• The GiftBot 2.0 Launch Giveaway Extravaganza has come to a close with an astounding 8073 games given away to the community by 696 members, a huge success thanks to you! The gifting now continues with more official prizes in the new Gaming Giveaways |OT|. Leftover Steam codes are also being given away to the PC Gaming Era community.

Richard Tyler Blevins (Ninja) believes bans for games shouldn't happen to content creators (Update: He regrets saying that)

ohitsluca

Member
Oct 29, 2017
395
Your original response which started this dialog stated that the quoted information in the OP and title were misrepresenting what he said. So to me, this means you simply took what was said in a different way from what myself and others took. I simply asked you to clarify if what he said was in fact true. It took you 3 responses to finally confirm this and it's because you don't feel it's accurate. I don't have a problem with that. But to say the actual quote is misrepresenting him, I don't agree with at all. It's like a 'well that's not what he meant' excuse and that doesn't jive with me.

If he said something to alter this response in a video or whatever, that's beyond the scope of what I asked about. The quote was correct, but you think it meant something else. That's it. The question from me wasn't flawed at all, I think you simply tried to avoid it because you were dead set on saying it wasn't what he meant.
You’re right, In my original post I said the title and quote were misrepresented. That is not exactly what I mean to say — I intended to say the thread title is misrepresenting the quote, which is a totally accurate quote.

This isn’t a case of reading things two different ways — he just simply doesn’t say the kid “shouldn’t have been banned”. In the quote, or in the video. He does explicitly say he thinks it should have been a less severe punishment, “I’m not saying he shouldn’t have been banned AT ALL”, just not permanently.

Yet the thread title, video title, and thumbnail all say that. Again, I would urge you to point me to where he says that in the quote or in the video. Now, again if we wanna have a discussion about him advocating for less harsh punishments only for streamers, let’s do it because that’s a horrible take. But that would require you to actually watch the video first
 

justiceiro

Member
Oct 30, 2017
4,189
WTF! I had supported some statements made by him on the past, but this is pure shit. Rules should apply to everyone equally, specially when the only detriment to it is someone's popularity. What a disgusting stance to take.

No wonder some companies don't want anyone make a living out of streaming their games, if it is a excuse to gain leverage over the rules of the any game's online community.
 

____

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,209
Miami, FL
LOL but why should I face consequences for my immoral actions that make me monies?! Think about my monies!!
 

Luthor

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,458
US, California
You’re right, In my original post I said the title and quote were misrepresented. That is not exactly what I mean to say — I intended to say the thread title is misrepresenting the quote, which is a totally accurate quote.

This isn’t a case of reading things two different ways — he just simply doesn’t say the kid “shouldn’t have been banned”. In the quote, or in the video. He does explicitly say he thinks it should have been a less severe punishment, “I’m not saying he shouldn’t have been banned AT ALL”, just not permanently.

Yet the thread title, video title, and thumbnail all say that. Again, I would urge you to point me to where he says that in the quote or in the video. Now, again if we wanna have a discussion about him advocating for less harsh punishments only for streamers, let’s do it because that’s a horrible take. But that would require you to actually watch the video first
I watched the video and what's really odd to me, is that he doesn't really seem to know what he's trying to say. On one hand he says that there's no way he should have been perm banned and then next he says there should be just a little favoritism with content creators which means he's not really too bothered by it. So he seems to go back and forth with what he thinks should have happened. All the other guys he's talking with seem to be like most here and say why should known people get away with it but not unknowns, which he then says he's not saying, but then basically says he does feel they should because it will cost the game devs money because of views, coverage, etc. I don't know, he's all over the place to me.
 

Jobbs

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,776
This is no different IMO. The punishment is too harsh. The guys future is turned upside down from this. He should be banned for a good while, 6 months? Followed by a limited access probation period.
No one is entitled to a life of luxury playing games for millions of dollars. If he's such a talented content creator I'm sure he'll find a way to make a living without this one particular game. Fortnite isn't forever. It may be the biggest game now, and maybe for the next few years, who knows -- but it won't be the biggest game for the rest of our lives.

