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Bede-x

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,421
Haven't seen much of it, but there's plenty of room for improvement on the original game both in terms of combat, enemy variety, balancing the difficulty level and map design. I don't think the first was anywhere near the best in the genre in those aspects, but I still liked it and am looking forward to the sequel.
 

GymWolf86

Banned
Nov 10, 2018
4,663
I bought the first one at launch but it was so full of platform section that for me was unfun.

I gonna read a lot of feedback for the sequel before even thinking of buying it.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,810
One of my favourite games ever, really.
For me the Definitive Edition is close to perfect. I can't tell what they could improve.
Will of the Whisps is easily my most anticipated game this year.
 

SmashN'Grab

Member
Oct 27, 2017
525
I just finished the first game at the weekend, having played it in fits and spurts over the past couple of years. IT was so impressive, that I immediately started the Definitive Edition afterwards and played through about 50% of it just yesterday. The visuals and music and overall presentation are sublime, and the controls are so good and so fluid that it's a joy just to move around.

By far the biggest problem though, is the difficulty of the chase sequences. They are simply not balanced at all, and a real source of frustration. I mean Christ! The game actually tells you how many times you died and respawned during the playthrough and in 12 hours of overall play I died 874 times. Now, I'm not completely shit at videogames, but that's ridiculous. I know that you respawn instantly, but that number blew my mind. I died over 150 times on the last chase in the lava with the bird alone. Fucking ridiculous. I must've died 300+ times on the Ginzo tree.

The window of failure during the chase sequences is literally less than 1 second. It's fucking nuts! I get what they were going for with the whole 'by the skin of your teeth' style of escape. But c'mon! Jesus, I was going fucking nuts playing the game and they'd better fix it in the sequel.
 

litebrite

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
21,832
I just finished the first game at the weekend, having played it in fits and spurts over the past couple of years. IT was so impressive, that I immediately started the Definitive Edition afterwards and played through about 50% of it just yesterday. The visuals and music and overall presentation are sublime, and the controls are so good and so fluid that it's a joy just to move around.

By far the biggest problem though, is the difficulty of the chase sequences. They are simply not balanced at all, and a real source of frustration. I mean Christ! The game actually tells you how many times you died and respawned during the playthrough and in 12 hours of overall play I died 874 times. Now, I'm not completely shit at videogames, but that's ridiculous. I know that you respawn instantly, but that number blew my mind. I died over 150 times on the last chase in the lava with the bird alone. Fucking ridiculous. I must've died 300+ times on the Ginzo tree.

The window of failure during the chase sequences is literally less than 1 second. It's fucking nuts! I get what they were going for with the whole 'by the skin of your teeth' style of escape. But c'mon! Jesus, I was going fucking nuts playing the game and they'd better fix it in the sequel.
You haven't explained how they're not balanced and they better fix it, only that you died a lot which i think is the point in creating a life and death escape sequences that put's all of the mechanics you've learned thus far to the test in high speed action.
 

SmashN'Grab

Member
Oct 27, 2017
525
You haven't explained how they're not balanced and they better fix it, only that you died a lot which i think is the point in creating a life and death escape sequences that put's all of the mechanics you've learned thus far to the test in high speed action.
What I said was that the window of failure is too small. The water chasing you is only about 1 second (or even less tbh) behind you. Ideally you'd be able to make at least one mistake or mis-time one small jump and still make it through, but in reality you need to pull off about a 2-3 minute stretch of incredibly intense platforming absolutely flawlessly or you start it again from the beginning each time.
 

Xiofire

Prophet of Regret
Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,137
Four...years?!
Jesus, time does fly. Absolutely loved the first, cannot wait for the follow up.
 

Karateka

Member
Oct 28, 2017
6,940
What I said was that the window of failure is too small. The water chasing you is only about 1 second (or even less tbh) behind you. Ideally you'd be able to make at least one mistake or mis-time one small jump and still make it through, but in reality you need to pull off about a 2-3 minute stretch of incredibly intense platforming absolutely flawlessly or you start it again from the beginning each time.
This is like asking for an easy mode in Dark Souls.
Technically there is nothing wrong with it, I guess. I liked the level of challenge the game gave me and wouldn't want it any easier, but many do, so maybe an easy mode would be good.
 

lvl 99 Pixel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,697
I just finished the first game at the weekend, having played it in fits and spurts over the past couple of years. IT was so impressive, that I immediately started the Definitive Edition afterwards and played through about 50% of it just yesterday. The visuals and music and overall presentation are sublime, and the controls are so good and so fluid that it's a joy just to move around.

