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CamDeenie

Banned
Nov 20, 2018
21
"Whats the big deal it's just another set of credentials" - console gamer

Sometimes I regret switching to PC since most third party games are meh and the platform is pretty unstable right now (every AAA publisher is about to have their own store, and there are tons of hackers in multiplayer). Plus, this joke is stupid, because I've only needed to enter my credentials once on PS4.
 

alosarjos

Member
Oct 27, 2017
364
So I totally get why most people want to stick with Steam currently but why are some of you so adamantly against even the prospect of a Steam competitor? I'm not implying there's one out now that's worth using for most PC games, but is it so improbable to think that a company will eventually rise to the challenge in offering something different and compelling as a substitute? Maybe it won't match Steam in every single feature they offer, which took them years to implement themselves, but may offer better pricing or other incentives when buying games there, for example.

I can get to the point where "having multiple libraries" is a hassle. I see GOG as a possible competitor, since it offers something else to the players, DRM Free games. But none of this stores/launchers provides absolutely nothing to the player (Just Ubisoft with the achivements/reward system I would say)
 

JD3Nine

The Fallen
Nov 6, 2017
1,866
Texas, United States
So I totally get why most people want to stick with Steam currently but why are some of you so adamantly against even the prospect of a Steam competitor? I'm not implying there's one out now that's worth using for most PC games, but is it so improbable to think that a company will eventually rise to the challenge in offering something different? Maybe it won't match Steam in every single feature they offer, which took them years to implement themselves, but may offer better pricing or other incentives when buying games there, for example.

The problem with this is that Steam has been on top for the better part of a decade. You would think by now that somebody would have at least closed the gap in features. But that hasn't happened.

I wonder why? Could it be that Valve actually does a lot of work on Steam's features? Work that undoubtedly costs more than the 30 percent that these companies are trying to save. Nobody else cares to improve the PC experience. They just want to avoid the fee while doing as little as possible.
 

Stone Ocean

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,561
So I totally get why most people want to stick with Steam currently but why are some of you so adamantly against even the prospect of a Steam competitor? I'm not implying there's one out now that's worth using for most PC games, but is it so improbable to think that a company will eventually rise to the challenge in offering something different and compelling as a substitute? Maybe it won't match Steam in every single feature they offer, which took them years to implement themselves, but may offer better pricing or other incentives when buying games there, for example.
I have no reason to give companies the benefit of the doubt when every alternative to Steam launches in the same broken way and takes a long time to become tolerable while still remaining inferior. Why should I believe Bethesda will be the one to actually do it, specially after the absolute shit show that their launcher has been? You're a multimillionaire company, put in the effort from day 1 or fuck off.

On another note, why is it so unreasonable to not want more and more and more different launchers to manage with different communities?
 

unknownspectator

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
2,191
Could you elaborate please? What is silly about choosing the historically best launcher and one that has the most consumer-friendly features? I'm a consumer not a fucking charity, im going to shop at the best place for ME, not the publisher.

Really, I would love to know more.
he's not gonna post again because he was trolling
 

Nzyme32

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,238
No steam no buy, Fuck off Bethesda.

In the case of Bethesda launcher and the continue sub-minimal effort put into it and any features / usability, you are entirely justified. I agree with you.

I feel confident that they will do this with Doom Eternal, which would be a shame since I would love to play it - but I definitely am not going to buy it from Bethesda's Launcher. If that means missing the game, fine. Bethesda's loss.
 
Oct 31, 2017
1,260
The Blocc
If Bethesda had a respectable refund policy or at least made sure their games were made well, I'd buy a game off of their marketplace. But I'll just skip this or buy it physically on console so I can at least sell it to some other sucker if it's bad.
 

Deleted member 4044

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,121
The 'no Steam no buy' movement is one of the cringiest in gaming.

Yup. One of the advantages (disadvantages?) of PC gaming is that companies can deliver their product to you in various ways. Never understood this argument that it's not worth playing a game if it's not on a launcher of choice.
 

no1

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Apr 27, 2018
954
So I totally get why most people want to stick with Steam currently but why are some of you so adamantly against even the prospect of a Steam competitor? I'm not implying there's one out now that's worth using for most PC games, but is it so improbable to think that a company will eventually rise to the challenge in offering something different and compelling as a substitute? Maybe it won't match Steam in every single feature they offer, which took them years to implement themselves, but may offer better pricing or other incentives when buying games there, for example.
Because most times the steam competitors leave one thing out that actually gets people to come back. The community aspect.

BNET's implementation doesn't count as it's trying to rip off discord with how they've set it up, but really we don't like the way it's being done Steam does everything Epic,BNET,Origin,uPlay,GOG, etc does but in a better form, now since I don't like having so many damn launchers and it's sorta ironic that i have to resort to this but installing playnite made shit much easier to manage.

But reegardless Bethesda doesn't at all know how to make a launcher as shown with fallout 76.

If companies took charge and did what uPlay/Ubisoft did which was sell on both and allow to play your games regardless if you have it on steam or uPlay using two different damn launchers then it would have been better, but that's the exact opposite of what's going on.
 

