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Oct 27, 2017
2,711
Here's the thing.

Our society has evolved for thousands of years, right? Our social communication in the real world has always been judged by rules, and laws. If I say something bad to you, and you take enough offense, you can go straight to the police and i'll probably get thrown in jail. That barely happens online. Why? Because policing the internet is complicated

Here's the procedure:
1.) Someone says something bad online
2.) Someone takes notice of it and calls the police
3.) The police have to care enough about the insult to act on it. Contact website owner to acquire IP Address if they don't have backdoors to said website
4.) Website owner provides IP Address if they don't have complains. Maybe they ask for a warrant first if it's Apple and they're being stingy
5.) Authorities make sure IP Address isn't a proxy and find the local police station relevant to that area
6.) Second police station gets involved and acts upon the received information
7.) They try to find out if they got the right guy

This is a huge, huge list of tasks with tons of hoops, checkpoints, and check & balances just to take someone to court for what they said online. Why are things like this? I think it's because we don't have a real internet police solution.

Simply, because we've allowed a new social bubble to form. Just like we eventually realized we would need real police to enforce communication and interaction in the social world, we need stronger structure in the digital world. We're lacking that critical component.

This is one area where the great chinese firewall, the golden shield project in particular, really shines. If you say something bad, authorities can be at your door within the hour. Social interaction online is properly policed online just like it would be in real life. With all this garbage posting online, and all these people being converted into serial killers and mass shooters by this garbage, is it time to really start realizing the pro's to China's solution, and stop dismissing them?

Here's an article from WP from the nitty gritty if you're interested
, but here's something interesting:
Indeed, just using a VPN to access blocked websites can earn you a trip to the local police station in the troubled, Muslim-majority province of Xinjiang, residents say.
Even using a VPN can net you a trip to your local police station? This is saying one thing: You aren't anonymous in the real world, so why should you be anonymous online? If you interact with society, you should be held accountable for what you say.

Would these stop mass shooters? Would these stop mass murderers? Well, I ask you this: How many times you have read threads of violence on the internet in the past week where it was clear nothing would happen to the person that posted those things? The chinese solution would catch almost all of these guys immediately.

Do you think it's time we start looking at the pro's to this solution, or is it still just too much?
 

Dyle

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
29,894
Just get rid of the guns and you won't need such a system
 

BY2K

Membero Americo
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
4,682
Québec, Canada
Yeah, I'm not gonna trade freedom for security in this particular area.

There's issues, yes. But the solution is not big brother.
 
Nov 4, 2017
2,203
"This is one area where the great chinese firewall, the golden shield project in particular, really shines. If you say something bad, authorities can be at your door within the hour."
I clicked the golden shield project link.

I clicked the section that said censorship.

This was the first thing listed.

wikipedia said:
"Web sites belonging to "outlawed" or suppressed groups, such as pro-democracy activists "

1984.gif
 

Divvy

Teyvat Traveler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,895
There's a lot of countries that don't have regular mass shootings or an oppressive police state
 

Rayne

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,633
Yeah or instead of having a police state we could get rid of the guns. I rather get rid of the guns.
 
Dec 12, 2017
4,652
Mass shooters would eventually just stop talking about it online. It's not as if they need to collaborate with anyone. How many killers even mentioned specific plans online before??
 

Burt

Fight Sephiroth or end video games
Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,134
There literally isn't a worse way to make this argument than to solely cite a system implemented by an authoritarian government specifically to suppress and punish a persecuted minority.

There probably isn't a worse place to make that argument citing that system than ResetEra.
 

Phrozenflame500

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
2,132
Calm down there Big Brother, the US has already sold enough of your privacy for """"""""""""security""""""""""""
 

Mona

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
26,151
There literally isn't a worse way to make this argument than to solely cite a system implemented by an authoritarian government specifically to suppress and punish a persecuted minority.

There probably isn't a worse place to make that argument citing that system than ResetEra.

This
 

Rackham

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,529
God damn OP. I mean come the fuck on.

