You are confusing BOM and retail price.
Sony was aiming for a BOM of $400 so they would have taken a lost no matter what at $400 retail .
This $50 can effect the retail price or it might not we have to wait and see.
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You are confusing BOM and retail price.
Sony was aiming for a BOM of $400 so they would have taken a lost no matter what at $400 retail .
This $50 can effect the retail price or it might not we have to wait and see.
I don't think so either, but not the clean sweep in some markets. I'd be hesitant myself if XSX is 30% better for a similar price though.
Clocking a part higher to bridge a large gap is not all that appealing to me. These GPUs TF flop number go hand in hand with the other specs like rops and texture units so while some performance can be gained the reality is the gap is still very large and will show more over time, a base 8.Xtf is about 40%, overclocking to 9.2tf is just masking it for a while. XSX GPU will; no doubt be speced accordingly.
If Sony has got the heat and noise down then fair enough, I certainly think this 7nm refresh can achieve some higher clocks than before but still wouldn't want to jump in early and for me Sony has form in PS4 and PS4 Pro being noisy and the PS3 60gb Phat had expensive cooling for a hot 170w system but mine turned into a jet engine 2 years in and the BGA failed with the YLOD like many did. At least they lasted longer than 360s in general.
Apparently the Phil's distorsion field is now able to immune his brand againt market fluctuations regarding prices and availability.
I agree and was kind of surprised when I read that in the Bloomberg article, specifically the "internal consternation" about the way things are going in terms of the reveal plan.
It seems like back in 2013 there was a clear plan. The big February event, which was teased in Janaury. Constant updates throughout the year. Big E3 blowout. It felt like they had more conviction at that time.
what meltdown? lol. I am discussing the latest news in a level headed manner without cursing, insulting other users, or arguing in bad faith to make my point. Which btw is par for the course in this thread. The only thing i have done is make an argument you dont like. the title of the article literally states that Sony is struggling to price it. you can feel free to spin it as a positive but this is NOT a positive article. just sweeping all concerns under the rug is not going to make this all go away.
besides, this is literally the first piece of news we have had in over two months. Came direct from inside Sony. if we cant discuss this what can we discuss?
Honest question: if we knew everything about the new Xbox(es), PS5, and the games for both that will be available this year, including gameplay video, would that make the wait for their holiday launch easier, harder, or not change anything? Explain your reasoning if possible.
While i do understand what your saying...its not always about comparison. I want best bang for my bucks and a system that stays "relevant" for the next 7 years. Meaning if i think that there is a chance that a pro version can comes out, ill skip PS5 so fast. If for some reason they think they should release cross gen games. Than also Skip!
To me the $399 dream still on the table if they think this is a short term problem .
If they think prices will drop in a few months they can sell at $399 while limting the number of consoles for a short while and eat the lost for a few months.
You could have actually discuss the info that they are going for a better colling solution for example.
Yep, unless Sony takes huge loss, the $399 dream is definitely dead.
There's been solid speculation for upwards of a year now that the new consoles would likely be priced at $499. I don't see why this should come as a surprise to people who have been following closely at this point.
Good. Lol.
I distinctly recall sony saying that they needed to sell a first party game with every console to break even on the PS4. We know the PS4 BOM was $380. So retail and distribution costs must have been $80.
If the BOM alone is $450, we are looking at at least a $530 console. you would think sony would be willing to take a $30 loss at $499 and only have to sell 1 first party game for every 2 consoles sold, but they dont feel confident going up against a $499 xbox series x and i dont know why other than the possibility of a 9 tflops $499 console.
if they have to go with $450 because of worse specs, they will have to make up $80 which means selling more than 1 first party game per console which can get very tricky, but not impossible if they launch with horizon and gran turismo 7.
That's not what you said and or implied........
So i agree with that. No need to have a breakdown, but i don't think he did though......he's just a little bit annoyed by the lack of info ;)
I dont disagree, but we won't know this till much later I think.
