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zomgbbqftw

Member
Oct 25, 2017
331
London, UK
Since there seems to be a lot of interest in the subject, might as well have a catch all thread for it.

My speculation:

Holiday 2019 release date.

Specs:

12-14TF based on modified Vega with an octocore Ryzen attached. 10nm. HBM2. The die size would be around 350-380mm². 4K Wireless video transmission for VR.

$399.
 

z0m3le

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,418
Here is my take from another thread:
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814202300 This is the performance GPU people expect in the next generation Sony console, a 12.6TFLOPs GPU, it's $500 today and that is the cheapest version of the card. A console has to have a Hard drive, CPU, motherboard, case, power supply, controllers, cables, ect. There is just no way in 2 years Sony will be able to ship a $500 console with that performance level inside of it, the 7nm GPUs (Navi) will likely get the GPU price down to ~$300 for something like that GPU, but the other components will keep the console coming out in 2020-2021 minimum. I'd suggest that a rushed PS5 in 2019, would only be about twice as powerful as the PS4 Pro, which while being about 5 times more powerful than the base PS4, would be only 25% faster than XBOX (Scorpio) which would allow Microsoft to basically stay in the next generation with a product they released 2+ years earlier. Sony needs to go out there and shoot for ~7times base PS4 to minimum launch a next gen console IMO, so don't expect a PS5 until 2020 and it might cost $499 this time.
It's important to look at the other components, when I said ~$300 for a retail GPU matching Vega 64 in 2019, I was looking at a $200 mass market GPU for PS5, If you want ryzen with 8 cores, that is a massive CPU, and that will cost a lot, even mass market pricing on something like that would probably be too much, so maybe a 4 core 8 thread CPU? we are looking at ~$300 (give or take $20) for just the CPU/GPU for a console. Maybe they can get this all in a platform for $500 but it isn't a given, I'd say there is a large engineering feat here at that price. All those other components, more than 8GB of memory, (XBOX has 12GB, so I'd assume 16GB minimum for PS5 but they might want to go for 32GB incase they want/need to push 8k or 4k VR in that generation. Even with a loss, this sounds like a $600 machine, and if Sony is willing to loose $100? I mean PS4 sold at a $60 price loss iirc, and it was only 7 months after launch that they closed that gap, largely because 28nm process had become cheaper. 7nm will still be brand new in 2019, and expensive, remember that PS4 and XB1 came out 2 years after 28nm, at best holiday 2019 will only be 1 year after 7nm becomes available for the most expensive devices (High End Smart Phones)



I agree that an 8TFLOPs console is in the cards, minimum would likely be a 10TFLOPs, but 12TFLOPs is what is expected, and in my opinion, needed for a real generation gap between PS4 (and pro) and PS5. I'm not sure about the XBOX's CPU being an issue, if the command processor for the API draw calls actually works as advertised? That is a huge lift off of the CPU's shoulders, I mean it won't match an 8 thread ryzen, but game designs really don't require that much more CPU power, even when you compare the CPUs in the XB1 and PS4 to last gen CPUs, the gap is no where near as big as it was with the GPU upgrade, maybe twice as fast. I'm also not sure that Microsoft is planning to move to a new generation after XBOX, they would likely look at another upgrade to their current platform in a similar form as smart phones. If I was a marketing exec over in Redmond, I'd call the next Xbox, Xbox gen 5. As the next one could be seen as the 5th version of the Xbox consoles. (XB1S is more like a 3.1)



I also believe PS4 should hold until 2020 because 2019 seems too early to get all their announced software out. The original PS1 launched in 1994 in japan, and PS3 came 7 years after PS2 in japan, PS4 was the same. PS360 gen seemed so long because 360 launched in 2005, and started the gen 8 years before PS4/XB1, but with game development taking 3+ years, it's really not in anyone's best interest to launch a new generation. If PS4 keeps up in sales, there is little reason to do so either, with it passing 100m in 2019 and finally slowing in 2020 significantly, a new console in that year would be strategic for them IMO)
 

Gamer17

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
9,399
i say specs are about right . but holiday 2020.

Maybe just 32 GB GDDR5X instead of HBM2
 

CQC

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,706
If 2018 and 2019 can pump out just as many good quality games for this generation as 2017 has.

