• Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.

Deleted member 3812

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,821
Pete Buttigieg has angered some black people by saying with him being gay, it helps him relate to the struggles that black people face in America, these black people view Buttigieg's statement as an attempt by a privileged white man to claim a type of victimhood that is distinct from the black experience in America:


Mayor Pete Buttigieg has delivered a provocative response in recent days to those who challenge his empathy with black Americans: His experience as a gay man helps him relate to the struggles of African Americans.

That has angered some African Americans, who view it as an attempt by a privileged white man to claim a type of victimhood that is distinct from the black experience in America, even while others take the comments more favorably.

Oliver Davis, a black council member in South Bend, Ind., where Buttigieg is mayor, said that African Americans, unlike gay people, don't have the option of "coming out" at their chosen moment — as did Buttigieg, who disclosed his sexual orientation after he had been elected mayor.

"When you see me, you would know that I'm African American from day one," said Davis, who has endorsed former vice president Joe Biden. "When someone is gay or a lesbian, unless they tell or they are seen in certain situations, then no one is going to know that. They are able to build their résumés and build their career."

LGBT activists see something different in Buttigieg — a barrier-breaker from a group that has long faced bigotry and violence, a face of the latest struggle for inclusion. And while some successfully conceal their difference, say leaders of the movement for gay equality, that decision can come with its own steep costs.

Evan Wolfson, founder of Freedom to Marry, which helped lead the fight for same-sex marriage, said Buttigieg's message is not "an attempt to appropriate someone else's experience." Rather, he said, the mayor is saying that "because he, too, has had to deal with his own struggles, that has made him more aware of the need to connect with the struggles of others."

"I think Kamala had a point, and I understood what she was saying," the Rev. Al Sharpton, the civil rights activist, said in an interview, though he added that Buttigieg had been misunderstood.

He said Buttigieg is doing his best to reach out. "He's evolving," Sharpton said. "Do I think he's where he needs to be? No."
 

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
92,987
This also says alot about his view on LGBTQ issues lowkey
 

Jarmel

The Jackrabbit Always Wins
Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,266
New York
I think this is fine. He's not saying it's the same but that it helps him understand the perspective of another discriminated group.
 

kittenbreath

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
656
"While I do not have the experience of ever having been discriminated against because of the color of my skin, I do have the experience of sometimes feeling like a stranger in my own country, turning on the news and seeing my own rights come up for debate, and seeing my rights expanded by a coalition of people like me and people not at all like me," Buttigieg said.

Asked about the comments during his recent campaign swing in western Iowa, Buttigieg said he was not trying to compare the black and gay experiences, only to say that he is driven to fight for African Americans the way others have fought for him.

"It was people like me and people not like me who came together — starting before I was born and through my lifetime — who have made it possible for things like my marriage to exist, or honestly for somebody like me to even be taken seriously as a candidate for president," Buttigieg said.

"Having seen that, having seen how that alliance can make an impact, makes me reflect on how I can turn around and make myself useful, not only to the LGBT community but to people whose life experiences are very different," he added.

This doesn't sound like he was being equivalent at all.
 

Fantastical

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,356
What exactly did he say? I don't like Buttigieg but I don't find the summary of what he said in the quote that bad? It's not a 1-1 experience, I doubt the was saying that
 

Neece

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,194
What exactly did he say? I don't like Buttigieg but I don't find the summary of what he said in the quote that bad? It's not a 1-1 experience, I doubt the was saying that
"While I do not have the experience of ever having been discriminated against because of the color of my skin, I do have the experience of sometimes feeling like a stranger in my own country, turning on the news and seeing my own rights come up for debate, and seeing my rights expanded by a coalition of people like me and people not at all like me," Buttigieg said.
 

Deleted member 52442

User requested account closure
Banned
Jan 24, 2019
10,774
"While I do not have the experience of ever having been discriminated against because of the color of my skin, I do have the experience of sometimes feeling like a stranger in my own country, turning on the news and seeing my own rights come up for debate, and seeing my rights expanded by a coalition of people like me and people not at all like me," Buttigieg said.


sounds inoffensive to me
 

Tbm24

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,157
Reading what he said, I see what he's trying to do? Idk, I feel like trying to be nuanced nowadays is such a wasted effort that it's pointless to try.
 

