Raphael van Lierop claims Nvidia added The Long Dark to GeForce Now without permission.

Video Games Are Dumb · Mar 1, 2020

For those of you not keeping track at home, GeForce Now has had a fairly rocky past few weeks. First with the removal of Activision Blizzard's games, followed by Bethesda also having their games taken down. In both cases, the action was sudden and the explanations were bare. Nvidia has said this was due to a "misunderstanding"

Now Hinterland Studio's Raphael van Lierop has claimed Nvidia put their latest game The Long Dark on the service without permission. Even worse, Lierop said Nvidia offered the developers a free graphics card as an apology....Yikes.

EDIT: I'm seeing a lot of users saying "Nvidia did nothing wrong" without addressing why Nvidia removed access to those games.

SuperBanana · Mar 1, 2020

A fucking free graphics card. Are they serious? Whoever is in charge of Now needs to be removed. You don't have multiple developers bail out of no where and comments like this without some serious mismanagement going on.

pksu · Mar 1, 2020

Regardless of what EULAs say this is still just stupid.

Bear Patrol · Mar 1, 2020

This really seems like Nvidia searched for the most foolproof way to piss off devs and sabotage their reputation amongst them in one fell swoop for absolutely no reason.

Like...why? What is the net benefit of all this mess to Nvidia?

Kieli · Mar 1, 2020

Can someone clarify what Geforce NOW is? Is it like an operating system that allows you to play games on the Cloud? In that case, nVIDIA doesn't need to ask for permission (i.e. it's merely infrastructure to play games that a customer had already bought from the developers). If it's something more like OnLive or Gaikai (e.g. cloud subscription service), obviously they need the developer's support (licensing for a subscription as a service product).

Video Games Are Dumb · Mar 1, 2020

Kieli said:
If it's something more like OnLive or Gaikai (e.g. cloud subscription service),

That's exactly what it is. And sadly, it's pretty dang good but is so mismanaged it's hard to recommend.

EDIT: me bad explain is vm

Jarate · Mar 1, 2020

moving your game from running on a cloud machine so you can get less sales

Video Games Are Dumb · Mar 1, 2020

Jarate said:
moving your game from running on a cloud machine so you can get less sales

Mmmmmmm no. Not a good take.

They never made a deal, they should be pissed.

BoredLemon · Mar 1, 2020

Kieli said:
Can someone clarify what Geforce NOW is? Is it like an operating system that allows you to play games on the Cloud? In that case, nVIDIA doesn't need to ask for permission (i.e. it's merely infrastructure to play games that a customer had already bought from the developers). If it's something more like OnLive or Gaikai (e.g. cloud subscription service), obviously they need the developer's support (licensing for a subscription as a service product).

It's a cloud PC that you rent from Nvidia. They don't sell games themselves. You just log into your Steam account and play games you already own.

low-G · Mar 1, 2020

Video Games Are Dumb said:
That's exactly what it is. And sadly, it's pretty dang good but is so mismanaged it's hard to recommend.

I don't think that's what this is. You can play your own Steam games on this right? This isn't a walled garden where Nvidia is selling you games, is it?

This is renting a cloud server to play the games you already own, right?

As such users SHOULD be licensed to play the games they own on a different machine. There's no reason devs have to sign off on this.

OldDirtyGamer · Mar 1, 2020

Im not sure why devs are against this. You already payed for the game so why pull games?

Jarate · Mar 1, 2020

Video Games Are Dumb said:
Mmmmmmm no. Not a good take.

They never made a deal, they should be pissed.

Is paperspace, a company that offers the exact same thing, get their copies of this game taken down?

This is literally just a virtual machine running a game liscence already bought. This would be like denying access to your games if you wanted to play it a PC Cafe.

ss_lemonade · Mar 1, 2020

Kieli said:
Can someone clarify what Geforce NOW is? Is it like an operating system that allows you to play games on the Cloud? In that case, nVIDIA doesn't need to ask for permission (i.e. it's merely infrastructure to play games that a customer had already bought from the developers). If it's something more like OnLive or Gaikai (e.g. cloud subscription service), obviously they need the developer's support (licensing for a subscription as a service product).

You use servers provided by Nvidia through the cloud to play games you already own

Video Games Are Dumb · Mar 1, 2020

low-G said:
I don't think that's what this is. You can play your own Steam games on this right? This isn't a walled garden where Nvidia is selling you games, is it?

This is renting a cloud server to play the games you already own, right?

Oops you're right.

pksu · Mar 1, 2020

Kieli said:
Can someone clarify what Geforce NOW is? Is it like an operating system that allows you to play games on the Cloud? In that case, nVIDIA doesn't need to ask for permission (i.e. it's merely infrastructure to play games that a customer had already bought from the developers). If it's something more like OnLive or Gaikai (e.g. cloud subscription service), obviously they need the developer's support (licensing for a subscription as a service product).

