PlayStation 5 Confirmed To Sport 8 Cores / 16 Threads CPU; Full Reveal Coming Next Year

Toni

Avenger
Nov 13, 2017
1,851
Orlando, Florida
Nice.The rumor suggested Sony will retail it for 499 while taking around 100$ loss themselves for first few months
PlayStation division is making 3 billions Dollars of pure operating profit in a single year thanks to PSN.

It took a PlayStation 2 or PlayStation 3, 5 to 6 years to generate that kind of profit.

$100 loss will easily be offset by the massive revenue coming in from PSN every quarter until prices come down.
Sony has become price-sensitive this gen. Mainly thanks to the response their audience had with a 399 pricetag.

PSN's profit margins keep growing every quarter / fiscal year thanks to rise of digital Services. If it keeps the same steady growth all the way to Holiday 2020, I've no doubt Sony will absolutely pull the magical "399" for November 2020 and have PSN offset everything else.
 

Seeya

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,639
This is great, current gen CPU is a toaster, that developers surprisingly managed to do pretty impressive stuff on, finally we are getting a well performing CPU next gen.
As limiting as it has been, limitations spawn innovation. We’ve made massive strides in AA And adaptive resolution reconstruction out of necessity’s
 

Segafreak

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,087
Sounds like it's turning out to be the beast everyone was hoping for.

Won’t be the top tier of CPU chips even next year when it releases. Things get cheaper with time and Sony isn’t paying MSRP for the parts. But the boost from the Jaguar will be noticeable especially for console only players.

Expecting something like $500 MSRP. Next year is my time to upgrade my PC and monitor
"noticeable" lol, it's coming from a 2012 tablet cpu (where amazing things have been achieved on ps4) to a monster cpu that's costing +300$ on pc, it's gonna be like a 2 gen leap at once.
 

LegendX48

Member
Oct 25, 2017
742
Reveal next year? But the cpu is already out and I can go buy one from Best Buy right now if I wanted :P
 

orava

Member
Jun 10, 2019
127
Sounds like it's turning out to be the beast everyone was hoping for.


"noticeable" lol, it's coming from a 2012 tablet cpu (where amazing things have been achieved on ps4) to a monster cpu that's costing +300$ on pc, it's gonna be like a 2 gen leap at once.
It's not going to be same part as the PC desktop CPU. The console CPU more likely to be closer to what AMD has developed for mobiles and alike. Still a good bump in performance.
 

Kage Maru

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,615
Not sure why this is surprising. We knew it had 8 cores and no way we're they going to disable SMT.
 

Sandcrawler

Member
Oct 27, 2017
54
Assuming they don't go with a monolithic APU, which I think is reasonable due to the modularity of the Zen architecture with AMD's "Infinity Fabric", I think they could get 3700x chiplets that didn't make the grade for desktop parts pretty cheap. Since AMD is packing 8 cores onto a single Zen chiplet, the die size is pretty small and I imagine they have a pretty big profit margin at $329.

If the GPU is on the same substrate as the CPU (the green part of a CPU/GPU), the cache/memory controller chip would probably be used by both (following PS4's use of hUMA) , which could also save cost.

I'm on team $499 at this point, even with a ~5700 GPU. The only thing is that part costs might not fall so fast in the time leading up to launch because of massive 7nm semiconductor production demand.

Does anyone think they might have multiple SKUs on launch? One with a big SSD and one with a small one? It crossed my mind but multiple SKUs always seems like a mess on launch.
 

Blue Skies

Member
Mar 27, 2019
3,257
I think they should do one base $500
And a VR bundle sold separately.
Will there be a VR2, or will we be stuck with current vr limitations on the PS4?
 

eso76

Member
Dec 8, 2017
2,101
I don't understand being scared by 599; It's a piece of hardware that should last 6/7 years at least (while hopefully providing a significant leap compared to Pro and One X).
That's less than 100$ a year, less than 9$ a month.
It's irrelevant compared to how much you probably spend for the games.
 

Dezzy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
730
USA
Clock speed is important and we don't know that yet, do we? An 8c 16t cpu means nothing if it's 2Ghz. Hoping for 3.5Ghz or so.
 

Segafreak

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,087
It's not going to be same part as the PC desktop CPU. The console CPU more likely to be closer to what AMD has developed for mobiles and alike. Still a good bump in performance.
It will be most likely, maybe lower clocked. AMD doesn't have a 8c/16t mobile Zen cpu. If they can get +300$ class pc gpu's in consoles they can do it for cpu's, it's not 2012 where Sony is forced to choose mobile cpu's once again.

