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Pokémon Sword and Shield: Spoiler, leaks and datamine thread (Discussion guidelines in OP)

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Scraftyko

Member
Oct 25, 2017
801
If anything, the sales taking a hit might be the only thing getting TPC to examine their handle of the franchise, only because they have to answer to investors and owners (Nintendo?).
Realistically, this won't affect their sales numbers significantly. Even if tens of thousands of hardcore fans boycott the game, that's just a drop in the bucket compared to the millions of casual fans, kids, and new players who don't know/care about the controversies and are going to buy it regardless.

Plus, and this is just an educated guess, but I don't even think the games are the franchise's primary moneymakers anymore? The amount they rake in from the anime, manga, toys, plushies, and merchandising deals probably dwarf the games' sales, and those are going to remain steady even if the games become irredeemable trash.
 

Mzril

Member
Oct 26, 2017
164
Are you asking game freak to balance a roster of 800+ creatures are you for real? Like can you even begin to imagine the amount of variables and interactions you have to consider plus the amount of time ud have to take to balance that amount of mons?
Again this can be solved by with

1. Creating 2 environments, one for the regional dex and one for the national dex. Hell just creating one for regional dex only would be a great start.
2. Limiting official tournaments like VGC to regional dex only.

This ensures a more balance-able and interesting meta while allowing people that want to play with all Pokemon the ability to play with all Pokemon. Sure it takes a lot more resources, but you only need to balance regional dex.
 

ze_

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,032
If anything, the sales taking a hit might be the only thing getting TPC to examine their handle of the franchise, only because they have to answer to investors and owners (Nintendo?).
The games are made in partnership with Nintendo. The Poke Ball Plus was a Nintendo thing. They've said that the Dex decision was a decision reached between GF, TPC, and Nintendo. Game Freak is not working in isolation.
Realistically, this won't affect their sales numbers significantly. Even if tens of thousands of hardcore fans boycott the game, that's just a drop in the bucket compared to the millions of casual fans, kids, and new players who don't know/care about the controversies and are going to buy it regardless.

Plus, and this is just an educated guess, but I don't even think the games are the franchise's primary moneymakers anymore? The amount they rake in from the anime, manga, toys, plushies, and merchandising deals probably dwarf the games' sales, and those are going to remain steady even if the games become irredeemable trash.
 

Mzril

Member
Oct 26, 2017
164
Again this can be solved by with

1. Creating 2 environments for online play, one for the regional dex and one for the national dex. Hell just creating one for regional dex only would be a great start.
2. Limiting official tournaments like VGC to regional dex only.

This ensures a more balance-able and interesting meta while allowing people that want to play with all Pokemon the ability to play with all Pokemon. Sure it takes a lot more resources, but you only need to balance regional dex.
 

arlu

Member
Nov 1, 2017
186
Venezuela
Realistically, this won't affect their sales numbers significantly. Even if tens of thousands of hardcore fans boycott the game, that's just a drop in the bucket compared to the millions of casual fans, kids, and new players who don't know/care about the controversies and are going to buy it regardless.

Plus, and this is just an educated guess, but I don't even think the games are the franchise's primary moneymakers anymore? The amount they rake in from the anime, manga, toys, plushies, and merchandising deals probably dwarf the games' sales, and those are going to remain steady even if the games become irredeemable trash.
I think you're right about that they have diversifed their sources of income, but ultimately, if the game's aren't (as) popular, they can't generate interest in the anime or sell the new toys and plushes. Also, I'm sure Switch's sales expectations have been projected taking in consideration the release of this games. I don't expect them to fail, nor I don't want it to, just wished they had better handle the situation so this mess was not happening.

Oh, thanks for posting that Tweet, very interesting.
 

Scraftyko

Member
Oct 25, 2017
801
Figured as much. Yeah, a boycott ain't doing squat so long as kids and fans keeping shelling out for merch and such.
I think you're right about that they have diversifed their sources of income, but ultimately, if the game's aren't (as) popular, they can't generate interest in the anime or sell the new toys and plushes. Also, I'm sure Switch's sales expectations have been projected taking in consideration the release of this games. I don't expect them to fail, nor I don't want it to, just wished they had better handle the situation so this mess was not happening.
At the end of the day, the true villain here is the poor working conditions for game devs. Based on all the knowledge we have about GF, they're overworked, understaffed, and forced to meet harsh deadlines thanks to their status as a cog in the massive machine that is Pokemon. Had they more time and resources perhaps they could've made a bigger and better game without having to sacrifice anything, but TCPI/Nintendo's weird insistence on keeping the team and budget small meant that compromises were inevitable.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,957
Figured as much. Yeah, a boycott ain't doing squat so long as kids and fans keeping shelling out for merch and such.

At the end of the day, the true villain here is the poor working conditions for game devs. Based on all the knowledge we have about GF, they're overworked, understaffed, and forced to meet harsh deadlines thanks to their status as a cog in the massive machine that is Pokemon. Had they more time and resources perhaps they could've made a bigger and better game without having to sacrifice anything, but TCPI/Nintendo's weird insistence on keeping the team and budget small meant that compromises were inevitable.
nintendo cant tell a third party dev how big their team should be...
 

JaredG

Member
May 17, 2018
1,606
Why people still act like the art director is responsible for all the Pokemon designs in a gen is beyond me. This is the only time a Pokemon game's art director has gotten so much scrutiny and it's literally only because they put him in a direct and told us he was the art director.
 

Greywaren

Member
Jul 16, 2019
1,485
Why people still act like the art director is responsible for all the Pokemon designs in a gen is beyond me. This is the only time a Pokemon game's art director has gotten so much scrutiny and it's literally only because they put him in a direct and told us he was the art director.
As far as I know, he gets the final word on which designs move into the final product, so he is kind of responsible.

