You mean "feeling a certain way about the people who support her career despite not being able to relate to it on a deeper level but who enjoy it and support her nonetheless"
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Noname (black female rapper) may quit music, says she won’t perform for mostly white audiences
- Thread starter nsilvias
- Start date
You don't get it. "White fragility" is displaying any reaction other than unconditional affirmation in the face of statements or actions that make white people feel uncomfortable. Read "White Fragility" by Robin DiAngelo to learn more.
sure, but explaining this away as 'it's cuz black people can't afford to see concerts' in so many words is kinda sus
No it's not. If you look at the historical context and how a lot of Black People were robbed by the Music Industry in the 50s/60s. It makes perfect sense why a Slam Poet-Rapper that makes content about the Black Experience would have that perspective.
Well it's true. How is it sus? White people have the time and money to drop hundreds on festivals. I know white guys who have seen Noname and Erykah Badu in concert at festivals 4+ times because they can afford to drop hundreds on multiple festivals.
OP
OP
It's the nature of the business though. Damn near every successful hip-hop act has a sizable, if not majority white audience, especially if they get attention from music blogs/sites.
i'm pretty sure she wasn't just talking about festival audiences lol. black people can absolutely afford to go see 25$ shows and do all the time
I agree with this. Its her choice in the end, but it comes off sounding racist as hell. I don't want to perform for white people? I get not wanting to hear the N word, but that is also on her as she can communicate with her fans and tell them its not cool. But yeah... this does sound bad.
So why doesn't she just play where she is comfortable with the audience? She can control that part of the equation.
Outside of performing at HBCUs or heavily black areas, I don't know how any rapper with any semblance of mainstream recognition expects to get a predominantly black audience.
I can't at all blame her for stepping away from hearing ignorant liberals yell the n word at her concerts day in day out. They should have known better and are now probably for the first time in their lives facing consequences for their ignorance.
I wonder what percentage of her "fans" will rage quit before self reflecting even a little.
I wonder what percentage of her "fans" will rage quit before self reflecting even a little.
Where does being a dick for no reason get us, when we have white people who actually want to try to understand?
As a white guy, I remember seeing 2Pac in concert back when he signed with Death Row. He performed at a place called Club New World. It was a hole in the wall club on a dirt road in southern NC, almost to Myrtle Beach.
The DJ came on and introduced him and then said (and I will never forget)... welcome to club new world.. the blackest club on the planet... so all you icicles get the fuck out.
While I was uncomfortable.. and I am not going to lie... I was. I had people pushing me from behind the whole time trying to start shit.... I kept to myself because as a 2Pac fan... I was there for him. I could give to fucks about this shitty club and the people in it.
My point is music is music. If you like it you like it.. who really gives a fuck in the end. She is entitled to her opinions but to me.. I would rather be known for my art from white and black fans.. instead of one group or no one.
The DJ came on and introduced him and then said (and I will never forget)... welcome to club new world.. the blackest club on the planet... so all you icicles get the fuck out.
While I was uncomfortable.. and I am not going to lie... I was. I had people pushing me from behind the whole time trying to start shit.... I kept to myself because as a 2Pac fan... I was there for him. I could give to fucks about this shitty club and the people in it.
My point is music is music. If you like it you like it.. who really gives a fuck in the end. She is entitled to her opinions but to me.. I would rather be known for my art from white and black fans.. instead of one group or no one.
Unfortunately, group identity is valued above all else and individualism is now viewed as an ideology of racism by some prominent and vocal parts of the progressive left in America these days.
Sure, but these are all fans and they are paying money to see you perform. It's not like they are going there out of spite to heckle her on stage.
Again, because a lot of posters are taking my posts the wrong way, I'm not saying she is wrong for feeling this way. I'm just expressing that as a fan it's a little disheartening to hear her perspective on how she views all of her white fans. This doesn't excuse the idiots who go around shouting the n word at her shows though.
Then it seems like she can kind of resolve some of these issues (Seeing majority white people in audience). Book House shows, Book small clubs in predominantly minority parts of the city etc, advertise on social media to predominately minority social groups etc.
I had assumed that she was on the festival circuit due to label wanting her to get out there to the biggest crowds etc.
I don't know what's what anymore.
