Overwatch |OT2-2-2| Role With It

BDS

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,419
It's also entirely false because Jeff stated way back in 2016 that he could see them eventually remove heroes from the hero pool.
I remember when he said this because people misunderstood it as Jeff suggesting characters could get permanently killed off as part of the ongoing story.

(This was back when we still thought the game actually had an ongoing story and they weren't just going to sit there doing nothing for five years until OW2)
 
Oct 25, 2017
9,533
That's not your problem at all. Why would you think about am i enjoying the game or not? Lol
You make it my problem, and everyone in this thread's problem, by polluting it with your constant toxicity.

Like, you don't like any changes they make. You don't like the "focus on esports balancing" (demonstrably false). You don't even fucking like any event skins. Why are you still playing?
 

NeoRaider

Member
Feb 7, 2018
3,326
You make it my problem, and everyone in this thread's problem, by polluting it with your constant toxicity.

Like, you don't like any changes they make. You don't like the "focus on esports balancing" (demonstrably false). You don't even fucking like any event skins. Why are you still playing?
Actually i said that i really like latest Sombra and Moira skins. So you are lying.

Sorry i am not in the Blizzard's ass losing my shit about everything they do or say.

I can stay here and discuss as long as i want. This is not your private forum.
 

The_Strokes

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,134
México
Actually i said that i really like latest Sombra and Moira skins. So you are lying.

Sorry i am not in the Blizzard's ass losing my shit about everything they do or say.

I can stay here and discuss as long as i want. This is not your private forum.
Do you play the game competitively or quick play? I'm failing to see how any of these changes aren't exciting for comp players.

I haven't touched this god awful stupidly boring toxic imbalanced game in months and this is the first positive information I've seen coming from the dev team in that time alongside the recent patches.
 

NeoRaider

Member
Feb 7, 2018
3,326
Do you play the game competitively or quick play? I'm failing to see how any of these changes aren't exciting for comp players.

I haven't touched this god awful stupidly boring toxic imbalanced game in months and this is the first positive information I've seen coming from the dev team in that time alongside the recent patches.
It doesn't matter what i am playing.
Hero pools imo. won't and can't be a positive thing in OW in the long run. It's going to be short lived "solution".
 

NeoRaider

Member
Feb 7, 2018
3,326
Also i don't understand why was all this hyped so much like something that's going to "save the game" and "make it fun again". I-
 

Kyle Cross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,393
The Experimental card is great, solving the entire PTR problem. This should hopefully bring some fun rebalancing. I don't think Hero Pools will fix much at all.
 

Veelk

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,661
Ow Community: "we need a hero ban system to shake up the meta"
Blizzard: "We don't believe in hero bans because we don't think the enemy team should be able to dictate what you get to play."
Ow community: "Well, okay, but then wha-?"
Blizzard: "Only we get to dictate that. Your favorite hero? Banned, as of now."
 

The_Strokes

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,134
México
It doesn't matter what i am playing.
Hero pools imo. won't and can't be a positive thing in OW in the long run. It's going to be short lived "solution".
Uh, really curious to know where such strong assertion is coming from when the game clearly could use a strong shake up against one tricks, and stale metas with Blizzard also finally addressing balance changes more quickly.

2-2-2 was a step in the right direction but implemented with janky balance around no role limits.

People like to complain about 'freedom' when we all know the realities of ranked. Fuck freedom, give me a strong ruleset that benefits overall gameplay experience.

Maybe I can play Winston now.
 
Oct 25, 2017
9,533
I'm okay with it, I just think it's funny they were like "we are philosophically opposed to hero bans" but then go "okay, so here are hero bans, just on our terms"
Kaplan's post, specifically about ban metas and increased non-playing game time, details why it's dev-controlled as opposed to player controlled.

I'll review the post, but I feel like there's nothing in there that specifically opposes bans to heroes at all as opposed to specifically letting players choose the ban
 

Chessguy1

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,456
everyone talking about hero pools but im all about the constant aggressive patches

ive become a meta slave, waiting for the meta to establish after patches before grinding out rank.
 

FLCL

Member
Oct 27, 2017
659
More rapid balance changes is great but the hero pool thing? eeeeh. Who and / or how will that pool be decided? I flex and enjoy playing a lot of heroes but... Should have been hero bans instead, really liked that aspect of Paladins.
 

dr.rocktopus

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
4,444
Tempting. As a former flex-player hero pools does make things interesting. I think it could be interesting on a quicker match-to-match, voted in basis. Not sure I can come back yet after Blitzchung, though.
 

SimpleCRIPPLE

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,369
The pool changing in every match further down the line sounds fucking amazing
This would be amazing for OWL. Forcing player subs and changes in strats on-the-fly after every match. Forcing teams to use the entire roster, and encouraging them to have a balanced roster with players who can play a large number of characters at a high level.

More rapid balance changes is great but the hero pool thing? eeeeh. Who and / or how will that pool be decided? I flex and enjoy playing a lot of heroes but... Should have been hero bans instead, really liked that aspect of Paladins.
Random election from a small pool based on a the weeks previously most-played characters. 2 DPS, 1 Support, 1 Tank
 

jviggy43

Member
Oct 28, 2017
17,167
I honestly dont believe them about faster updates and hero changes. They said they would update us more with heroes and maps quicker and they didn't live up to that promise at all. Hero pools is stupid and the game doesn't have enough heroes to justify that at all.

And when it comes down to it they clearly aren't understanding the issue. The issue isn't rapidly changing metas because it gets stale. The issue is the last several metas have all sucked and no one has enjoyed playing them and you didn't do a good enough job at figuring out how to change them (and took too long to implement solutions that haven't made the game better). This solution entirely misses the problem.
 

