-
Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
-
We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.
PS5 and Xbox Series speculation launch thread |OT9| - For flops sake!
- Thread starter Mecha Meister
- Start date
- Status
Yep, i'm expecting $499 minimum.
Any less and i'll be pleasantly surprised, going in expecting $399 is setting yourself up for disappointment IMO.
People need to stop looking at MSRP for Sony and MS parts .
A current RX card cost $349 .
Do you think that going to cost Sony or MS any where near that if they wanted to put in into there systems.
What matter to these companies is how much it going to cost to make the APU on 7nm not what AMD selling there CPUs or GPUs for .
It's not ROPs. AFAIK, it's CU*64 (which is the no. of stream processor per CU)* GPU clock*2
PS4 GPU: 800MHz, 32ROPs, 18 CU and yields a theoretical peak of 1843.2 GFlops (product of 18*64*0.8*2)
Someone can correct me if I am mistaken. Thanks.
Yeah I pointed this out yesterday.. people keep comparing the APU size to Navi GPU sizes and expecting that math to work out forgetting that part of the die is CPU, a significant part really.
And potentially a more significant portion when comparing to the XOX GPU. We can't infer THAT MUCH from size.
Of course they don't pay MSRP, but they also don't pay $50 for a $400 GPU. The APU has to cost at least $300 per unit given what the cpu and GPU are this time around, and that doesn't even factor in the box itself, the power supply, the memory (gddr6 very pricey this year), the ssd, the bluray player... idk how they come away making a single dollar.
The amount of speculation in this thread is above the levels of when we were guessing about the Xbox One X's architecture. Before the big Eurogamer info drop people were thinking it may have a Ryzen 3 level set up.
You would be way off base .
Like i said the PS4 APU cost $110 @348nm.
PS5 APU being the same size on 7nm is not going to cost $200 more .
More expensive yes but not by $200 more.
I'm sure their buy prices come down a lot when you're agreeing to a 5+ year deal and 10's of millions of chips.
The PS4 APU used an embarrassingly old laptop cpu that cost them almost nothing. Zen2 8 cores are not even comparable to a Jaguar cpu lol.
Really? Instagram and Twitter likes are the new console wars battlefront? Are you people for real?
We truly are plumbing new depths here. For the love of god let there please be a new leak to discuss instead.
We truly are plumbing new depths here. For the love of god let there please be a new leak to discuss instead.
If I'm reading that right, it'd be 64% for a 400mm2 die, 68.5% for a 350mm2 die, and 73% for a 300mm2 die.
I don't know much specifics on CU size, but a complete 40 CU Navi GPU is 251mm2, so the compute units are smaller than 6.25mm2.
I guess the fun part of this calculation that I keep forgetting (unless I'm completely wrong, lol) is that disabling the compute units isn't random chance, I think they get to choose so instead of a 2% random chance of disabling the correct CU and salvaging the part, they get to pick the one that's bad. Otherwise there'd be no point and it'd make more sense to just make them smaller. So instead, the entire CU area is fair game for defects as long as it's the actual CU and not support logic. So now a 400mm2 APU looks like a 350mm2 or even 300mm2 APU in terms of defect rates, depending on how much area is CU vs. CPU and other logic.
I think with that, we can get a better sense of how cost scales with size, and it's looking a lot more linear than I would've expected. I don't know if it's generally considered a good defect rate but it seems great to me. Does anyone know long TSMC's yields have looked like this at 7nm?
wait, people think the APU/SOC will be $200 or $300 per unit?
lol no way. These GPUs and CPUs cost are sold to PC buyers at 3x cost or more because it's an enthusiast market, but for consoles, they can sell a bit above cost to Sony and Xbox because they will order 100-150M+ instead of maybe 1-10M on PC for enthusiast cards imo.
I doubt next gen APUs cost more than $150, probably much closer to the $100-$110 they cost XB1/PS4 in 2013. I can see a bit more expensive with RT, and 7nm but 8 cores @3.2Ghz+, 9-11TFs should be doable at $120-$150.
lol no way. These GPUs and CPUs cost are sold to PC buyers at 3x cost or more because it's an enthusiast market, but for consoles, they can sell a bit above cost to Sony and Xbox because they will order 100-150M+ instead of maybe 1-10M on PC for enthusiast cards imo.
I doubt next gen APUs cost more than $150, probably much closer to the $100-$110 they cost XB1/PS4 in 2013. I can see a bit more expensive with RT, and 7nm but 8 cores @3.2Ghz+, 9-11TFs should be doable at $120-$150.
Don't understand? Do you think it's not a good metric?
Social Media activities is a really good metric if you want to know about market share. It's even the right demografic.
I recall a Wall Street Journal article last year that first said a PS5 was coming in 2020, and it stated that Sony's plan was to target the "hardcore gamer". It immediately made me wonder if they might be targeting a $500 console day one.
As others are pointing out, all this tech in a console seems to demand a higher price. So it really does make me wonder if we might end up seeing.
Series X - $600
PS5 - $500
Series S - $400
As others are pointing out, all this tech in a console seems to demand a higher price. So it really does make me wonder if we might end up seeing.
Series X - $600
PS5 - $500
Series S - $400
It should be locked until something happens. People are just going crazy.
You seem to be missing the point.
It's the die size they paying for .
Zen 2 die size is not much bigger than Jaguar even more so if they take out some of the L3 cache .
Right now the RX 5700 is 251 nm but guess what the PS4 GPU was around 228nm.
