NYPD on Twitter: "We regret to inform that Desmond Amofah aka Etika has been found deceased." (See guidelines before posting)

Thera

Member
Feb 28, 2019
784
Posts like yours are exactly the reason why some people here find issue with moderation, you just want their head on the platter because he said this one silly thing while completely ignoring the rest of his message.
Yep and it drive me nuts. He is out of the "circle", knowing and saying is out of it, and he said a stupid thing. Some are in the circle, can explained it to him (like he asked) and let him join the circle, but they decided to let him out and making him speechless. It is disgusting.
 

AmbientRuin

Member
Apr 18, 2019
451
we have ample time to collect our thoughts and explain to them WHY you are so sick of hearing it instead of asking for their head.
Almost like someone who has difficulty doing these things might have a mental illness
Yep and it drive me nuts. He is out of the "circle", knowing and saying is out of it, and he said a stupid thing. Some are in the circle, can explained it to him (like he asked) and let him join the circle, but they decided to let him out and making him speechless. It is disgusting.
Sorry I promise to man up and not let those posts get to me again
 

Trejo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,010
This is terrible news. RIP Etika. After reading the last thread it seemed the signs were on the wall but I still held a glimmer of hope that maybe he'd turn out to be alright. I should probably thank my lucky stars that I've fortunately never had to deal with issues like those plaguing him but hopefully he's in a better place now.

And I agree with some of you that moderation here is a little too trigger happy sometimes but can we please not derail the thread about that?
 

mindatlarge

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,034
PA, USA
I can understand that everybody has a different story, but what are the contributing factors? Maybe you are right, and i can not understand it because i don't feel that way. Yes the hurt and pain is there, but i process and coop with it differently. Is it then will or willpower, or no self worth?
You're asking a question where the answer is based on an almost infinite amount of variables. There are so many different factors involved with how people deal with mental health issues or just life in general.

If you are already struggling with a mental illness, the cards are stacked against you in terms of how you process even normal day events and occurrences. Some may still find a way to cope, but others may not, for example due to stresses, negativity and loss. In Etika's case, he was dealing with his illness by not acknowledging it fully. That is the most dangerous thing one can do when sick. Mental health is just like physical health in the way that, if you have a sickness, sometimes treatment is required to heal or at least continue to function.
 
Last edited:

VinceK

Member
Oct 25, 2017
238
It's been a day and this is still so very hard to process. Etika was honestly one of the brightshining lights on the net in general. His happiness and all around hype that he shared with everyone was always a thing that could help make someone's crappy day go better.

I guess all I can say now is that I hope he's finally at peace and that the mental demons that had him feeling this way as well as all the hate and jokes that he received as well as got made at his expense can't hurt him anymore. RIP Etika
 

steviejd1

Member
Nov 8, 2017
5,594
Yep and it drive me nuts. He is out of the "circle", knowing and saying is out of it, and he said a stupid thing. Some are in the circle, can explained it to him (like he asked) and let him join the circle, but they decided to let him out and making him speechless. It is disgusting.
People are allowed to be upset when others say things that upset them. Sure banning was probably the wrong course of action but saying "man up" in a thread about a young man who has killed themselves is going to hurt others. The people calling for bans need to be more thoughtful and not make snap judgements but at the same time your post isn't helping matters either.
 

NoName999

Member
Oct 29, 2017
3,460
Bad faith arguers: Mods are too insensitive to mental health issues

Mods ban user who tell those who are depressed to "man up." A highly douchey thing to say.

Bad faith arguers: Wow that guy didn't deserve to be banned. Mods are being tyrants.

I KNEW it would come to this. I knew it wasn't a concern for mental health awareness. It's just taking vengeful piss swipes at Era.
 

AmbientRuin

Member
Apr 18, 2019
451
Bad faith arguers: Mods are too insensitive to mental health issues

Mods ban user who tell those who are depressed to "man up." A highly douchey thing to say.

Bad faith arguers: Wow that guy didn't deserve to be banned. Mods are being tyrants.

I KNEW it would come to this. I knew it wasn't a concern for mental health awareness. It's just taking vengeful piss swipes at Era.
Bingo. Theres a handful who care overshadowed by a mass thats just mad about mods
 

Radeo

Member
Apr 26, 2019
724
People jumping to the defense of that post need to realize that if you want to talk about mental health, you can't be that insensitive.
Not singling you out but I get it, I still hear this almost daily from people in my life. It's still unfortunately one of the most common canned phrases people use, along with the timely classics of "just go outside" and "just go out and meet people". The vast majority of people never have to actively question these things, which is great for them obviously but means they come across as insensitive without realising it. It may seem like common sense to us, but people come from all sorts of backgrounds and this is far from common
 

steviejd1

Member
Nov 8, 2017
5,594
Bad faith arguers: Mods are too insensitive to mental health issues

Mods ban user who tell those who are depressed to "man up." A highly douchey thing to say.