Ps+ combined with the fact that this isn't going to be an long term issue, i don't see why $399 would be a problem for the first few months.
I know. But afaik there were rumors about Lockhart being cancelled before that. He just confirmed it.
If Sony manage to package:
3.2Ghz 8C/16T Zen 2, 9.2TF Navi w/ RT, 16GB GDDR6 and 1TB super fast SSD
For $399 then that is a very compelling product even if we here would rather have a 12TF $499 version. The average buyer is way more price conscious than we are. Such a machine would probably sell better than the one we want.
I remember reading somewhere that Layden and Ryan differed on whether big events were necessary for communication (Layden didn't think they were). It makes me wonder if the Wired articles were part of Layden's marketing strategy for PS5, which Ryan didn't approve of and possibly led to Layden leaving or being forced to resign.
Layden didn't have a big reveal planned, so as of his departure last year there wasn't a PS Meeting-type event in the works. Ryan wants a big conference reveal so now they're hurrying to put one together (which would explain the delay). Just a random thought.
Layden didn't have a big reveal planned, so as of his departure last year there wasn't a PS Meeting-type event in the works. Ryan wants a big conference reveal so now they're hurrying to put one together (which would explain the delay). Just a random thought.
Yes it would be over a $100 but over a $100 for a few months might not be a problem if it's short term which was my point .
So a extra $50 for 4 or 5 months while limiting the amount they make can work .
Truth is it's only this gen where Sony or MS eat small losses but now they also have way more way to make money .( no one is thinking consoles are dead\dying)
I wonder if they would go back to PS2\360 where they lost $100 .
I'm not so sure going by the IHS BOM estimates for PS4 ($381 inc manufacturing but not retail cut or marketing) but still came in at $399.
If $450 proves accurate then it would mean an ~$50-$70 loss for PS5 vs PS4's ~break even.
But i did talk about their cooling last night around midnight when this article first went up. in three different posts.
the discussion has since moved and ive replied to people talking about other things. i havent even ranted in a solo post. im simply replying to others. again, i dont understand the gatekeeping.
Sure but he was the first one to confirm it and put his name behind it.
But whatever i have no clue why we are having this conversation.... It doesn't matter lol
It's all good my people... Just thought it was a bit weird.
Agreed.
My primary point is that if someone believes that Sony is going to be at 9.2 TF; and are suggesting that would equal doom for Sony, they are likely arguing from a perspective NOT doing with sales. Assumption being that they are competitively priced vis-a-vis a potentially stronger Xbox.
Not aimed at you, but just in general, I am NOT arguing that Sony WILL be 9.2TF.
i dont like that this gets brought up all the time. Klee didnt say this in the thread. he PM'ed a poster about what he heard. if he had felt confident about it, he wouldve mentioned it in the thread. so not only did the poster break his trust by revealing the content of a private message, now his credibility is being questioned over something he did not even say publicly.
Yeah but the question is how long will the BOM be $450 is this a short term problem or one that will last long .
This gen ram prices went up and down so i feel that is one of the reason why we not get permanent prices cut for years .
If it's short term are they willing to eat the extra $50 for a few months .
Like how they still did sales with PS4 when ram prices went up .
That sentence always feels a bit like a cheap cop out even though it's true....
I'm not sure what you mean by that. Mochizuki is probably one of the most well respected business journalists for Japanese companies in the US. I mean Bloomberg and Wall Street Journal are not usually the places you think of when you think of crappy journalism.....
Alright, fair enough, didn't know that's how it was found out.
This makes more sense, there's no way the cooling difference of a couples of dollar per units makes up the difference between 36cu and 56cu price wise. People who see this as making github spec more likely have confirmation bias.
but Jim took over in February and the first wired article was in April. Its possible Shawn did cancel E3 before he left, but Jim did not one but two wired articles after shawn left.
Jim had over a year to put together a big meeting.
