PlayStation Worldwide Studios |OT Se7en| What's in the box?

TheRealTalker

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,905
I feel nothing about Remedy

next one will be [email protected] being acquired by Facebook

then only a matter of time Sony screws up with BluePoint but at least here they are currently partnering with Sony (for now)
 

gundamkyoukai

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,441
Japan studio is just the result of bad management and budget cut.

They don't have to become Capcom of Square level of big. But what about Atlus ? Monolith ? Platinum games ? Heck you could take the the case of From, they were nobody before Dark Souls . Now ? They are one of the most prestige studios out there.

While JP studios's titles are very unique and even great sometimes they are just too niche. Sony need to invest a lot more...
Hopefully that rumored Horro title will be a step in the right direction.
Japan Studio should have had some IPs of there own and made into teams long ago.
From since the PS2 gen they work on smaller stuff while helping others and that should have change last gen or this gen.
They should have been made into 2 or 3 teams to work on stuff.
Instead of so many small ones doing there own thing or helping out with other pojects from the out side.
 
Oct 31, 2017
5,983
Japan Studio should have had some IPs of there own and made into teams long ago.
From since the PS2 gen they work on smaller stuff while helping others and that should have change last gen or this gen.
They should have been made into 2 or 3 teams to work on stuff.
Instead of so many small ones doing there own thing or helping out with other pojects from the out side.
I might be misunderstanding you, but I think they used to have a bunch of teams working on different games that weren't getting off the ground, but now they're a group or 3 or 4 teams.
 

DigSCCP

Member
Nov 16, 2017
1,924
Ueda left Sony in 2011 and people are whining because he got a multiplatform deal in 2020 ? What the hell is wrong with some of you.
 

Zukkoyaki

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,159
Studio Japan gets a lot of undeserved flak and it seems to boil down to them simply not making the types of games people personally want. I'd argue they had one of the better generations out of Sony's crop in terms of quality and output: Gravity Rush 2, Astro Bot, The Last Guardian and collaborated on Bloodborne, Everybody's Golf, Freedom Wars, etc. Honorable mention to Puppeteer which should have been a PS4 launch title.

Factoring their internal devs and external group, we're probably getting due for their next wave of games and I'm looking forward to it.
 

Pariah

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,346
What is the point of Japan Studio doing the same type of games every other third-party does. Seriously, what is the point.
You're aware that genres or formulas are not restricted compartments. From a single common idea there could be endless interpretations; I don't wish or hope for them to do the same game, but to adapt and mold those proven concepts by their own hands, according to their talents.

At some point during its conception, every game was heavily inspired by others. Horizon: Zero Dawn is the result of applying original work on the ideas used by developers behind Monster Hunter or The Witcher; Uncharted evolved from traditional action-platformer in the vein of classic Tomb Raider to include a prominent over-the-shoulder camera and cover system after Resident Evil 4 and Kill Switch respectively popularized both systems. When Gravity Rush introduced its floating mechanic, it was following in the footsteps of the many developers who had toyed with similar concepts from different points of execution.

In short, Sony studios all around the world have been already doing the same type of games every other company does, for decades, because that's how any creative industry works. Why should Sony Japan be now the exception? Most of all, why, when their efforts have not worked commercially at the level of their Western counterparts for many years? This is a business, after all. Even in a casual conversation, like this one we're having, I think if something doesn't seem to be doing as good as it could, then contemplating alternatives is not an unreasonable attitude. Insisting on doing the same wouldn't be my ideal course of action.
 

gundamkyoukai

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,441
I might be misunderstanding you, but I think they used to have a bunch of teams working on different games that weren't getting off the ground, but now they're a group or 3 or 4 teams.
I remember that was the plan before this gen started but there out put just seem to weak again this gen.
Even more so when you look at that they suppose to be 250 plus people if i remember right .
 

Kolx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,639
One thing for sure: with Epic, Facebook and Stadia going ham on acquisition and partnerships, Sony 2nd party is going to look a lot more anemic than this gen.

You’d think Sony will try and secure some of their 2nd party studios before they lose them but nope. Hopefully their gamble on expanding their existing 1st party works out cuz if not then welp.
 

Nightengale

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,945
Malaysia
I mean, to be absolutely certain - I'd love it if Sony had chosen to fund Ueda's next game. ( and it could very much be that they were open to it, but Epic gave a better deal )

But that is on the assumption that Ueda would not have been able to develop the kind of game he'd like had it been another publisher, given his development history.

With Epic opening their wallets and using their Fortnite Bux to give what appears to be one of the best, if not the best publishing deals out there ( IP ownership, full funding, 50% profit sharing ) - it's a huge boon for developers. And no, I would not want Sony or any publisher to get into a bidding war with Epic just for the sake of 'securing Ueda' just for the sake of an exclusive when Epic's funding was going to have it come to Playstation anyway.