GLAVONAK

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,931
the experimental mode sounds great but, while I’m glad they’re trying things, I wouldn’t be surprised if hero pools didn’t last
 
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Dead Prince

Dead Prince

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,132
i have enough knowledge to play most support hero so im okay. its not like it would matter anyways since the comp game is gonna RNG still.
 

JayCB

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,352
Wales
Very glad I've spent some time diversifying my tanks playpool. Still not big on playing Orisa and I'm a soso at best Winston, but other than that they are all at a pretty good level for me for this change.
 

Veelk

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,661
You know, unless they do it just right, this might encourage mirror comps, unless they just target banning meta heroes, they might just be effectively limiting the hero pool. If Rein and Sigma are meta, and they ban Orisa who is closest to being meta to them, well, then that just feeds into them being more meta without the second-rate meta hero being there to compete with them.
 

SDBurton

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,888
I'm okay with it, I just think it's funny they were like "we are philosophically opposed to hero bans" but then go "okay, so here are hero bans, just on our terms"
Pretty much what I got from it. I have Brig, Mercy, and Moira so I'll be fine overall, but still.. not a fan.

May be the pessimist in me, but I can already see people throwing games in comp if their 'main' gets locked out for a week.
 
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Dead Prince

Dead Prince

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,132
I have to be an actually good flex support now.

.........
i doubt theyll limit lucio. if anything it'll be bap. just play zen. they aren't going to touch a hero no one played for several seasons ;P

but i have to see about how they choose which hero to ban for the week. because it could make the overall balance of the game go off.
 

Sanox

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,417
Instead of 1 meta it will just be 2 maybe 3 major comps you see


All top picks get banned

Alternative for the next week

Then back to the old meta
 

SimpleCRIPPLE

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,369
Really wish they would lower the AFK time out. So many matches lost because one dumb ass would rather ruin a match instead of drop back to queue.
 

Nimby

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,008
People down on hero pools will immediately change their mind when they see Hanzo greyed out for an entire week.

edit: and I can easily much more experimentation and fluidity in the meta coming from hero pools. Blizzard just has to ban smartly to keep players not devolving back into old strategies. Banning characters with the highest playtime will probably just make it so you play a different comp every other week. The dev team really need to think about what characters synergize in any given comp, and what hero removed makes the comp not function.

I’d also like to know if their list of potential revisions to hero pools includes less banned heroes at lower ranks and different heroes per rank. Maybe that would be a better compromise. Characters like Moira and Reaper dominate at lower ranks and aren’t in the meta at all in GM. If hero pools don’t work out I’d like to see this changed first before adjusting the time period or scrapping the concept altogether.
 
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Oct 25, 2017
1,426
I just discovered Mystery Heroes and I'm having lots of fun.

That's where I'm at.

This proposed change to comp sounded very strange at first but yes, it does seem fine now when you think about it.

I think I should finally start getting my console skills up to snuff too. I've owned it on PS4 but never played it and I've had it longer than I've had my PC copy.
 

MG310

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,529
Got my 9 wins for the last weekly challenge costume already. Also got 2 identical "fuck u" messages from a Sombra who could not shoot straight enough to kill my hacked Roadhog.

I'd call that a good night.
 

KillstealWolf

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
6,615
Yeah I dunno about hero pools. And only 4 characters as well doesn't even sound like it'll shake things up much.

The only benefit is I get to have some matches without one of the DPS teammates thinking they are the world's hottest Hanzo and throw the match for us. But on the counter point, we don't get the matches where the opponent team gets that world's hottest Hanzo player throwing for them...
 

Noppie

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,675
And only 4 characters as well doesn't even sound like it'll shake things up much.
Let's say the meta is Winston, D.Va, Hanzo, Soldier, Baptiste, Ana. Now we remove D.Va, Soldier, Hanzo and Ana from the pool. How does that not shake things up? Now we target the meta with targetted balance changes: we nerf Hanzo, Baptiste and buff a counter. Now we reintroduce those heroes. That is a double shake up. Rince and repeat.

If they stay ontop of things like they're saying they will, there is no way this doesn't shake things up alot.
 

KillstealWolf

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
6,615
Let's say the meta is Winston, D.Va, Hanzo, Soldier, Baptiste, Ana. Now we remove D.Va, Soldier, Hanzo and Ana from the pool. How does that not shake things up? Now we target the meta with targetted balance changes: we nerf Hanzo, Baptiste and buff a counter. Now we reintroduce those heroes. That is a double shake up. Rince and repeat.

If they stay ontop of things like they're saying they will, there is no way this doesn't shake things up alot.
I guess it's the one week cap as well that comes into play. If they can update on a weekly basis it could change things up. Time to see if that works in practice though.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,123
Toronto, Canada
I mean they have the data to back it up, the reason why they are the ones doing the band is simple and they've explained it. "Metas" come from the top ranks and no matter the balance patch, at the highest level people don't move away from certain compositions quick enough.

I figure their line of thinking is, if the user can't be trusted to move that Meta even when balance patches are aggressive, who's to say hero bans won't result in the exact same heroes being banned every game (ie. Always Orisa, always Mei and Hanzo, always Brigitte and Bap). By having it be them ban heroes, people will have to adapt to the situation.

Also if you want all the heroes, you can always just play Quick Play or any other mode for that matter. Idk so many games that have seasons do it in a way in which each season is wildly different from the previous one... OW has always been the same for 21 seasons and I guess that change can be hard for some. I'm open to trying new things every season