By far the biggest problem though, is the difficulty of the chase sequences. They are simply not balanced at all, and a real source of frustration. I mean Christ! The game actually tells you how many times you died and respawned during the playthrough and in 12 hours of overall play I died 874 times. Now, I'm not completely shit at videogames, but that's ridiculous. I know that you respawn instantly, but that number blew my mind. I died over 150 times on the last chase in the lava with the bird alone. Fucking ridiculous. I must've died 300+ times on the Ginzo tree.

The window of failure during the chase sequences is literally less than 1 second. It's fucking nuts! I get what they were going for with the whole 'by the skin of your teeth' style of escape. But c'mon! Jesus, I was going fucking nuts playing the game and they'd better fix it in the sequel.

*shrug* I loved those sequences and I played on hard where everything in the ginso tree sequence killed you in one hit. If anything I want them to make something more challenging for the sequel, at least on an optional hard mode because it seems like a love it or hate it aspect.
 

SmashN'Grab

Member
Oct 27, 2017
525
This is like asking for an easy mode in Dark Souls.
Technically there is nothing wrong with it, I guess. I liked the level of challenge the game gave me and wouldn't want it any easier, but many do, so maybe an easy mode would be good.
It's not at all like that, I'm simply saying a minor widening of the window of failure in those specific sequences would help the game. Not that they should be 'easy', but that they're not quite balanced for fun and challenge to the right degree.
 

Servbot24

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
43,126
Yes and yes.First game was quite good but it was far from perfect. They can definitely top it.
 

Messofanego

Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,178
UK
I just hope they aren't toning down the emotional side of things in their hunt for better and more varied gameplay, what they've shown so far hasn't pulled the same strings for me as the unveil trailer for Blind Forest.
That's the main concern and whether it will have emotional staying power which is why people remember the fist game so well.
 

litebrite

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
21,832
What I said was that the window of failure is too small. The water chasing you is only about 1 second (or even less tbh) behind you. Ideally you'd be able to make at least one mistake or mis-time one small jump and still make it through, but in reality you need to pull off about a 2-3 minute stretch of incredibly intense platforming absolutely flawlessly or you start it again from the beginning each time.
Yes, I think that was intentional in creating incredibly intense life and death escape sequences. There's a reason they're not very long. It's the moments in the game that really test how well you've mastered the mechanics in platforming.
It's not at all like that, I'm simply saying a minor widening of the window of failure in those specific sequences would help the game. Not that they should be 'easy', but that they're not quite balanced for fun and challenge to the right degree.
It would help the game be easier FOR YOU. Which is fine. That's essentially what you're saying, but you keep using the word "balanced" as if there's a fundamental flaw with those escape sequences and not with your ability to efficiently complete them which is always going to be a subjective experience when it comes to difficulty and fast twitch based gameplay under a timer.
 

SmashN'Grab

Member
Oct 27, 2017
525
Yes, I think that was intentional in creating incredibly intense life and death escape sequences. There's a reason they're not very long. It's the moments in the game that really test how well you've mastered the mechanics in platforming.

To be fair, 2-3 minutes is quite long when you're talking about a sequence like this.

It would help the game be easier FOR YOU. Which is fine. That's essentially what you're saying, but you keep using the word "balanced" as if there's a fundamental flaw with those escape sequences and not with your ability to efficiently complete them which is always going to be a subjective experience when it comes to difficulty and fast twitch based gameplay under a timer.

I'm far from the only player who has mentioned the three escape sequences as being a huge spike in difficulty. You're right that it's subjective, but those three sequences are (I feel) a little too demanding when set in the context of the rest of the game. It'd be like the bosses in Super Metroid being as difficult as Orphan of Kos, instead of what they actually are. It'd feel like a 'spike', as in, not in keeping with the pace of the rest of the game.
 

litebrite

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
21,832
I'm far from the only player who has mentioned the three escape sequences as being a huge spike in difficulty. You're right that it's subjective, but those three sequences are (I feel) a little too demanding when set in the context of the rest of the game. It'd be like the bosses in Super Metroid being as difficult as Orphan of Kos, instead of what they actually are. It'd feel like a 'spike', as in, not in keeping with the pace of the rest of the game.
I suppose in their easier modes they can try slowing the timing of events your escaping from to increase your window of life and margin of error.
 

thomasmahler

Game Director at Moon Studios
Verified
Oct 27, 2017
1,097
Vienna / Austria
Can't wait for you guys to play Will of the Wisps :) We're deep in the polishing stages, trying to perfect everything... this'll be our most stressful year so far, but I definitely hope it pays off and that you folks will have an incredible time with it.
 

FelipeMGM

#Skate4
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
3,012
Ori ''1'' is an amazing game, but it has one very weak-link, which is its combat. It bad all-around IMO

And from what I played from Will of the Wisps, the improvement on that front is enormous, so yeah, I think it could definitely top the original for me. Very excited to play it, hope it's soon!
 

