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Official PlayStation Next-Gen plans (2020, Wired Exclusive Article) [ Ray Tracing, BC, SSD, & more]
- Thread starter Wollan
- Start date
It's so sad having to play games that I love at 30 FPS and not having an option to change that. I wish every PS5 game had a performance mode.
By the nature of the technology, Google could increase this anytime they wanted.
Again, Stadia is not aiming to be the most powerful "console" - it's a service aimed at people who aren't necessarily going to buy Xbox or PS.
The message was clear: you won't need to spend $500 on a console. Play with that you already haveI want to know Google reaction especially after this
ShadowFall didn't feel fun to navigate in it's game world. The shooting sections felt lackluster which felt surprising considering how great KZ2 and 3 were. Shadowfall's visual tech is something else though, the character models, animations and lighting all just so incredibly crafted.
So since PS4 BC is happening, it seems safe to presume that the DS5 will be quite similar to the DS4. Or would they get rid of the touchscreen for something else like an IBM laptop power nubbin?
Playing BloodBorne atleast with rock-solid 30 fps without any framepacing issues (sadly PRO wasn't quite capable of such thing) would be great. 60 fps BB looks kinda like a pie in the sky dream, not even talking about higher framerate, because I doubt there will be major upgrades to old games. They'll look better, and perfomance will be enhanced as well, sure, but I don't think we'll be able to play, let's say Spider-Man or BB in 60 fps, it will still be 30. That's being said, I really hope Sony and PS5 will prove me wrong.
What I meant by that is a half refresh changes the perspective on what's available on the market as of right now.
Yeah, that sucks hopefully it's something they can improve, as it does look amazing. Next level even, just so damn smart and cool. It's too pricey for me to jump on one this late, but if PS5 is controller BC I'd seriously consider one.
I'm not sure RAM is that important anylonger if it has got a super-SSD. Of course the GPU's needs some GB but my uneducated guess is 16GB should suffice.
I thought Arthur from RebelFM was off his rocker when he initially said next-gen consoles will have SSDs and Raytracing (based on various published rumours). It was true, all of it.
Die 1000 times multiplied by 30 second load times = 3000 seconds (50min)
Nice, an hour of my life potentially saved!
There was a new patent from Sony a half year ago specifying a Xbox One X-similar cooling solution
Good stuff. I am sure that will be a big relief for Sony fans.
With all that backward-compatibility patents, it would be definitely wasted if it's only just for PS4.
Though we still have to wait for more official news.
I don't think it will be an actual SSD but rather memory that's soldered to the board to assist with loading. I expect there to also be a standard HDD bay (but at least one that will take full advantage of current desktop SSDs).
I'm way more excited at the prospect of playing my PS1 collection on the PS5 than my PS4 collection for some reason. Fingers crossed it happens.
I think given the timing of their filing, those patents almost entirely concern themselves with PS4->PS4 Pro compatibility, and in that sense are relevant to PS4->PS5 compatibility. I wouldn't read into them compatibility beyond that.
PS1 and PS2 emu should be technically easy on PS5, for digitally available titles at least. PS3 is a question mark.
But for PS1 and PS2, that'll be a business decision... it's not clear Sony has an interest in doing that. I hope they do though.
I kind of like the understated, out of the blue nature of this reveal. I get so annoyed with weeks of teasing, usually culminating in an underwhelming event (see the new Star Wars game reveal for a recent example). Hype cycles annoy me no end.
I'm hoping that that's the shape of the DS5, in the sense that it will have paddles as a standard moving forward. I'm hoping Sony will have their OWN premium DualShock 5 that you can customize while still allowing other companies to release competitors to their efforts.
Eh my Spidey Pro is really not loud at all, and it doesn't bother me so much unless it's 2am in the morning on my base PS4. Headphones also are good. I like a quiet system as well, but it's not some deal breaker lol.
AFAIR when STI (Sony, Toshiba and IBM) came up with the Cell, IBM provided PPC and Cell emulation for R&D and SDK, before actual hardware was made. RPCS3 already shows it's possible and Sony should be even in a better position since they actually knee deep in docs, R&D, etc. Let's hope, they'll try a little.
This. Is anyone else thinking that the ray tracing is a red herring? A bit like Xbox power of the cloud - it's technically possible, but the downsides (impact on a sub-$1000 GPU) it brings means it won't be used.
Unless Sony/AMD have done something very very clever and leapt ahead of current-gen PCs at a (sure to be) relatively modest pricepoint?
I'm really no expert, but my gut says that the SSD stuff is real and will be extensively used, but the raytracing stuff is stuff of marketing.
That's a decent scenario but I hope there's room for at least 2-3 retail games at any given moment. Also, blade SSD instead of soldered would be great.
