NVIDIA RTX 20 SUPER Series

Mecha Meister · Jun 19, 2019

Elfotografoalocado said:
Resetera.gif

Well, the GP102 chip is 471mm^2 and has 11.8B transistors, the TU104 chip is 545mm^2 and has 13.6B transistors. So, being in a version of the same process, it's a significantly bigger chip, and has the new and fancy GDDR6 memory.

I did intend to mention die sizes in my post but decided to take it out :P

dgrdsv said:
There are a huge number of asterisks which should be attached to this statement.
For example, you can buy a GTX 1660 right now which will cost you $220 and provide more or less the same performance as a 980Ti which was sold for $650 four years ago.
The fact that some card's name is considered a successor of some other card's name and there's a price hike between them means zero without looking at performance of these cards.
Basically, always check what price/performance comparisons show, not how much a xx60 or xx80 card costs.

Sorry I should have been more clear. I was referring to the direct succeeding generation of GPUs offering more performance at lower price points.
For example, the GTX 970 delivered GTX 780 Ti performance at a significantly lower price, IIRC, in the UK it was selling for around half the price the 780 Ti was, so around £500 down to around £260. This was huge!

The 780 Ti also had a 28nm 561 mm² die while the 970 had a 398 mm² die.
The GTX 1660 offering 980 TI performance 4 years later (3 GPU generations later) isn't really impressive to me, compared to the GTX 970 situation.

I haven't seen anything like it since, hence the reason I made the claim of NVIDIA GPUs moving up in price each generation, although that claim does have it's flaws as there have been performance gains, it's just that their model number segmentation doesn't appear to hold as much relevance as it did with past generation GPUs.
EuroGamer - Nvidia GeForce GTX 970 review

The RTX 2060 appears to be between a GTX 1070 Ti and 1080 and is cheaper than I can recall seeing the 1070 Ti at which is a positive, although it does have 2GB less VRAM.

dgrdsv said:
It's about 10% faster on average and that gap gets bigger in newer titles which Turing architecture is better suited to. It will grow even further if some game will use Turing's capabilities - and that's complex compute (counting FP16 here as well; not async though as Pascal is doing async compute with essentially the same gains as Turing), VRS, mesh shaders. All in all 2080's price/performance is better than that of 1080Ti, especially if we're looking at future titles, but not significantly so. It makes 1080Ti 100% obsolete though.

I say they're similar performers as they're typically within 10% of each other, although in games such as Wolfenstein 2 and Rainbow Six Siege the Turing GPUs really stretch their legs. If more games continue to take advantage of Turing's architectural advantages they'll really shine.

Turing is definitely impressive from an architecture standpoint, and I'm curious to see what will be done with it's Raytracing and mesh shading capabilities, it's just that I'm not very enthusiastic about the price points of the GPUs.

TechPowerUp: ASUS GeForce RTX 2080 Ti Matrix 11 GB Review - Page 22

TechPowerUp: ASUS GeForce RTX 2080 Ti Matrix 11 GB Review - Page 26

dgrdsv said:
Well, yeah, but TBH 2080 doesn't make any sense as an upgrade option for 1080Ti owners so it's not a regression in the sense of a typical user upgrade path. G6 is rather expensive, a year ago especially. Which is coincidentally also why we don't see AMD doing their favorite trick with 5700 this time - providing double the RAM of NV's competition.

I'm curious to see the RX 5700's performance when reviews are published and the card is in the hands of consumers, but so far I'm not impressed with it's price point, it's going against up the RTX 2070 which is a very capable and advanced GPU and doesn't appear to offer much in competition besides allegedly faster performance.

Edit - Corrected spelling mistakes.

Lashley · Jun 19, 2019

Resident Guru said:
As will the already released 2080 Ti.

I'd honestly wager the 2080 is the same. I can see the next consoles being at 2060-2070 level.

Genio88 · Jun 19, 2019

My RTX 2060 arrives tomorrow, so i will have time until July 7 to send it back to Amazon if needed, i hope they announce these Super cards before that date so that i can decide if i should go with the 2060 Super instead

Galaxea · Jun 19, 2019

Prices are going up? I'm assuming that means the 2060 won't drop in price. I guess the 1660ti is going to end up the card for me. It should be good enough for my 1080p gaming and oculus rift s when I buy it in August. I will do a full upgrade in a couple years.

