SNES has a jitter that combined with the 60.08hz refresh rate causes incompatibility issues with some displays.
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Retro AV Thread |OT| RGB, CRTs, Upscalers, and More
- Thread starter ShinJohnpv
- Start date
Sorry if this isn't the right place to ask. I don't want to make a new thread just for this question.
I was wondering if Wii games would look better running on a Wii U hooked up to my 4K TV or on the Wii hooked up to a trinitron via component cables? I'm wanting to play a few Wii games tonight and want the best picture.
Thanks.
I was wondering if Wii games would look better running on a Wii U hooked up to my 4K TV or on the Wii hooked up to a trinitron via component cables? I'm wanting to play a few Wii games tonight and want the best picture.
Thanks.
480p CRT is the *ideal* way to play Wii games natively IMO.
OSSC line2x to 960p is the best way to play natively on a flat screen TV.
Dolphin can be amazing but that's emulation and it's still not 100% compatible.
OSSC line2x to 960p is the best way to play natively on a flat screen TV.
Dolphin can be amazing but that's emulation and it's still not 100% compatible.
OP
OP
It depends on your needs and situation. Right now its still better at deinterlacing than the other options IMHO, it has the greatest compatibility with TVs and Receivers, and supports Composite, and S-Video. The current OSSC has better color handling, no lag, but bob deinterlacing is terrible (least to me), has much greater compatibility issues, and only supports RGB, Component, and I believe VGA.
It really is 6 of one and half a dozen of another. The OSSC pro is definitely going to change some things, and shake some stuff up. We'll have to wait till its out to see how it ends up handling deinterlacing, and how its compatibility is. I do wish they had gone with including Composite, and S-Video right off the bat though, instead of requiring an input add on board.
Not everything has an RGB or Component mod, and some stuff I don't know if we'll ever see one for them.
That's my personal take on things though.
I'm really looking mainly for ps2/xbox/sega saturn on a 4k tv.
OP
OP
OSSC seems to have better compatibility with 4K tvs, but PS2 is going to be mostly 480i. So it depends on how you feel about bob deinterlacing. Personally for me I far prefer the Framemeister's deinterlacing. Xbox is going to have a fair share of 480i stuff too but I believe more of it is going to be 480p which the OSSC handles better. Saturn is 240p and both handle it great, though OSSC with less lag.
The OSSC Pro could potentially match or best the FM in deinterlacing. It remains to be seen.
The og Xbox is 100% 480p after a softmod, which the OSSC Pro should easily integer scale to 960p in a 1080p window. It'll surely have better picture quality for 480p sources than the FM
The og Xbox is 100% 480p after a softmod, which the OSSC Pro should easily integer scale to 960p in a 1080p window. It'll surely have better picture quality for 480p sources than the FM
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Different ports. The PSIO Uses the Parallel port not the serial port. It was only used for the PS Link Cable.
You can see them labeled in this image. The port the PSIO Uses is the big one that was eventually removed.
Going to pick up a jvc av-32d305 today. Was going to pick up a 32" Trinitron, but it is like 50lbs heavier, so fuck that.
Found a KV-G21S1 at a second hand shop near me. Only has composite in but apparently it's one of the easier models to RGB mod, the idea opening up a CRT is still hella intimidating though.
how are Hyperkin? i discovered this which i assume would be equally as good as the compontent adapter https://hyperkinlab.com/hdtv-cable-for-psp-2000-and-3000-models-hyperkin/
Quick search online and it looks like the oem Sony cable is about the same price. Any reason not to go that route?
i actually have component cables but i'm looking to get a new tv and none of them seem to have component only composite and my reciever only does same port in and out so it doesn't do component conversion either
Sorry, completely missed that the hyperkin one is hdmi. I thought it was component also.
Hello, I am so glad I found this thread. I had a question that is probably decently common.
I got a Sony PVM and an older low-latency HDTV that both have component cables. Most folk are using Scart cables now to get RGB quality out of their old consoles because it is a good deal more affordable than all the limited availability specialty component cables. However, my PVM and that HDTV both use component.
What is a good or typically used SCART to component converter? Preferably with audio, not just the 3 video colors/ports.
Thanks!
I got a Sony PVM and an older low-latency HDTV that both have component cables. Most folk are using Scart cables now to get RGB quality out of their old consoles because it is a good deal more affordable than all the limited availability specialty component cables. However, my PVM and that HDTV both use component.
What is a good or typically used SCART to component converter? Preferably with audio, not just the 3 video colors/ports.
Thanks!
