Sony responding would be dumb. They aren't going to comment before the reveal.
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Next-gen PS5 and next Xbox speculation launch thread |OT8| - The Dark Tower (See Staff Post)
- Thread starter Mecha Meister
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No one can convince me in a perfect BC world that PS4 pro should have 64 ROPS.
I think it's the GL0/GL1/GL2 caches
That's what most of the test cases are about and looking at the counters in GLX it seems to fit. You can see all of the performance counter blocks for navi here:
I don't personally think Lockhart should be a problem, if as rumoured it's aimed at playing the same games but at 1080. That's literally just a graphics card difference between the two.
The one that worries me is the cross gen games, something I used to dismiss mentally as console warrior "concern"... but let's use Halo as an example... Given the cpu constraints of xbox one, surely that must limit the scale of encounter that 343i can design in halo infinite? If they were targeting the new gen only, it would surely be a more epic gaming experience.
Yep.
II see GL0/GL1/GL2 mentions for caches for Oberon that matches with the Arden test cases with GLX.
Great find!
Even a power difference as big as this leak suggests ultimately won't matter at all. Consumers only care about games, rightly so, that is why Sony's weaker PS4 Pro sells more than Xbox One X. The price difference also helps which is why the PS5 doesn't need to be the most powerful. A great line up of stunning first party games will suffice!
I have both an X and Pro and play the Pro way more due to the games. I think it's only tech geeks like us that will get worried about spec differences.
I have both an X and Pro and play the Pro way more due to the games. I think it's only tech geeks like us that will get worried about spec differences.
What if...
There were rumours that said the Ps5 AND Ps5 Pro would launch at the same time.
What if... what if Sony decided to go the Lockhart way and Oberon is, in fact, a Ps5 Lite??? (Would be clocked to 1.8 rather than 2.0 for yield purposes)
Sony launches the Ps5 at 13/14 Tflops with HBM suprising Ms trying to surprise Sony with XSX and Lockhart
Cue Inception PFWAAAAAH sound
There were rumours that said the Ps5 AND Ps5 Pro would launch at the same time.
What if... what if Sony decided to go the Lockhart way and Oberon is, in fact, a Ps5 Lite??? (Would be clocked to 1.8 rather than 2.0 for yield purposes)
Sony launches the Ps5 at 13/14 Tflops with HBM suprising Ms trying to surprise Sony with XSX and Lockhart
Cue Inception PFWAAAAAH sound
A point that i would bring up is that many are expecting MS to be more focused on cross-generational content in order to expand their ecosystem, so much that we heard rumors about no XsX exclusives in the first year or so (although Hellblade II seems to be next-gen only?).
That + having to cater to Lockhart hardware would limit the output (especially in terms of graphics and such) of their games quite a lot.
On the other hand Sony, who is pushing for a faster transition and only one SKU, can have it's teams develop exclusively for next-gen and possibly have a stronger visual impact?
Like, in the absolute worst case scenario MS could find itself with a 12TF that still has to render XBO games, or Lockhart, but with all bells and whistles, while Sony gets full fledged next-gen exclusives.
Both interesting approaches that make for fun times ahead.
If this is real then i can accept the reasoning of PS5 being "weaker" (from a pure raw power standpoint) but noticeably cheaper. If they'd both be at the same price, now that would be baffling.
I guess we could either see 299/399/499 or 399/499/599?
That + having to cater to Lockhart hardware would limit the output (especially in terms of graphics and such) of their games quite a lot.
On the other hand Sony, who is pushing for a faster transition and only one SKU, can have it's teams develop exclusively for next-gen and possibly have a stronger visual impact?
Like, in the absolute worst case scenario MS could find itself with a 12TF that still has to render XBO games, or Lockhart, but with all bells and whistles, while Sony gets full fledged next-gen exclusives.
Both interesting approaches that make for fun times ahead.
If this is real then i can accept the reasoning of PS5 being "weaker" (from a pure raw power standpoint) but noticeably cheaper. If they'd both be at the same price, now that would be baffling.
I guess we could either see 299/399/499 or 399/499/599?
Well that makes the most sense for GLX with X being variable for the number. Any other insights you were able to gleam?
Tom Warren is probably the most connected Xbox insider we have and he seems pretty confident. And no one with any credibility will come out and definitively say for sure either way because things can always change. Sony could always decide to make a PS5 pro or something tomorrow and change the entire story.
But in my opinion, as soon as they announced 2 SKUs, it was pretty apparent (to me) that they were going to go all in on the higher tier SKU, and have a nice baseline on the lower tier. In my opinion, I don't think they would have 2 SKUs if both were going to be "less powerful"than the PS5. It just doesn't make sense. Having a console that's 100 dollars more than PS and another 100 dollars less always made the most sense.
In % terms sure. But 3TF sure powers a lot of effects... The X1 vs ps4 was a 0.5tf difference.
Once we're at the level of 10tf, diminishing returns do come in to play of course.
This is a massive overexageration. The market doesn't give a crap about Teraflops.
All the PS5 needs to be is significantly better than the PS4 (which it is) and be reasonably priced (which if it really is 9.2, then it sure sounds like it will be.)
The differences will be noticeable sure, but it'll mostly be a resolution or minor things. it won't be nearly enough to lead to it being labled as "old tech".
Some had similar theories in 2013 with the hidden second GPU of XB1. :P
You have it. And Flute tested bandwidth almost perfectly fits with Oberon B0. About 530GB/s measured giving an approximate 550GB/s theoretical bandwidth.
Phil Spencer also sounds very confident, but I guess all he ever says is just PR fluff, right?