Deleted member 2625

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,596
it's not oppression olympics. Gay people and black people face different unfair societal challenges. for my part he didn't seem to be drawing an equivalence, just noting that he's sensitive to systemic bigotry.
There's lots to criticize Mayor Pete for but this seems like a fishing expedition

like that thread title
 

Deleted member 17403

User Requested Account Closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,664
I can understand his perspective or line of thinking with the comparison. Honestly, being black, I think we should be the most welcoming of all people considering all the hardships and hate that we have faced throughout history simply because of who we are and the fact that we exist, yet those struggling with mental health concerns or are members of the LGBTQIA community are shunned by parts of our community. I think his view has merit in being that he's trying to communicate how society ostracizes and demonizes the people of his community much like what blacks experience the world over.
 

FeistyBoots

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,506
Southern California
It's a difference in kind, not in degree, in the sense that both groups have been horrifically abused and oppressed for an inherent aspect of who they are.

At the same time, a gay cis rich white guy obviously possesses privileges that black people don't have (let alone if they're black and gay/trans).
 

Big Boss

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,466
I don't think what he said was offensive but I don't think he should have said it because he's still a white guy at the end of the day.
 

WarioLuigi22

alt account
Banned
May 11, 2019
224
"While I do not have the experience of ever having been discriminated against because of the color of my skin, I do have the experience of sometimes feeling like a stranger in my own country, turning on the news and seeing my own rights come up for debate, and seeing my rights expanded by a coalition of people like me and people not at all like me," Buttigieg said.
That sounds fine
 

Neece

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,194
Also from the article:

Asked about the comments during his recent campaign swing in western Iowa, Buttigieg said he was not trying to compare the black and gay experiences, only to say that he is driven to fight for African Americans the way others have fought for him.

"It was people like me and people not like me who came together — starting before I was born and through my lifetime — who have made it possible for things like my marriage to exist, or honestly for somebody like me to even be taken seriously as a candidate for president," Buttigieg said.

"Having seen that, having seen how that alliance can make an impact, makes me reflect on how I can turn around and make myself useful, not only to the LGBT community but to people whose life experiences are very different," he added.

That resonates with many in the gay rights community. Matt Foreman, program director of the Evelyn and Walter Haas Jr. Fund, which advocates for marriage equality, among other causes, said it's not a given that being gay gives someone greater empathy for the struggles of people of color.
"But it should," he said. "It can't be the same, because you can never get inside anyone else's skin. But I see that in a lot of LGBT organizations and their sincere commitment to helping address systemic racism."
 

Fantastical

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,356
"While I do not have the experience of ever having been discriminated against because of the color of my skin, I do have the experience of sometimes feeling like a stranger in my own country, turning on the news and seeing my own rights come up for debate, and seeing my rights expanded by a coalition of people like me and people not at all like me," Buttigieg said.
Seems like a reasonable thing to say, imo. Where was this? Did someone ask him a question? Sorry don't have a WaPo sub.
 

Deleted member 2625

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,596
At the same time, a gay cis rich white guy obviously possesses privileges that black people don't have (let alone if they're black and gay/trans
Yes. But at the same time there isn't an argument to not marry black people, "convert" black people, or not teach about black people existing in 2019

it's just different
 

Catshade

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,197
Not an American, but I do hope more cis het men in ethnic/religious minority groups look at racial/religious discriminations against them and reflect on it to empathize more with the plight of LGBTs and women (of all people, but particularly in their own groups).
 

Blue Skies

Banned
Mar 27, 2019
9,224
He didn't say his experience was the same. He just said it helped him understand others more. I don't think there's anything wrong with that.
 

Tbm24

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,157
I don't think what he said was offensive but I don't think he should have said it because he's still a white guy at the end of the day.
At the end of the day, despite being a white male, you don't get to invalidate any struggles he's had to endure for being gay. That's not fair. It's totally fair for him to reflect on it and then try to relate/understand the oppression other groups feel. If you stop the conversation before it even happens then what? What benefit has come out of this?
 
Oct 28, 2017
5,210
I don't have a problem with it. I would like to think growing up as a black man has made me more sympathetic to the issues women deal with. I obviously do not know the exact experiences, but I understand the feeling of being treated so differently.
 

