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NY Times: "As Fresh Water Grows Scarcer, It Could Become A Good Investment"

JohnsonUT

Member
Oct 27, 2017
187
It is going to be quite the coincidence when all the politicians who publicly deny climate change also have portfolios deeply invested in water rights.
 

MilesQ

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,101
Someone post the Bill Burr rant where he talks about Nestle trying to own the water. Dude has been rambling on about this for years.
 

Indeed™

Alt account
Banned
May 26, 2019
115
This is why I enjoy living where I do. I have three wells on my property that go down to different depths (up to 600 feet) that nobody but me can shut off and a water table that's super high. I won't have a lack of water anytime soon.
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,513
This is a perfect example of why basic necessities such as water, food, healthcare, & housing should be regulated to prevent profiteering, if not completely controlled by the state.
 

luffxan

Member
Oct 28, 2017
478
I just know the fucking Resnicks are licking their lips while looking at their paper water portfolios
 

Complicated

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,554
I can't wait for inhalers with clean shots of air to become the new multi-billion dollar industry like Juul.
 

Buddy1103

Member
Jan 8, 2019
404
But I was told that this is = communism which is = gulags because stalin
i think the fact that a majority of people in the world believe this pretty much makes that dystopian water-scarce future very likely to happen. i feel like our current civilization will be the one that a future civilization will discover amid ruins and study as an example of what not to do.
 

aeolist

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,924
i think the fact that a majority of people in the world believe this pretty much makes that dystopian water-scarce future very likely to happen. i feel like our current civilization will be the one that a future civilization will discover amid ruins and study as an example of what not to do.
"future civilization" lol
 

Chikor

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,280
This sounds EXACTLY like the sales pitch they gave Bolivia and it turns out horribly.
I donno, I'm not an expert, but I think the fact this article is clearly advocating a pretty radical political proposal and it's framed as something else is pretty telling..

In any case, I personally think it's a horrible idea and I think it's 100% motivated by big ideological ideas about the government rather than looking at a problem and trying to find a solution. Though if someone want to try and change my mind, I promise I'll listen.
 

KojiKnight

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,328
"We could spend money on desalination plants or in improved water recycling...."

"Or, and hear me out, we could just buy really really big containers and horde all of the fresh water and then charge a fortune selling it back to people"

/laughs in michigander
Fresh also means drinkable, and the Great Lakes aren't known to be the cleanest. And with environmental protections taking a massive step back after Trump I wouldn't bet on that in 20-30 years time.
 

Titik

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,289
Much like food, this generally continues to be a problem on the horizon that we are wholly dependent on engineering and science to solve.

Pray those smartest among us can find a viable, affordable solution. Particularly for poor nations that will suffer the most.
Yeah I agree with this. The sooner we get abundant energy, the sooner we will solve this.

Can't fault companies for investing in these but it's the job of the government to ensure that these companies aren't artificially manipulating the market and punish those that are. It's also the governments job to ensure that solar, wind and other alternatives are easy to build and use as these technologies are key to lowering the price of fresh water by making electricity cheap to power desalination and water treatment plants.

Thankfully many poor nations are wisely investing in solar and they are also located in areas with plentiful sunlight. It's easy enough to implement a solar power plant next to a desalination plant even if yoy don't have to worry about storing said electricity since you can run the desalination plant when it's sunny then shut it down when it's raining. Ideally you also want a dam nearby to store water from rain water.
 

Pwnz

Member
Oct 28, 2017
7,084
Places
I think a lot of people will be surprised how populations shift over the next 30 years.

Unless there's a breakthrough in cheap desalination and powering said desalination plants, I think we'll see huge population shifts from southern California, Vegas, and Phoenix to basically central TX and eastward. Water from the Mississippi irrigated to major cities 500 miles west. The rust belt redone. A surprising population increase in Alaska. All because of water.
 

Titik

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,289
i think the fact that a majority of people in the world believe this pretty much makes that dystopian water-scarce future very likely to happen. i feel like our current civilization will be the one that a future civilization will discover amid ruins and study as an example of what not to do.
Hah, jokes on them. We would have used up all the easy access fossil fuel by then.
 

Chirotera

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
1,417
Jesus fuck I know this kind of shit is prevalent but it's disgusting seeing it out in the open.
 

Titik

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,289
I think a lot of people will be surprised how populations shift over the next 30 years.

Unless there's a breakthrough in cheap desalination and powering said desalination plants, I think we'll see huge population shifts from southern California, Vegas, and Phoenix to basically central TX and eastward. Water from the Mississippi irrigated to major cities 500 miles west. The rust belt redone. A surprising population increase in Alaska. All because of water.
Eh, these places have plenty of sunlight. California is widely investing in solar and has easy access to the ocean. If anything it will be NIMBYS that will kill Cali, not lack water lol. I was I was kidding about the NIMBY part tho.