RGB2COMP | RetroTINK
Analog transcoder to convert RGB video to component video. Supports 240p/480i/288p/576i/480p/720p/1080i and custom resolutions 1x SCART input 5x RCA output (Y, Pb, Pr, Left, Right) Rec. 601 conversion matrix Note: includes microUSB cord for power. Due to the many different types of plugs, we...
www.retrotink.com
Anyone here with an OSSC and an OLED TV and use BFI when gaming on older consoles? Tonight I decided to play some SNES and some Zelda:LTTP and decided to play around with the BFI setting on the TV. I turned it on and then upped the OLED Light setting to 100 (from the 53 it's usually at in my calibrated SDR modes) to compensate for the brightness loss and it looks really nice to me.
Now, LTTP isn't really something that suffers horribly from motion blur due to its art style, but I then switched over to my Dreamcast and threw in Phantasy Star Online and in the Forest level, the difference is really apparent on textures and blurriness with BFI off and on.
I think I can play this way constantly so long as this isn't going to hurt the TV. I can't see why it would though, OLED Light is at 100% in all the HDR modes anyway.
Now, LTTP isn't really something that suffers horribly from motion blur due to its art style, but I then switched over to my Dreamcast and threw in Phantasy Star Online and in the Forest level, the difference is really apparent on textures and blurriness with BFI off and on.
I think I can play this way constantly so long as this isn't going to hurt the TV. I can't see why it would though, OLED Light is at 100% in all the HDR modes anyway.
Not only might I try this, but you just made me realize I was retroactively starting to think that nintendo had dimmed Wii Virtual Console games in the same way they infamously did on the WU, because of how dim the OSSC is. The games still look great, but I bet they'd look a lot better with some tweaking.
Thanks for this post, you got some wheels turning in my head.
Well, to be clear, the OSSC wasn't making it dimmer in my situation, turning on BFI on my TV made it dimmer. However, video gain for all the color channels (and an overall video gain too I believe) can be adjusted on the OSSC to make the output brighter if you want regardless of what your set is doing.
I really need to update the firmware on mine to find out what it's truly capable of. I'm still poking around using the display on the front of the unit and don't yet have access to the OSD.
Until I started this N64 mod, I've been more or less happy with how it works out of the box with my GC/PS2/Wii.
Edit: It doesn't help that I lost the power supply and need to find a new one that won't fry it.
You don't gain any new functionality from having the OSD aside from the OSD itself. It's merely displaying what's on the front LCD on your TV screen. If my work network didn't block the OSSC wiki site I could point you to the setting and where they are in the menus, but alas, I can't right now.
Hardest part of the Worthington N64 mod is done. Think I'm done for the day, my hands are shaky now.
impressive! How long have you been soldering for?
OP
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For anyone looking Castlemania games seems to have Virtual Taps back in stock
castlemaniagames.com
Virtual Tap - Embedded video-out mod board for the Nintendo VirtualBoy
If you've ever wanted to be able to play the VirtualBoy without having a seizure, or in a different color than red, if you want to stream gameplay from real hardware, or if you've want to use a projector to show off your awesome sk1LLz at shows and expos, now you can! Features: Pixel-perfect...
castlemaniagames.com
The new 'My Life in Gaming' video is worth a watch.
Serves as a nice introduction for those looking to get their head around some of the common areas around playing old games in the modern era.
Looking forward to where they take the series from here.
Serves as a nice introduction for those looking to get their head around some of the common areas around playing old games in the modern era.
Looking forward to where they take the series from here.
Thanks! I've been repairing my own gear since I was a teenager, my dad is in the sciences and builds his own instruments so I had a good teacher.
I also have been doing stained glass as a hobby for a long time, which also involves soldering, albeit with quite a bit less precision.
This is easily the hardest job I've tried though, and required both buying some new gear, and practicing on some discarded PCBs with similar chips. It really exposed some flaws in my technique. Testing with a multimeter, I don't appear to have bridged anything, but I had quite the time with the (poorly) tinned wire tips fanning out when i applied pressure to them with the iron.
Yeah and I should've linked to the thread in here since this has become "main" retro thread even though that's what the RetroEra OT was supposed to be.
My Life in Gaming 5-part docuseries "Analog Frontiers"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0AOzKwStM0 They're hoping to have all five parts out by this summer.
www.resetera.com
So I wanted to get a low-cost/low-fuss setup going for my consoles and wanted some opinions.
I have an unmodded NES, SNES, Genesis Model 2, unmodded N64, PSOne, PS2, GameCube.
I was thinking of going:
NES - Composite
SNES - HD Retrovision
Genesis - HD Retrovision
N64 - S-Video
All going into a RetroTINK 2xPro and then into an HDMI hub.