Bad faith arguers: Wow that guy didn't deserve to be banned. Mods are being tyrants.

I KNEW it would come to this. I knew it wasn't a concern for mental health awareness. It's just taking vengeful piss swipes at Era.
You're making some very sweeping generalizations here...
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,035
Bad faith arguers: Mods are too insensitive to mental health issues

Mods ban user who tell those who are depressed to "man up." A highly douchey thing to say.

Bad faith arguers: Wow that guy didn't deserve to be banned. Mods are being tyrants.

I KNEW it would come to this. I knew it wasn't a concern for mental health awareness. It's just taking vengeful piss swipes at Era.
You're being reductive. They said something shitty but the post was insightful regarding their experience. It's not any less valid. It didn't deserve a ban in my opinion.
To label everyone who had a problem with that as 'bad faith arguers' is just trying to stir shit.
 

RageBawt

Member
Oct 27, 2017
338
I'll go ahead and say I don't care what the punishment is/was but please don't tell your friends to just man up or just get over it. You wouldn't say just don't have a broken arm to a person with a broken arm so don't trivialize what I'm going through. I can't speak for everyone but I personally hate being told this because it's absolute bullshit and usually earns a go fuck yourself pretty quickly. Trust me if I knew what it was I would very much so attempt to just get over it.
 

Oheao

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
6,030
London, Ontario, Canada
Bad faith arguers: Mods are too insensitive to mental health issues

Mods ban user who tell those who are depressed to "man up." A highly douchey thing to say.

Bad faith arguers: Wow that guy didn't deserve to be banned. Mods are being tyrants.

I KNEW it would come to this. I knew it wasn't a concern for mental health awareness. It's just taking vengeful piss swipes at Era.
What about those of us who stated the former but not the latter? In fact I think that him saying that and being supported by so many to the point that the mods backtracked is evidence that there's a problem.
 

steviejd1

Member
Nov 8, 2017
5,594
You mean people aren't being upset that the mods are taking their advice?
You're making mental health into a black and white issue... The guy said something 'douchey', sure, and needed to be educated that it is wrong to say these things. How is a ban going to solve that, especially if the rest of his post is read and that he probably has some serious mental health issues himself that he hasn't dealt with yet?

Etika also said some douchey things when he wasn't in a healthy state of mind too, look what happened there. Bans are not the answer, neither is attacking anyone. To be honest I don't even know what the answer is and I'm not sure anyone does and that is the problem here.
 

Elephant

Member
Nov 2, 2017
854
Nottingham, UK
Bad faith arguers: Mods are too insensitive to mental health issues

Mods ban user who tell those who are depressed to "man up." A highly douchey thing to say.

Bad faith arguers: Wow that guy didn't deserve to be banned. Mods are being tyrants.

I KNEW it would come to this. I knew it wasn't a concern for mental health awareness. It's just taking vengeful piss swipes at Era.
What!? It was a post at an attempt to learn from people who have experienced mental health issues. How fucking dare you label me a "bad faith arguer" because I don't think a person should be banned for trying to understand people like ME a little bit better. No one is defending the term Man Up, in fact we're universally against that term, we're defending his right to ask a genuine question in a civil environment. You are the worst kind of person to try and defend MY plight. Piss off.

Edit: Perhaps posting about Civil Environments, while letting that anger out is a bit much! lol
 

Thera

Member
Feb 28, 2019
784
User Banned (3 days): false equivalence, history of similar behavior
People are allowed to be upset when others say things that upset them. Sure banning was probably the wrong course of action but saying "man up" in a thread about a young man who has killed themselves is going to hurt others. The people calling for bans need to be more thoughtful and not make snap judgements but at the same time your post isn't helping matters either.
I don't see in my post where I am saying people are not allowed to be upset. They are allowed to feel whatever they feel, like everyone else in the world.
But if people start to ignoring people who asked for understanding, nothing will ever change.

I am upset because people doesn't help people who asked for it, am I not allowed to be upset?
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,713
Didn’t follow him but this is a battle that it’s always sad to see someone lose. RIP to him and hope that his family is eventually able to find some kind of closure.
 