"I think" and "they are aiming" isn't what I'd call confidence.
Oh yes, they will just throw together a new console in less than a year.
It doesn't make sense to who? It isn't something that they can control if PS5 ends up being stronger.
Because literally no one with any credibility would say "I definitely know what's happening" because if something changes then their credibility takes a hit.
Well then, someone needs to tell PCGuide that their numbers are way off. 😋
Also; found that link about the instruction set.
9.2TF PS5 isn't a problem provided it's cheaper than XSX. If they're the same price however... Yikes.
I honestly think if a 9.2TF PS5 is true then they must be shooting for $449 or less.
Tom Warren says that XSX will have the performance lead "for a price" which suggests that the XSX will be more expensive than the PS4.
Lockhart $349 (no way cutting the GPU down and 4GB less RAM cuts costs to a $300 next gen console)
PS3 $$449
XSX $549 (XSX is a 7nm part which means the APU is freaking massive, this thing is gonna be expensive)
Is how I see it shaking down.
I honestly think if a 9.2TF PS5 is true then they must be shooting for $449 or less.
Tom Warren says that XSX will have the performance lead "for a price" which suggests that the XSX will be more expensive than the PS4.
Lockhart $349 (no way cutting the GPU down and 4GB less RAM cuts costs to a $300 next gen console)
PS3 $$449
XSX $549 (XSX is a 7nm part which means the APU is freaking massive, this thing is gonna be expensive)
Is how I see it shaking down.
Extra power will most likely go towards resolution most of the time, which there are diminishing returns at such high resolutions, especially with the upscale techniques used in modern games. Add to that the difference is even smaller than PS4/XB1 or Pro/X, so the actual differences visually will be insignificant.
That said, I don't believe it will be 9.2TF vs 12TF.
interesting ... it looks like GLX are referring to registers on gfx10 (the old GCN)... hmmm
You answered it yourself, their "masterful PR" would be showing off their exclusive games.
When these Xbox and PS games are first presented, most customers will be live streaming these presentations at best 1080p if not alittle less clear. Then when they are uploaded to youtube, some customers will be streaming the 4K verisons...but again with Youtube bit rate quality. And some of these customers might stream those in 1080p or auto setting.
It will come down to art. As far as standing out.
I mean the fact that he was suggesting series X will cost more than PS5 means he was talking about the test findings which puts the PS5 nowhere near the X, the PS5 isn't gonna end up stronger with that kind of difference with any change at this stage.
If Lockhart is only 4 TF they might not want to use numbers tbh. It'll depend on the PS5's final specs (I think it'll be in the 10-12 range but we'll see), if Lockhart happens, and the price point imo.
They tested a lot of configurations, some of them I'm sure we haven't seen, so who knows?
I was unable to find it. And yes, Flute did have 531GB/s real-world performance which could be anything between 531GB/s and 572GB/s.
Made it back with scotch tape. Bought extra for Cerny.
But this time it's different!......?
But this time it's different!......?
If they're shooting for the same price as XSX then sure. But maybe they aren't.
XSX may well be even more expensive than what we were thinking. A 56CU 7nm chip, which is what it seems to be, will be hugely expensive. Especially when coupled with SSD and 16GB GDDR6.
XSX may well be $549 or even $599.
If Sony can hit $449 vs that then 9.2TF isn't a bad value proposition at all.
Most you will get out o sony is a "we don't comment on rumors or speculation"...
But if the PS5 is 9TF, that's not the end of the world. No chance its 9TF and the SeX is 12TF and both are $499 though. If there is that big a power gap, then expect the PS5 to be $399.
But if the PS5 is 9TF, that's not the end of the world. No chance its 9TF and the SeX is 12TF and both are $499 though. If there is that big a power gap, then expect the PS5 to be $399.
So I decided to compile a bunch of stuff from Usman Pirzada who has a pretty good record covering the Navi. He called a 40 CU Navi part, was the first one to say that Navi wont be tied to GCN or its 64 CU limit as well as release dates.
This is what he had to say about the PS5.
This is what he had to say about the PS5.
I'm about to ask Mark Cerny what the deal is on Twitter, I'll let you guys know if he gets back to me
It'll only matter if the games look and play substantially better on Xbox.
I really think we're looking at $349 Lockhart, $449 PS5 and $549 XBX.
The 7nm 56CU+RT APU in the XSX is an absolute monster. Like ridiculously huge, and thus ridiculously expensive.
Being that mainstream outlets like IGN are posting articles on the Github data leak as legitimate representation of what the PS5 GPU will be, do you think this will nudge Sony to come forward with more info prior to late February, assuming this rumor is even partially untrue?
Coming back into this thread:
I love how Matt said that he was glad people had moved past the GitHub info and people came back in and argued how we should still talk about the GitHub information. There's no helping at this point. I'm just going to wait for the unveil.
I love how Matt said that he was glad people had moved past the GitHub info and people came back in and argued how we should still talk about the GitHub information. There's no helping at this point. I'm just going to wait for the unveil.
Don't the docs show Arden_Native /gen1 / gen0 and similar for sparkman? Ariel is listed the same with native and gen1 / gen0 - maybe even MS are having to do something at the hardware level like Sony with such a major change in the hardware?
Tell Cerny I said friendship ended with Cerny. Phil spencer is now my best friend.
no
because since when did Sony comment on rumour and speculation
long ago they used to put out just that statement alone but more recently even with their own games being part of certain rumours don't even bother doing that too
anything false or true will be confirmed soon enough, no reason to run like a headless chicken based off of speculation
I don't think PS4 games looked and played substantially better than Xbox games but that power gulf was talked about in great detail.
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