Rinoa: "You're the best looking guy here" - 2019 edition

RagnarokX

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,152
I mean to be fair one of the main plot devices in the game is that he literally remembers none of what you’re talking about so it’s pretty hard to latch onto.
Squall definitely alludes to having experienced experiencing pain from being close to others in the past. When he comments that Seifer may have been executed for his actions in Timber, he says this:

Rinoa: "Even so! I still hope he's alive."

Squall: (Think what you want. ...Reality isn't so kind. Everything doesn't work out the way you want it to. That's why...) "As long as you don't get
your hopes up, you can take anything... You feel less pain. Anyway, whatever wish you have is none of my business."

Rinoa: "...You're mean. MEANY!!!"

Squall: (What's with her...?) "...Sorry."

So he's motivated by avoiding pain. He spent years crying and hoping his dad and sis would return for him, and now he's closed himself off to anything that can cause that kind of pain for him again. He doesn't remember the details, just that he felt pain before from relying on others and he doesn't want to feel that pain anymore.

This view is somewhat ironic because Squall has formed a bond with Seifer and, although he tries to act stoic, when it's later announced that Seifer has been executed Squall has a bit of an existential crisis over it. He takes the news most poorly of the group. He was the only one that liked Seifer besides Rinoa.
 
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Wazzy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,925
I would disagree that he understands he was abandoned. His introspection for most of the game is limited to statements that people can’t rely on other people.
You would be wrong then: Here is some examples in the script:

This scene is on Disc 2 before the orphanage reveal right after Squall confronts Ellone for sending him to the past:

Squall: (What Ellone said under her breath was... You're my only hope. Why do
people depend on each other? In the end, you're on your own. I've made
it this far by myself. Sure, I couldn't do a thing when I was a kid...
I've depended on others, but... I'll be the first to admit that I'm
here because of other people.)

[While Squall is thinking, Ellone has already left on the White SeeD
ship. Later on, he lies on his bed, still contemplating.]

Squall: (I'm fine by myself now. I have all the skills I need to survive. I'm
not a child anymore. That's a lie. I don't know anything. I'm confused.
I don't want to depend on anyone. How can I do that? Someone tell me...
Someone? So I'll end up depending on others after all.)

[Flashback...? A small child stands outside in the rain, his back to a pillar.]

Boy: "...Sis... I'm...all alone. But I'm doing my best... I'll be ok without
you, Sis. I'll be able to take care of myself.


Squall and Rinoa discussing his feelings on why he pushed people away on the Ragnarok:

Squall: "I can't remember anything about my parents... But...Ellone was there
for me. Ellone was there to hold my hand."

Rinoa: "Made you feel safe and secure?"

Squall: "Sure. But she left. Just disappeared. I'm afraid.. Afraid of having
that feeling of comfort taken away..."


Rinoa: "You were afraid of losing us? Is that why you kept your
distance?"

Squall: "I was always alone...

Rinoa: "Squall... You missed out on all the good things in life. You've missed
out on so much."


The orphanage scene where they are discussing Quistis enrolling at Garden when she was 10 and Squall who was 9 would mention his sister:

Squall: "Yeah... Quistis always used to break us up."

Quistis: "Yes! That's right! Seifer was a kid who always needed to be the
center of attention. But Squall always used to ignore him... But
eventually they would end up fighting. Squall could have easily walked
away from it, but always took up the challenge. He should've just
ignored him, but Squall, almost in tears, would say...'I gotta do my
best by myself. Or else I won't be able to see Sis'.
I guess I was
trying to take Sis...I mean, Ellone's place. I tried, but to no
avail... That's probably it! Even after becoming an instructor, I
couldn't stop thinking about Squall. I thought it was...love. I had to
hide my feelings because I was an instructor, but I've come to
realize it wasn't. It was my childhood feelings as a big sister that

lingered... Oh well.

Squall at the concert with Rinoa BEFORE the orphanage reveal:
Am I that untrusting...? Maybe I'm this way because I'm scared.
Nothing lasts in this world. It feels great to have friends who believe
in you, and adults you can rely on. That's why it's so dangerous,
especially if you become used to it. Someday you're bound to lose
everything. Everyone around you will be gone. Then what are you left
with? Nothing. Nobody... It's so miserable. And it's inevitable. It's
so hard to recover from something like that. I never ever want to deal

with that again. I can't. Even if it means being alone..

IIRC there is more examples but I can't look right now.
 

SugarNoodles

Member
Nov 3, 2017
7,259
Portland, OR
You would be wrong then: Here is some examples in the script:

This scene is on Disc 2 before the orphanage reveal right after Squall confronts Ellone for sending him to the past:

Squall: (What Ellone said under her breath was... You're my only hope. Why do
people depend on each other? In the end, you're on your own. I've made
it this far by myself. Sure, I couldn't do a thing when I was a kid...
I've depended on others, but... I'll be the first to admit that I'm
here because of other people.)

[While Squall is thinking, Ellone has already left on the White SeeD
ship. Later on, he lies on his bed, still contemplating.]

Squall: (I'm fine by myself now. I have all the skills I need to survive. I'm
not a child anymore. That's a lie. I don't know anything. I'm confused.
I don't want to depend on anyone. How can I do that? Someone tell me...
Someone? So I'll end up depending on others after all.)

[Flashback...? A small child stands outside in the rain, his back to a pillar.]

Boy: "...Sis... I'm...all alone. But I'm doing my best... I'll be ok without
you, Sis. I'll be able to take care of myself.


Squall and Rinoa discussing his feelings on why he pushed people away on the Ragnarok:

Squall: "I can't remember anything about my parents... But...Ellone was there
for me. Ellone was there to hold my hand."