Please be respectful towards one another when discussing experiences with mental health

Wonderment

Moderator
Oct 27, 2017
9,126
Official Staff Communication

We know that there are many members here who want to have an honest conversation about mental health and their experiences with it. There is an opportunity to discuss these things and learn from each other in a meaningful way. But if this is to happen, people must be considerate to the sensitivity of the issue. Please do not be dismissive or antagonistic towards one another, especially members with personal experiences that relate to this topic.

Please stay on topic and maintain a respectful atmosphere in this thread. Thank you!
 

Espi

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,253
Honest question, because i do not know much about the subject of mental illness. How is it that one has a fighting spirit and hope and another get broken and defeated.

In short, don't feel like writing a novel:
I have been living on my own since i was 16 (37 now), my father abused my mother when i was a baby (father was oke in my teens, but then died when i was 18). My Mother has always been distanced because she missed her own childhood always gone to work or with friends. I have been to prison, been stabbed and been hurt a lot emotionally and have hurt a lot of people also. From being alone across sea in a foreign country with not even 1 cent to my name to the passing away of an stillborn. And lets not talk about racism because i am mixed, that they see my name and have a job interview and see me and all of a sudden no job available anymore. To losing all my friends and family, to a couple of years of alcohol and drug abuse A lot of shit has happened.

But i never and never once thought about suicide or giving up or going to that dark place. I always kept fighting and kept hope that i did not deserve this life. I have been lonely and questioned why do these things happen to me. But i always told myself it is just a matter if time and keep going and survive. Now i am a manager at an energy company i have a caring loving wife and 3 beautiful kids and no more debt and i am living a very good life. I have a good relationship again with my mother and family and i feel so loved. And looking and feeling good if i may say so myself and working out in the gym 4 days a week. I would have missed all these thing if i gave up and i am so blessed now. I feel anger and sadness when i see someone going trough depression. I just want to say man the fuck up and show them what you are made of and never accept defeat. You are missing out on so many beautiful things that you also deserve to have. Are my feelings unreasonable? Because i do not want to offend anyone, i just want to understand.
Because it’s not that simple, and even if someone “man ups” they usually just repress those feelings and it comes back even worse in the future because you’ve never actually dealt with the issue.

Manning up is the equivalent of when kids get told to clean their room and they just shove everything under the bed.

I’m glad things worked out for you and I didn’t let depression break me but we’re not all built the same way. You have no idea what any of these people go through, so who are we to judge?
 

AmbientRuin

Member
Apr 18, 2019
451
I feel like we're talking passed eachother lol.
We probably are now its getting difficult to follow. I'm still livid about the man up horse shit. Going to take a break
Just like saying "fuck the Jews", saying the f-word and shit like that yes. And it wasn't my word for it anyway. My first post talked about toxic masculinity, and how harmful that is so I understand being upset by it, I was upset by it as that was why I posted in the first place today. But it's not that simple as is shown with the case with Etika.
Yeah sorry about that
 
Last edited:
Dec 11, 2018
688
Mods ban user who tell those who are depressed to "man up." A highly douchey thing to say.
Could you be more disingenuous? He didn't tell anyone to man up. He said his instinct was to say that, but he admitted that in a post in which he's asking for help understanding how he should actually behave in those scenarios. He was asking for guidance on how to act in a complicated situation that clearly most people aren't adept at and instead he caught a ban and vitriol from other users.
 

steviejd1

Member
Nov 8, 2017
5,594
Yeah I guess telling a depression sufferer they should get over it is douchey. Guess thats one word for it
Just like saying "fuck the Jews", saying the f-word and shit like that yes. And it wasn't my word for it anyway. My first post talked about toxic masculinity, and how harmful that is so I understand being upset by it, I was upset by it as that was why I posted in the first place today. But it's not that simple as is shown with the case with Etika.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,035
We probably are now its getting difficult to follow. I'm still livid about the man up horse shit. Going to take a break
In all fairness so was I. I've heard that shit a lot of times in my life, and in turn I've said it to others.
It made me feel lesser and I'm sure it felt the same to people I've said it to. It's one of the reasons I have such a hard time talking about my mind state as a black man, especially with parents who've grown up in a country during tumultuous times. So whenever I brought up my depression it felt small in comparison and I always felt that I'll be dismissed(which did happen). The lessons I've learnt as a teen was to shut up, keep it inside, nobody gives a fuck and this is probably what it means to be a man. And it led to so many issues.
It's such a shitty thing to say to someone and I've only learnt that lesson a few years back. I'm only 25 now and I still have a lot of learning to do, right now I can't even express how I feel without feeling like I'm 'weak'. Don't think I've cried properly for years, the last time was when I was 17? 18 maybe?