As a white guy, I feel sometimes like I'm damned if I do and I'm damned if I don't. Is there someone wrong with me going to a slam poet/artists show and listening to her plight? If anything that would help me understand and sympathize. I figured going to a show like that would be showing respect, dignity and understanding for the oppression they faced.
As a white guy, I feel sometimes like I'm damned if I do and I'm damned if I don't. Is there someone wrong with me going to a slam poet/artists show and listening to her plight? If anything that would help me understand and sympathize. I figured going to a show like that would be showing respect, dignity and understanding for the oppression they faced.
You could attempt to understand instead of getting offended and feeling a need to dismiss or downplay it as a result.
There is video in this thread where she goes at lenght explaining her point and it is far from "viture signalling"( an alt right dogwhistle)
her frustration makes sense. I think there are better ways around it than quitting tbh. look to Vince Staples for a model. raps about very specifically african-american slices of life and ended up with weirdo white kid fans who shoutalong to the n-word. so what does he do? either ignores them or specifically tells them he doesn't give a shit about them haha. he doesn't specifically cater to them or feel pressured to soften the edges of his art or anything, just lets his white fanbase exist as long as they're respectful while he focuses on the people he's truly making the music for. I see nothing wrong with operating that way
This is a problem inherent to rap for as long as I can remember. Shit, inherent to all black-dominated music except maybe gospel, but rap is particularly bad for this. Black people are the creators but the paid consumption, the money, is white. And so that's a problem. I have no idea what can be done about this. We are 14% of the population and something like 3% of the wealth.
I hope Noname can navigate this in a way that she can live with.
I hope Noname can navigate this in a way that she can live with.
So many things here.
in chicago it is expensive as fuck to own and operate a venue because of performance taxes. This basically removed all music venues from the south and west sides were the black populations are.
concerts are expensive to go to and not all are close to public transit.
If you are white and actually processed what the fuck she says in her music you wouldnt be saying the n word at the show and would be doing work to help boost the lives of black people in the city.
So many shitty white people love rap and listen to the hurt and violence in these songs and say thats rough and DO NOTHING to stop it they go about their way. Its cultural eavesdropping with a dash of racism.
I hope she rolls in money someoday and her and chance help the bring music back to the places in the city where they originated
in chicago it is expensive as fuck to own and operate a venue because of performance taxes. This basically removed all music venues from the south and west sides were the black populations are.
concerts are expensive to go to and not all are close to public transit.
If you are white and actually processed what the fuck she says in her music you wouldnt be saying the n word at the show and would be doing work to help boost the lives of black people in the city.
So many shitty white people love rap and listen to the hurt and violence in these songs and say thats rough and DO NOTHING to stop it they go about their way. Its cultural eavesdropping with a dash of racism.
I hope she rolls in money someoday and her and chance help the bring music back to the places in the city where they originated
I was just thinking about this and was wondering about the change of scene for her. Is her West Coast move behind these feelings or what? Though the city is changing, shows i go to in Chicago are usually very mixed, although still white-majority.
I think I get her point.
Her music does deal heavily with her experience as a black woman from Chicago, so I can imagine there's a very clear disconnect as she performs this music about her life experiences to a bunch of predominantly white crowds. Part of it has to do with how indie music is pushed by primarily white institutions: Pitchfork, Stereogum, NYTimes, etc. are primary tastemakers, and most hip-hop sites tend to focus on trap or more mainstream artists. Aside from Bandcamp spotlights, Pitchfork and Stereogum are usually the first to tell me about a new NoName, Saba, Griselda, Your Old Droog, etc. album. In addition, one of the points folks seem to be overlooking is how she feels frustrated that listeners are not letting the music challenge their view of the world. They'll know every bar by heart, but have no idea what it means.
Ultimately, her frustrations on the way her music is being consumed are valid.
With that being said, I do find it disturbing how many folks here are calling her racist or willfully misrepresenting her comments or trying to find ways to shut down her critique.
