 6700xt or 6700X-RT type card that uses the same type of chips (as a 5000 series) but just a tiny bit more efficient and coupled with some ray tracing hardware. I don't expect insane TF levels or even a giant chip for the same reasons as anyone else (heat dissipation and power usage mostly ) but it really feels like both new consoles are still over a year out at this point, why would they use 20 month old tech when they could get revised 7 month old tech made the most cutting edge ... if the option exists ?
Also , while I was really hoping next gen would finally return is to 60fps gaming .... based on the benchmarks from RDR2 PC I fear we're still going to be stuck at 30fps for a LOT of software. That game needs a 2070 super just to hit 60fps .... at 1080p. It's not even a next gen game yet either , just a souped Up PS4 title , so where does that leave actual ground up next gen titles ?
Also , while I was really hoping next gen would finally return is to 60fps gaming .... based on the benchmarks from RDR2 PC I fear we're still going to be stuck at 30fps for a LOT of software. That game needs a 2070 super just to hit 60fps .... at 1080p. It's not even a next gen game yet either , just a souped Up PS4 title , so where does that leave actual ground up next gen titles ?
That's what a lot of us have been saying for a while. Don't expect 60fps across the board, you probably shouldn't even expect 60fps in most games. About what you're getting now is what you'll get next gen.
So they are planning DLC and multiplayer, but will also have time to completely remake the game from the ground up for a next-gen remaster?
And I am the one underestimating costs for devs?
Competetive multiplayer games will sacrifice graphical features, like cut som of the RT effects to hit 60 FPS like BF games for example. imo theycould ofefr both options like full RT features with 60 FPS at 1440p of 4K checkerboard and Native 4K 60 FPS with some RT features only like shadows.
They shoudl not be stuck to just oen option and always favor 60 FPS only over graphics.
Exactly, read above.
you will get multiplayer shooters at 60 fps just like this gen. the rest will be 30 fps. no one is wasting half of gpu resources trying to render open worlds at 60 frames when 30 will do just fine.
5800 or 6800 is what we should expect.
From the ground up ? No they will port the PC version and can even outsourced it. If they "in sourced" it, they won't be able to work on it until the technical side of the game is patched on PC and consoles. After that, they will.
And I don't think the port will come before Q1 2021.
So in regards to their next-gen plans, I'm noticing a definitive lack of PS4 Pro deals in leaked black Friday ads. Seems like Sony is going all-in on the PS4 slim and Gen 1 PSVR. Seems like a sign that they'll drop the Pro like a rock once PS5 is around.
That always made the most sense, but now we're getting a clearer picture.
Microsoft on the other hand... They've got plenty of deals on both the Xbox One S and the Xbox One X. That makes sense for them as we already know Halo Infinite is cross-gen. Interesting split in strategies between the two!
That always made the most sense, but now we're getting a clearer picture.
Microsoft on the other hand... They've got plenty of deals on both the Xbox One S and the Xbox One X. That makes sense for them as we already know Halo Infinite is cross-gen. Interesting split in strategies between the two!
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14 tflops will be their mic drop moment yes. That combined with HBM2.
We have seen this before. Forza Horizon 4 on the 5700xt is on par with 2080. thats where thuway got his rumor from. i think the PS4 was the game's lead platform unlike many other games where the pc version is the lead platform and everything gets downported. RDR2 is a technical marvel on consoles most likely because it was treated as an exclusive by rockstar.
That could be source of some rumours that nextgen ps5 is on pair with rtx2080 even though is on pair with slightly underclocked 5700xt
lol you and 9 tflops.
There are more things pointing to >10 tflops monsters then less.
It's not happening.
No way any of the next-gen GPUs will be less powerful than the 5700XT, first both have RT hardware capabilities which any RX card lacks, second both will be double digit GPUs, so in order to get that mathematically, both GPUs need to either have higher clocks or more CUs or both.
QUOTE="AegonSnake, post: 26184853, member: 5295"]
lol you and 9 tflops.
There are more things pointing to >10 tflops monsters then less.
It's not happening.
[/QUOTE]
This, i don't know why he insists on it being 8 Tflops or less. :p
Just sayin ;dlol you and 9 tflops.
There are more things pointing to >10 tflops monsters then less.
It's not happening.
Sure in term of rt capability. Will it be double digits we will se, Klee source can be wrong.
yeah, if the 5700xt is on par with 2070 then the 5800xt should be on par with 2080. if we are getting a cut down version of the 5800xt then we should be right around 2080 performance. if the 2.0 ghz oberon rumors are true, we should be on par if not better than the 2080. maybe even 2080 super performance levels.
i think MS is at 2080 performance levels while Sony is 2080 super. 12 vs 14 tflops.
[
Well if the PS5 has a GPU clock of 2GHz then over 10 Tflops is granted and things seems to lean toward it.
Possibly. And to those thibnking this is not possible because thsoe GPUs are high end now, by next year NVidia will be releasing their 7nm euv RTX 3000 series which will obliterate the current RTX cards and even ATI will release high end GPUs that are far superior ro next-gen ones. So what seems high end this year for many and not possible, by next year it will be mid range and affordable to manufacture in big scale.
Well if the PS5 has a GPU clock of 2GHz then over 10 Tflops is granted and things seems to lean toward it.
Possibly. And to those thibnking this is not possible because thsoe GPUs are high end now, by next year NVidia will be releasing their 7nm euv RTX 3000 series which will obliterate the current RTX cards and even ATI will release high end GPUs that are far superior ro next-gen ones. So what seems high end this year for many and not possible, by next year it will be mid range and affordable to manufacture in big scale.
PC version was the lead. You're getting those results because AMD GPUs perform a lot better with DX12. It's not the first time. It wont be the last.
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