Are you sure about that?
Why wouldn't it be? AMD doesn't have any 8c/16t cpu that's costing less than $300, they're probably gonna clock it to ~3Ghz, have less cache and no boost.
 

metalslimer

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
4,411
I suspect it will be 499. PS4 pro is still 399 and while I'm sure they will price drop it next year it's hard to see there only be $100 difference between the two.
 
Oct 27, 2017
758
I'm hoping the PS5 has a completely redesigned cooling system as well. I love my PS4 Pro, and my fan is mostly quiet but ive read all the PS4 and PS4 Pro horror stories here.
 

Oticon

Member
Oct 30, 2017
585
I posted some of this, and added "I guess they are saying threads and processors aren't the same thing?"

He said - "they're not, I was driving and thinking quickly"

then went ahead to post this -


"thats an 8 core/16 processor cpu from 2016"

"thats 3 years ago, but finding this data is kinda hard"

Edit:


"here is a server CPU from 2012 with 8 cores and 16 threads"

edit 2:

"I'm not too familiar with AMD, but Intel came out with Hyperthreading before AMD came out with CMT"
1.) The Xeon is a server CPU which was around $3000 at launch and the 6900k was $1000 at launch. Both of these CPUs were used in prosumer/enterprise level, not really the general consumer level. You have to remember that even though there are 32 core CPUs available today, it doesn't mean that the general population will have access or use case for them. A 3700x CPU would outpace most consumer PCs out there today.
2.) CMT and hyperthreading is basically the same shit. If you look at benchmarks/performance tests today, CMT implementation is better.
Well it's what we've been hearing for the last couple of years about this gen, isn't it?
The Jaguar cores used in the PS4/Xbox One were dog shit from the beginning. IIRC the core was developed for netbook usage or other low power applications. The 8c/16t Zen 2 CPUs are enthusiast level CPUs today. Of course overtime they other more powerful products will come out but I think the PS5/Xbox One 2 CPUs will actually be able to keep up the pace in 5-6 years.
 

A1an

Member
Oct 26, 2017
790
We need a Digital Foundry on this!

This does sound good now, but what about in five, eight or ten years time, I know it cannot be future proofed that far in advance.

I am keen to know the size of this SSD as games are getting bigger and will get even bigger in the future, it has to be 1TB at least, my PS4 as soon as I got it I took out the 500GB and put in a 1TB SSHD.
 

Toni

Avenger
Nov 13, 2017
1,851
Orlando, Florida
If the price drop with PSNow surges their subscription rate, I can see the PS5 being $399
PlayStation Now is an incredibly small fraction of the empire that PSN has become.

The main drivers are Game and Network Services.

Sony was generating yearly a 3 billion profit return before the PSNow pricedrop. PSN can comfortably offset any hardware losses for PS5.
 

Hawk269

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,566
I wonder how many Cores of the CPU will be dedicated to the OS? I believe with the Xbox One/PS4 that 2 of the 8 Jaguar cores are dedicated to the OS. With the advancements of this CPU, I wonder if they only need 1 core for the OS?
 

Sotha_Sil

Member
Nov 4, 2017
1,622
I guess I'll be retiring my 4-core, 4-thread 6600k in the near future then. Maybe the Zen 3 processors will be out by next-gen.
 

Justified

Member
Oct 25, 2017
729
Atlanta
PlayStation Now is an incredibly small fraction of the empire that PSN has become.

The main drivers are Game and Network Services.

Sony was generating yearly a 3 billion profit return before the PSNow price drop. PSN can comfortably offset any hardware losses for PS5.
True and that was my ultimate point. If Game and Network Services continues and quite possibly becomes bigger. The cost of the console will be easy for them to offset if the consumers are buying the services.

It's basically (or akin) to the Freemium model (of course the console wont be free)
 

Savinowned

Member
Oct 25, 2017
365
Nashville, TN
The Xbox One X was $499 two years ago. I see it very difficult for the PS5 to be under $499 with the this CPU, a beefy GPU (though do we have these specs yet?), an SSD, and a 4K blu ray drive.

EDIT: I forgot about all the tariffs too. How the hell will any of the new consoles be under $499? It just seems impossible.
 
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Reinhard

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,979
I think it will be $599 so they don't have too big of losses. Remember when the PS3 came out, there weren't $999 smart phones or $799 iPads.
 

