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Nintendo just posted a Tutorial on how to find the in-game Tutorial in Smash Bros Ultimate. (Kotaku Updates)

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Banned
Dec 18, 2017
3,492
As soon as I saw this article in my Switch News timeline it reminded me of the recent debate here about whether or not the new Smash Bros does a good job at explaining the game's basics to newcomers.

Some people argued the game explains everything you need to know, others said the game doesn't explain anything and it's hard for newcomers to even notice the "tips" section.

I think this post is pretty telling:

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"You can see tutorials and all kinds of tips in Super Smash Bros Ultimate - here's how to find them in-game!"

Seriously, developers have to do something about their fighting game tutorials.


Edit:
Now featured on Kotaku as well:
https://kotaku.com/nintendo-posts-tutorial-on-how-to-find-smash-ultimates-1831323868
 
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Dyle

Dyle

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
29,945
Thanks for the tutorial on finding the news article for finding the tutorial in Smash

It really isn't that hard though, there's a question mark on the right panel on all the top menus and the move list can be accessed in the pause menu during gameplay. I'm confused why people gave seemed to struggle so much with finding them. They might not tell you what you need to know, but finding them really isn't an issue
 
dralla

dralla

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,872
The Smash Ultimate menu is straight trash. It makes no logical sense and everything takes too long.
 
gabegabe

gabegabe

Member
Jul 5, 2018
2,753
Brazil
I've played more than 30 hours of Smash Ultimate and I didn't know that there was a How To Play video. And I checked the tips section.
 
YolkFolk

YolkFolk

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,212
The North, England
I find it weird how the stage music selection menu is a tiny button in the bottom left of the music menu and that character sound effects are given greater prominence.
 

Deleted member 31092

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 5, 2017
10,783
As stupid as it may sound the main reason I don't play Smash (well, other than the fact that I get destroyed online) is the main menu being too clunky for me, I always came back to the Splatoon 2 plaza for some multiplayer. The game look intimidating imo.
 
Brakke

Brakke

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,798
Kamek said:
This is the first thing I noticed about the game. I assumed it was designed this way for handheld optimization?
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How? "Games & More" is a wild label when there are 2 other options that lead you to playing a game.

And then there's that jump-menu under RT but it isn't available when you might actually use it, and it doesn't take you anywhere useful either.

It's all just nonsense too to bottom.
 
HypedBeast

HypedBeast

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,058
I miss Melees simple menu design.
hqdefault.jpg


Its not as stylish, but it gets the job done.

Brawl UI is also fine.

hqdefault.jpg
 
Geg

Geg

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,552
I don't understand how anyone would have trouble with Smash menus lol
 
Maquiladora

Maquiladora

Member
Nov 16, 2017
5,093
Selphie said:
The only people who should have trouble finding this are people who can't read, if you can't read you should ask your mom or dad for help.
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Yeah because "Vault > Movies" is a totally obvious and natural path to follow when looking for a tutorial on how to play something.

Nice edge there tho. You really got em.
 
faint

faint

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,158
They must have seen the stream of the woman who found the BoTW tutorial after 90 hours. :)
 
FSLink

FSLink

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,262
I don't think the Smash menus are hard to use, but I do think the tutorials should be more easily discoverable.

The game even explains how DI and SDI works in-game, or how moves like Jigglypuff's Rest works (which a newbie wouldn't immediately understand how that works) but it's not likely anybody new would be able to easily find the info.
 
Eoin

Eoin

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,103
Geg said:
I don't understand how anyone would have trouble with Smash menus lol
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Something important to understand about menu design is that there's several different ways in which people view menu navigation.

Some people will look through every menu and will find everything. Nothing's going to be hidden for them, so menu designers don't have to worry much about this type of person (within reason - things like overly complex menus are still bad for them).

Others, however, will be trying to do something within the menu system and won't take any non-obvious step. If they're looking for a tutorial, they will never pick Vault (their attempt to find a tutorial will almost certainly start with the "?" icon in the bottom right, and probably will also end there). If they don't find what they're looking for quickly and easily, they will probably give up and assume it''s not there.

You may think that kind of behaviour is not a useful way to approach menus, but from a menu design perspective it's not the problem of the user to figure out the menus, it's the problem of the menu designer to design menus that don't need to be figured out (and, just to be clear, menus that don't their own tutorials). Consideration for this type of behaviour is the biggest reason why menus have moved away from complex hierarchical structures into simpler, friendlier menus that are better for everyone.
 
goldenpp73

goldenpp73

Banned
Dec 5, 2017
2,144
I find the menu for Smash Ultimate good.. The one in 4 was a clusterfuck but Ultimate is fine? I'd question your intelligence if you can't find what you're looking for fairly quickly. Want to play normal Smash? Click Smash and select your mode, want to play anything Spirit related? Hit spirits. Online time? Click online then pick lobbies or quick play. The horror.
 
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Guymelef

Guymelef

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,644
Spain
Haven't played this game yet but if the menus are like Smash Wii U it makes sense.
It had one of the most confusing menus ever.
 
julian

julian

Member
Oct 27, 2017
16,786
I think the menus are a huge improvement over the last game. Still not great. Also, this is the movie that starts playing on the main screen if you don't touch anything. It's not exactly hidden from the user.
 