So I know how utterly shitty it is to tell someone while they feel like they're at rock bottom to just 'man up'.
 

Kaelan

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
642
Maryland
True. I continue to fail to come to a consistent opinion on whether or not he should have been made to undergo more extensive treatment from professionals.
Let me chime in here a bit (Working as a masters and want to become a therapist, more-so addictions).

Honestly, even if he got the "best" help its a crapshoot. He would need to be ready, timing would need to be right, etc. Getting the "best" help in the world doesn't erase years of trauma. It takes hard, dirty work, that may take time and require determination.

This is a 'perfect world' assuming he got the best help ever. We don't wanna say it, but there are shit counselors out there. He could have encountered some who didn't understand his world view or struggles - it happens. Finding a great counselor is tough, really tough.

On another note bipolar is also a difficult diagnosis to go through. Many factors at play. I just want people to understand that help isnt a "catch-all" and even if you get it recovery isn't instantaneous nor does it erase pain/trauma.
 

AegonSnake

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,627
Honest question, because i do not know much about the subject of mental illness. How is it that one has a fighting spirit and hope and another get broken and defeated.

In short, don't feel like writing a novel:
I have been living on my own since i was 16 (37 now), my father abused my mother when i was a baby (father was oke in my teens, but then died when i was 18). My Mother has always been distanced because she missed her own childhood always gone to work or with friends. I have been to prison, been stabbed and been hurt a lot emotionally and have hurt a lot of people also. From being alone across sea in a foreign country with not even 1 cent to my name to the passing away of an stillborn. And lets not talk about racism because i am mixed, that they see my name and have a job interview and see me and all of a sudden no job available anymore. To losing all my friends and family, to a couple of years of alcohol and drug abuse A lot of shit has happened.

But i never and never once thought about suicide or giving up or going to that dark place. I always kept fighting and kept hope that i did not deserve this life. I have been lonely and questioned why do these things happen to me. But i always told myself it is just a matter if time and keep going and survive. Now i am a manager at an energy company i have a caring loving wife and 3 beautiful kids and no more debt and i am living a very good life. I have a good relationship again with my mother and family and i feel so loved. And looking and feeling good if i may say so myself and working out in the gym 4 days a week. I would have missed all these thing if i gave up and i am so blessed now. I feel anger and sadness when i see someone going trough depression. I just want to say man the fuck up and show them what you are made of and never accept defeat. You are missing out on so many beautiful things that you also deserve to have. Are my feelings unreasonable? Because i do not want to offend anyone, i just want to understand.
first of all, sucks you had to go through it. and props for getting through it and getting your life together.

i dont have any first hand experience with depression, just second hand. it's much tougher for people suffering from mental illness because their mind goes to dark places. they see no way out. people like you and me almost get stronger from adversity, but its because our body and mind cooperate in ways it doesnt for people suffering from depression and bipolar disorders. i suggest reading up on it. ive seen people simply shutdown and for the longest time i didnt understand it.

you hear about the term light at the end of the tunnel, now imagine being in the darkness and seeing no way out. its not that they are not strong. i would argue they are stronger. they do have that fighting spirit. but if your body and mind are telling you one thing over and over again it becomes your reality. And why would anyone question their reality?
 

RageBawt

Member
Oct 27, 2017
338
In all fairness so was I. I've heard that shit a lot of times in my life, and in turn I've said it to others.
It made me feel lesser and I'm sure it felt the same to people I've said it to. It's one of the reasons I have such a hard time talking about my mind state as a black man, especially with parents who've grown up in a country during tumultuous times. So whenever I brought up my depression it felt small in comparison and I always felt that I'll be dismissed(which did happen). The lessons I've learnt as a teen was to shut up, keep it inside, nobody gives a fuck and this is probably what it means to be a man. And it led to so many issues.
It's such a shitty thing to say to someone and I've only learnt that lesson a few years back. I'm only 25 now and I still have a lot of learning to do, right now I can't even express how I feel without feeling like I'm 'weak'. Don't think I've cried properly for years, the last time was when I was 17? 18 maybe?