To be fair... MS hasn't said anting either. More so, being silent doesn't mean there is some sort of problem. It could just mean that when they do talk they want to have a lot o meaningful things to say and show. Oh, nothing was officially said of the XB1 until May 2013. A whole 3 months after sony did their full reveal. That has nothing to do with why MS lost this gen, and even if sony remains silent til may or after mS does their own full reveal, it wouldn't change anything. What I think is important is what is said when something is actually said.
And the RX5700xt costs over $400 and the PS5s GPU is supposedly more powerful than that....
But let's make this simple, I believe that whatever SSD solution sony/Ms uses wouldn't cost them more than $55. So you mean to tell me that you believe it would cost them at least $100?
Some of the articles about Shawn's departure suggest that there was a power struggle. Maybe he [Layden] was getting his way at first (since the Wired articles were probably already planned at that point), but Ryan ultimately won out? Idk.
Also, didn't Shawn leave in October 2019? Both Wired articles were done while he was still with PlayStation I think.
Hmm. I think TV TV, second screen experiences, and the BOM vs. PS360 are pretty obvious signs among many that console makers were looking to avert risk and broaden out beyond the classic "dedicated" box.
I think this time they are much more convinced that the dedicated box is still a pretty big deal, hence why they are comparatively "splurging" on them hardware wise.
Especially considering Sony is going to save more money on the components they make themselves (bluray drive etc)
You know, it's interesting to me that just before 8th gen started, (just about) every time CBOAT appeared, she/he/it came bearing bad news relating to Xbox One and the Xbox division's internal decisions regarding it. And there was a hunger among posters for these drops of information. Regardless of the tone in which that information was delivered, IIRC, most of it turned out to be true.
Going on what we are piecing together, some internal struggles and changes have occurred within the PlayStation division over the last ~3 years and it's beginning to look like these changes have altered the division's behavior, perhaps significantly. If the recent Bloomberg article holds water, then there's also concern among Sony leadership about the PS division's strategy. And why wouldn't they be concerned? PlayStation is a massive part of their operations.
Yet to some, discussing that information is tantamount to "doom and gloom." I'm not calling anything on GitHub, that's still not 100% clear to me, but to deny that something is up at PlayStation and that everyone who insinuates such is on a warpath agenda reeks of insecurity.
Going on what we are piecing together, some internal struggles and changes have occurred within the PlayStation division over the last ~3 years and it's beginning to look like these changes have altered the division's behavior, perhaps significantly. If the recent Bloomberg article holds water, then there's also concern among Sony leadership about the PS division's strategy. And why wouldn't they be concerned? PlayStation is a massive part of their operations.
Yet to some, discussing that information is tantamount to "doom and gloom." I'm not calling anything on GitHub, that's still not 100% clear to me, but to deny that something is up at PlayStation and that everyone who insinuates such is on a warpath agenda reeks of insecurity.
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Snake, you are overreacting way too hard, bruh. You guys were setting yourselves up for failure when you guys thought they show something at CES 2020. Like this is why you responded like this. Microsoft did the exact same opposite seven years ago because they were good with the gamers and Sony was making a strong comeback. They had to strike first and lol @ not being confident in your product. Please.
MS has revealed the XSX is a cool video at E3 and shown the console at the Game Awards. Spencer is out there talking about how excited he is about it.
Sony are being so weird about it.
This thing is supposed to be out in 10 months. And we know what the logo looks like. That's it.
Feb reveal would have been fine, but it looks like we aren't even getting that. So PS5 is some kind of secret mystery that us, as consumers, are not allowed to know about.
The thing is coming out in 10 months, if they can't show it off now then they're in major trouble and it isn't coming out this year. If it is on track for holiday 2020 then there is no reason they can't show us SOMETHING.
If we get nothing by the end of Feb I think the fans have every reason to be pissed at Sony.
If you read this thread all the time that's pretty obvious he does. Lol
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