I'd rather the resources go to a developer who needs it.
 
Oct 31, 2017
5,983
I remember that was the plan before this gen started but there out put just seem to weak again this gen.
Even more so when you look at that they suppose to be 250 plus people if i remember right .
Their output seemed a lot better to me this gen compared to last gen. At a minimum, there seemed to be more organization. Though I think it's better to start from 2013 when the first wave came out after restructuring.

2013: Soul Sacrifice, Rain, Puppeteer, Knack, The Playroom,
2014: Destiny of Spirits, Oreshika: Tainted Bloodlines, Freedom Wars, Soul Sacrifice Delta
2015: Bloodborne (jointly with From Software)
2016: The Tomorrow Children, The Last Guardian
2017: No Heroes Allowed! VR, Gravity Rush 2, Everybody's Golf, Knack II, The Last Guardian VR 20-min demo, The Playroom VR
2018: Astro Bot Rescue Mission, Deracine
2019: Everybody's Golf VR

I feel like the next few years will be bring quite a bit from them considering their output in 2017/2018 in particular. We can safely assume since 2019 that they're all working on next-gen titles.
 
Oct 31, 2017
5,983
One thing for sure: with Epic, Facebook and Stadia going ham on acquisition and partnerships, Sony 2nd party is going to look a lot more anemic than this gen.

You’d think Sony will try and secure some of their 2nd party studios before they lose them but nope. Hopefully their gamble on expanding their existing 1st party works out cuz if not then welp.
A few problems with this logic:

1. They're creating a new studio, they launched new studios already this gen, and they recently bought Insomniac Games, which people keep forgetting is an efficient developer. It's already provably false that they haven't tried to expand their first party when they said they would, and they have.
2. This assumes there are only, like, five developers they can work on. There are hundreds upon hundreds of developers looking for funding that people don't know about. Who knew much about Iron Man VR's developer? Or Predator's? Did anyone know about Guerrilla before the PS2 days? Or Media Molecule before PS3?
 

gundamkyoukai

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,441
Their output seemed a lot better to me this gen compared to last gen. At a minimum, there seemed to be more organization. Though I think it's better to start from 2013 when the first wave came out after restructuring.

2013: Soul Sacrifice, Rain, Puppeteer, Knack, The Playroom,
2014: Destiny of Spirits, Oreshika: Tainted Bloodlines, Freedom Wars, Soul Sacrifice Delta
2015: Bloodborne (jointly with From Software)
2016: The Tomorrow Children, The Last Guardian
2017: No Heroes Allowed! VR, Gravity Rush 2, Everybody's Golf, Knack II, The Last Guardian VR 20-min demo, The Playroom VR
2018: Astro Bot Rescue Mission, Deracine
2019: Everybody's Golf VR

I feel like the next few years will be bring quite a bit from them considering their output in 2017/2018 in particular. We can safely assume since 2019 that they're all working on next-gen titles.
The thing is about half of those games they made with other people so i would really call it there out put alone .
IMO if Bend can be 60 plus people and grow to 130 and make DG Japan studio should have been able to so the same with new IPs for this gen .
 
Oct 31, 2017
5,983
The thing is about half of those games they made with other people so i would really call it there out put alone .
IMO if Bend can be 60 plus people and grow to 130 and make DG Japan studio should have been able to so the same with new IPs for this gen .
Ehh, you have to also consider that they've always collaborated with other developers. Dark Cloud's a good example of a Sony Japan game that they worked on with a different developer. Demon's Souls is another.
 

Bundy

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,121
A few problems with this logic:

1. They're creating a new studio, they launched new studios already this gen, and they recently bought Insomniac Games, which people keep forgetting is an efficient developer. It's already provably false that they haven't tried to expand their first party when they said they would, and they have.
What people are forgetting too is that Sony closed a lot of studios like Evolution Studios, Bigbig Studios, Cambridge Studio, Studio Liverpool, Manchester Studio, etc.
Jim Ryan said "content is more important than ever". He is right. Getting exclusives from 3rd parties is too expensive these days. And indie studios are getting bought left and right from Google, MS, Facebook, etc.
It's time to get a few more studios. I'm still waiting.
 

TheJollyCorner

The Fallen
Nov 7, 2017
3,515
Their output seemed a lot better to me this gen compared to last gen. At a minimum, there seemed to be more organization. Though I think it's better to start from 2013 when the first wave came out after restructuring.