So I know how utterly shitty it is to tell someone while they feel like they're at rock bottom to just 'man up'.
This. It makes you self loathe even more and wonder why you aren't stronger like every one else and capable of dealing with this. Also it just plainly doesn't work look at suicide statistics if that's what manning up is then I want none of it. Like I used to scoff at toxic masculinity when I first heard it, but I looked into it and realized it isn't an insult it's meant to help us with destructive behavior. Like openly talking about my depression with the normalcy of any other illness felt like such a burden lifted off my shoulders. I didn't have to lie and come up with fake excuses as to why I didn't want to talk or hang out. Repression just doesn't help and really makes you self loathe even more.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,659
I wish there were some fancy movie style time travel clips one could show our friends and loved ones who may feel this way to make them understand the aftermath and show them that more often than not, you really are greatly appreciated.
The scary part about it is that most of the time, suicidal people are well aware of this. Some of my friends who struggle with this have mentioned several times how the only reason they haven't yet killed themselves is because they don't want to upset people around them and that they are literally counting the years until they no longer have to worry about that. Obviously someone being pushed even further would have a very tenuous connection to that feeling and it wouldn't really stop them, especially if they are struggling with psychosis and/or manic episodes etc.
 

Abominuz

Member
Oct 29, 2017
696
Netherlands
Bad faith arguers: Mods are too insensitive to mental health issues

Mods ban user who tell those who are depressed to "man up." A highly douchey thing to say.

Bad faith arguers: Wow that guy didn't deserve to be banned. Mods are being tyrants.

I KNEW it would come to this. I knew it wasn't a concern for mental health awareness. It's just taking vengeful piss swipes at Era.

Thanks tot the unban mods!

English is not my native language, so sorry if it came across wrong. I am genuinely interested in the thought process and i am trying to learn. And with man up, i mean that is what worked for me and i kept telling myself that. I did not mean that is a good approach for everyone going trough depression.
 
Last edited:

Thuddert

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,759
Netherlands
Yeah, terms like man up or get over it are just so damaging especially when I'm already distressed. Even if they mean well, it feels like a dagger in my sides.

It's important to let people know what's better not to say.
 

RageBawt

Member
Oct 27, 2017
338
The scary part about it is that most of the time, suicidal people are well aware of this. Some of my friends who struggle with this have mentioned several times how the only reason they haven't yet killed themselves is because they don't want to upset people around them and that they are literally counting the years until they no longer have to worry about that. Obviously someone being pushed even further would have a very tenuous connection to that feeling and it wouldn't really stop them, especially if they are struggling with psychosis and/or manic episodes etc.
Pretty much the only reason I'm still around.
 

Radeo

Member
Apr 26, 2019
724
This. It makes you self loathe even more and wonder why you aren't stronger like every one else and capable of dealing with this. Also it just plainly doesn't work look at suicide statistics if that's what manning up is then I want none of it. Like I used to scoff at toxic masculinity when I first heard it, but I looked into it and realized it isn't an insult it's meant to help us with destructive behavior. Like openly talking about my depression with the normalcy of any other illness felt like such a burden lifted off my shoulders. I didn't have to lie and come up with fake excuses as to why I didn't want to talk or hang out. Repression just doesn't help and really makes you self loathe even more.
Sure, but it's so widespread exactly because most people never do look into it. They never need to, because as far as mental health is concerned we're just coming out of the dark ages and most people barely recognise it exists. Hell I've had several counselors and doctors say some variation of it to me. So while it hurts, I can't really demonise people who do think like this because I can count the number of friends who have been sensitive about it on 1 hand, even hanging around places like Era.
 

Abominuz

Member
Oct 29, 2017
696
Netherlands
No, he quite clearly was not saying that to himself.



He wants to tell them to "man the fuck up" and enjoy life.
No i did not mean that, i will try to find a better English words to bring across what i mean. I am not asshole that will try to tell someone with mental issues that they just need to man up. Mu English is pretty good, but sometimes it is difficult to find the right words with such emotional subjects. My post was from my feelings and it seems sometimes the words don't come across that well.
 

chezzymann

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,583
I can understand that everybody has a different story, but what are the contributing factors? Maybe you are right, and i can not understand it because i don't feel that way. Yes the hurt and pain is there, but i process and coop with it differently. Is it then will or willpower, or no self worth?
As someone who has had suicidal thoughts, for me it was that i just didnt really enjoy life, or had a huge motivation to keep going and didnt want to have to live until i was 70 or something. I've always had trouble making friends and relationships and just didn't have the motivation to fix all the problems in my head to change things. The thought of being alive that long sounded like torture. The main thing that keeps me going right now is that i dont want my mom to be devestated.

Everyone has different ways to get to that point though. But it generally comes down to not wanting to deal with something anymore, like turning off a video game console when youre tired of the game.
 