Someone has mentioned you could just use an external USB at your own discretion for mass storage, allowing Sony to do away with a HDD bay completely. I feel like it's a strong possibility too, but for that to happen the onboard SSD memory must be decently sized, 500GB minimum.
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If it's hardware based or not (keep an eye on the Computex keynote May 27th for Navi unveil), Microsoft was 100% assuredly going to shout Ray Tracing at their E3 conference this year and with both consoles being based on Navi it seems Sony wanted to get ahead of that.
Unrelated:
The Tomorrow Children on PS4 was one of the more noteworthy ray-tracing implementations on that platform. Using GPU Compute for cascaded voxel cone ray-tracing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tomorrow_Children
"It features new lighting techniques developed by Q-Games, such as cascaded voxel cone ray tracing, which simulates lighting in real-time and uses more realistic reflections rather than screen space reflections.[6] This allows real-time global illumination,[5] without any need for pre-calculatedor pre-baked lighting.[2][7] It supports direct and indirect illumination in real-time,[5] and up to three bounces of light per pixel from all directions (compared to one bounce for Pixar films).[6] It also features deformable landscapes, with layered depth cubes, representing the world as volumes, which are then converted to polygons as needed."
Xbox diehards were mad that their console was not the de-facto most powerful hardware in this current gen.
Phil made sure that the X was better than the Pro by waiting a year.
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It was a smart move for multitude of reasons:
1. No pre-announcement-hype catching everyone by surprise. Just another ordinary Tuesday...
2. Sony's end-of-fiscal-year financial meeting later this month. How they are spending their money can now be talked about in more detail.
3. Devkit deployment has just started rapidly accelerating. Someone was likely going to leak certain aspects. Sony is taking control of the message beforehand.
4. Microsoft is aiming for a full-blowout at E3. They were destined to drop a lot of keywords like ray-tracing, Navi, Ryzen, SSD etc. and talk a big game. Now instead Sony is leading that conversation. And it seems kinda silly to megaphone those details now after Sony seemed it fit for a mere tweet and a blog-post.
5. PS4 BC. There's 90+ million users that will gradually start to consider next-gen platforms. Now they can rest-assured their game collection can be carried over making things a no-brainer for many. Especially if you have been buying digital.
6. The PSVR ecosystem will carry on over to the PS5. That message is now out which is very valuable for the slowly emerging VR market.
7. Sony breaks their radio-silence that was slowly building tensions in their fanbase since mid-2018. We now have a lot of concrete juicy details about the PS5 tech but they left out just enough so that Sony themselves can respond on the moves made by the competition this summer.
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The market doesn't move much based on the preference of "xbox diehards."
Its the mass market that decides these things, and the mass market by and large doesn't care about the pro OR the X or which one is stronger.
The one X was meant to squeeze more money out of people already in the xbox ecosystem, and justified the inflated price tag with specs.
You're launching a new system your calculus needs to be different. More Power has rarely been the biggest selling point for a new console. Lest we forget the ps2 was easily outclassed by the GC and Xbox, and Nintendo and Microsoft still got their clocks cleaned.
The Wii was nowhere near the capabilities of the 360 and PS3, but easily outsold both until sales fell off a cliff when the casual market lost interest in motion controls.
Price point, exclusives, and network lockin are far more relevant than a few more fps. History tells us this repeatedly.
Unofficial PS3 emulation on PC is pretty impressive, even in early stages.
Official emulation, if they decided to invest in it, would definitely be technically feasible on modern machines.
I'm hoping they at least try and replicate the success MS has had with their OG Xbox/360 BC initiative.
This is all official information! This is not a drill.
- Mark Cerny is once again the Lead System Architect.
- 8 core AMD 7nm Zen 2 based on third generation Ryzen.
- Ray-tracing support with custom AMD Navi GPU.
- Custom AMD unit for 3D Audio, also aided by ray-tracing, a big upgrade. Hot on the heels of Sony having acquired near-industry-standard AudioKinetic.
- Extremely fast high-end custom SSD storage faster than any solution currently available for PC:
Spider-Man load times on PS4 Pro: 15 seconds → 0.8 seconds on next-gen PlayStation. That's ~19x faster!
Huge practical game changer opening up for new design opportunities.- Technically supports 8K but Cerny demoed Spider-Man load speed improvements on a 4K screen (I would only take this as confirmation of HDMI 2.1).
- New Virtual Reality platform strongly hinted at but also supports current PSVR (meaning millions of VR users 'day one').
- Death Stranding might be a cross-gen title (speculation in article based on Cerny reply).
- Physical Media.
- Backwards Compatible with at least PS4 (relevant for 90+ million users).
- Devkit is with developers and they recently accelerated its deployment.