They rent virtual machines using streamlined GUI. And for some reason it's completely different thing to play your own virtual copies on Nvidia's leased computer than on your own bare metal HW.

Gush · Mar 1, 2020

Video Games Are Dumb said:
Mmmmmmm no. Not a good take.

They never made a deal, they should be pissed.

Why? In what way are they harmed?

Komo · Mar 1, 2020

Kieli said:
Can someone clarify what Geforce NOW is? Is it like an operating system that allows you to play games on the Cloud? In that case, nVIDIA doesn't need to ask for permission (i.e. it's merely infrastructure to play games that a customer had already bought from the developers). If it's something more like OnLive or Gaikai (e.g. cloud subscription service), obviously they need the developer's support (licensing for a subscription as a service product).

Yes it is exactly that. You play your own games. So really why are developers removing their games off of these platforms? It seems seriously a waste of time and a bad gesture at that.

mugurumakensei · Mar 1, 2020

Jarate said:
Is paperspace, a company that offers the exact same thing, get their copies of this game taken down?

This is literally just a virtual machine running a game liscence already bought. This would be like denying access to your games if you wanted to play it a PC Cafe.

if it got noticed probably

Dunlop · Mar 1, 2020

Video Games Are Dumb said:
Mmmmmmm no. Not a good take.

They never made a deal, they should be pissed.

For what? The game had to be purchased from Steam and Nvidia makes nothing from that sale.

Cutting off potential customers.

How this bites these devs in the a$$

Kyle Cross · Mar 1, 2020

You're renting their computers, not the games. Only people with license to a game can play it on GeForce Now.

tombo85 · Mar 1, 2020

It just seems crazy that an indie developer would be upset that their game is being sold to a paying customer. This walled garden bs is something that we shouldn't see in 2020. What's next, you can't watch your movies on certain TVs

Giever · Mar 1, 2020

Based on the way GeForce Now works, they shouldn't need permission. That said, offering a graphics card as an apology is very dumb, lol.

GhostTrick · Mar 1, 2020

Why would they need their permission ?
You cant play the game if you dont own it on Steam.

Geforce Now is basically streaming a virtual machine to play games you own. It's streaming a computer you're renting.

That's greedy af.

Dec · Mar 1, 2020

This is dumb. They don't need permission. That they are removing games on request is probably covering their ass and not making publishers angry at them. Either way I look at any developer who refuses to allow their game on Geforce Now as either greedy fucks, or fucking idiots.

spam musubi · Mar 1, 2020

Yeah I don't agree with the dev here. Preventing users from playing a game they already own sucks. They don't lose any revenue here. Geforce Now simply gives you a PC on the cloud to play the games you already own.

low-G · Mar 1, 2020

mugurumakensei said:
if it got noticed probably

No, that would never happen. You can install a Steam game on as many computers as you wish to log onto, as long as it's not also SecurROM protected or something.

Quad Lasers · Mar 1, 2020

Love to own my customers because they dare played my game while taking a shit at work.

GhostTrick · Mar 1, 2020

But yeah, this is why the streaming future sucks. You can definitely see how some publishers and developpers are greedy and overprotective about stuff you already paid for.

Video Games Are Dumb · Mar 1, 2020

Dunlop said:
For what? The game had to be purchased from Steam and Nvidia makes nothing from that sale.

Cutting off potential customers.

How this bites these devs in the a$$

Well they're selling the service based on the ability to play YOUR game.

Let's say YOUR game has another cloud deal coming up, possibly exclusively.
Or let's just say you want to control the way YOUR game is available.
It's not just this indie dev, Activision and Bethesda jumped off too.
Clearly something was not communicated by Nvidia to developers.

mugurumakensei · Mar 1, 2020

Video Games Are Dumb said:
That's exactly what it is. And sadly, it's pretty dang good but is so mismanaged it's hard to recommend.

EDIT: me bad explain

Nope. It's a service to rent a VM.

ThreepwoodMighty · Mar 1, 2020

I played this game in the cloud using Steam's remote play. Are they going to freak out about that as well?

justiceiro · Mar 1, 2020

Deve should control where their games are sold, not played. Nvidia did nothing wrong.

Gush · Mar 1, 2020

ThreepwoodMighty said:
I played this game in the cloud using Steam's remote play. Are they going to freak out about that as well?

How dare you

Remark · Mar 1, 2020

From my experience with the GeForce Now beta isn't it just remote access to a powerful computer? Like you literally logged into Steam/B.net in there.

How is NVIDIA handling this where games are being removed?

Decarb · Mar 1, 2020

OldDirtyGamer said:
Im not sure why devs are against this. You already payed for the game so why pull games?

Nobody dislikes money or more exposure/sales, but people also don't like to be taken for granted. The least Nvidia could've done, short of making a deal, is to at least ask them before putting up their games for streaming.

GhostTrick · Mar 1, 2020

Video Games Are Dumb said:
Well they're selling the service based on the ability to play YOUR game.

