[Reddit] Removing your support items in Anthem massively increases melee/combo/proc/ult damage

Oct 27, 2017
1,580
What a disaster.

What's sad is I have a friend who vehemently defends this broken mess. I think he's still in the denial phase.

The Division 2 is out for people who want a good Looter Shooter
 
Dec 13, 2017
663
Someone making design decisions seems to be clearly lacking in judgement at bioware. They don't even seem to be taking into account basic behaviour of their playerbase.
Game devs make design descision that don't account for certain player behaviors all the time that in restrospect are really dumb. Things that come to mind for me are the twisted sword for Diablo 3 where a party of one ET wizard and 3 zero DPS supports did far more damage than a party of four DPS builds and unkillable turtle builds in one of the Dark Souls games.

The complaints about this issue in Anthem seem a little bit baffling to me. In Diablo 3 if something like this happened I doubt hardly anyone would complain about it since everyone benefits from it.
 
Last edited:
Oct 25, 2017
2,530
I'm not an anthem player, just a bioware fan watching this trainwreck from the sidelines with a vague sense of concern for the company, but this is the latest hotness from Reddit

https://www.reddit.com/r/AnthemTheG...rscaling_why_loot_doesnt_matter_anymore_math/

This isn't exactly new, since it's more of a detailed explanation of why removing your stuff increases your damage, but it does mean that as of this new patch, you have no reason to collect more loot from your looter shooter.

You just need one legendary weapon, and that's it.
It's pretty clear why the game has no stat sheet now. It's all bogus numbers that don't mean anything.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,044
Clear.price gaming or some such. dude is like filip mucin as he has good editing skills but his videos are increadibly shallow and are just summaries with no original thought. Some of his videos also waste a lot of run time on the intro and outros that the actual content is much shorter than it seems.
 
Oct 26, 2017
4,692
I'm not an anthem player, just a bioware fan watching this trainwreck from the sidelines with a vague sense of concern for the company, but this is the latest hotness from Reddit

https://www.reddit.com/r/AnthemTheG...rscaling_why_loot_doesnt_matter_anymore_math/

This isn't exactly new, since it's more of a detailed explanation of why removing your stuff increases your damage, but it does mean that as of this new patch, you have no reason to collect more loot from your looter shooter.

You just need one legendary weapon, and that's it.

this explanation is just insane.................no wonder a stat sheet doesn't exist...........all the numbers are bullshit.

maybe bioware should just kill the scaling. There is a reason so many online games and RPGs don't do it and if they do its max level down......not the otherway around.



This isn't going to be fixed in one patch, the entire systems around damage and scaling are completely broken. They basically need to rewrite how 1-30 and powerlevel works. This game is fucked.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,412
Developer just replied, saying they have a hotfix

https://www.reddit.com/r/AnthemTheG...snt_matter_anymore_math/eillnya/?context=1000

Darokaz said:
Spoke with the designer on this so I understand how it's being "fixed".
Instead of using how many items you actually have equipped, the calculation will be done by how many slots you have unlocked. This means at level 30, for example, your average power score will be divided by 11 even if you have empty weapon/gear/component slots.
The people replying to it are saying that that doesn't fix the core issue tho, so *shrug*
 
Oct 26, 2017
288
BioWare community manager posted this:


Spoke with the designer on this so I understand how it's being "fixed".
Instead of using how many items you actually have equipped, the calculation will be done by how many slots you have unlocked. This means at level 30, for example, your average power score will be divided by 11 even if you have empty weapon/gear/component slots.”

There’s a pretty big problem with this though - it doesn’t fix the issue.
 
Oct 25, 2017
876
I was thinking about the mod system, talents and reconfiguring you can do to the equipment you have in the Division 2 and now this? Just counting the loot system here, it's like cavemen vs the military.
 
Oct 28, 2017
208
Legitimate question: why do people still play this game? It must be some morbid curiosity in helping to test the game or find additional problems. Why waste hours and hours finding the “perfect roll” on gear when the gear stats in some cases mean literally nothing and in other cases will be completely redefined over the course of the next few months?
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,344
Legitimate question: why do people still play this game? It must be some morbid curiosity in helping to test the game or find additional problems. Why waste hours and hours finding the “perfect roll” on gear when the gear stats in some cases mean literally nothing and in other cases will be completely redefined over the course of the next few months?
Probably:
  1. Expectation that the gear scaling will be fixed (they actually claimed today that it will be fixed in 1.0.4, the next patch)
  2. Legendary loot is still more interesting than the more "powerful" common loot
They responded in that specific reddit thread (about how loot is broken) and said it will be fixed. That's surprising...it seems like a systemic thing that requires more time. I'm not a game dev, though, so I really have no idea.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,128
I was hooked on Dragon Age Inquisition Multiplayer, and a lot of problems were in that game, like some of the skill enhancing rings not working, and thanks to their very limited UI information you couldn't even tell. For over all stats you had to add them, looking over the numbers in the different gears, and your prestige amount for each attribute to determine the statistics you're interesting in knowing.