2013: Soul Sacrifice, Rain, Puppeteer, Knack, The Playroom,
2014: Destiny of Spirits, Oreshika: Tainted Bloodlines, Freedom Wars, Soul Sacrifice Delta
2015: Bloodborne (jointly with From Software)
2016: The Tomorrow Children, The Last Guardian
2017: No Heroes Allowed! VR, Gravity Rush 2, Everybody's Golf, Knack II, The Last Guardian VR 20-min demo, The Playroom VR
2018: Astro Bot Rescue Mission, Deracine
2019: Everybody's Golf VR

I feel like the next few years will be bring quite a bit from them considering their output in 2017/2018 in particular. We can safely assume since 2019 that they're all working on next-gen titles.
God I miss The Tomorrow Children.

Dylan... your child was too beautiful for this cruel world! :((
 

Stygr

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,210
There are publishers out there willing to publish and fund titles made by external developers and they don't demand the IP from studios, when Sony is only willing to find your game if they own the IP.

We are in a generation when IP ownership is vital for a lot of developers and some of them were burn out during last gen when they made a successful title but the IP now belongs to a publisher and they can't do a lot.

It is not surprising seeing Epic Games, 2K, Warner Bros and even Activision being open with finding title and letting developers own the IP and I guess this is a much better deal than giving up your IP entirely.
 

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
40,473
There's this tiny company called Insomniac that was added that produces more than Remedy.

The concern trolling is off the charts, but that's what these threads turn into every time corporate purchases happen.
The thing about Insomniac is that they're a known quantity and already have games they're making for Sony. If you aren't excited about sequels to Ratchet and Spider-Man, what's the big deal about Insom?

That's why I'm saying Sony needs new teams - not because they don't HAVE ANY teams, but because they need to add more new ideas and new IPs to cover areas they aren't covering right now.
 

Nightengale

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,945
Malaysia
There are publishers out there willing to publish and fund titles made by external developers and they don't demand the IP from studios, when Sony is only willing to find your game if they own the IP.
To be fair, it's not like it's an infallible rule.

Sony of the past would never have funded Spider-Man or Predator, both games where they don't own the IP. Or Death Stranding, which clearly had PC in the dotted line from day one, even with IP ownership.
 

gundamkyoukai

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,441
Ehh, you have to also consider that they've always collaborated with other developers. Dark Cloud's a good example of a Sony Japan game that they worked on with a different developer. Demon's Souls is another.
That was my point .
They should have stop that and build up there self internally.
Form teams and get a culture going instead they were made to work with other directors \people.
If you look at all of Sony other studios you see new talent and leaders over the years not so for Studio Japan and they have the numbers .
 

Stygr

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,210
To be fair, it's not like it's an infallible rule.

Sony of the past would never have funded Spider-Man or Predator, both games where they don't own the IP. Or Death Stranding, which clearly had PC in the dotted line from day one, even with IP ownership.
They don't own the IP, but they licensed the proprieties, they own them right now for X years.
Death Stranding is the exception tho.
 
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Zukkoyaki

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,159
I'll pose a question:

After the almost guaranteed Spider-Man and Ratchet sequels, what would everyone like to see Insomniac work on?

I'd love to see them revisit the cancelled Monster Knight concept. Such a cool idea that seemed overly ambitious for the early PS2 era. I'd love to have more family-friendly but genuinely great games kind of like Ratchet.
 
Oct 25, 2017
7,494
If Sony isn't interested in maintaining a level of quality out of their Japanese teams that equals the level of quality people expect out of their Western teams, why even have a Japanese wing at all?
This I agree with. There is absolutely no reason or excuse for Japan Studio to be so utterly mediocre outside of piss poor management. If it is by design it's a pathetic design.
 
Oct 17, 2019
1,268
I'll pose a question:

After the almost guaranteed Spider-Man and Ratchet sequels, what would everyone like to see Insomniac work on?

I'd love to see them revisit the cancelled Monster Knight concept. Such a cool idea that seemed overly ambitious for the early PS2 era. I'd love to have more family-friendly but genuinely great games kind of like Ratchet.
New IP and another crack at Sunset Overdrive (don't @ me, let me dream)
 

Bundy

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,121
I'll pose a question:

After the almost guaranteed Spider-Man and Ratchet sequels, what would everyone like to see Insomniac work on?

I'd love to see them revisit the cancelled Monster Knight concept. Such a cool idea that seemed overly ambitious for the early PS2 era. I'd love to have more family-friendly but genuinely great games kind of like Ratchet.
I guess their AAA games will be Spider-Man related next gen. So I hope we will get some games from them from a Ratchet & Clank-sized team (~40 - 50 devs maybe?). I think they could make a great arcade racer like Sony's Rollcage. Something like that. You don't need a huge budget / a lot of devs to make a nice arcade racer.
We both know this IP is dead, son 😉
 

Kamaros

Member
Aug 29, 2018
1,665
I'll pose a question:

After the almost guaranteed Spider-Man and Ratchet sequels, what would everyone like to see Insomniac work on?