I will be ready for PS5 and Next Xbox as early as Holiday 2019.
 

jipewithin

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,094
There was just 2 games for 2019 (or later) in Paris, so if Sony didn't save new releases for PSX it's pretty safe to say PS5 might actually be released in 2019.
 

Bgamer90

Member
Oct 27, 2017
750
Fall 2020 at the earliest. The PS4 is still waiting on the debut of first current gen entries in popular Playstation franchises. Plus the PS4 is doing very well. No need to rush its successor out before 2020 in my opinion — especially when the PS4 Pro is just one year old too.

Edit: They also seem to want to get deeper into games as a service. Easier to do that with an already large userbase than starting fresh and working your way up.
 
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z0m3le

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,418
I think an announcement of PS5 in February 2020 and a launch that Christmas with the previous year having The Last of Us 2 and Death Stranding, would feel about right. Maybe FF7r comes in early/mid 2020, and a holiday launch of PS5 would fit right.

Matt I guess has said that PS5 comes before 2020 though, so they might be cutting PS4 a bit short.
 
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zomgbbqftw

zomgbbqftw

Member
Oct 25, 2017
331
London, UK
Agree with OP except on Price. I believe they will have to sell something like that at $499 or more.
Remember the PlayStation model is to lose money on the hardware in order to make money on games and services. Even more so now that someone like Kodera is taking over. With those specs I fully expect Sony to lose $50-60 per unit at launch.
 

Nozem

Member
Oct 27, 2017
396
I wonder how much the timing of Microsofts releases are a factor in Sony's decisions.
 

Chazzhay

Member
Oct 29, 2017
14
I think that Sony could willingly push back a PS5 and just try and slowly ramp up PS4 Pro sales. The issue will be convincing people who have a Pro to by a PS5 so soon. I think 2020+ is more reasonable and a focus on cross generation games will be a must.
 

Ahegao

Member
Oct 28, 2017
219
Remember the PlayStation model is to lose money on the hardware in order to make money on games and services. Even more so now that someone like Kodera is taking over. With those specs I fully expect Sony to lose $50-60 per unit at launch.
That hasn't been the case with PS4. They reported profits since day 1.
 

Rivyn

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,709
It will probably be Holiday 2020. I honestly believe 2019 is way too early.
 

Inuhanyou

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,214
New Jersey
2019/2020. 10tflop AMD GPU, 16GB GDDR5X, 4core double threaded/8core single threaded Zen CPU at 2.6 to 3 GHZ. 7nm. 399$. BC with PS4 games which will take the spot of traditional crossgen separate disc releases, the PS4 games when put in PS5 will become "PS5 enhanced versions" via firmware update

Although it might not be as powerful as some people might want, the fact that it is setting the new console baseline will more than make up for it in terms of pure upgrade.
 

funky

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,527
Holiday 2019

Maybe not the massive GPU leap you expect but a better CPU to balance it out.

Limited PS4 backwards compatibility

399
 

Jonnax

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,920
I think Sony is also waiting for the demand in GPU for crypotocurreny mining to reduce to they can get better prices for chips.
 

Tickling

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
961
I think they have two scenarios a winter 2019 release and winter 2020. If I was a betting man I would go winter 2020. I can see them pushing for a winter 2019 if the Xbox One X lights a real fire and starts pushing Xbox forward. I still think winter 2020 is more realistic moneywise.
 

Ahegao

Member
Oct 28, 2017
219

Ayirek

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,252
I don't see the next gen coming until 2020+. When it does come, though, I expect specs similar to what OP predicts. I don't expect it to cost more than 400 dollars; I want to think Sony learned their lesson with the PS3 launch.

In any case, I don't expect ps5/nextbox to be earthshatteringly different from what we today in terms of fidelity.
 

kami_sama

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,998
The most likely candidate for the SoC will be a beffed up Raven Ridge.
The new SoC from AMD looks phenomenal.
 

Gamer17

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
9,399
Just wanted to share this post that Matt made today

thats great news but it doesnt tell us anything about time frame.

