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Pokémon Sword & Shield Spoiler, Leak and Datamine Thread 2 | Page 401 (Update: Datamining has begun)
- Thread starter Atheerios
- Start date
The guy gets a lot of undue hate. I mean, he seemingly dedicated a large part of his life to the fandom and created what may be one of the most inconic video game fan sites of all time. Of course he's invested in liking pokemon as a series.
DQ11's problems are no where near Pokemon's from what we've seen. It is technically competent, with a much bigger, much more detailed world. Not to mention better animations, and more content. The only area Pokemon is clearly better in terms of production quality is music, and that has nothing to do with Square's ability as a developer.
I'm honestly surprised the anger has continued for this long, thought it would have cooled off for now.
I'm glad though, since it's gonna sell this is the only thing we can do.
It's good to give Gamefreak or any dev the benefit of the doubt & not just say "well they want to sell a 3rd version with the full Dex back" But im thinking it is just that, balance issues are something GF never worried about, Mega Rayquaza might as well have been Goku.
If they were new models i might pick this up, but reusing models & cutting many Pokemon (including my boy Heracross) makes me want to wait for Gun version or whatever.
It gets renewed as we get new info. Having undeniable proof of the reused models was enough to start the fire again.
The leaks have been an absolute shitshow and killed much of the momentum the games have generated. They will sell well, there is no question. But a company like Nintendo is not happy with this sort of stuff whatsoever. It is complete brand poison.
There are 726 monsters in DQXI, and they all have a staggering amount of animations. Be absurdly generous and say 200 are recolours - that's still insane. It'll sell 1/3 of what this game does.
Iunno, I just completely disagree with comparing these two. Outside of music, it's a massacre for Pokemon in every other category.
yep it should be 4 years as we have things like dlc and online content updates in this day and age to keep the hardcore from getting thirsty. Gamefreak needs to take notes from rockstar and how rockstar runs its gta franchise. Gamefreak needs to never hold back and go all in on the single player experience and content and have a great online filled with features and extras. I dont ever want to see another lets go game and they should only have one remake at most per console gen. Id prefer no remakes all together though.
I don't disagree. Just commenting how a few of my problems with DQXI are kinda similar, even if DQXI is likely a much better game (for reference, XI S is my favorite game of the year so far, so I'm not hating).
I wouldn't mind Pokémon keeping a smaller scale if they fixed the problems with the world design (make it more interesting, with more paths, etc) and post-game content.
I'm not saying Pokémon is better, far from it. And do they really have that many monsters? Maybe the bosses not being unique and the remixed dungeons gave me more that impression, just felt like the game was reusing too much stuff while other entries feel insanely huge in scope.
I would have purchased the game by now, jank and all, if the content looked anything like NDS era, especially HGSS and BW2.
I would take a game with 200 Pokemon if it meant a mainline game would have the depth and scale of a modern RPG.
I'm a bit bewildered at how the models issue became such a sticking point for so many people. Graphical fidelity, removal of features, general game design choices and trends, these are all concrete things you can take issue with.
The pokemon models don't inherently make the game worse. The dex culling isnt that bad in theory but it seems the game doesnt really make up for that aspect in other areas. Criticize the game itself for not improving quality in other ways. Getting mad about models is missing the point i think.
Its especially bad when its a bunch of people talking about programming and game dev when 99.9% of them don't have a clue about those fields and have never had to work in a real professional environment where time/money/resources are limited.
The pokemon models don't inherently make the game worse. The dex culling isnt that bad in theory but it seems the game doesnt really make up for that aspect in other areas. Criticize the game itself for not improving quality in other ways. Getting mad about models is missing the point i think.
Its especially bad when its a bunch of people talking about programming and game dev when 99.9% of them don't have a clue about those fields and have never had to work in a real professional environment where time/money/resources are limited.
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Dragon Quest has a lot of pallette swaps. Technically if we count them we should count shiny Pokémon
They fooled me tbh, some comparison pics, they do look better. Lighting & HD res changes a lot.
Really it's fine to reuse models, who cares, but why cut so many of them, makes me want to throw down $60 less.
The proof to me was when they had 153 Pokemon fully done and usable in Lets Go but chose to exclude and lock out tons of them from Sword and Shield. I can understand not wanting them in the Galar Dex, but not making them compatible/transferable into these games? That just really rubbed me the wrong way and was basically saying they are looking for more ways to squeeze money out of fans
Let's not forget that models are more than just wireframes.
Now it does look like the models are derivatives of the old ones, which makes sense but clearly aren't brand new.
What I want is clarification by what Game Freak meant in the interviews. I do need to remind people they never specified all models. However, we may never know what actually happened and it's really hard to say if anything went wrong in the process by just looking at the end product.
I want more information before I pass judgement
Now it does look like the models are derivatives of the old ones, which makes sense but clearly aren't brand new.
What I want is clarification by what Game Freak meant in the interviews. I do need to remind people they never specified all models. However, we may never know what actually happened and it's really hard to say if anything went wrong in the process by just looking at the end product.
I want more information before I pass judgement
Do we triple the DQXI number because they made two different versions for the 3DS and 2D mode too >.>?
It's weird we even immediately went to the models thing. There's so much more to the games, and they're where Pokemon is falling behind. I don't even care they reused the models, they still look good outside of the animations.
I'm pretty sure it's because Game Freak very plainly lied in regards to the models. So it's less about the scale of the problem, and more about the discourse of Game Freak.
According to some online if you discount recolors there are probably 200-300 unique monsters in the game, which i feel is pretty reasonable for the apparent scale.
So no story details, but just wondering, did Bede turned out well as an jerk rival? XD Loved him the moment he was revealed, and he does have a great battle theme.