As well:
PSOne - RAD2X (or maybe an HD Retrovision into the RetroTINK depending)
GameCube - Carby
Both into the HDMI hub.
And then the HDMI hub into an MCable MClassic and then into a 4KTV.
The big outlier is the PS2. I do have official component cables for it but AFAIK there is no good HDMI solution, only compromises. If I sent it the RetroTINK or got a second RAD2X I couldn't use progressive scan features on games.
I have an unmodded NES, SNES, Genesis Model 2, unmodded N64, PSOne, PS2, GameCube.
I was thinking of going:
NES - Composite
SNES - HD Retrovision
Genesis - HD Retrovision
N64 - S-Video
All going into a RetroTINK 2xPro and then into an HDMI hub.
As well:
PSOne - RAD2X (or maybe an HD Retrovision into the RetroTINK depending)
GameCube - Carby
Both into the HDMI hub.
And then the HDMI hub into an MCable MClassic and then into a 4KTV.
The big outlier is the PS2. I do have official component cables for it but AFAIK there is no good HDMI solution, only compromises. If I sent it the RetroTINK or got a second RAD2X I couldn't use progressive scan features on games.
Wow. I'm glad you said that. I desperately need to mod my N64 to better integrate it with my setup. It needs component out. S-video to Retrotink2x to OSSC is just not cutting it! As I have no soldering experience I'll just pay someone. Worthington's RGB mod supports component out, right? And it works with any N64 model as well?
Here's the page https://etim.net.au/n64rgb/
According to him, the supported cables are PAL SNES RGB SCART, and Gamecube RGB SCART. (This is similar in quality to component if I'm not mistaken.) Fortunately for me, I picked up what I believe to be the latter when I was in australia a long time ago.
It seems there are some places that will do the installation for you. I think you may need to provide them with the chip though, and specify which cable you have.
I'm going to be using it with an OSSC, so I'll post updates in here once I finish the remaining wiring.
I also ordered an extra switch he offered, to toggle the added de-blur feature the chip has (without de-blur on left, with de-blur on the right):
N64 RGB Mod Comparison | Snail Tooth Gaming
There are two different ways to RGB mod a Nintendo 64 depending on what model of the console you have. Is one better than the other? Lets find out!
www.snailtoothgaming.com
So I was just looking to get an OSSC and saw that the Pro was announced a few weeks ago.
So I'm guessing it would make more sense for me to wait? I'll mainly be using it for PS1/Dreamcast/PS2/GameCube/Wii on a 4K Sony tv. Hearing about how the current OSSC handles 480i makes me think to wait. I'm just a bit unsure about how hard it'll be to preorder or get waitlisted for.
So I'm guessing it would make more sense for me to wait? I'll mainly be using it for PS1/Dreamcast/PS2/GameCube/Wii on a 4K Sony tv. Hearing about how the current OSSC handles 480i makes me think to wait. I'm just a bit unsure about how hard it'll be to preorder or get waitlisted for.
Only problem I can see is that you should only have one input (composite/s-video/component) connected to the RetroTINK2x at the same time so you'll have to unplug whatever you're not using. They say you can technically have everything plugged in but they warn to make sure to never power on multiple consoles at the same time.
Also, the pro shares the luma connection (green cable) with composite video so you'll have to plug/unplug your NES whenever you want to play that. But since you didn't mention a component switch I guess you'll be plugging/unplugging things anyway.
Assuming the pro's production time is longer than the OSSC due to the increased complexity, it probably won't be available to pre-order for several months and then wouldn't ship till later in the year, that said it does sound like it'll be noticably better at 480i, so if you can wait it would be worth it.
Personally I'm happy with the OSSC's deinterlacing, as I play on a small monitor, but I'd imagine it could be annoying on a large 4k screen.
I was going to use a component switch and passive cable joiners to have everything connected.
Basically SNES/Genesis/PS2 into component on the switch and NES into the composite, cable joiner to join the Green and Yellow outs to both go into green, then two joiners for the audio cables to join the switch and N64 audio.
I assume you mean RCA y-adapters. I don't know if they'd give you any trouble since you'd be backfeeding the consoles you're not using with the ones you are. It wouldn't be a problem with the HDRV SNES and Genesis cables because they have specific circuitry in them to prevent this but the N64 (audio) and NES (both audio and composite) would have no such protection. I don't know how much, if any, damage can occur but it'll make audio lower than it should be.
Third Party — HD Retrovision
hdretrovision.squarespace.com
Something like the gcompsw can have component and composite sources plugged in at the same time so only the N64 would be on its own.
