Red Dead Redemption 2 DF Analysis (Read OP)

JackEtc

Member
Oct 28, 2017
280
NYC
Now I’m split between XB1X and PS4 Pro....on the off chance I’ll enjoy the online all my friends are on the pro, and I have a $10 credit there from Sony; idk if a slightly higher image quality on my 1080p screen is worth it
 

pswii60

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,272
UK
There are other devs who managed to make good Pro ports, using exactly the same resolution and checkerboarding.

So yes, there is something wrong here. Hopefully it can be fixed/enhanced with a patch.
Indeed, and just imagine what the X version will look like when that gets fixed/enhanced with a patch too.
 

Tommyguns

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
549
I want to buy an X and get the 100 dollar off deal. Wonder if gamestop would allow me to purchase the digital copy of the game...
 

ODDI

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,087
Some of these hyperbolic responses here are unreal.

Thank God I don't have the time to count pixels tho I do appreciate the analysis DF did.
 

nib95

Member
Oct 28, 2017
10,317
Classic "lazy devs" in disguise here eh

Pretty poor timing for this argument too.

This is a demanding game, and according to DF, it still looks great on Pro, just considerably better on X. It is, afterall, a much more powerful machine.
It's not lazy devs argument in disguise, rather, it's merely a statement of truth, that there are better reconstruction implementations out there, and also the implication that the devs potentially messed up.

Fact is, at present this is a not a particularly well implemented checkerboard system, as Dark1x has himself alluded to. The PS4 Pro should obviously be better looking than the PS4 version by a good margin in all aspects (it is after all more than twice the performance and power) but the differences are smaller in certain areas than they should be due to poor reconstruction results.
 

Deleted member 41104

User Requested Account Closure
Banned
Mar 15, 2018
207
Pro is not absolutely a rushed hardware, come on now. It's a ps4 upgrade thinking for the 4k TV. MS needs to recover their image and they released an hardware to replace completely the base xbone. Look the IQ, is a mess in this console. They almost pretend it not exist. Sony couldn't risked to screw their userbase releasing a console which replaced the base sku otherwise to MS.

How is Microsoft screwing their userbase with the X ?

Sub 1080p resolutions existed since the beginning of the generation and well before the X even existed. This game is no different. The X simply there for enthusiasts, not the casual buyers.

Also you often speak about how performance (fps) is more important than resolution, yet the base PS4 isn’t even better than OG XB1 in that department. So in your same logic, Sony is screwing over their userbase with the Pro who offers better performance (which is more important than IQ/resolution according to you).

In the end, neither MS or Sony screwed their customers with midgen refresh, they just offered something more for their core userbase.
 
OP
OP
BladeX

BladeX

Member
Oct 30, 2017
773
And just out of curiosity... did you guys test engaging in combat in Snt Denis? If the Pro drops to 28-29 while simply traversing I wonder what happens if you start shooting things....
 

Golding

Member
Oct 25, 2017
447
Oooooh.. pro looks bad in those comparison shots.. jesus.
Xbox one x owners are the true winners here for sure.
 

Chris McQueen

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
4,002
London
I'll be playing this on my PS4 Pro. Whatever your preferred console of choice may be, fucking enjoy the game.

For everything else that's about to go down...
 

Voxels

Member
Oct 27, 2017
526
Well doesn't the Dev kits takes the base versions and "ports" it over to the Midrefresh consoles? It seems MS had much more to work with than on Sony's side.
 

Pharaoh

Member
Oct 27, 2017
577
Shame about the HDR. IMO a good HDR implementation does more for the game than 90% of the bells and whistles people fight over on this kinds of threads.
 

Spades

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,377
Nice. Xbox One X version sounding very awesome. This would have been such a bigger deal at the beginning of the gen.
 

g-m1n1

Member
Oct 27, 2017
248
Luxembourg
Other devs share code with R*? Did Ubi Montreal get a credit somewhere? CDPR send a tech team to rockstar studios? Other devs is just a bad argument.
Come on, isn't it possible to have a normal discussion on a forum?

I'm not looking for arguments, but looking at facts and recent examples.
If the other devs get it right, why shouldn't R*? They are the probably the biggest studio in the world.