I'd love to see them revisit the cancelled Monster Knight concept. Such a cool idea that seemed overly ambitious for the early PS2 era. I'd love to have more family-friendly but genuinely great games kind of like Ratchet.
although i liked the concept, i really would like they to work on Sunset Overdrive 2 :)
 

NKnight7

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,567
I'll pose a question:

After the almost guaranteed Spider-Man and Ratchet sequels, what would everyone like to see Insomniac work on?

I'd love to see them revisit the cancelled Monster Knight concept. Such a cool idea that seemed overly ambitious for the early PS2 era. I'd love to have more family-friendly but genuinely great games kind of like Ratchet.
Honestly? Sunset Overdrive 2.
 

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
40,473
I'll pose a question:

After the almost guaranteed Spider-Man and Ratchet sequels, what would everyone like to see Insomniac work on?

I'd love to see them revisit the cancelled Monster Knight concept. Such a cool idea that seemed overly ambitious for the early PS2 era. I'd love to have more family-friendly but genuinely great games kind of like Ratchet.
Probably something completely new. Dunno what I would want out of them though, because honestly I'm kind of at capacity for Western third person action games and I don't know if I'm ever going to be particularly interested in more of them.
 
Oct 25, 2017
7,494
Studio Japan gets a lot of undeserved flak and it seems to boil down to them simply not making the types of games people personally want. I'd argue they had one of the better generations out of Sony's crop in terms of quality and output: Gravity Rush 2, Astro Bot, The Last Guardian and collaborated on Bloodborne, Everybody's Golf, Freedom Wars, etc. Honorable mention to Puppeteer which should have been a PS4 launch title.

Factoring their internal devs and external group, we're probably getting due for their next wave of games and I'm looking forward to it.
Mediocrity is mediocrity. Outside of Astro Bot they have not made an impacful game on their own since when?
 
Oct 31, 2017
5,983
What people are forgetting too is that Sony closed a lot of studios like Evolution Studios, Bigbig Studios, Cambridge Studio, Studio Liverpool, Manchester Studio, etc.
Jim Ryan said "content is more important than ever". He is right. Getting exclusives from 3rd parties is too expensive these days. And indie studios are getting bought left and right from Google, MS, Facebook, etc.
It's time to get a few more studios. I'm still waiting.
Nobody forgot that, but they've closed studios before this gen. That's not new. Even some of those you mentioned were studios they also bought before; it's not like they were 4-gen mainstays and numbers have done nothing but dwindle.

You're also not waiting considering Insomniac wasn't that long ago. I'm gonna go out on a limb and assume that wasn't it considering they bought Insomniac without telegraphing their moves to us while they were doing it.

The thing about Insomniac is that they're a known quantity and already have games they're making for Sony. If you aren't excited about sequels to Ratchet and Spider-Man, what's the big deal about Insom?

That's why I'm saying Sony needs new teams - not because they don't HAVE ANY teams, but because they need to add more new ideas and new IPs to cover areas they aren't covering right now.
No wonder this board scares away insiders. I can't imagine thinking I'd be able to openly talk about things I'm working on when I read your posts about trying to find an unknown quantity that isn't currently making games for Sony that is making new IPs you don't know about and is working on new ideas but not the new ideas Insomniac tackled already and the new ideas need to be made by a company that's an unknown quantity, which is the only way it'd be a big deal.
 

Kolx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,639
A few problems with this logic:

1. They're creating a new studio, they launched new studios already this gen, and they recently bought Insomniac Games, which people keep forgetting is an efficient developer. It's already provably false that they haven't tried to expand their first party when they said they would, and they have.
2. This assumes there are only, like, five developers they can work on. There are hundreds upon hundreds of developers looking for funding that people don't know about. Who knew much about Iron Man VR's developer? Or Predator's? Did anyone know about Guerrilla before the PS2 days? Or Media Molecule before PS3?
They closed as many studios as they opened this gen (and that’s assuming there’s a new studio working with VASG on a new AAA game).


As for the 2nd points it doesn’t matter how many studios there’re out there. Great studios on the level Sony is looking for (able to make good games with high production values) are not common at all. Insomniac sold for +200 million without owning anything of value because of their reputation.

There’s only one Ueda. There’s only one Miyazaki. You can’t just ask a random studio to make a AAA game for you. Sony initiative in China has been mostly average to bad so far. If you want a studio that doesn’t need 10 years of nurturing and multiple games before they make a great game (that’s IF they do), you need to start securing studios who already can.