Also: Fuck cheaters. Not only should he not be held to a lower standard just because he's a Content Creator, but if he was given a pass on this it would just encourage the use of these hacks which is ruining online games, particularly BRs. Ask anyone who plays PUBG if they've ever been killed by a cheater and what it felt like. I'm not sure they'd decide it was worth it as long as the person who killed them was a Content Creator
 

Tophat Jones

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,071
I'm a hypocrite because I listen sports podcasts all day at work.

But man these 'content creators' seem so up their own asses and annoying. Not all I'm sure, but every time one of these people come across my feed for they seem extremely annoying at best, and racist shit heads at worst.
 

L Thammy

Spacenoid
Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,629
I watched the video and what's really odd to me, is that he doesn't really seem to know what he's trying to say. On one hand he says that there's no way he should have been perm banned and then next he says there should be just a little favoritism with content creators which means he's not really too bothered by it. So he seems to go back and forth with what he thinks should have happened. All the other guys he's talking with seem to be like most here and say why should known people get away with it but not unknowns, which he then says he's not saying, but then basically says he does feel they should because it will cost the game devs money because of views, coverage, etc. I don't know, he's all over the place to me.
Sometimes statements come across as wishy-washy because the person saying them knows they shouldn't but really wants to.
 

Tokyo_Funk

Member
Dec 10, 2018
2,322
"I'm popular at X sport, therefore I should not be banned for using performance enhancing drugs"

Sounds stupid in this context, sounds stupid in Ninja's context.
 

ohitsluca

Member
Oct 29, 2017
395
I watched the video and what's really odd to me, is that he doesn't really seem to know what he's trying to say. On one hand he says that there's no way he should have been perm banned and then next he says there should be just a little favoritism with content creators which means he's not really too bothered by it. So he seems to go back and forth with what he thinks should have happened. All the other guys he's talking with seem to be like most here and say why should known people get away with it but not unknowns, which he then says he's not saying, but then basically says he does feel they should because it will cost the game devs money because of views, coverage, etc. I don't know, he's all over the place to me.
I came away with the impression that he is basically advocating for a slap on the wrist (solely because the kid is a streamer)... at one point he specifically says the ban should have been 6 months ‘or something’. And at another point he says “I’m not saying he shouldn’t have been banned at all”

Which I totally disagree with... I think cheating bans should be permanent bans, period. Regardless of who you are. That said... if this was a case where he did it offline for a video, I wouldn’t agree with but I would at least understand the argument for it not being permanent.

But yeah you’re right...Him saying Epic shouldn’t permanently ban him because they will lose publicity for the game is absurd and clearly Epic didn’t think twice about it. Fortnite will be fine without him lol
 

Sloth

Member
Nov 27, 2017
10
This definitely isn’t a good look for ninja. Fully expect this to be his last social media post that isn’t vetted by Microsoft first.
 

Shawcroft

Member
Oct 29, 2017
302
I thought he was an idiot before when he repeatedly put his foot in his mouth, but, holy shit, what a fucking idiot.

Also it's fantastic how in a very silly microcosm this mirrors a lot of problems... "Yes, it's against the rules, but he's big, he made money, he shouldn't get punished for it!"

Great stuff.
 
Nov 14, 2017
1,056
On one hand I kind of get what he's saying. A regular person getting banned means nothing to them other than not playing the game. A creator getting banned is essentially firing them from their job (whether you agree that it should be a job or not is a moot point here). However, people get fired from their jobs every day and this shouldn't be any different. Don't do something stupid and you won't get fired.
Exactly my thoughts.
 

Potterson

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,911
You can't arrest politicians, they have power to loose. What do normal power have to loose? Not that much, arrest them.
 
Nov 3, 2017
2,202
I read the whole article to see if there was some nuance or perspective that was lacking in the quote, but nope. It’s as completely naive and self centred as the thread title implied.

In a way, I understand how he’s come to this bizarro view of the world. The economics of streaming are completely fucked and wrap people into this black mirror universe where your worth as a human being is based on followers and income

Ninja and those of his ilk have been made richer than almost any other individual in the world (even moreso relative to his age cohort) because they are popular video game streamers. Like the whole income not being proportional to social utility thing is a tale as old as human civilisation, but I feel streaming has taken this to another level.

