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Nintendo Direct Speculation |OT2| Reset the Thread

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Clov

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,450
People who say things like this clearly haven't ever played a Persona game.
Having played all of the Persona games, Persona 5 is a homophobic game.

Yeah, it's a relatively small part of the game, and it's not nearly as prevalent as the even worse homophobia in Persona 4, but it's still there and shouldn't be ignored. It's something that's always going to tarnish what otherwise is a pretty good game. It's been like this since Hashino took over with Persona 3 (which also has a really stupid transphobic scene). It's really a shame that in terms of how well the series treats LGBT characters has gone steadily downhill since Persona 2. Innocent Sin is still my favorite in part because of this.
 

superbright

Member
Feb 11, 2019
229
United Kingdom

OwOtacon

Alt Account
Banned
Dec 18, 2018
2,394
So is 3.0 going to be the update with stage builder, or has the datamining not confirmed that 100%?
 

mindatlarge

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,154
PA, USA
What microscopic glimmer of hope are we banking on for a Direct now? There seems to be renewed lust in this thread. Anyone care to fill me in?
 

mindatlarge

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,154
PA, USA
literally hoping Nintendo has something special planned for Reggie's last week + we're halfway through April so maybe something for Smash as well
That would make sense, I mean, this is Reggie we are talking about. Maybe they will let his new Twitter account be the first to annouce the next Direct lol. If the man is loved now, that would put him in the stratosphere.
 

Clov

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,450
That would make sense, I mean, this is Reggie we are talking about. Maybe they will let his new Twitter account be the first to annouce the next Direct lol. If the man is loved now, that would put him in the stratosphere.
Do you think Reggie would really want that? He's retired now. I bet at this point he just wants to post some pictures of his next vacation.
 

Dark Cloud

Member
Oct 27, 2017
36,355
That would make sense, I mean, this is Reggie we are talking about. Maybe they will let his new Twitter account be the first to annouce the next Direct lol. If the man is loved now, that would put him in the stratosphere.
Please tell me you’re joking. He’s retired. He doesn’t care. People need to stop thinking he cares. Nobody higher up at Nintendo fantasizes about this scenario.
 

mindatlarge

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,154
PA, USA
Do you think Reggie would really want that? He's retired now. I bet at this point he just wants to post some pictures of his next vacation.
Please tell me you’re joking. He’s retired. He doesn’t care. People need to stop thinking he cares. Nobody higher up at Nintendo fantasizes about this scenario.
I know he loves the business and even more the fans, just think it would be a really cool way to go out.
 
Jan 9, 2018
928
I'm not going to say Atlus didn't make mistakes with some scenes in the game, yeah they do some things wrong in terms of how they show some LGBT characters. Is that bad? Of course it is. But saying the game is actively homophobic completely tosses out the point of not just Persona 5 but Persona as a series. Did Atlus do some bad things in Persona 5 in terms of how they show some LGBT characters? Yeah they did. But saying the game is actively homophobic is completely disingenuous. Nintendo have made similar mistakes themselves and are they considered a homophobic company who makes homophobic games? No becuase they make Mario and people like Mario.
Mario is probably not the example you want to use considering Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door featured a transgender character named Vivian that people still hold up as good representation in 2019, just like people still hold up P2: IS. Going from good rep to actively harmful portrayals is enough to call that aspect of the game bad. It's stuff like Mario and Link being allowed to dress femininely that gives Nintendo gets a pass now, if that's what you want to call it. Maybe Nintendo has developed games with homophobic sentiments in the past, but clearly they're not doing that right now.

Anyways, the game is definitely homophobic, and it's the game itself that is throwing out its own message. Being queer is apparently a problem in Hashino's eyes, and that's why Persona 5's message makes no damn sense.

Anyways, sorry for continuing the P5 discussion, but I didn't want to see this slip by. We really need that Direct lol.
 

mariodk18

Member
Dec 27, 2017
381
At this point I'm expecting a Smash Direct focused on 3.0.0 and a Mario Maker 2 Direct in early May. Everything else will be revealed at E3. Astral Chain will probably get its own Direct in early August like Bayo 2 did.
 