That being said, if this is getting more scrutiny than usual it's because of all the other issues people have with the games. They're just piling stuff up at this point.
 

Big One

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,604
I know this is sacrilige to say but honestly I still consider Gen 2 to be the weakest generation when it comes to Pokemon designs. Gen 8 is still better imo.
 

Odeko

The Fallen
Mar 22, 2018
4,641
Midwestern America

PancakeFlip

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,212
Figured as much. Yeah, a boycott ain't doing squat so long as kids and fans keeping shelling out for merch and such.

At the end of the day, the true villain here is the poor working conditions for game devs. Based on all the knowledge we have about GF, they're overworked, understaffed, and forced to meet harsh deadlines thanks to their status as a cog in the massive machine that is Pokemon. Had they more time and resources perhaps they could've made a bigger and better game without having to sacrifice anything, but TCPI/Nintendo's weird insistence on keeping the team and budget small meant that compromises were inevitable.
It's not really about the sales. Let's say they keep releasing games with less and less content and a vocal minority keeps getting more upset and controlling most of the online narative. This is obviously a n extreme "what if" scenario, but eventually they would literally need real shills to keep their positive media presence online sustainable years down the line. There's a reason they basically had Ash obliterate the Alola league despite the majority of viewers probably not even caring about what happened in Kalos. Reports of the show having Ash lose again, and articles asking what's going on with the writers etc are dangerous to public image which needs to be maintained for longevity.
 

Brock Reiher

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,717
some of the designs I don't care for as much (a lot of the officially revealed ones actually) but the only truly bad ones are the squirrels.
 

mnk

Member
Nov 11, 2017
991
I know this is sacrilige to say but honestly I still consider Gen 2 to be the weakest generation when it comes to Pokemon designs. Gen 8 is still better imo.
I put both 2 and 3 down at the bottom. I can't properly place 8 until I can see the Pokemon in motion, but at the moment I'm guessing it'll land in 4th or 5th for me.
 

Scraftyko

Member
Oct 25, 2017
801
It's not really about the sales. Let's say they keep releasing games with less and less content and a vocal minority keeps getting more upset and controlling most of the online narative. This is obviously a n extreme "what if" scenario, but eventually they would literally need real shills to keep their positive media presence online sustainable years down the line. There's a reason they basically had Ash obliterate the Alola league despite the majority of viewers probably not even caring about what happened in Kalos. Reports of the show having Ash lose again, and articles asking what's going on with the writers etc are dangerous to public image which needs to be maintained for longevity.
Oh sure, eventually, but I think in the short term it's not going to mean much if anything. If several generations down the line we're still having these same conversations then perhaps something would have to be done, but as of right now all the sound and fury basically amounts to a sneeze in the wind. I'm mostly just speaking to the delusional folks who seem to think that it's even possible to organize a boycott strong enough to harm GameFreak or Pokemon as a brand; if the Satanic Panic couldn't dent the series, then a bunch of folks mad online sure as hell can't.
 

goodretina

Member
Dec 30, 2018
246
I hate the dex cut but like the graphics and new Pokémon designs. Everything this generation seems to be doing right is being overshadowed by removing more than half of the Pokémon.

The sales will be fine and the IP will continue to make tons of money. The chances of a significant change to the games based on feedback are slim.
 

Birdie

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,699
I think the issue with Gen II is that there's a lot of ho-hum designs mixed with Pokemon that don't have any in-game usage to make up for it. No unique moves, Abilities, etc.

Also the fact many of them were hidden in GSC (some available via random Swarms or Kanto) didn't help.

I think it's telling most of the more beloved GS Pokemon are those related to classics or good like T-Tar.
 

Greywaren

Member
Jul 16, 2019
1,485
I hate the dex cut but like the graphics and new Pokémon designs. Everything this generation seems to be doing right is being overshadowed by removing more than half of the Pokémon.

The sales will be fine and the IP will continue to make tons of money. The chances of a significant change to the games based on feedback are slim.
I'm shocked at the fact that most people are straight up ignoring the "game" and dumping all their rage and frustration on the post-game (or lack thereof). I get that some people don't care about the story, but you can't claim a game is lacking in content if you ignore a HUGE chunk of that content.
 

cainhxrst

Member
Nov 10, 2018
774
I hate the dex cut but like the graphics and new Pokémon designs. Everything this generation seems to be doing right is being overshadowed by removing more than half of the Pokémon.

The sales will be fine and the IP will continue to make tons of money. The chances of a significant change to the games based on feedback are slim.
eh this is a common misconception for some reason. Despite the games selling well, gamefreak does implement changes based on playerbase feedback as far as we've seen. A lot of changes in Sw/Sh are direct responses to critiques made towards sun/moon (skippable cutscenes, more open route design, characters being more expressive)

Of course, something that was as big of a decision as the nat dex removal may not be back-tracked on
 

Mr-Joker

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,345
i personally think a number of them look like Yokai.
Some of the older Pokémon are based on Yokai, so I feel that this argument doesn't work in regards to the newer Pokémon.

As far as I know, he gets the final word on which designs move into the final product, so he is kind of responsible.

That being said, if this is getting more scrutiny than usual it's because of all the other issues people have with the games. They're just piling stuff up at this point.
Not when it comes to Pokémon design as that is presented to a group of panel and they quiz the creator detail about the Pokémon.

Plus being the art directer also means being responsible for the non Pokémon stuff like the human design and the over world, which he nailed bang on.
 
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