I had a few up from a model I made here's a couple of them https://m.imgur.com/a/l2sZVAN?
I have some more shots of it vertical compared to others if you want to see those just lmk
(The link image tool never works for me not sure if I'm doing something wrong or what)
Where were you when Sony unveiled the PS5 logo? I'll always remember. Pepperidge Farm will, too.
Been happening for a few days now and I think it's only going to get worse before it gets better...
4M likes for a logo is absolutely bonkers lol....how many likes will the final form get?
This is normal if you looking at Social Media metrics for a brand .
It's like when people laugh at people who talk about YT views .( non advertise one )
Yes that don't mean huge sales but it shows interest and that is first step to selling something.
150 die per wafer, $9000 per wafer, 64% yield is $94 per die.
______________________
I'd like to point out that pretty much 0 of the "leaks" about die size had it 390-407 mm^2. Your daily reminder most rumors are full of shit.
I was kind of expecting some desktop AMD GPU news last night. We're 9 months from these new consoles being shipped to stores, with all this promise of ball busting tech and perf yet we still have a 5700 XT out there only. Of course AMD could really be laying out a GPU banquet sometime this year but with AMD doubling it's die size to come with more perf it seems a little odd.
When I first heard of 12tflops in a console I thought AMD was gearing up for Maxwell moment of perf per watt but seems like it's going to huge and thirsty.
When I first heard of 12tflops in a console I thought AMD was gearing up for Maxwell moment of perf per watt but seems like it's going to huge and thirsty.
You can do that on a ps4/xbox, you just have to spend another ~$25 on a BT transceiver. The creative bt-w2 would work. Plug it into the ps4, pair with the headphones and you're good to go.
We can see 12TF at $499-$599, IMO.
7 years and $100 more should get you there.
This is why we can't have nice things. I would prefer that it stays unlocked, though.
You may take our lives, but you will never take our Likes!
Anyone else find more excitement thinking about the generation AFTER the incoming one? For example, PS6 conceivably being 30+TF in 2025/2026, whenever they release it, makes me feel really humble and accepting of whatever they deliver for the PS5. It's just so interesting to me just how quickly technology becomes outdated nowadays. Even by the mid decade I'll still be thinking back to the launch of PS4 and how less than 2TF was a big deal, yet compared to the hypothetical PS6, that'll only be 1/15th of an assumed 30+TF console. I'll be 35 by then. And a decade after that cards are probably looking at 100TFs.
lol I guess thinking of technology this way helps make me appreciate what I have now because the moment is so fleeting.
lol I guess thinking of technology this way helps make me appreciate what I have now because the moment is so fleeting.
Exactly.
Social medias influence for marketing isn't necessarily about direct sales (or whatever your business end goal is) but in creating a brand that people want to interact with and can feel familiar with.
The people who are engaged enough to follow and interact with your channel are not only more likely to follow through with your product but also help to raise awareness with others.
It's just a part of the whole marketing process but it's a damn important one these days and those laughing at people discussing it clearly have no idea what they are talking about.
Thanks for the data and info!
I still feel like at least PS5 will be $399, of course that could change
I wonder what other, interesting info Sony/Microsoft could reveal to bridge the time until release.
Packaging
- Is it made of recycled material
- Is there a handle to carry it
- How many cats can sit in it
Console
- How stable is it
- Can you see fingerprints on it
Controller
- Can it handle greasy fingers from food
- Can I wash it with running water
Dimensions
- How big is the packaging compared to a banana
- How big is the console compared to a banana
- How big is the controller compared to a banana
Exciting times!
Packaging
- Is it made of recycled material
- Is there a handle to carry it
- How many cats can sit in it
Console
- How stable is it
- Can you see fingerprints on it
Controller
- Can it handle greasy fingers from food
- Can I wash it with running water
Dimensions
- How big is the packaging compared to a banana
- How big is the console compared to a banana
- How big is the controller compared to a banana
Exciting times!
But then what would I read when I wake up to piss in the middle of the night and can't get back to sleep?!
Cooking
- Can it make toast?
- How about an omelette?
- Can it stand in as a slow cooker if left on over the course of a day?
All the leaks with die size and price are fake. The only true one where non fully details spec sheet for Lockhart and Xbox Series X in January 2019. Some of the rumors were true with codename or the github leak maybe outdated since Komachi don't want to share something now. And we have some rumors from trustable insiders.
Dude the manufacturing costs don't scale with a chips performance. It scales with the size of the die and the yields they get. So if you've got some comparative numbers of the yields of Jaguar vs Zen2 then share them, otherwise you're way off base.
Instagram likes are next to worthless, it's one of the most easily gamed metrics in the digital media space. Buying likes and utilizing bots to boost that metric isn't too expensive and anyone can do so. We have absolutely no idea how many of those likes are actual users.
it's actually a pretty big problem in the digital advertising industry that is going ignored as it inflates performance for a lot of advertising initiatives and a lot of marketers either don't know better or simply don't care as they're constantly just chasing the big numbers in the end.
Here's an article on it from 2018
I wouldn't trust any social media metrics regardless of brand.
Sorry for being off topic with the general thread, but figured this was worth addressing as someone in the digital ad tech industry.
Edit: I should add that it doesn't necessarily need to be the brand themselves actively using the bots, any third party can do so for whatever reason, and there are a ton of players involved that aren't directly related to the brand that stand to gain (ie. 3rd party vendors etc)
- Status