Intel_89

Intel_89

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,038
Portugal
They could just add a prompt whenever you booted the game for the first time asking if you'd like to watch the tutorial video and wether you said yes or no at the end it would tell you where to find it if you ever needed to watch it again.
 

Deleted member 8752

User requested account closure
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Oct 26, 2017
10,122
Eoin said:
Something important to understand about menu design is that there's several different ways in which people view menu navigation.

Some people will look through every menu and will find everything. Nothing's going to be hidden for them, so menu designers don't have to worry much about this type of person (within reason - things like overly complex menus are still bad for them).

Others, however, will be trying to do something within the menu system and won't take any non-obvious step. If they're looking for a tutorial, they will never pick Vault (their attempt to find a tutorial will almost certainly start with the "?" icon in the bottom right, and probably will also end there). If they don't find what they're looking for quickly and easily, they will probably give up and assume it''s not there.

You may think that kind of behaviour is not a useful way to approach menus, but from a menu design perspective it's not the problem of the user to figure out the menus, it's the problem of the menu designer to design menus that don't need to be figured out (and, just to be clear, menus that don't their own tutorials). Consideration for this type of behaviour is the biggest reason why menus have moved away from complex hierarchical structures into simpler, friendlier menus that are better for everyone.
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Well said. I constantly debate with colleagues about menu design and navigation. You'd be surprised with how few of them understand this concept.

A menu needs to be extremely simple and obvious from a visual standpoint. As great as Smash is from a development standpoint, it's menus are poorly made for first time players.

I had no trouble with them, but it's easy to see how newbies would find it confusing. "Vault" for example is a very poor category name.

They need to rethink the taxonomy.
 
'3y Kingdom

'3y Kingdom

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,494
phanphare said:
same. it's honestly kind of hilarious how self explanatory each section of the menu is
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They're not self-explanatory unless you've been religiously following the game pre-release. Why is the main adventure mode under "Spirits" and not "Games and More"? What does "Spirits" even mean? What is the "Vault"?
 

Vector

Member
Feb 28, 2018
6,657
I'll never understand the outrage regarding Smash's menus - it's not a needle in the haystack type of thing, it's really easy to find the thing you're looking for.
 
OP
OP
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60fps

Banned
Dec 18, 2017
3,492
Brakke said:
How? "Games & More" is a wild label when there are 2 other options that lead you to playing a game.

And then there's that jump-menu under RT but it isn't available when you might actually use it, and it doesn't take you anywhere useful either.

It's all just nonsense too to bottom.
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Yes, my thoughts exactly.

Finale Fireworker said:
Is this thread itself a tutorial of how to find the tutorial that helps players find the tutorial to Super Smash Bros Ultimate?
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Yes! Because, you never know.

Eoin said:
Something important to understand about menu design is that there's several different ways in which people view menu navigation.

Some people will look through every menu and will find everything. Nothing's going to be hidden for them, so menu designers don't have to worry much about this type of person (within reason - things like overly complex menus are still bad for them).

Others, however, will be trying to do something within the menu system and won't take any non-obvious step. If they're looking for a tutorial, they will never pick Vault (their attempt to find a tutorial will almost certainly start with the "?" icon in the bottom right, and probably will also end there). If they don't find what they're looking for quickly and easily, they will probably give up and assume it''s not there.

You may think that kind of behaviour is not a useful way to approach menus, but from a menu design perspective it's not the problem of the user to figure out the menus, it's the problem of the menu designer to design menus that don't need to be figured out (and, just to be clear, menus that don't their own tutorials). Consideration for this type of behaviour is the biggest reason why menus have moved away from complex hierarchical structures into simpler, friendlier menus that are better for everyone.
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This is so well-explained, thank you for that.
 
Jahranimo

Jahranimo

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,020
I think I'm missing something here...

This is the best menu since Brawl. Each section opens up to the specific area you would need.

The pictures from the news section on the Switch shows like two steps, which is very simple.

Y'all really on that hyperbole train huh?
 

Deleted member 5127

user requested account closure
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Oct 25, 2017
3,584
I'm a UX/UI designer and I think the menu's have been absolutely horrible in Smash since Brawl. Kirby Air Ride also had a similar thing going on. Sakurai should stop giving the UX design to his wife.
 
Mark1

Mark1

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,006
Guymelef said:
Haven't played this game yet but if the menus are like Smash Wii U it makes sense.
It had one of the most confusing menus ever.
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It is considerably better than the Smash Wii U menu.

The difference really is night and day. And personally find it surprising that some don't like Smash Ultimate's menu.

Especially with the shortcuts section, which people can easily pull out by pressing ZR.
 
Jahranimo

Jahranimo

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,020
Mark1 said:
It is considerably better than the Smash Wii U menu.

The difference really is night and day. And personally find it surprising that some don't like Smash Ultimate's menu.

Especially with the shortcuts section, which people can easily pull out by pressing ZR.
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This is another thing! While I think you can't hit the top menu from certain areas, which should be changed...but having stuff like spirits, controls and settings there is very convenient.
 
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