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Hmm... I didn't realize there could be issues with y-adapters. I currently have my SNES and N64 hookup up via S-Video y-adapter to my old LCD and haven't had issues.I assume you mean RCA y-adapters. I don't know if they'd give you any trouble since you'd be backfeeding the consoles you're not using with the ones you are. It wouldn't be a problem with the HDRV SNES and Genesis cables because they have specific circuitry in them to prevent this but the N64 (audio) and NES (both audio and composite) would have no such protection. I don't know how much, if any, damage can occur but it'll make audio lower than it should be.
Third Party — HD Retrovision
Something like the gcompsw can have component and composite sources plugged in at the same time so only the N64 would be on its own.
Maybe I'll get an RCA audio 2-1 switch and just manually swap the yellow and green then. Or do you think I could plug my NES into the green of the switch instead of the yellow? It doesn't process the signal, just transmits it so it should work that way, right?
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Yeah, you'd be able to use the switch to do both component and composite into the RetroTINK. If the switch is automatic then you'd have to see what it uses to detect the input. If it's a manual switch then it doesn't matter at all.
Here's the page https://etim.net.au/n64rgb/
According to him, the supported cables are PAL SNES RGB SCART, and Gamecube RGB SCART. (This is similar in quality to component if I'm not mistaken.) Fortunately for me, I picked up what I believe to be the latter when I was in australia a long time ago.
It seems there are some places that will do the installation for you. I think you may need to provide them with the chip though, and specify which cable you have.
I'm going to be using it with an OSSC, so I'll post updates in here once I finish the remaining wiring.
I also ordered an extra switch he offered, to toggle the added de-blur feature the chip has (without de-blur on left, with de-blur on the right):
N64 RGB Mod Comparison | Snail Tooth Gaming
There are two different ways to RGB mod a Nintendo 64 depending on what model of the console you have. Is one better than the other? Lets find out!
Thanks for that. I really don't want to add more SCART cables in to my setup. I have a nice component switch that does a great job, and I've been really happy with HD Retrovision products (versus the questionable quality of some SCART manufacturers).
I may wait for something pre-modded with Borti's Advanced RGB mod. Unfortunately neither of my N64s are compatible with the mod Voultar sells and installs, and the cost for an unmodified console in decent shape these days is over $100. Even at $300-$350, a pre-modded N64 with RGB/component out seems like a good deal.
I am looking for advice on connecting to an NEC MultiSync FE700 VGA computer monitor. I have YpbPr component cables (HD Retrovision) for several systems (PS2, Wii, Saturn), Carby Component for GameCube, and SCART RGB for Dreamcast & PS1. I also have a MiSTer with an IO board, as well as Analogue Super Nt and Mega Sg.
Any and all suggestions are welcome!
Any and all suggestions are welcome!
OP
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For anything that is 240p or 480i you're going to have to have it line doubled or deinterlaced to 480p at least. So maybe something like the retrotink2x or OSSC, though I think they both only output HDMI, so you would then need a VGA to HDMI converter in the line. For 480p component sources I believe you should just need a component to VGA adapter. I can say that 480p GameCube games look amazing on a VGA monitor. Back in the day I had a second pair of component cables modded into VGA cables for the GameCube and would play my 480p games that way. Dreamcast actually has VGA boxes that would support directly going into a VGA monitor so maybe look into that. Analogue NT, and Mega SG, you might be able to set them to 720p and use an HDMI to VGA converter, otherwise it would be setting them to 480p and then doing the HDMI to VGA converter.
I've never done a set up like that and I'm just kind of spitballing/guessing here so maybe someone with similar set up as what you want could chime in.
At least for the PS2, Saturn, PS1, you could do the 240p/480i stuff to the Tink/OSSC and then hdmi to VGA to the monitor. Some PS2, I believe all Wii and most Gamecube games support 480p and with component you should be able to do a component to VGA adapter. That monitor supports up to 1280 x 1024, so you MIGHT beable to get 240p line 3x or 4x into it, and MAYBE 480p line 2x into it. Analog stuff tends to be a bit more loosey goosey with exact standards. That said though I don't have an OSSC, or that monitor so I can't say for certain if those will definitely work into them.
Looks like a quality monitor, but it won't quite work with what you've got, the MiSTer should be fine, as the IO boards have VGA out and the Dreamcast could work if you got a VGA box (behar bros make the best ones, but there's alot of cheaper options) everything else will need converting which ShinJohnpv has already said more about than I know.
I'll also mention that the multi sync name usually means that it can accept 240p (15Hz) images, as computers like the Amiga used this resolution, so you may not need a line doubler, but you will need something to convert the signal to VGA.
Okay, this is my proposed setup.
Probably a noob question, but how do I make a figure for the setup like this?