GhostBanana · Jun 20, 2019

dex3108 said:
This really puts me in strange position. I want to upgrade my 1060 6GB card but i want decent performance with RayTracing at 1080p so 2060 is out of the question. And i want to upgrade before Cyberpunk 2077. That means 2070 Super is kinda best choice but i don't know if it is worth it or should i wait for 30xx serise :/

We are in the same boat. I might just go with a 1660 ti and upgrade again next spring/summer.

Edit: It's a hard call though because the 1660 ti isn't so much cheaper than the current 2060. I change my mind every couple days. I thought I read Dictator is working on another Ray Tracing video. Would love to see it.

Cirerus · Jun 20, 2019

The GPU market is in such a mess nowadays, i still can wait to upgrade my RX 590 thankfully.

1-D_FE · Jun 20, 2019

Yeah, any temptation I may have had, is completely out the window.

LG putting HDMI 2.1 into their 2019 TV lineup has proven to be purely future proofing. There's literally nothing released in 2019 that will be able to feed it 4K @120hz. So unless your TV crapped out and you must upgrade in 2019, there's zero reason not to wait until 2020 and get the OLEDs with the next gen panels in them.

Razgriz417 · Jun 20, 2019

hmm with those prices, now I don't know what I should get to replace my 970...I run 2 1080p monitors and would most likely stick with those for a few more years. Wanting to run high/max settings on games like vampires and cyberpunk. Wonder if a regular 2060 would suffice or maybe still aim for a 2060S?

The Bookerman · Jun 20, 2019

Flandy said:
2070 and 2080 are 9 months old tho

First off, it still looks bad. Second, I bought my oc 'd 2070 2 months ago. It borked on me last week. Asus doesn't have the stock to replace mine, probably because they are too busy making supers. So i can't agree with you. Fuck you nvidia

HMD · Jun 20, 2019

I bought my 2080 last month. I was thinking I was set for at least a year...

Lame.

Skyebaron · Jun 20, 2019

One would hope AMD be competitive against nvidia to mitigate this torrential of overpriced bullshit. Ill keep on hoping forever.

1-D_FE · Jun 20, 2019

Razgriz417 said:
hmm with those prices, now I don't know what I should get to replace my 970...I run 2 1080p monitors and would most likely stick with those for a few more years. Wanting to run high/max settings on games like vampires and cyberpunk. Wonder if a regular 2060 would suffice or maybe still aim for a 2060S?

Those aren't releasing this year. Unless you have a need now, I'd just wait for the 3XXX series on 7nm. It should also get you HDMI 2.1 (if that's of any future interest to you).

Resident Guru · Jun 20, 2019

Lashley said:
I'd honestly wager the 2080 is the same. I can see the next consoles being at 2060-2070 level.

Agreed.

Flandy · Jun 20, 2019

Razgriz417 said:
hmm with those prices, now I don't know what I should get to replace my 970...I run 2 1080p monitors and would most likely stick with those for a few more years. Wanting to run high/max settings on games like vampires and cyberpunk. Wonder if a regular 2060 would suffice or maybe still aim for a 2060S?

Rumor right now is that next gen will have a gpu as powerful as a 1080/2070. Of course this is just a rumor and could be wrong but if I were you I'd make sure to get something at least as powerful as a 2070 for my next upgrade. Personally I'm waiting for next years cards to upgrade.

dex3108 · Jun 20, 2019

blumen_dieb said:
We are in the same boat. I might just go with a 1660 ti and upgrade again next spring/summer.

Edit: It's a hard call though because the 1660 ti isn't so much cheaper than the current 2060. I change my mind every couple days. I thought I read Dictator is working on another Ray Tracing video. Would love to see it.

I think that RTX 2070 Super is still best choice if i aim for 1080p with RT and higher resolutions without RT. It can serve me well for 3 years at least.