Last edited:

Abominuz

Member
Oct 29, 2017
696
Netherlands
first of all, sucks you had to go through it. and props for getting through it and getting your life together.

i dont have any first hand experience with depression, just second hand. it's much tougher for people suffering from mental illness because their mind goes to dark places. they see no way out. people like you and me almost get stronger from adversity, but its because our body and mind cooperate in ways it doesnt for people suffering from depression and bipolar disorders. i suggest reading up on it. ive seen people simply shutdown and for the longest time i didnt understand it.

you hear about the term light at the end of the tunnel, now imagine being in the darkness and seeing no way out. its not that they are not strong. i would argue they are stronger. they do have that fighting spirit. but if your body and mind are telling you one thing over and over again it becomes your reality. And why would anyone question their reality?
I understand it a little bit better, so their fight is with themselves and the thoughts they have and their way of thinking if i understand correctly. They are constantly fighting with themselves, that seems really exhausting.
 

RageBawt

Member
Oct 27, 2017
338
I understand it a little bit better, so their fight is with themselves and the thoughts they have and their way of thinking if i understand correctly. They are constantly fighting with themselves, that seems really exhausting.
The way I describe it to people is imagine just suddenly not having any motivation. Just everything seems so pointless and you have this constant supply of negativity as your brains first response to anything you can think to do. Things you have always enjoyed just suddenly aren't fun and seem like a total waste and you just don't know how to turn things around at all.
 

Elephant

Member
Nov 2, 2017
854
Nottingham, UK
The scary part about it is that most of the time, suicidal people are well aware of this. Some of my friends who struggle with this have mentioned several times how the only reason they haven't yet killed themselves is because they don't want to upset people around them and that they are literally counting the years until they no longer have to worry about that. Obviously someone being pushed even further would have a very tenuous connection to that feeling and it wouldn't really stop them, especially if they are struggling with psychosis and/or manic episodes etc.
Mmhmm, it was a big reason as to why it took me as long as it did to attempt, it was my main reason for not trying again when released. Their reactions were devastating to me. It's kinda like being at your own funeral with the outpouring of emotion. After that, everyone treats you differently, everyone stops being like they used to. it was only after a couple of years, and finding some peace in myself, that's when people started treating me normally again. That made me happy, but it was a weird time.
 

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
5,418
UK
I understand it a little bit better, so their fight is with themselves and the thoughts they have and their way of thinking if i understand correctly. They are constantly fighting with themselves, that seems really exhausting.
I'm not sure you saw it due to your ban, but I replied to your initial post linking to a post of my own that might shed some light on the internal struggles some face.
 

Radeo

Member
Apr 26, 2019
724
I understand it a little bit better, so their fight is with themselves and the thoughts they have and their way of thinking if i understand correctly. They are constantly fighting with themselves, that seems really exhausting.
The internal struggle is just one element of it. Imagine trying to fight against your gut instincts and paranoia constantly, while also having to potentially deal with a demanding job, or an abusive family/friends, or physical symptoms (panic attacks, hallucinations, mood swings, etc), or any other number of things that happen in life. And while this is happening, you more than likely feel like you can't speak to anyone about this inner struggle because you're scared of how they may react, and you feel like no one can possibly understand how you feel, maybe you even feel guilty for pushing your burden onto someone else. It can completely warp how you interact with people, and how you perceive the world around you.
 

Chaz

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
2,452
Scotland, UK
Trigger warnings: depression, suicide, suicidal thoughts, sexual abuse, rape, detailing of wounds.

-----

I had hoped to make this post sooner but was unable to. This rips through me, feels incredibly close to home and heartbreaking. I'm not sure how much I'll share but some of this stuff is only known by singular people in my personal life, but it could be important for members here right now. It might be rambling in parts but hopefully some might relate to elements of it.

I'll start by echoing a post of mine in an Etika thread before this:

Which sounds harsh, but hopefully everyone can now understand the severity with which we're talking. There should be no tolerance for it, it's disgusting and it costs lives.

I have been both the person suffering, and have tried to help others who suffer.

If you're any age and can relate to Etika's last video, general desperation or find yourself apart from the world drifting – it gets better. It can, it will, it does.

I wish I could show you how far down the well I was, so you understood the tears with which this ink is mixed. I've been to the top of multi-story car parks and stood on the edge, I've sat under trees in the forest crying wondering which I might hang from soon. Every week I drive over a bridge well-known for suicides and every time I do there's still a glint within me that asks if the world would be better if I did. I don't think it ever leaves you, but now I have a list of things that pop up when I think that, reasons to stay alive. Some days that list is shorter than others, but it's always there now and a number of those items are strong enough to where I don't have to worry any more. Which is why it is so important to me that you understand that it can get better, because there were many times where I didn't have that list in the road until now.