Deleted member 1759

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,582
Europe
also, hypocritical for those who often say, "competition is good" but when their platform loses then suddenly it's bad.
Release your games on all storefronts and try to get people to buy from yours by offering stuff the others don't. Then we can talk about competition.

Apart from that, I don't think Bethesda will be able to offer the user a good experience. They can prove me wrong but with everything that happened with Fallout 76 - which you'd think would be the showcase game for their launcher - I'll definitely avoid their store for the foreseeable future.
 

J-Wood

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,747
Welp, we were saying it in hyperbole for awhile, but it's for real this time. We're now neck deep in it.

The platform wars on PC have begun. Sucks.
 

The_Land

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,390
Cleveland Ohio
Not so sure why people are so obsessed with Steam. They have been stagnant for years and it's finally catching up with them. Glad to see other players in the field.
 

elenarie

Game Developer
Verified
Jun 10, 2018
9,776
Very saddened by the No Steam no buy crowd.
Competition is good for everyone. Monopoly is not.

Getting this one on day 1. :)
 

Static

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
6,107
Because Rage 2, Prey, Fallout 76 are all Bethesda games and they would benefit from getting their own launcher to have better features and performance.

How can STEAM be the superior platform for Bethesda games at the end of the day? Bethesda should know what is better for their own games and their own business and I hope they build on that.

Why do you care that I want Bethesda to put in work on their own stuff instead of "giving" up and just bowing to Valve? Why does it affect you?

You basically are saying they shouldn't even try because of the superiority of Steam? With this attitude, nothing would get done, not even Steam.
You would have a point of Beth launcher weren't presently an undeniably worse launcher than Steam. Even when it isn't broken, the difference in featureset is incomparable. Numerous other publishers have created their own launchers and none of them have yet come up with a single compelling reason that showcases how their launcher actually benefits their game in a way that Steam cannot. Not a single fucking one. The idea that Bethesda launcher will, or even conceivably can come up with that justification is sort of laughable. The idea that you think this is in any way about building a better player experience sort of blows my mind. This is about money. And while I understand the sense behind their business choices, I don't like them, and I don't see any reason I should.

How can Steam be the superior platform for Bethesda games? How can it not? We don't even have to argue about the hypothetical. Bethesda launcher exists. It is an inferior experience. It speaks for itself.

I suppose the reason I care is that I see this situation, the proliferation of launchers, the necessity as someone with broad tastes of suffering every single one of them, as an absolute and inherent negative. Steam has competition. It's had competition for years. For all of that, Steam remains the standout head and shoulders champ. But I can't use Steam for half of the games I want to play, and that number is only going to get worse. So in light of that, in light of you and me being strong armed into every single crummy platform on PC under the undeniable justification of increased profits. And to make matters worse, there's little reason to even be optimistic about where it'll take us. These platforms will drag you to them through exclusivity. They will keep you there through exclusivity. So where's the incentive to improve? If you have to install a different platform for every single publisher's games, featureset becomes pointless to compete on, and player/customer experience becomes a pointless investment.

This sucks. But you seemed optimistic. And I wanted to know why.

EDIT: TO be clear, I'm not in the no steam no buy crowd. I have Origin, I have Uplay, I have Battle.net, because I have to have all of these thigns to play the things I want to play. This isn't about a refusal to try. This is about the knowledge that I'll be forced to endure them.
 
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NoPiece

Member
Oct 28, 2017
304
Yup. One of the advantages (disadvantages?) of PC gaming is that companies can deliver their product to you in various ways. Never understood this argument that it's not worth playing a game if it's not on a launcher of choice.

Except this is the opposite of "companies can deliver their product to you in various ways." Bethesda is locking their game into their own sales platform. They are creating a monopoly for sales of their own games. If they built their own platform, and put their games on it, and put them on Steam, Origin, GOG, etc.., that would be awesome. That would create competition. This is not that at all.
 

RaySpencer

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,625
The 'no Steam no buy' movement is one of the cringiest in gaming.

Yeah, people complain when something is console exclusive, but thats a multiple hundred dollar problem, not a free download problem. I can understand wanting everything in one place, but damn I wont let some FREE launcher stop me from playing a game I want.

Of course every company wants 100% of the profits. Why give up 30% (or whatever the new thing is) for no damn reason? Everyone should get used to a launcher for every publisher.
 

Stone Ocean

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,561
Not so sure why people are so obsessed with Steam. They have been stagnant for years and it's finally catching up with them. Glad to see other players in the field.
People keep saying Valve is resting on their laurels, being lazy or stagnant or whatever. What does that even mean?
Very saddened by the No Steam no buy crowd.
Competition is good for everyone. Monopoly is not.

Getting this one on day 1. :)
Yeah, monopolies are bad. That's why we need products that can only be bought from a single retailer who can single handedly dictate the price on it! That is totally not the definition of what an actual monopoly means!
 

Virtua Sanus

Member
Nov 24, 2017
6,492
I am totally fine with using multiple launchers. The problem here is Bethesda's launcher is outrageously terrible.