Let's say YOUR game has another cloud deal coming up, possibly exclusively.
Or let's just say you want to control the way YOUR game is available.
It's not just this indie dev, Activision and Bethesda jumped off too.
Clearly something was not communicated by Nvidia to developers.

Yeah, YOUR game your already payed for.
What I do with my library is none of their business.

Gush · Mar 1, 2020

Remark said:
From my experience with the GeForce Now beta isn't it just remote access to a powerful computer? Like you literally logged into Steam/B.net in there.

Correct. When I tried GeForce Now to play Doom it was being played directly through my steam account.

Dunlop · Mar 1, 2020

Video Games Are Dumb said:
Well they're selling the service based on the ability to play YOUR game.

Let's say YOUR game has another cloud deal coming up, possibly exclusively.
Or let's just say you want to control the way YOUR game is available.
It's not just this indie dev, Activision and Bethesda jumped off too.
Clearly something was not communicated by Nvidia to developers.

As a customer of said game I don't really care. Nvidia is effectively me renting a PC, the dev received the same amount of profit from me as if I had a physical PC.

It's pure greed

OldDirtyGamer · Mar 1, 2020

Decarb said:
Nobody dislikes money or more exposure/sales, but people also don't like to be taken for granted. The least Nvidia could've done, short of making a deal, is to at least ask them before putting up their games for streaming.

I guess I agree with that but from the way the dev responded I don't think they would have allowed it anyway.

Kieli · Mar 1, 2020

Video Games Are Dumb said:
Well they're selling the service based on the ability to play YOUR game.

Let's say YOUR game has another cloud deal coming up, possibly exclusively.
Or let's just say you want to control the way YOUR game is available.
It's not just this indie dev, Activision and Bethesda jumped off too.
Clearly something was not communicated by Nvidia to developers.

I'm very afraid of the precedent this sets. I should be able to rent my computer/cloud computation from ANY cloud vendor (Azure, AWS, GCP, NOW) to play a game that I bought with my own money.

If I install a Steam client on this virtual computer, how would the developers know that I'm playing on Geforce NOW vs. my own computer. Even if they could tell, why would it matter?

Hella · Mar 1, 2020

Nvidia what in the world are you doing??

Remark · Mar 1, 2020

Decarb said:
Nobody dislikes money or more exposure/sales, but people also don't like to be taken for granted. The least Nvidia could've done, short of making a deal, is to at least ask them before putting up their games for streaming.

But in a sense your basically just renting a powerful computer to play said games. That's really what NVIDIA is making money off of. It's not a Stadia situation where the games are being individually added to the service from my understanding.

ThreepwoodMighty · Mar 1, 2020

Video Games Are Dumb said:
Mmmmmmm no. Not a good take.

They never made a deal, they should be pissed.

They shouldn't have to. People who paid for the game should be able to play it on any computer. It's still the same platform.

Kieli · Mar 1, 2020

Hella said:
Nvidia what in the world are you doing??

I'm going to argue nVIDIA actually doesn't need to do anything in this situation. They're renting you computers to play the games you bought.

Video Games Are Dumb · Mar 1, 2020

ThreepwoodMighty said:
They shouldn't have to. People who paid for the game should be able to play it on any computer. It's still the same platform.

ThereAreFourNaan · Mar 1, 2020

This is one of those things where ethically it's fine for them to not need specific permissions to rent you a server to play games you own, but legally you probably can block people from doing it.

The future sucks tbh.

BoredLemon · Mar 1, 2020

Video Games Are Dumb said:
Well they're selling the service based on the ability to play YOUR game.

I mean, they also sell graphics cards "based on the ability to play YOUR game", yet the idea that a graphics card's manufacturer needs to strike a deal for every game would sound ridiculous. And i don't see much difference, tbh. In both cases Nvidia just a hardware provider.

ThreepwoodMighty · Mar 1, 2020

Video Games Are Dumb said:

I guess we're just gonna have for Valve to release their own cloud service.

Decarb · Mar 1, 2020

Remark said:
But in a sense your basically just renting a powerful computer to play said games. That's really what NVIDIA is making money off of. It's not a Stadia situation where the games are being individually added to the service from my understanding.

I know, but since technically publishers can remove the games from GFNow, NV should've had seen this coming and taken them into consideration. If pubs couldn't remove their games at all no matter what then it would've been a different situation.

Dakkon · Mar 1, 2020

Decarb said:
Nobody dislikes money or more exposure/sales, but people also don't like to be taken for granted. The least Nvidia could've done, short of making a deal, is to at least ask them before putting up their games for streaming.

It's literally no different than PC Cafes letting you play games you own on their better computers and charging you for it.

And no, PC Cafes aren't going around to every developer asking for permission to let people play their games there. Because that'd be dumb.

Raphael van Lierop claims Nvidia added The Long Dark to GeForce Now without permission.

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