Shoichi

Member
Jan 10, 2018
3,201
At this point I'm expecting a Smash Direct focused on 3.0.0 and a Mario Maker 2 Direct in early May. Everything else will be revealed at E3. Astral Chain will probably get its own Direct in early August like Bayo 2 did.
If Joker is dropping with the 3.00 Update. A Direct will happen (if there is one) by the end of April as Joker has been confirmed to drop by the end of the month.
 

superbright

Member
Feb 11, 2019
229
United Kingdom
Mario is probably not the example you want to use considering Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door featured a transgender character named Vivian that people still hold up as good representation in 2019, just like people still hold up P2: IS. Going from good rep to actively harmful portrayals is enough to call that aspect of the game bad. It's stuff like Mario and Link being allowed to dress femininely that gives Nintendo gets a pass now, if that's what you want to call it. Maybe Nintendo has developed games with homophobic sentiments in the past, but clearly they're not doing that right now.

Anyways, the game is definitely homophobic, and it's the game itself that is throwing out its own message. Being queer is apparently a problem in Hashino's eyes, and that's why Persona 5's message makes no damn sense.

Anyways, sorry for continuing the P5 discussion, but I didn't want to see this slip by. We really need that Direct lol.
I used mario as an example as to why people give Nintendo a pass (in that he's popular) not the proof they've made these kinds of mistakes in the past, in terms of what mistakes Nintendo has made in the past I refer to stuff like the gay conversion therapy scene in fire emblem. One scene, which as I say is obviously a bad scene, does not make the game, series or company homophobic in my eyes especially when you look at characters like Lala and Kanji which seem like genuine attempts to show LGBTQ characters in their games in a positive light, which is more than a lot of companies try. Anyway, like you say I'll stop talking about this now. This is a Nintendo Direct thread after all. I enjoyed this conversation though, so thanks for being respectful. Same to everyone else I discussed this with.
 

NateDrake

Member
Oct 24, 2017
2,862
Regarding P5 on switch, I remember hearing NateDrake on the spawncast saying that he's 99% sure its coming. Perhaps he knows something.
That wasn't based on info. It's just my own feelings on the matter. Joker coming to Smash and the way they have marketed the character as a Persona 5 character & not from PQ2 lead me to believe Persona 5 will come to Switch.
 

Fanuilos

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
1,112
That wasn't based on info. It's just my own feelings on the matter. Joker coming to Smash and the way they have marketed the character as a Persona 5 character & not from PQ2 lead me to believe Persona 5 will come to Switch.
You heard it here first folks, NateDrake feels that Persona 5 is coming to Switch. Draft your $1 offers.
 

Clov

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,450
Mario is probably not the example you want to use considering Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door featured a transgender character named Vivian that people still hold up as good representation in 2019, just like people still hold up P2: IS. Going from good rep to actively harmful portrayals is enough to call that aspect of the game bad. It's stuff like Mario and Link being allowed to dress femininely that gives Nintendo gets a pass now, if that's what you want to call it. Maybe Nintendo has developed games with homophobic sentiments in the past, but clearly they're not doing that right now.

Anyways, the game is definitely homophobic, and it's the game itself that is throwing out its own message. Being queer is apparently a problem in Hashino's eyes, and that's why Persona 5's message makes no damn sense.

Anyways, sorry for continuing the P5 discussion, but I didn't want to see this slip by. We really need that Direct lol.
Thank you for posting this. There's a lot of people who give Hashino's games a pass for their anti-LGBT content, but it makes me happy to see that there's some people who are willing to criticize them. Being queer myself, it means a lot.

I used mario as an example as to why people give Nintendo a pass (in that he's popular) not the proof they've made these kinds of mistakes in the past, in terms of what mistakes Nintendo has made in the past I refer to stuff like the gay conversion therapy scene in fire emblem. One scene, which as I say is obviously a bad scene, does not make the game, series or company homophobic in my eyes especially when you look at characters like Lala and Kanji which seem like genuine attempts to show LGBTQ characters in their games in a positive light, which is more than a lot of companies try. Anyway, like you say I'll stop talking about this now. This is a Nintendo Direct thread after all. I enjoyed this conversation though, so thanks for being respectful. Same to everyone else I discussed this with.
It's true that Fates does have that blatantly awful scene. It's also the only FE game that lets you have any kind of same sex relationship. While I can't ignore how horrible those scenes involving Soliel are, I did at least appreciate that it let my Corrin be gay at all, even though my options were limited in that regard. There's clearly a lot of improvement needed for future installments. At the very least, Leon in Echoes was handled well.

As a last note, and I won't go into too much detail to keep things brief, but Kanji (and especially how other people treat Kanji) is one of the worst handled aspects of Persona 4. I don't for a second believe that Hashino intended anything positive regarding queer people when it comes to that character.
 
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