People don't care that the models are reused, they care that they were told that they were told they were made brand new and the new animations would be worth cutting the dex. The anger is largely at GameFreak's inability to communicate.
Yeah, it's a fair number. Just wondering then why they didn't make unique bosses then. Some bosses in all DQ games show up later recolored as normal enemies, but in XI I think like only 2 or 3 are truly unique, which is weird.
Anyway, I stand corrected on that point then.
I have to admit that LGPE is probably the single biggest discredit to the Reddit rumor imo. If there was an issue with model importing, why did LG get out unscathed? And even if we were to ignore that, why isn't the Galar Dex mostly Kanto if that's the gen that's completely imported?
Different engines. Still the biggest thing against the Reddit rumor is the Little Town Hero part lol.
This is incredibly disingenous. They said they had to make models from scratch as an excuse because they did not have time to add every Pokemon or because they just don't want to keep this unsustainable model going on in the future. They clearly lied, not only with this, and you even admitted to it in the past. There is no hidden story here, or at least one that will put TPC in a good light.
So basically they're Telltale?
This is a very large chunk of Pokemon discourse going back several generations now yeah. Would it kill them to be sincere?
Just want to remind people as to what was actually said in the interview, then I'm going to go on my way as I don't want to be called a shill for "defending" when I'm explaining or not wanting to pass judgement until we have a full story
I just want the full story before I start complaining
If GameFreak, Creatures, or whoever else really screwed the pooch on the model transitions, I honestly doubt they would ever be transparent about it. "Yeah, the intern spilled coffee on the computer and we lost 3 months worth of translating models to HD." (hyperbole but you get my point)
I do think there are going to be meetings held about how to handle PR going forward because this is going to get worse before it gets better. I'm curious what happens. I hope cooler heads prevail.
If there's one thing I love about the Pokemon community nowadays is that it seems to have mellowed out A LOT when it comes to hating on new Pokemon designs. Any pushback these newest Pokemon might be getting is nothing compared to how it often used to be. I feel like its a shift that started during the 3DS era and keeps getting better with people willing to defend even the most unlikely of mons. It was at its worst from gen 3 to 5, I think.
The gen 3 mons got hated on at first due to having a very different style compared to the original two gens, although I believe the hate toward these designs mellowed out way quicker than the others. While the regular gen 4 mons seemed to get pretty positive reception from the get go, a lot of the cross gen evos were pretty much endlessly hated on and sometimes I wonder if that negative reception is what caused cross gen evos to stop being a thing. Gen 5 is gen 5, oh no ice cream cones and all that, but the hatred toward the gen 5 mons has really turned around in recent years.
Gen 6 has easily some of my most favorite modern Pokemon designs, if not some of my most favorites ever. It just seems like they kinda got forgotten due to gen 6 ending up being kinda forgettable itself. Gen 7 seems to have easily some of the most well received and popular Pokemon of the modern era, it's just too bad that the games they are supposed to star in seemed to do everything it could to make them hard to find.
The gen 3 mons got hated on at first due to having a very different style compared to the original two gens, although I believe the hate toward these designs mellowed out way quicker than the others. While the regular gen 4 mons seemed to get pretty positive reception from the get go, a lot of the cross gen evos were pretty much endlessly hated on and sometimes I wonder if that negative reception is what caused cross gen evos to stop being a thing. Gen 5 is gen 5, oh no ice cream cones and all that, but the hatred toward the gen 5 mons has really turned around in recent years.
Gen 6 has easily some of my most favorite modern Pokemon designs, if not some of my most favorites ever. It just seems like they kinda got forgotten due to gen 6 ending up being kinda forgettable itself. Gen 7 seems to have easily some of the most well received and popular Pokemon of the modern era, it's just too bad that the games they are supposed to star in seemed to do everything it could to make them hard to find.
That's fine, just saying everyone else has the right to complain and saying "they never specified all models" is moving goal posts as it's finest.
Thats why I turn off the battle animations in every Pokemon game I play.
Yeah, it's real. I believe the same animation happens during Fury Attack, and probably others as well. Tail Whip just pivots the model in the middle and moves sideways too.
There *are* some really great animations though, such as Cinderace's signature move. It looks legitimately great.
We've seen the Double Kick animation since June. However there are many great animations
I do that so battles go by more quickly. It used to bother me as a kid, so I left animations on. As an an adult, it usually cuts the length of battles in half, so it stays off. I don't have infinite time as a student, and they never really mattered to me after the first few times I saw a hydro cannon, anyway.
I'm surprised I didn't see the thing about the models trending until just now. That's kind of wild how much attention it's getting. Good. Game Freak lying about remaking them all from scratch should definitely be blasted, obviously not with harassment, but y'know. It's always good to expect companies to be transparent and not lie.
Why would you turn animations off for a first playthrough? there's always some great stuff in there even if Z moves took way too long
Complaining about the quote about remaking models from scratch is fine with me.
My problem is more about taking the full leap towards "there was no special effort needed for 3D models and animations and they shouldn't have been a factor in removing the national dex". That's not something you can say without expert knowledge in the field.
My problem is more about taking the full leap towards "there was no special effort needed for 3D models and animations and they shouldn't have been a factor in removing the national dex". That's not something you can say without expert knowledge in the field.
Yep.
This game really has been a complete mess from E3 all the way until today.
I'm not expecting every animation to be good. Its just hilarious.
Also I dunno obvious this ain't 1 to 1 because the sheer amount of pokemon.But ya'll couldn't just have thrown a spare kick animation from another move on my man like in fighting games. I don't care if like 100+ like humanoid esque like kick based pokemon got the same kick, I play fighting games animation sharing is a thing. I just expected it to more than
smal hop
The Sonic movie was delayed when it became clear consumers were unhappy with the 3D models, unlike Pokemon.