Deleted member 18951

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,531
Can't wait for you guys to play Will of the Wisps :) We're deep in the polishing stages, trying to perfect everything... this'll be our most stressful year so far, but I definitely hope it pays off and that you folks will have an incredible time with it.

Cough once if it's releasing before E3 or cough twice if it's coming after E3 ;)
 

jon bones

Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,020
NYC
I'm only 2/3rd done with the first one - i am waiting til March when i upgrade to a 4K HDR TV to play the rest

can't wait for Will of the Wisps - better combat sounds perfect. i do hope for more Ginsu Tree style levels, that was a masterclass in platforming design.

Can't wait for you guys to play Will of the Wisps :) We're deep in the polishing stages, trying to perfect everything... this'll be our most stressful year so far, but I definitely hope it pays off and that you folks will have an incredible time with it.

good luck!
 

Damn Silly

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,194
The first Ori was terrific from beginning to end, so I'm not sure how they could top it, and yet, I'm confident they will.
 

Elixist

Member
Oct 31, 2017
1,170
looks incredible excited for it. the combat being massively improved is just so yummy as i felt that was the weakness of the first game.
 

KamenRiderEra

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,153
I just want a more free approach to exploration, and the option to backtrack and full explore any area. (In the original the temples are locked after completion).
 

DarkFlame92

Member
Nov 10, 2017
5,644
It sure can top it ,because 3-4 years of developement for such games is super enough to deliver an amazing product
 

Elodes

Looks to the Moon
Member
Nov 1, 2017
1,234
The Netherlands
Hard to not be looking forward to it after the quality of the first one.

The weirdest / most interesting thing I've seen regarding the game is hiring Alexander O Smith (legendary game localisation person, worked on FFXII, Vagrant Story, etc). I'm guessing he's going to be helping out with the story?
Oh shit, they did this? That's fantastic news. Ori's writing and storytelling were the game's main flaws imo. Can't wait to see what Smith can make of it.
 

Phonzo

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,817
Can't wait for you guys to play Will of the Wisps :) We're deep in the polishing stages, trying to perfect everything... this'll be our most stressful year so far, but I definitely hope it pays off and that you folks will have an incredible time with it.
I just wanna throw out that if you make a CE for Ori 2, i would buy it even though i'll have gamepass.
 

Phonzo

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,817
It'll be great. But I'd happily never play anything as tricky as the Ginsu Tree ever again.
I felt the last runner was harder. To me the ginsu tree was hard because of the slingshot. Usually with that ability, the person moves their stick in the opposite direction they want to go, to sling them off, but here you point in the direction your going and it throws me off.
 

SpinlyLimbs

Banned
Feb 1, 2018
914
Pretty much got me into Metroidvanias (only other one I'd beaten was Shadow Complex) I love it that much. Pretty much changed my opinion on a whole genre. Ori 2 is looking to be a masterpiece.
 

Deleted member 7948

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,285
What I said was that the window of failure is too small. The water chasing you is only about 1 second (or even less tbh) behind you. Ideally you'd be able to make at least one mistake or mis-time one small jump and still make it through, but in reality you need to pull off about a 2-3 minute stretch of incredibly intense platforming absolutely flawlessly or you start it again from the beginning each time.
You can make small mistakes, you just can't make huge ones. The water speed is tied to yours, if you go too fast, it accelerates.

And the sequences are around 70 seconds long, at least for the Ginso Tree and Forloin Ruins ones.
 

entremet

You wouldn't toast a NES cartridge
Member
Oct 26, 2017
60,098
In gaming sequels usually surpass prequels. Mostly because developers learn tons of lessons from the first game and they have leftover ideas to explore.

I fully expect the Hollow Knight sequel to surpass the original as well.
 

Alex840

Member
Oct 31, 2017
5,120
Really looking forward to Will of the Wisps. The original game is one of my favorites this generation.
 

Thizzles

Banned
Feb 9, 2019
315
By anticapting the mistakes and having fall backs to keep the intensity up? I'm not sure why you'd actually want the player to be able to fail during those segments. It runs counter to most of the rest of the game. It's like if at the end of Metroid/Super Metroid Nintento gave players exactly 10 extra seconds to get out as opposed to having plenty of time to escape. The point is the feeling of danger, not to punish players for not being good enough.
So you just want an instant win segment? Lol games have done trial and error since day one. The goal is to get better. If you want a game that just let's you instant win I'm sure there's some cool children's games you could find
 

Odeko

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Mar 22, 2018
15,180
West Blue
I didn't find the metroidvania part of the first super compelling, but damn sometimes I still get that song stuck in my head from when you escape the rising waters. I'm excited for the pure audio-visual experience alone.