Their only upcoming game I even care about is Doom Eternal and even if I adored the last one it just seems like a lot of extra annoyances to go through to play one game that I will want to play through every couple years. The odds of me forgetting passwords or losing save files or whatever in that time period is crazy high too.
 

Ichi

Banned
Sep 10, 2018
1,997
Release your games on all storefronts and try to get people to buy from yours by offering stuff the others don't. Then we can talk about competition.

Apart from that, I don't think Bethesda will be able to offer the user a good experience. They can prove me wrong but with everything that happened with Fallout 76 - which you'd think would be the showcase game for their launcher - I'll definitely avoid their store for the foreseeable future.

because most are cheap-ass and just want the game itself, not the extra stuff. that's not how you make people jump from one
platform to another. maybe in consoles that could work and even then, it usually isn't the case. even when so many extras come with an xbox version, most people will buy it from the market leader just 'cause there are just twice as many systems out there.

so yeah, it makes the most sense that they offer a game instead of just extras, because if they're just going to offer extras, there are way less incentives to jump ship.
 

Thrill_house

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,594
Well damn. Looks like I'll be skipping this one as well. Hell I can always rent it or get it on the cheaps down the line on ps4
 

thebishop

Banned
Nov 10, 2017
2,758
Very saddened by the No Steam no buy crowd.
Competition is good for everyone. Monopoly is not.

Getting this one on day 1. :)

Competition would be good if launchers like Origin were actually trying to compete. Where's the "Big Picture mode" for Origin, for example? If EA doesn't want to share a cut with a store like Valve, it would be preferable at this point if they released games as downloadable exe installers. Instead we have to run a half a dozen background services doing god-knows-what from half a dozen different publishers, all with separate user accounts, achievements, friends lists (if we're lucky), etc. Origin is the best of the worst of these, but the cumulative user experience for PC gamers is very bad.
 

Deleted member 42

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 24, 2017
16,939
I'm just tired of all these launchers

so many launchers

help me god I just wanna be on the ground
 

KimonoNoNo

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,568
I don't care if it's "Silly"; My money, my PC, my choice what software I want to install and use.
 

Solaris

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,278
Yeah, people complain when something is console exclusive, but thats a multiple hundred dollar problem, not a free download problem. I can understand wanting everything in one place, but damn I wont let some FREE launcher stop me from playing a game I want.

What about letting your personal data get compromised?

Oh wait, that HAPPENED with Bethesda!
 

Deleted member 4044

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,121
Except this is the opposite of "companies can deliver their product to you in various ways." Bethesda is locking their game into their own sales platform. They are creating a monopoly for sales of their own games. If they built their own platform, and put their games on it, and put them on Steam, Origin, GOG, etc.., that would be awesome. That would create competition. This is not that at all.

It's no different than them selling you the game directly, as an executable or a disk, instead of Steam. Them not wanting to sell the game on Steam or Origin or the Windows Store is not the definition of a monopoly.

Do you also have an issue with Valve games being exclusive to Steam?
 

Razzorn

Member
Jan 9, 2018
35
Very saddened by the No Steam no buy crowd.
Competition is good for everyone. Monopoly is not.

Getting this one on day 1. :)

Competition is only better when others are offering a comparable product. In every other launchers case? They aren't. It's all about money. I'd be willing to look at other launchers when they other things like refunds. That hasn't happened yet.
 

Deleted member 2620

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,491
I'm firmly in the "this is annoying but not enough to detract me from the otherwise great-looking game" camp.
 

Derrick01

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,289
Very saddened by the No Steam no buy crowd.
Competition is good for everyone. Monopoly is not.

Getting this one on day 1. :)

Let's look at what competition your company's Origin has brought the PC space in the last 7-8 years.

- Origin was first to have a meaningful refund system that Valve copied/improved on eventually.

............

and that's it. In 8 years. Stunning display of competition.
 

EAPidgeon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
68
Exactly people have been saying for so long how they hate multi platform games. By releasing exclusively on 1 platform there can be ensured steady price competition between all 1 of the digital storefronts trying to sell the license. I think we can all agree that 1 vendor being in charge of pricing for one product always leads to fair prices after all. When you play on console it's irritating when a game releases on the console you own. It's much better it releases on a specific console as an exclusive so it can be better optimized using hardware magic rather than being available on the platform you have a large investment in.

Yes, this is sarcasm.
 

Nzyme32

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,238
Very saddened by the No Steam no buy crowd.
Competition is good for everyone. Monopoly is not.

Getting this one on day 1. :)
Is it also good when my personal info gets leaked online? or when my games directory disappears?

- How about not being able to refund my product?
- What about not being able to even access or use my broken product?
- Do I know that I can own the products from that store in perpetuity?

People have good justification in many cases for "no Steam no buy" - IF they are enjoying their experience as a customer / player on Steam more than a different solution.
It's highly arrogant to think one person cannot make this decision on their own, or somehow that their decision is somehow so flippant that it was devoid of any thought at all / done on some sort of fanboyish nature.

It is disappointing that you as a developer, can only see it this way when there are very very blatant long term issues and no evidence that anything but the bare minimum is being put into the service
 
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