- Four years in development so far.
- 2020.
Straight from Mark Cerny. Key aspects were demoed to Wired on next-gen hardware.
I suggest you start saving up now...
/Cerny
Next up: AMD's Dr. Lisa Su will deliver the Computex keynote on May 27th. She is expected to unveil the Navi GPU architecture as well as to launch the third generation of Ryzen CPU's.
As for Sony it seems they have struck a nice balance here of giving us a lot to consider with key architectural designs and coming out ahead of the discussion and leaving out just enough so that they can take their time before re-surfacing. Likely a good while after the competition has revealed their cards at E3. Outside of the Computex keynote I wouldn't expect significant new insights about the next-gen PlayStation platform before later in the year.
just need more banderas gif
Yea talking about cooling, all that stuff sounds great but if next Sony console will be as loud as launch PS4 or launch PS4 Pro I'd have to build sound dampening enclosure for it as now playing any game which is over 1080p on my Pro is like going to hairdresser and putting my head into one of these big over the head hairdryers.
I think 16 is a safe bet. 4 for OS, 12 for games perhaps. With that amount and new GPU and CPU, that should be more than enough to push.
The mass market usually find out all the details from the core gamers. It's the core gamers who disseminate the message to the mass market.
The message this gen was Xbox was not only weaker, it was also more expensive. Couple that with the disastrous reveal(sports, watercooler, online only) it got so big that even people who aren't that into gaming knew about it.
A couple more things that affects perception are date of release, marketing and exclusives. Releasing earlier than the competition means it gets to be talked about earlier, bought earlier by core gamers who would then tell them to the mass market. Marketing can be a blessing or a disaster and it also could come from themselves or from outside sources. I remember a hilarous rumour about Saddam Hussein or Bin Laden using duct taped PS2 to power his missiles. It was a meme before memes were even born. Now the Kinect for XBO on the other hand had extremely bad luck. It came at a time when the public were getting scared that they were being monitored by the US government and it came out that MS were partners with that. Lastly, exclusives and mind you the judgement was decided even before the games were released. Sony was showing massively polished games throughout the year before release while Ryse was the butt of jokes.
All these trickle down to the mass market so core gamers, the 'diehards', still have a lot of power in making or breaking who the leader of the gen will be. I definitely agree with everything else in your post though.
Would be interesting to see game like Persona 5 via backward-compatibility with instant loading time.
The game have too much loading, albeit not that long.
We probably see little of those fancy loading screens & Take Your Time because it's (too?) fast now on PS5.
The game have too much loading, albeit not that long.
We probably see little of those fancy loading screens & Take Your Time because it's (too?) fast now on PS5.
Possibly. It's also possible Stadia pushed Sonys hand, hence the article throwing out general information and no solid specs.
It might push MS to talk more about their nextgen stuff but I think they already had that in hand for E3.
There has been talk of a separate pool of 4GB DDR4 for the OS and all of the GDDR6 being allocated to games.
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The ps5 should easily be enough to handle ps3 emulation by now.
The mass market gets their information from mainstream publications and media, and occasionally youtube. They aren't on forums, reading gaming magazines, or asking the hardcore for their opinion.
The Xbox stumbled out of the gate by being $100 more expensive (which immediately hits the mass market in the wallet) AND having confusing messaging about banning used games- which absolutely did get picked up by mainstream media. Nobody was happy. The sole selling point to the Xbox One was built in Kinect- which very, very few people cared about mass market or otherwise. As mentioned, Microsoft's entire messaging around that was TV centric, not gaming centric because there were so few gaming applications appropriate for it. It went over like a lead balloon.
So for the mass market gamer that wants to play Madden, Minecraft, Call of Duty, GTA, etc...why would you pay a $100 premium for the Xbox one? You could do it just as easily on the PS4, save yourself $100, and have no confusing questions about whether you can still play a used/borrowed game.
"Power" didn't really come into that equation, and if it did it was WAY down the list. "government surveillance" doesn't even register as a concern- people fall all over themselves to buy smart speakers they KNOW are being monitored and recorded. nobody cares, they keep selling.
and yes- Sony's lineup of exclusive software did come into that equation but it wasn't a new thing. Sony had built themselves a lot of goodwill by continuing to release well designed exclusive software for the PS3 when Microsoft had done virtually nothing for the 360 after releasing Kinect for THAT platform. The assumption was that Sony was simply more interested in producing games than Microsoft was, and that was the impression among both core AND mass market gamers by that point.
or could sony throw in separate ram(low tiered one) for OS and have a dedicated 16gig memory for games?
A possibility too. I think most would prefer unified, since as OS overheads go down, it frees up more for the games but 16 would be a solid amount for just game.