Hopefully now that they know how they should provide info, and make sure gear works correctly, this will make Dragon Age 4 so much better. If they end up finishing it before EA require their head I will concede that Anthem happening right after another Sci-Fi game was worth it.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,344
So here is Bioware on how they're addressing this: https://www.reddit.com/r/AnthemTheG...snt_matter_anymore_math/eillnya/?context=1000
Spoke with the designer on this so I understand how it's being "fixed".

Instead of using how many items you actually have equipped, the calculation will be done by how many slots you have unlocked. This means at level 30, for example, your average power score will be divided by 11 even if you have empty weapon/gear/component slots.
Isn't this just fixing the illusion of power and not the actual damage scaling? I mean, if you are lower level and can only equip 7 pieces of gear, the scaling is better for you vs when you have 11 pieces. The difference will be that, since you won't have very powerful gear at lower level, you won't notice.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,999
So here is Bioware on how they're addressing this: https://www.reddit.com/r/AnthemTheG...snt_matter_anymore_math/eillnya/?context=1000

Isn't this just fixing the illusion of power and not the actual damage scaling? I mean, if you are lower level and can only equip 7 pieces of gear, the scaling is better for you vs when you have 11 pieces. The difference will be that, since you won't have very powerful gear at lower level, you won't notice.
Yes, yes, and yes, this is exactly what this sounds like.

I don't get BioWare's obsession with scaling opposite to what loot is supposed to be doing. There's more than one idea I have that I think would work better, but then I realize that they must have had these too and still went with this scaling. Why?
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,926
Oct 26, 2017
288
Yes, yes, and yes, this is exactly what this sounds like.

I don't get BioWare's obsession with scaling opposite to what loot is supposed to be doing. There's more than one idea I have that I think would work better, but then I realize that they must have had these too and still went with this scaling. Why?
My guess - it’s so they can then scale you to NPC enemies.

The whole game is the illusion of progress - I’ve been in Grand Master 1 groups before with low level players as for some reason the game has match made me with well below level 30 players, and they got on absolutely fine as, I presume, everything to scaled for them.

Same with you can play the story missions with level 1 and level 20 characters in same group and it makes no difference.

Say with The Division 2, if you run off to level 10 missions at level 2 you will get murdered in one shot. It has exact character stats. I think these things are related.
 
Oct 25, 2017
814
My guess - it’s so they can then scale you to NPC enemies.

The whole game is the illusion of progress - I’ve been in Grand Master 1 groups before with low level players as for some reason the game has match made me with well below level 30 players, and they got on absolutely fine as, I presume, everything to scaled for them.

Same with you can play the story missions with level 1 and level 20 characters in same group and it makes no difference.

Say with The Division 2, if you run off to level 10 missions at level 2 you will get murdered in one shot. It has exact character stats. I think these things are related.
But you can also get matched up and have your level scale up to the content in Division 2. That's the whole point of having normalized stats.
 
Oct 28, 2017
1,663
Yeah... I feel like the 4-tomb-wall was supposed to be much more than it turned out to be. Like, each tomb was supposed to be some unique dungeon/gameplay experience but they had to cut all that for time and instead made those achievement-type requirements to take up the missing time.
The fact that you unlock a tomb after grinding arbitrary stats and load into a 10x10 room with nothing in it but a little glowing casket to get 200 coins does not seem like it turned out how it was originally intended.

Anthem reminds me of The Phantom Pain - another game that ran out of development time and is cobbled together with unfinished concepts.
 
Oct 26, 2017
1,357
England
Blizzard made the exact same mistake last year in the BfA expansion. Level scaling so poorly designed that players quickly realized if they unequipped the legendary amulet the game's expansion is built around, their characters actually ended up being more powerful. It's an issue many level-scaled games face, and it's hard to find one that does it well. It's a shame Bioware didn't learn from Blizzard's identical mistake though before pushing this patch.

Regarding WoW's level scaling, also from Reddit last year:

Blizzard has mobs scaling in power to match your bagged iLvL when in open-world BFA content. So, by unequipping high iLvL trinkets, rings, and your Heart of Azeroth, you can reduce your iLvL significantly while keeping your DPS relatively less impacted. The result of this is a lower TTK (faster kill time) on most mobs...

Bungie/Destiny uses the same mob scaling in their games, and of course one of the biggest complaints about progression in that game is that there's no feeling of becoming more powerful. You are always either under-geared, or just good enough. Having full raid gear in Destiny means you're just as viable as someone who just hit max level. Now that same mechanic is in BFA (was in Legion too), but is implemented in a far worse way.

This is poor game design. There is no feeling of power progression, just a grind with for a number that no longer has meaning. Equipping more powerful gear should always result in an increased feeling of power. This is a core concept of an RPG, and Blizzard has intentionally undermined it.