During my time at secondary school (ages 11-16) I was both sexually abused at the start, and I was bullied on a daily basis for close to four of the years. My offense was that I was born with ginger hair and needed glasses. Mix that with being pretty shy and coming off the back of everything sexual abuse brings, and I was a prime vector of attack. We're talking being spat on, kicked between the legs, pushed down flights of metal stairs, poled on the bus, punched, kicked, whatever. Every day of school, for years. Several occasions I was threatened with knives. Nothing happened to the bullies because "boys will be boys" and because it wasn't racially motivated.

So I grew up with an irreconcilable level of self-hatred, shame, guilt and a strong perception that the issue was me. After all, I was being broken on a daily basis purely for features of my body I was unable to change. It wasn't immediate, it wasn't overnight but with time that settled and it settled deep. I became an incredible liar and – as with many people suffering from depression – managed to perfect the wearing of masks. Every day I went home and smiled at my parents, said all was fine before going upstairs and breaking down into the pillows. Occasionally I couldn't make it to the bedroom before that, and my parents would see a crack of what was happening. I'd summarily dismiss it as being solely whatever had managed to escape at the time, before going upstairs and wondering how I could get a gun in the UK to put to my head.

---------
Trigger warnings: depression, suicide, suicidal thoughts, sexual abuse, rape, detailing of wounds.
---------

Which is another thing: suicide isn't taken seriously until it's committed to.

Unsuccessful suicide attempts are well known as being disregarded as attention seeking (for which I'll let the irony escape for now) but there's a further subset to where if you've only considered it but taken no action toward it then you really aren't being serious. Which needs to be challenged. Thinking of ending your own life isn't a simple one. People might want to die but few want to die in agony. This is about not living, not dying itself. If you jump from a bridge you risk tearing your body apart but surviving and living life crippled with zero ability. Pills are simple but seem horrific in their action except when coupled with alcohol, but again – you read too many stories about people surviving and coming too in the hospital having fucked their organs. A jump off of a tall building seems like the best way to go but the duration of the fall means you could regret it and be unable to reverse the decision, the same is true of hanging and bleeding out. A gun seems like the easy solution but then how do you find out how to do it well, because if you botch that then you're back with the above. Trains are the immediate solution but then you're impacting another, random, person with your already-waste-of-space life. I have spent a lot of time considering these things in the past.

This is what suicidal thoughts entertain, and it turns out that the human body is quite resilient. That dying is scary even when suicidal and that it's not a case of walking into the local supermarket and picking up the cheapest "erase me" kit. If you're not taking suicidal thoughts seriously before they become actions, then you need to change your mentality. There is no bar that people have to hit before they're "actually suicidal", and any of those barriers could crumble if a signfiicant additional blow is dealt to them in life.

Depression is your mind working against you

Why didn't they seek help? Why did they refuse help? Why did they just push people away that were trying to help? All of these show a massive ignorance towards what depression is like, and that's ok. We need to educate people, and mental illness is a conversation that has long been taboo. So ignorance is expected, but you have to be able to put aside your affront and recognise it's nothing compared to the inner turmoil the person is going through. Depression isn't logical and trying to approach it like it is won't help. When someone can't conceive their own self worth it's near impossible to believe that others can. Depression is your mind telling you that you deserve to feel this way. Depression is your mind telling you that help can only ever be temporary because you're the problem. Depression is your mind telling you to jump, because it's the only way to ensure nothing continues. It is your mind doubting every solution and labouring every negative, it is you telling you to kill yourself. It is the insidious trickery that forces you to live under that weight.

Thankfully I learned to break from it, and you can too. Councilling helps. Talking to people complete disconnected from your life helps.

When I was 16 I placed a bet with my friend at the time for £10 that I wouldn't live until 30. I couldn't see it. I was scraping by day by day purely for others and I couldn't conceive of a happy life so far into the future. It wasn't even dramatic, it was just a certainty to me.

Now I'm two months into being 30, and it's not been an easy road but I have that list and I love it. I have reasons to live outside of dependencies, I have things I love about life. I want to see, I want to travel, I want to experience. I'm in a good job, with a loving partner, in our own home. I live in a beautiful part of the country. We're getting a dog this year, and plan to get married and have children.

However none of that is what turned it around. I am not alive because of my SO (though she has been intrumental in her support of things I've shared). I am not alive because of my job. I am not alive because I have a nice house and money. These are all reasons I enjoy life, but they aren't what saved me. I am what saved me, and you are what will save you. Every day is a win. Every breath is a win. Every time you push those thoughts down enough to continue, it's a win. Every time you crack a little off the shell to let people know how you feel, is a win.

---------
Trigger warnings: depression, suicide, suicidal thoughts, sexual abuse, rape, detailing of wounds.
---------

Perspective is what allows you to win, and it's what depression robs you of.