Razgriz417 · Jun 20, 2019

Flandy said:
Rumor right now is that next gen will have a gpu as powerful as a 1080/2070. Of course this is just a rumor and could be wrong but if I were you I'd make sure to get something at least as powerful as a 2070 for my next upgrade. Personally I'm waiting for next years cards to upgrade.

thanks for the tip, I guess it is probably best to wait til early next year before buying anything, have nothing I really need to play right now. Will have to hope new cards come out early next year

Flandy · Jun 20, 2019

Razgriz417 said:
thanks for the tip, I guess it is probably best to wait til early next year before buying anything, have nothing I really need to play right now. Will have to hope new cards come out early next year

Praying they're out in time for Cyberpunk but if they're not I'm guessing Summer

DeepChord · Jun 20, 2019

Shouldn't we have heard anything if the announcement would be happening tomorrow?

Se_7_eN · Jun 20, 2019

DeepChord said:
Shouldn't we have heard anything if the announcement would be happening tomorrow?

I was thinking the same... I am getting worried.

(I REALLY need an upgrade)

MAX PAYMENT · Jun 20, 2019

Are these confirmed as real yet?

inner-G · Jun 20, 2019

MAX PAYMENT said:
Are these confirmed as real yet?

Kind of

Nvidia put out a 'super' teaser video, but hasn't said anything. It was on the GeForce channel though, so it's probably a GPU product, and we have these details leaking.

It's not official yet though.

TC McQueen · Jun 20, 2019

Supposedly there'll be an announcement tomorrow.

Rickyrozay2o9 · Jun 20, 2019

I guess it's too early to know officially but just how much do we expect the older rtx models to drop in price?

Jeff6851 · Jun 20, 2019

Genio88 said:
My RTX 2060 arrives tomorrow, so i will have time until July 7 to send it back to Amazon if needed, i hope they announce these Super cards before that date so that i can decide if i should go with the 2060 Super instead

Same for my 2080. Though I doubt a 2080 Super will be so much better than a 2080 that I'll want to drop more money on that. I decided against a Ti and got a EVGA FTW3 for less than 2080 Super MSRP and that's one of the best models.

dgrdsv · Jun 20, 2019

DeepChord said:
Shouldn't we have heard anything if the announcement would be happening tomorrow?

Nothing will happen tomorrow AFAIK. Which also mean that the prices can be totally wrong. Both are from WCCFT, unconfirmed by other sources.

OHRye · Jun 20, 2019

I'm in search of a new computer (as in i currently don't have one). I was gonna buy a pre built one from ibuy with the 2070, at this point I should probably just hold off for the super announcement right?

Flandy · Jun 20, 2019

OHRye said:
I'm in search of a new computer (as in i currently don't have one). I was gonna buy a pre built one from ibuy with the 2070, at this point I should probably just hold off for the super announcement right?

You should definitely hold off. Even if you don't end up getting a Super card you might see sales on the regular versions

DeepChord · Jun 21, 2019

So no news today?

dgrdsv · Jun 21, 2019

DeepChord said:
So no news today?

Well...

https://wccftech.com/nvidia-rtx-super-series-graphics-cards-launch-date/ said:
July 2: Planned announcement day for all graphics cards (RTX 2060 SUPER, RTX 2070 SUPER, RTX 2080 SUPER). AKA soft launch.

July 9: GeForce RTX 2060 SUPER and GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER arrive on shelves.

July 23: GeForce RTX 2080 SUPER planned to hit the shelves. [Tentative]

Lashley · Jun 21, 2019

wccftech are reliably unreliable.

Aranath · Jun 21, 2019

Had to return my 2080 this week due to a fault and couldn't get a replacement for it, so Amazon are giving me a refund. Good timing, I guess. Time to hold off for further news.

dgrdsv · Jun 21, 2019

Lashley said:
wccftech are reliably unreliable.

I can at least say that according to what I've heard one of these dates is correct.

LabouredSubterfuge · Jun 21, 2019

Only really interested in the 2080ti Super. Hope they talk about it soon at least.

Grimm Fandango · Jun 21, 2019

Is the 2060 still the best value to game at 1080p comfortably for a few years?

IgnotumCL · Jun 21, 2019

Nahh... next generation then

Doct0r · Jun 21, 2019

dgrdsv said:
I can at least say that according to what I've heard one of these dates is correct.

Yeah, the 2nd of July has been thrown around a lot.

I hope the TI gets a 'super' variant, but if it does it'll be much later

Serpens007 · Jun 21, 2019

Grimm Fandango said:
Is the 2060 still the best value to game at 1080p comfortably for a few years?