Edit: Honestly depending on OP's response I'm about to ignore them. What a stupid take
 

Deleted member 12790

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
24,537
You know, if we crushed all free will and implanted chips in our brains that have government agencies control our actions, nobody would commit murder anymore. It's time to talk about the positive sides of being a mind slave.
 

MotherFan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
659
I can´t believe I just read this. Have you thought of how China is using this? Suptessing dissenting thought, keeping a social media score, and completely owning the flow of information.

Dare post something critical of the govt? Internet Police within the hour.....ugh
 

Wulfric

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,963
Lol what? No thanks, I like being able to tell government officials to fuck off without getting imprisoned. Also, you put minorities in a really bad position when you restrict speech and access to information.
 

PeskyToaster

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,312
You don't think such a system would be first used to suppress enemies of the government rather than people being meany pants online? China ran over thousands of their own students with tanks, yeah sure sounds like a model government that uses great power responsibly.


Honestly I'm getting whiplash from the amount of head shaking. Even in what you quoted the system is specifically targeting a Muslim majority region. Yeah real god damn awesome system. I'm sure the parties out of power and minorities in any other country would be so comfortable with that.
 

Kuga

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
2,263
The ability to be selectively anonymous online is invaluable to well-functioning societies.
 

Skytylz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
779
Worst OP ever or WORST OP ever?

Seriously though, this is nuts. I think their intellectual isolationism is China's biggest weakness.
 

Deleted member 12790

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
24,537
You don't think such a system would be first used to suppress enemies of the government rather than people being meany pants online? China ran over thousands of their own students with tanks, yeah sure sounds like a model government that uses great power responsibly.

Just a reminder that we're still learning about how brutal their totalitarian government can be: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ish-ambassador-1989-alan-donald-a8126461.html
 

IDreamOfHime

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,416
I think the Chinese system is a bit too far in that you can't criticise the Government, but i have no problems with UK cops arresting folks for the shit they say about private citizens on twitter/facebook.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,789
1) Neither the free speech or hate speech problems are nearly as bad as either side makes them out to be. People get annoyed and are tired of certain behavior but most are doing fine. The reality is that we're probably more sensitized to previously acceptable behavior because we're making positive social progress and fostering more inclusiveness.
2) A lot of the actual bullshit actually comes from these oppressive regimes to cast FUD and normalize their policies. You took the bait.
 

Deleted member 12790

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
24,537
This is about stopping people who issue threats of violence, which free speech has never covered.

How naive to not see that the tools to achieve one are not mutually exclusive from achieving the other. In fact, the second half of your sentence is achieved in such countries by precise what you are saying will be curtailed in the first half of your post.
 

Xe4

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,295
Yeah, no. Like it's such a bad flat out idea it's not even worth considering. The US has a lot of probelms with the way it treats online interactions and it's gonna take a lot of work to get working right.

But the answer is not and will never be the bullshit big brother crap China pulls with with the internet. It exists solely to push down and opress those pushing for change in society and ensures the only voice you hear is that of the party. It's a horrible, horrible idea and I'm a little shocked anyone would even consider it.
 
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nsilvias

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,704
You do understand that gov'ts would jump at the opportunity to enact this kind of thing not to protect their people but to control them rite? It's what the uk has done with their mass survellaince shit and the us did something similair after 911. you should never want a gov't to have all that power. I mean, this facebook stuff just happened and you're suggesting this? are you not thinking straight? that alone should give you an idea of what could happen on a gov't scale. there's better solutions to these problems that we have, dont give in to the shittiest option just because you are fed up with what's happening.
 

Kthulhu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,670
What the hell? No.

Even using a VPN can net you a trip to your local police station? This is saying one thing: You aren't anonymous in the real world, so why should you be anonymous online? If you interact with society, you should be held accountable for what you say

Uh, why not? Also, you do realize VPNs are used for way more than just privacy, right?
 

John Rabbit

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,091
I kept looking for ways to get incisive on OP's post, but it's literally an unending scrawl of piss poor opinions.
 
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