Talk to people who know nothing about you. Tell them. Be kind to yourself. Death is final and not going anywhere, so pushing through another day to see what it brings is an overwhelming success. Keep doing that and you will climb out of that well. Even if it seems like there's no footholds, they will come. You'll never lose the memory of being in it, but it's that that will give you the strength to resist it whenever it whispers to you. You just need to keep winning long enough to realise that you and that voice inside your head are not the same, and that you are the greater of the two.

Not everyone gets to that stage though.

Every time I think about this I cry. Every time I talk about it my voice cracks. Every time I feel an immense hole in my heart. It's been 13 years and I can still feel the warmth of the blood on my hands. This is about an incredible woman I once knew, who we'll call Amy here. Amy had been my friend for years and had supported me throughout. Though I could never appreciate it at the time, and only later gained the perspective to do so fully, she was intstrumental in my own survival. She was gentle and warm person but prone to the 'bad lads'. She was also extremely attractive which meant the bad lads went for her, and it meant a ridiculous amount in her acknowledgement of me at the time. She came from an abusive home and was truly a diamond in the rough, so she empathised with a lot of the hurt I was going through and never shied away from spending time with me when her peers would reject me.

Over the years she grew less confident and more timid. She was raped by a boyfriend, abused by another and constantly found herself only in relationships where she was little more than a plaque to her partner. I helped where I could but she withdrew signficantly over time. She started to self-harm, drink excessively and other things that numbed her pain. It killed me to see, but it was impossible to break when I lived miles away and she kept going home to an environment that wasn't safe and detrimental to her health.

One day at 9:37pm I received a text message. I'll never forget the words:

I'm scared. I'm alone. I've messed up. I don't know what to do :( help.

She didn't reply to the next one and I knew this wasn't a joke. I threw myself down the stairs and into the car and drove as fast as I could to where she was staying. No answer on the front door, so I hopped the fence and ran to the back which was open. I called out her name, nothing. I ran upstairs and I saw it. Red drips on the landing, red smears on the walls. I went into the bathroom and crumpled on there she was. Unnaturally white, blood everywhere and crumpled on the floor. I took off my shirt and jumper and did what I could to wrap her arms and stem the flow but I knew fucking zero about first aid. I held her, I screamed out into the street, I softly brushed her hair as she faded slumped against me, waiting for the ambulance. I couldn't save her.

I adored her. I still do. She would have been 30 like me this year, and she would have been the most amazing woman. She would have been the most loving mother, and she could have done so much good for the world.

She can't though, and it tears through me. I know that many people she reached out to for help didn't take it seriously, and I had to stand next to many at the funeral. She was mocked for it, she was called weak and an attention seeker. She was none of them.

---------
Trigger warnings: depression, suicide, suicidal thoughts, sexual abuse, rape, detailing of wounds.
---------

So I literally beg of anyone to never hand-wave people that are coming out as being suicidal. Berid yourself of any personal bar of "seriousness" that a person has to hit before you take suggestions of suicide seriously, and make sure that every single one of your friends knows that you're there for them. Not in an unspoken way, say that shit to them. Tell them that if they ever feel down that you're there to talk to, regardless of how small or large it might be.

Suicide is still such a hush-subject that people – myself included – still can't openly talk about it even when we're not considering it, because of the baggage it brings. I can't tell anyone in my life chunks of the above currently. It would scare them, because they don't understand mental illness and have thankfully never suffered from it. Today I have to tone down the depression I experienced for the comfort of others, as were I to tell anyone close to me the knowledge that I once very much considered ending my life would apply a veneer instabilty that is neither accurate nor warranted.

This is not healthy. We must become much, much more accepting of suicide as a topic of conversation and as something people deal with. Otherwise we're all awkward on it until another person dies, and that's a horrific way to keep a conversation active. People need to start challenging their own preconceptions about it, need to start realising that suicidal people are people and that in each case you have an opportunity to help and an opportunity to harm.

It doesn't matter if it's a mocking comment on a forum that another depressed user might read or otherwise, it has an impact. It affects the way we, as a whole, treat suicide and it affects the avenues of help people have to survive using. If you find yourself willing to gamble over the life and death of people in misery, purely to throw a meme or a joke in, then you seriously need to reflect on that for a bit.
Incredible post Kyuuji, thank you for sharing and I am sorry for your loss. Even after all this time I can imagine it is very difficult to go back to that time mentally, so again thank you.

You are one of my favorite posters on here, I hope you are aware of how much of a valued member of this community you are.