They messed up something with their reconstruction technique.
of course CBR < native resolution, but still, it could be better implemented. Maybe it will get 'fixed' in a future patch.

However gamers around the world will still enjoy playing the game. Is it on a Pro or a standard PS4 / One S.
 

Yerffej

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,614
Having an X and Pro, the X is always the obvious choice and I'm glad I went with X, but I never pay attention to these comparison shots. It doesn't mean a thing in motion most times. If all you have is a Pro, it looks like you'll still be appropriately blown away. This thing looks alike a technical marvel, overall.
 

Malek

Member
Feb 15, 2018
551
User Warned - Lazy Dev Rhetoric
Christ, would it be possible that the X was the lead platform?
Sony getting lazy and releasing a half ass attempt of a pro console is what happened
That's what happens when you have a 2:1 lead over your competitor, you get greedy and blinded by all the money

it's the sole reason why i'm not expecting too much from PS5 going into next gen, Instead I'm more interested to see what MS brings to the table
 

VinFTW

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,364
It's not lazy devs argument in disguise, rather, it's merely a statement of truth, that there are better reconstruction implementations out there, and also the implication that the devs potentially messed up.

Fact is, at present this is a not a particularly well implemented checkerboard system, as Dark1x has himself alluded to. The PS4 Pro should obviously be better looking than the PS4 version by a good margin in all aspects (it is after all more than twice the performance and power) but the differences are smaller in certain areas than they should be due to poor reconstruction results.
No game is trying to do what RDR2 is doing, clearly, judging by the reviews.

You simply cannot compare this game with anything else out there. So, no, the devs didn't "mess up".

The fact is, what you see is what you get. Theres no "secret sauce", "coding" or "patch" to fix whatever you think is "wrong" with the game.

Also, the Pro is pushing more pixels than the base PS4. While you think it looks somewhat similar its probably not the case on your TV from a comfortable distance.


That's not a lazy dev post, it highlights a clear thing because it sounds like the same thing that affects the pro affects the s. It doesn't affect the x because of the power difference and they were able to hit native 4k.
Theres nothing "wrong" with what the developer did. It's less powerful hardware. It will look worse.

Not sure what's "wrong" about that


______________________________

Kinda tiring that whenever a game looks appropriately and significantly better on X that the rhetoric instantly changes to "the devs messed up!".
 

texhnolyze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,642
Indonesia
So.. are the textures better on the Xbox One X?
Seems like they're identical, just higher in resolution.
As far as I can tell, textures are identical on Pro and X but they do APPEAR sharper on X due to the superior resolution. The reconstruction messes with texture clarity.

I couldn't find any fluctuation in resolution - even in the busiest scenes - it was always came back as native 4K. We checked like 40 something shots too and had three different people including myself look at them.
 

Dark1x

Digital Foundry
Verified
Oct 26, 2017
2,817
Dark1x do you think that it would have been wiser to chosoe 3200x1800p/CB for the PS4 Pro? I mean generally if games on XB O X are Native 4K the PS4 Pro version is 1800p and if the XB O X version is 1800p the PS4 Pro version is either 1800p CB or 1440p.
So do you think it was possible to at least achieve 1800p either native or checkerboard on PS4 Pro? It will still offer better IQ and more pixels. I think since they released L.A Noire they didn't' try to search for another resolution method on PS4 Pro and used the same method here in RDR2.
The game is already using what seems to be checkerboard 4K so it would look worse with checkerboard 1800p.

Maybe this'll help demonstrate better...

Here's what PS4 Pro looks like if you snap a still shot ONE FRAME after a camera cut...

(view in separate window for 1:1 pixel)



...and here it is a few frames later once the TAA has resolved.



I think the way they reconstruct just doesn't work that well with their TAA and it creates a strange looking game.
 

EvilBoris

Member
Oct 29, 2017
5,612
It's not lazy devs argument in disguise, rather, it's merely a statement of truth, that there are better reconstruction implementations out there, and also the implication that the devs potentially messed up somewhere.
.
Or perhaps the rending of resolution goes deeper and everything is super finely tuned to deliver on all of the impressive technical feats that the game is clearly pulling off.
Perhaps the artists working on this considered the resolution to be secondary to the numerous endless other visuals technique.