AtomicShroom

Tools & Automation
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
1,397
We know the console will have a SSD, but will it also have a HDD on top of that? A SSD is already expensive enough as it is, so it probably won't be a very big one (~250 GB is my guess). And knowing how people on here hate having to empty their fridge and swear by keeping every single game they own installed at all times, you'll be lucky if you can manage to hold more than 2 to 5 games on that SSD at any given time. I can't imagine them also including a HDD to hold the leftover games (which will also need time to move over to the SSD whenever you want to play them, by the way). I assume most everyone will need to purchase an external HDD for that purpose? How do people feel about it?
 
Oct 31, 2017
1,339
People thinking Sony will charge $599 for this are nuts. No way Sony does that, max we’ll see is $499 and that’s cutting it too close especially now with the increased competition from Google Stadia. Sony isn’t going to leave any chance that PS5 doesn’t succeed because it lost some of its potential customers to Google and MS. They will eat the extra cost and do whatever it takes to ensure PS5 is extremely competitive. They have PSNow and PSN to fall back on unlike previous gens so they are more flexible in that regard.
 

Md Ray

Member
Oct 29, 2017
135
Chennai, India
Not really. Despite the 8-cores CPU of PlayStation 4 and Xbox One, a 4C/8T CPU is still enough for high-end gaming on PC. 16C is also far from needed right now, maybe in 10 years lol.

But the upgrade to minimum 6C will become necessary next year or in 2021 for high settings.
A 4C/8T CPU is enough because those 8-core Jaguar CPUs on consoles are extremely slow, with terrible IPC, initially designed for low-power mobile devices. Even 4-core i5 CPUs from 2013-14 run circles around them. At the time they were even slower than Intel's Atom processors which were designed to compete with AMD's Jaguars in mobile sector. So naturally, games designed for Jaguar CPUs ran extremely well even on quad-core CPUs with extremely fast IPC. However, this won't be the case for next-gen.

Their Zen 2 CPUs are very potent in terms of IPC, cache, etc. If/when a game is designed to take advantage beyond 8 threads on consoles, it will likely require the same amount of threads/horsepower on PC. In that case, having an equivalent amount of cores/threads in our gaming PCs will help. Ofc, it will depend on dev teams and their goals, I'm not saying that every game will require 16 thread CPU. I believe 6C/12T CPUs will become the minimum required going forward & it should be good for the most part, and 8C/16T will be needed if you're targeting 60+fps for those multiplatform open-world games on PC.

Does an underclocked ryzen in the 3700 family running at 3.2 GHz have more or less the se power consumption as the current PS4 cpu? I'm guessing that, despite probable improvements in the cooling system, they would also want to control how much heat it's generated.
From my rough tests: Ryzen 7 3700X CPU alone consumes about 63W under full load and worst-case scenario being 79W at 3.2 GHz under Prime95 stress test. Keep in mind though that this power consumption results may not be 100% representative of the CPU inside PS5, as it is highly likely that their CPUs will be heavily tuned/clocked lower to meet the console manufacturers' power consumption requirements and as such the max power consumption of the 8C/16T CPU inside consoles may not even be close to what I just found using the desktop counterpart.

How does the CPU performance translate to video games? How much better is it than the Jaguar and what more can be done? I'm trying to gauge how much better this is.
Based on the performance data of Jaguar cores running at 1.6 GHz, and comparing them with Zen 2 8C/16T's performance numbers (assuming they'll be clocked at 3.2 GHz), we have a rough estimation that it will be nearly 7 times better than the Jaguar cores inside base PS4. What can be done with it is up to the devs. I personally would like to see much more interactability with the environments, objects in games, much more accurate physics, destructibility, better animations, densely populated game worlds, and whatnot.

Isn’t 8 cores what we had before on PS4 or am I thinking of 8 gb of ram
We had 8 cores, 8 threads CPU on PS4 (yes, also 8GB of RAM). Now we have a much, much faster 8 cores, with double the thread count, 16 threads CPU on PS5.
 

Kirblar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,658
People thinking Sony will charge $599 for this are nuts. No way Sony does that, max we’ll see is $499 and that’s cutting it too close especially now with the increased competition from Google Stadia. Sony isn’t going to leave any chance that PS5 doesn’t succeed because it lost some of its potential customers to Google and MS. They will eat the extra cost and do whatever it takes to ensure PS5 is extremely competitive. They have PSNow and PSN to fall back on unlike previous gens so they are more flexible in that regard.
Yeah, the last time they did $599 it was a nightmare for them. No chance of that happening.