Noog

▲ Legend ▲
Member
May 1, 2018
2,856
Guys, please read what he actually said. I think his comments make sense. I think people who experience discrimination or oppression have an easier understanding what others go through
 

DavidDesu

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
5,718
Glasgow, Scotland
Reading what he said, I see what he's trying to do? Idk, I feel like trying to be nuanced nowadays is such a wasted effort that it's pointless to try.
Yeah. There's a strange race to be the most offended or most put out by someone's words that the reaction bears absolutely no relation to what was said or how it was said. Seems perfectly reasonable for him to say you can understand others better because of people's intolerance towards you, even if for different reasons. He wasn't saying they were alike. I mean come on. We will never progress if a very basic genuine sentiment like this gets taken as offensive.
As you say, subtlety and trying to be subtle or thoughtful these days is a losing game, you'll just end up with super abbreviated tone illiterate headlines that can say all sorts of things you clearly never intended. And people are so quick to jump on that. We'll never get better at this given our technology and mentalities.
 

Deleted member 60295

User requested account closure
Banned
Sep 28, 2019
1,489
Seems perfectly fine to me. And I don't even like Buttigieg. As a gay man, he definitely can relate more to being oppressed than I can, for sure. Cause apart from being on the autism spectrum, I am the walking definition of privilege.
 

peyrin

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,408
California
1) the statement itself is fine
2) the statement however is still rich coming from the guy who is still in the middle of a douglass plan fiasco
 

Deleted member 32563

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 11, 2017
1,336
1.) They're not the same. Period. (The historical context alone, the socio-economics, the institutionalised destabilization...)

2.) Him even nearly saying it was/ is a risk. Being that if you read what he actually said he did not literally say it. But he still could illicit a side eye and it would be arguably deserving.

3.) He's still White.

P.S. saying minorities/various ethnicities should used their situation to identify with the plight of another group is a slippery slope. The dynamics don't work quite like that and I'd extend that vice versa. But I understand.

P.S.S. Who was he hoping to reel in and what type response was he anticipating. Super curious ..?
 
Last edited:

Jon Carter

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,746
He's a wealthy white guy, but he's running for president. He has no choice but to comment on stuff that you would normally want a white guy to just be quiet about and instead listen to people who know first-hand. His statement seems inoffensive enough in that context.
 

Nerokis

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,558
In the abstract, the sentiment is fine, but Buttigieg just isn't the best messenger for it. He grew up privileged, with super educated parents in a middle/upper middle class household; went to the best schools; didn't come out until later in life; generally blended in so seamlessly with his fellow Midwesterners that it wasn't until he moved to Massachusetts, the first state to legalize gay marriage, that he ever felt like an outsider.

This isn't to invalidate the struggles I'm sure he's had, or to disagree that LGBT identity is conducive to empathy for other marginalized communities. Nothing about Buttigieg's actual life experience, though, leads me to believe he's uniquely positioned to understand oppression. Like, the past decade plus of his existence has been walking a ridiculously frictionless and calculated path toward becoming President of the United States.
 

CDX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,476
"While I do not have the experience of ever having been discriminated against because of the color of my skin, I do have the experience of sometimes feeling like a stranger in my own country, turning on the news and seeing my own rights come up for debate, and seeing my rights expanded by a coalition of people like me and people not at all like me," Buttigieg said.

Honestly, I don't have an issue with that statement.

He has plenty of other things that deserve criticism, but I don't see it with this.
 

onyx

Member
Dec 25, 2017
2,520
You don't have to say anything wrong to say the wrong thing. Pete just isn't the right person to give this message and it's not the right way for him to reach out. Doesn't seem like it'll be a big deal since he is not really saying what he is accused of saying.
 

Kirblar

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
30,744
There are a lot of issues with Pete and his campaign on this topic.

This isn't one of them.
 

TheAbsolution

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,387
Atlanta, GA
I concur with most of the thread here. I'm not even the biggest fan of Pete here and even I can see what he was trying to say. I don't think this is really at all offensive, and I say that as pansexual black man.
 

Pooh

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,849
The Hundred Acre Wood
The statement was perfectly fine. There are plenty of things to be upset with Pete about without having to resort to going after a benign statement like that.