I am assuming games that have been pro patched will be able to hit 4k and better AF and all that jazz . what about the games that didnt receive pro patch. thats interesting to know
 

Liquidsnake

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,980
Here is my take from another thread:
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814202300 This is the performance GPU people expect in the next generation Sony console, a 12.6TFLOPs GPU, it's $500 today and that is the cheapest version of the card. A console has to have a Hard drive, CPU, motherboard, case, power supply, controllers, cables, ect. There is just no way in 2 years Sony will be able to ship a $500 console with that performance level inside of it, the 7nm GPUs (Navi) will likely get the GPU price down to ~$300 for something like that GPU, but the other components will keep the console coming out in 2020-2021 minimum. I'd suggest that a rushed PS5 in 2019, would only be about twice as powerful as the PS4 Pro, which while being about 5 times more powerful than the base PS4, would be only 25% faster than XBOX (Scorpio) which would allow Microsoft to basically stay in the next generation with a product they released 2+ years earlier. Sony needs to go out there and shoot for ~7times base PS4 to minimum launch a next gen console IMO, so don't expect a PS5 until 2020 and it might cost $499 this time.

This person knows what they are talking about
 
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zomgbbqftw

zomgbbqftw

Member
Oct 25, 2017
331
London, UK
Here is my take from another thread:
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814202300 This is the performance GPU people expect in the next generation Sony console, a 12.6TFLOPs GPU, it's $500 today and that is the cheapest version of the card. A console has to have a Hard drive, CPU, motherboard, case, power supply, controllers, cables, ect. There is just no way in 2 years Sony will be able to ship a $500 console with that performance level inside of it, the 7nm GPUs (Navi) will likely get the GPU price down to ~$300 for something like that GPU, but the other components will keep the console coming out in 2020-2021 minimum. I'd suggest that a rushed PS5 in 2019, would only be about twice as powerful as the PS4 Pro, which while being about 5 times more powerful than the base PS4, would be only 25% faster than XBOX (Scorpio) which would allow Microsoft to basically stay in the next generation with a product they released 2+ years earlier. Sony needs to go out there and shoot for ~7times base PS4 to minimum launch a next gen console IMO, so don't expect a PS5 until 2020 and it might cost $499 this time.
You're comparing a consumer price graphics card to Sony buying 20m APUs at a time directly from the manufacturer. It's not advisable.
 

Nozem

Member
Oct 27, 2017
396
Forgive me if this is a stupid question since I'm mostly clueless about hardware, but would the Apple mobile CPUs be a valid option for consoles (assuming Apple would license them out)? They always knock it out of the park performance wise.
 

Jaxar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,048
Australia
2013 - PS4
2016 - PS4 Pro
2019 - PS5 + 25th anniversary of Playstation

I have a feeling Sony are going to make 2019 a big year for their gaming division.
 

Gamer17

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
9,399
one thing tells me sony has planned 2019 as lunch regardless of PS4. They went out of their way to push out PS4 pro in 2016 which is 3 years after the launch of PS4.

So if it is indeed a mid-cycle update , they want to launch the next console 3 years after that which would be 2019.

What do you guys think?
 

nib95

Contains No Misinformation on Philly Cheesesteaks
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,498
I really hope it isn't forwards compatible with the PS4 Pro. I want a fresh slate, with games built from the ground up for PS5 only. They can have the same transitional cross-platform multiplatform games as per every generational transition, but after that first year or so if we're still held back by older platforms I'll be disappointed.

Regarding my guesses, I think zomgbbqftw is probably very close.
 

Ahegao

Member
Oct 28, 2017
219
Forgive me if this is a stupid question since I'm mostly clueless about hardware, but would the Apple mobile CPUs be a valid option for consoles (assuming Apple would license them out)? They always knock it out of the park performance wise.
Buying APU's from manufacturers like AMD is much cheaper and more efficient than getting individual parts so I doubt it would be possible.
 

ps3ud0

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,906
More interesting to speculate when they schedule the first announcement/spec reveal etc

Can't see past holiday 2019 for launch myself with the specs revealed that E3. Not sure how late they'll announce it exists but I don't think they'll do an early one like the PS4 and they won't repeat the XOX mistake.

ps3ud0 8)
 

nismopower

Member
Oct 29, 2017
150
Ryzen apu, with 8-10 tflops and 16-24gb gddr5x.
And launches around end 2019, begin 2020.(somewhere around the 25 years playstation celebration).
Making it able to handle games like horizon zero dawn in (native or checkerboarded i dont give af) 4k/60fps would be the target.
Especially the 60fps is hopefully the focus next gen.
 
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