Probably, if you are on a 960 or really really want to upgrade

IgnotumCL said:
Nahh... next generation then

Yep, I'm fine with the 1060. When you realize you don't need the ultriest of ultra settings, it really comes to you how unnecesary is to upgrade.

I think CPU is far more important to upgrade for next gen

Duxxy3 · Jun 21, 2019

Grimm Fandango said:
Is the 2060 still the best value to game at 1080p comfortably for a few years?

Hard to say because next gen systems will likely bump up the requirements a year or two after they come out.

RTX ON · Jun 21, 2019

Grimm Fandango said:
Is the 2060 still the best value to game at 1080p comfortably for a few years?

A 2060 pumps out more fps at 1080p than a 2080 at 1440p.

You'll be fine. Especially If next gen consoles target 4k.

dgrdsv · Jun 21, 2019

Duxxy3 said:
Hard to say because next gen systems will likely bump up the requirements a year or two after they come out.

I don't think that GPU requirements will "bump" with next gen launch any more than they usually do. Graphics is highly scalable.
CPU requirements on the other hand...

GarthLordOfTheSith · Jun 21, 2019

So we were all right:

SUPER expensive

Darkstorne · Jun 21, 2019

Still 8GB VRAM... and similarly overpriced.

Again this gen of cards looks weak for future-proofing, and too expensive to be attractive as a short-term stop-gap. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that AMD's 2020 Navi cards offer strong enough competition that Nvidia's 30XX range are priced better, and that 12GB+ becomes the norm. AND that Cyberpunk is delayed until after these are all on sale =P I'm sure the game would benefit from more time in the oven anyway. My 1070 will be fine for another year.

DeepChord · Jun 21, 2019

RTX ON said:
A 2060 pumps out more fps at 1080p than a 2080 at 1440p.

You'll be fine. Especially If next gen consoles target 4k.

wait, is this true? can you link me to some benchmarks?

RTX ON · Jun 21, 2019

DeepChord said:
wait, is this true? can you link me to some benchmarks?

In-game testing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdzlhL4Hz4E&list=FLCTBwt-3qZDWex2WsYcjYaA&index=2&t=0s

Deleted member 30077 · Jun 21, 2019

Duxxy3 said:
Hard to say because next gen systems will likely bump up the requirements a year or two after they come out.

Not if the next gen consoles are going to target 4K native though and you're sticking with 1080p. It's a bit different from the usual gen bump where consoles are playing catch up to higher PC resolutions. If you only need to render 1/4th of the pixels you can get away with a GPU much weaker than the consoles.

dgrdsv · Jun 21, 2019

DeepChord said:
wait, is this true? can you link me to some benchmarks?

Why wouldn't it be true? 1080p->1440p is twice the pixels meaning double the shading and double the bandwidth needed.
And 2060 is about 2/3 of 2080.

RTX ON · Jun 21, 2019

dgrdsv said:
Why wouldn't it be true? 1080p->1440p is twice the pixels meaning double the shading and double the bandwidth needed.
And 2060 is about 2/3 of 2080.

To be fair a lot of the talk on these very forums insinuate a 2080 or bust mentality. Seemingly creating an "anything below a 2080 is not enough for gaming next gen" mindset, which is quite frankly false.

DeepChord · Jun 21, 2019

RTX ON said:
To be fair a lot of the talk on these very forums insinuate a 2080 or bust mentality. Seemingly creating an "anything below a 2080 is not enough for gaming next gen" which is quite frankly false.

this was exactly my mindset. Since I'm ok with 1080p and no ray-tracing (even if the card can do it), I might just go for a 2060 Super.

Grimm Fandango · Jun 21, 2019

Serpens007 said:
Probably, if you are on a 960 or really really want to upgrade

I got an old ass gtx 770 so I'm definitely due lol. But I don't game a ton on PC anymore. Can probably wait until Doom Eternal comes out. Cyberpunk definitely looks good enough to make it run well.

dgrdsv · Jun 21, 2019

RTX ON said:
To be fair a lot of the talk on these very forums insinuate a 2080 or bust mentality. Seemingly creating an "anything below a 2080 is not enough for gaming next gen" mindset, which is quite frankly false.

It's worse than that actually, it's "2080Ti or bust" which is coincidentally where most of the talk about "price gouging" and "worse perf/dollar" originate. As I've said a couple of days ago, people pay way to much attention to marketing product names.

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