The closest analogue would be entertainers, but at least for that profession, there is a narrative of artistic performance and expertise that entertainers can tell themselves as justifying their fame and fortune. Streamers are dependent on products made and owned by other people - literally the only metric they can show to validate their self worth are their followers.

There’s also the whole fucked up parasocial relationship that is core to the streaming experience. While entertainers often also live in gilded worlds themselves, they still have to interact with real human people on a day to day basis. Streamers don’t even need to do that. The usual human interaction they have on the job is in reading comments from faceless usernames.

This whole thing is fucked up, for both streamer and audience. I don’t want to sound like an old man angry at an entertainment form that younger people like, but streaming as an industry genuinely seems unhealthy to both audience and streamer.
 

Armaros

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,688
I read the whole article to see if there was some nuance or perspective that was lacking in the quote, but nope. It’s as completely naive and self centred as the thread title implied.

In a way, I understand how he’s come to this bizarro view of the world. The economics of streaming are completely fucked and wrap people into this black mirror universe where your worth as a human being is based on followers and income

Ninja and those of his ilk have been made richer than almost any other individual in the world (even moreso relative to his age cohort) because they are popular video game streamers. Like the whole income not being proportional to social utility thing is a tale as old as human civilisation, but I feel streaming has taken this to another level.

The closest analogue would be entertainers, but at least for that profession, there is a narrative of artistic performance and expertise that entertainers can tell themselves as justifying their fame and fortune. Streamers are dependent on products made and owned by other people - literally the only metric they can show to validate their self worth are their followers.

There’s also the whole fucked up parasocial relationship that is core to the streaming experience. While entertainers often also live in gilded worlds themselves, they still have to interact with real human people on a day to day basis. Streamers don’t even need to do that. The usual human interaction they have on the job is in reading comments from faceless usernames.

This whole thing is fucked up, for both streamer and audience. I don’t want to sound like an old man angry at an entertainment form that younger people like, but streaming as an industry genuinely seems unhealthy to both audience and streamer.
You know whats funny? The person whose liveyhood was 'ruined' by the ban is already a millionaire at 17.
 

Luthor

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,458
US, California
I came away with the impression that he is basically advocating for a slap on the wrist (solely because the kid is a streamer)... at one point he specifically says the ban should have been 6 months ‘or something’. And at another point he says “I’m not saying he shouldn’t have been banned at all”

Which I totally disagree with... I think cheating bans should be permanent bans, period. Regardless of who you are. That said... if this was a case where he did it offline for a video, I wouldn’t agree with but I would at least understand the argument for it not being permanent.

But yeah you’re right...Him saying Epic shouldn’t permanently ban him because they will lose publicity for the game is absurd and clearly Epic didn’t think twice about it. Fortnite will be fine without him lol
Yeah I was glad the other guy said that, that Fortnite will be okay, to which Ninja seemed to just kinda shrug away.

I get that he says he's trying to be 'realistic' but it just seems that he's not really trying to think much about it. Kinda just rushing to react without giving it a whole lot of thought. And I think that's usually the honest reaction, the one that comes with little preparation.

Kind of off topic, how has he been with regards to stream sniping? I have a funny feeling he's dealt with it a lot, has he been as forgiving as he seems to be here even though he does say that some type of ban should have happened? Maybe because this specific scenario didn't affect him, he just has a 'who cares' attitude.
 

Stewarto

Member
Oct 27, 2017
351
Literally saying they should get special treatment, absolutely hilarious.

How out of touch he has become
 

Karak

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,305
One of the best and most consistent traits that a creator has that connects them with the entirety of their audience is the intrinsic feeling of a shared beginning or at the very least a shared idea that a passion can elevate someone. That feeling of connection and hopefully a reminder that anyone can do well is important and randomly throwing up ideas and rules of being special completely negates it.
 

XR.