Her music does deal heavily with her experience as a black woman from Chicago, so I can imagine there's a very clear disconnect as she performs this music about her life experiences to a bunch of predominantly white crowds. Part of it has to do with how indie music is pushed by primarily white institutions: Pitchfork, Stereogum, NYTimes, etc. are primary tastemakers, and most hip-hop sites tend to focus on trap or more mainstream artists. Aside from Bandcamp spotlights, Pitchfork and Stereogum are usually the first to tell me about a new NoName, Saba, Griselda, Your Old Droog, etc. album. In addition, one of the points folks seem to be overlooking is how she feels frustrated that listeners are not letting the music challenge their view of the world. They'll know every bar by heart, but have no idea what it means.
Ultimately, her frustrations on the way her music is being consumed are valid.
With that being said, I do find it disturbing how many folks here are calling her racist or willfully misrepresenting her comments or trying to find ways to shut down her critique.
Constantly editing your post isn't going to change the fact that this isn't about you. There's plenty of posts here that explain what she meant by this, and there's especially the DJBooth interview posted above that goes even further.
Imagine what could happen if us white people weren't so infatuated with having to say that word. There's also a huge issue regarding black-majority spaces, I imagine its frustrating when everything gets coopted, not just the spaces but a lot of cultural things too, it's like constantly being pushed out.
White as snow Canadian guy here and it's obvious as day what she's saying here. It's not hard to understand. This is like a gutter-punk band saying they don't want to play big festivals or corporate gigs because the audience won't truly understand what they're singing/angry about, but even more so due to the uniqueness of the Black American experience.
Why are so many people being vindictive here? "Oh she doesn't want me to listen???? GUESS SHE ISN'T GETTING DEEZ BUCKS, GOTTEM."
Fuck off if all you're taking away from this is that she doesn't want white people at her shows.
Fuck off if all you're taking away from this is that she doesn't want white people at her shows.
This is a much better representation of her thought process than the tweets and article.
This is why twitter will always be the worst way to consume news/media. I'm talking tweets, not videos within them.
I've been to a NoName show, in Chicago (her hometown) and attend plenty of shows for various hip-hop artists. In my very anecdotal opinion, the main reason you see a predominately white audience at these type of shows (at least here) is not because of the costs since they usually are $30 GA shows but because artists like her, Saba, Chance have all gained a following in the progressive liberal circles composed of mostly art-scene and college kids. These types of circles are the kind that are very diverse and Chicago's scene, for example, has a lot of emerging and prominent artists of various racial backgrounds. These circles typically attract the "woke" white people from the burbs or the hood affluent white people and they share the music and trends from these circles to their less affluent friends who feel more comfortable attending these shows than for example a show for Gunna, DaBaby, MegThaStallion, etc. The latter artists have a much more trap/hood focused following and that intimidates those same white people in ways that NoName doesn't. So it's easy to understand why the demographics are why they are.
Regarding her comments, it's a bit surprising to me at least since the scene that she came up in is like I said, very diverse so I would think she would understand how things work. I hope she's able to find peace with this but as of now it just feels like a take that could have been articulated more concisely.
Regarding her comments, it's a bit surprising to me at least since the scene that she came up in is like I said, very diverse so I would think she would understand how things work. I hope she's able to find peace with this but as of now it just feels like a take that could have been articulated more concisely.
Making money in music is already a 1 out of a million thing and she is trying to turn up the difficulty sliders. If she wants to make a lot of money then it's time to get OK with playing Coachella for a crowd of Madisons and Hayleys.
Skimmed the thread but still not sure why she can't play smaller venues in areas dominated by minorities. It'll probably bring less money but she'll get to play her preferred audience. Right now it sounds like she wants the cake (money) and eat it too (less white people).
Imagine putting your heart into something, trying to craft a message to a specific audience, trying to be their voice. Then it falls on tone deaf ears who only superficially like your music while the audience you targeted doesn't even show up to give you the time of day.
I don't blame her. I'd be frustrated too, and if she values that connection over the fame/income that's fine. Her choice.
I don't blame her. I'd be frustrated too, and if she values that connection over the fame/income that's fine. Her choice.
Which is a thing.
It's come to something when someone who is 'right wing' at least doesn't have ambivalence on their thoughts on race. Which is not always racist but is at least letting me know where they stand.
White people who consider themselves on the 'left' and I notice it a lot on here. Talk a good game about not standing for racism but will sit quietly when acquaintances, friends and family go off.
So performative liberalism online to PoC but not doing much to actually challenge and change themselves.