Rip Vegas and Phoenix tho.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,033
Kinda tangential here, but an idle thought I've had for a long time...

I've felt like there will soon become some massive technical solution for regionalized water problems... or at least that a massive technical solution becomes more realistic cost wise given the rising cost of water problems. WIth the affect of climate change you'll have concurrent stories dominating the new of droughts in the (US) Southwest and Southeast, and floods in the midwest and plains. Now, sure, there's a massive mountain range and insane logistical costs that prevent the surplus in one area from alleviating the drought in the other, but ... I'm starting to think as extremes become more ... extreme ... when we tally up the total damage caused by both extremes (insurance), that pre-emptive technological solutions become more realistic. The north east US is mostly reaching water capacity in its reservoirs ... The largest reservoir in New England, the Quabbin system in central Mass (provides public water to Boston and major metro areas around it), has reached record capacities successive years in a row, and the reservoir is currently at max capacity now, draining off into the Swift/Connecticut river system, and yet, 12-24 hour drives away there are localized water shortages at the same time of year. Now, obviously, this is a logistical "impossibility" today because of cost, but as localized/regionalized water shortages become more dire the cost of those shortages increases and the cost of damage (insurance) can make pre-emptive investment more reasonable.

It's one of those ideas that's batted around in my head that if I were a billionaire who wiped my butt with money I'd throw $10b into cost analysis research.



It's not, it's just that anything that is presented without opinion or editorial makes 40% of this forum go into an illogical rage, and being a newspaper, the NYT usually reports stories like this without editorializing on it. I'm sure in the coming days and weeks they'll run editorials about it that have opinions, but that's not enough... for a growing number of people the news has to be editorialized these days or else it's evil.

Yeah, the solution is called wide-spread MSR-based nuclear power/heat generation.

Latest gen nuclear power solves almost all of the climate, environmental, and scarce commodity resource issues we have globally. But people hear "nuclear" and they shut down immediately. It's the most depressing thing when you know exactly how to solve many of the world's most difficult problems but there isn't the political will or informed understanding of the technological options on a broad basis to do so.
 

Pwnz

Member
Oct 28, 2017
7,084
Places
Eh, these places have plenty of sunlight. California is widely investing in solar and has easy access to the ocean. If anything it will be NIMBYS that will kill Cali, not lack water lol. I was I was kidding about the NIMBY part tho.

Rip Vegas and Phoenix tho.
If anything Vegas is in the best situation. They'll change the law to get full water rights to lake mead, which should sustain and slowly fill up Vegas.
 

The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,180
Yeah, the solution is called wide-spread MSR-based nuclear power/heat generation.

Latest gen nuclear power solves almost all of the climate, environmental, and scarce commodity resource issues we have globally. But people hear "nuclear" and they shut down immediately. It's the most depressing thing when you know exactly how to solve many of the world's most difficult problems but there isn't the political will or informed understanding of the technological options on a broad basis to do so.
I'm completely ignorant here, how does MSR (Molten Salt?) nuclear power/heat gen affect/solve water scarcity and abundance problems?
 

Titik

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,289
Yeah, the solution is called wide-spread MSR-based nuclear power/heat generation.

Latest gen nuclear power solves almost all of the climate, environmental, and scarce commodity resource issues we have globally. But people hear "nuclear" and they shut down immediately. It's the most depressing thing when you know exactly how to solve many of the world's most difficult problems but there isn't the political will or informed understanding of the technological options on a broad basis to do so.
Yeah we have so many options. We already have the tech to do all of this. The question is political will.

Im optimistic though because it will only take one country to show the rest what to do. But it might need some sort of help from the richer countries because nuclear power plants ain't exactly cheap.

But I think once one country demonstrates it, the rest will follow immediately and leapfrog straight to it.

Kind of like how many developing nations went straight to mobile phones and mobile internet instead of the traditional route of landlines first. I can see the same with solar/wind and nuclear, much more so on the former since initial investment is much cheaper.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,033
I'm completely ignorant here, how does MSR (Molten Salt?) nuclear power/heat gen affect/solve water scarcity and abundance problems?
Because desalination via distillation is relatively cheap via MSRs, all other alternatives being considered. Once MSRs are mainstreamed with a small, modular, mass produced design, the sky is the limit because thorium fuel is so abundant, cheap, ubiquitous, and energy dense. Oh yeah, it can also burn the "nuclear waste" from LWRs down to almost nothing, all while extracting tons of energy/heat in the process. The tiny amount of waste left over is only harmful 2 to 3 hundred years rather than 10s of thousands.