Member
Nov 22, 2018
1,447
But if you framed the videos as a journalistic or explanatory exercise, in that case the story might be a bit different. Hard to say.
I wouldn't classify this video as investagitive or an explanatory excercise - but even if it was it should still be produced in a controlled environment. A lot of videos studying cheats for CSGO does this, where they set up their own server without any anti-cheat enabled and use all the cheats they desire without anyone batting an eye.

I think there's a disconnect somewhere if you think you can break the rules and ruin other people's fun without repercussions just because you're a content creator. Not to mention the message the whole ordeal would convey to the community.

There comes a degree of responsibility and professionalism with the work and I don't think there was any indication of either here. However, whether the ban should be permanent or set to a year, or five years, I can't really say. I'm indifferent to the punishment, but I think there's a point in keeping it consistent and the treatment equal.
 

Messofanego

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,534
UK
One of the best and most consistent traits that a creator has that connects them with the entirety of their audience is the intrinsic feeling of a shared beginning or at the very least a shared idea that a passion can elevate someone. That feeling of connection and hopefully a reminder that anyone can do well is important and randomly throwing up ideas and rules of being special completely negates it.
Yup. Taking their audience and support for granted.
 

Hyun Sai

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,349
It is no big deal. Yet people here are so passionate about it happening. I've seen it spread all over the internet too. It's absurd.
Some celebrity streamer promoting cheating / aimbotting on Youtube and potentially ruining the games of players is no big deal ? You are surprised gamers are passionate about it ?
 

kurashikane

Member
Feb 4, 2019
15
What a bad take. If you're irresponsible with how you deal with your job, you'll have to face the consequences.
 
Aug 28, 2019
270
“A content creator cheating, whose entire life is about the game he’s playing and then some random who has no YouTube channel, no Twitter account – he doesn’t even care, he just cheats, he has to hack – you ban one, you ruin his life. You ban the other, he makes another account and keeps cheating.”
Ridiculous hyperbole aside, no. Epic didn't ruin that streamer's "life." He ruined it all by himself.

If he's mature enough to make money off this shit, he's mature enough to take responsibility for fucking it up. Just like everyone else with a job, including kids his age and younger. Most of us exercise at least a modicum of care every day to avoid trashing our own livelihoods. If he can't even do that much, it's not on Epic to do it for him.

I did suffer through the video, at least the first half, and while the headline is exaggerated, Blevins does come down very strongly on the side of streamers like him receiving preferential treatment.
 

Triscuitable

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,818
“Influencers” and notable streamers should be held to a higher standard than other players in regards to punishment. That way they’d actually tread carefully and be liable for wrongdoings, instead of getting off scot-free.

But this isn’t a just world. They make money by keeping influencers around. That’s the whole point.
 

AntiMacro

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,568
Alberta
What an absolutely fucking ridiculous take. He thinks if you have enough followers it entitles you to use aimbots to kill other players? Are those other players going to get a cut of the money you made when you killed them with hacks for Content?
I don't think you get to say it's a ridiculous take when you're THAT FAR off what he actually said.
 

Border

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,466
Why are we identifying this guy by his first, middle, and last name? Did he assassinate someone?
 

galvatron

Member
Oct 27, 2017
447
Austin, TX
Yeah, Ninja! If Logan Paul wasn’t banned for life by a completely different organization for posting a video of a corpse why can’t this kid cheat at fortnite?!

Is this the 2019 Chewbacca defense?
 
Oct 27, 2017
4,239
It's always fascinating how money can warp the perception of reality so much that you can think you're above everything. And by fascinating I mean terrifying.
 

RF Switch

Member
Oct 31, 2017
1,617
Yikes I don’t follow anything about this dude but man the entitlement that statement spews
 

Stider

Member
Oct 25, 2017
171
Could not disagree more. Content creators and streamers should get harsher punishments then your regular person. IF you want to go "pro"(making a living by streaming or playing e-sports) then you should get harsher penalties the same as professional athletes do.
 

Servbot24

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
20,533
Some celebrity streamer promoting cheating / aimbotting on Youtube and potentially ruining the games of players is no big deal ? You are surprised gamers are passionate about it ?
Yeah it’s no big deal. He deserves a couple months ban. Costing other players a game or two isn’t nice but it shouldn’t be a lifetime ban.