Rinoa: "Made you feel safe and secure?"

Squall: "Sure. But she left. Just disappeared. I'm afraid.. Afraid of having
that feeling of comfort taken away..."


Rinoa: "You were afraid of losing us? Is that why you kept your
distance?"

Squall: "I was always alone...

Rinoa: "Squall... You missed out on all the good things in life. You've missed
out on so much."


The orphanage scene where they are discussing Quistis enrolling at Garden when she was 10 and Squall who was 9 would mention his sister:

Squall: "Yeah... Quistis always used to break us up."

Quistis: "Yes! That's right! Seifer was a kid who always needed to be the
center of attention. But Squall always used to ignore him... But
eventually they would end up fighting. Squall could have easily walked
away from it, but always took up the challenge. He should've just
ignored him, but Squall, almost in tears, would say...'I gotta do my
best by myself. Or else I won't be able to see Sis'.
I guess I was
trying to take Sis...I mean, Ellone's place. I tried, but to no
avail... That's probably it! Even after becoming an instructor, I
couldn't stop thinking about Squall. I thought it was...love. I had to
hide my feelings because I was an instructor, but I've come to
realize it wasn't. It was my childhood feelings as a big sister that

lingered... Oh well.

Squall at the concert with Rinoa BEFORE the orphanage reveal:
Am I that untrusting...? Maybe I'm this way because I'm scared.
Nothing lasts in this world. It feels great to have friends who believe
in you, and adults you can rely on. That's why it's so dangerous,
especially if you become used to it. Someday you're bound to lose
everything. Everyone around you will be gone. Then what are you left
with? Nothing. Nobody... It's so miserable. And it's inevitable. It's
so hard to recover from something like that. I never ever want to deal

with that again. I can't. Even if it means being alone..

IIRC there is more examples but I can't look right now.
So like I said, he has these feelings and he doesn’t understand why until well over halfway through the game where he magically remembers his past.
 

Wazzy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,925
So like I said, he has these feelings and he doesn’t understand why until well over halfway through the game where he magically remembers his past.
...Did you even read my post? You said he doesn't understand he was abandoned. I just showed you that you are wrong because multiple of those quotes happen before he remembers his childhood friends/situation.

This quote:

Squall at the concert with Rinoa BEFORE the orphanage reveal:
Am I that untrusting...? Maybe I'm this way because I'm scared.
Nothing lasts in this world. It feels great to have friends who believe
in you, and adults you can rely on. That's why it's so dangerous,
especially if you become used to it. Someday you're bound to lose
everything. Everyone around you will be gone. Then what are you left
with? Nothing. Nobody... It's so miserable. And it's inevitable. It's
so hard to recover from something like that. I never ever want to deal
with that again. I can't. Even if it means being alone..


This happens before he remembers the orphanage. He clearly says " I never ever want to deal with that again" which means he has experienced abandonment before.

The other quote:

[Flashback...? A small child stands outside in the rain, his back to a pillar.]

Boy: "...Sis... I'm...all alone. But I'm doing my best... I'll be ok without
you, Sis. I'll be able to take care of myself.



This happens in his sleep before he remembers the orphanage. He remembers his sister leaving him. What he doesn't remember is the orphanage and the people who inhabited it.

Do you think he isn't capable of realizing he doesn't have family?
 

Scotia

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,013
UK
So like I said, he has these feelings and he doesn’t understand why until well over halfway through the game where he magically remembers his past.
No, he’s like that the whole time but he doesn’t open up to anyone until he gets close to Rinoa. You’re ignoring several moments in the game where Squall states that he distances himself from people because of Ellone unwillingly abandoning him, some of which that happens before the orphanage reveal.
 

SugarNoodles

Member
Nov 3, 2017
7,259
Portland, OR
...Did you even read my post? You said he doesn't understand he was abandoned. I just showed you that you are wrong because multiple of those quotes happen before he remembers his childhood friends/situation.

This quote:

Squall at the concert with Rinoa BEFORE the orphanage reveal:
Am I that untrusting...? Maybe I'm this way because I'm scared.
Nothing lasts in this world. It feels great to have friends who believe
in you, and adults you can rely on. That's why it's so dangerous,
especially if you become used to it. Someday you're bound to lose
everything. Everyone around you will be gone. Then what are you left
with? Nothing. Nobody... It's so miserable. And it's inevitable. It's
so hard to recover from something like that. I never ever want to deal
with that again. I can't. Even if it means being alone..


This happens before he remembers the orphanage. He clearly says " I never ever want to deal with that again" which means he has experienced abandonment before.

The other quote:

[Flashback...? A small child stands outside in the rain, his back to a pillar.]

Boy: "...Sis... I'm...all alone. But I'm doing my best... I'll be ok without
you, Sis. I'll be able to take care of myself.



This happens in his sleep before he remembers the orphanage. He remembers his sister leaving him. What he doesn't remember is the orphanage and the people who inhabited it.

Do you think he isn't capable of realizing he doesn't have family?
I mean I doubt we’re going to see eye to eye on this. I’m not saying that Squall is unreasonable, I’m saying it’s easy to see why the presentation of his character is unapproachable to a lot of players seeing as we find out nothing about what makes him the way he is for a long ass time for a super shitty reason.

Let’s be clear here. He’s as a-hole for like half the story but we can’t find out why because the GF made him forget. Him briefly referencing it for the first time after the Garden siege or having a cryptic dream doesn’t really change that.

Like, he’s such a butt to his team that his teammates needed to be written as the biggest dumb-dumbs just so that when Squall facepalmed, the player would be like “yeah same bro what is up with those idiots?”
 

Wazzy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,925
I mean I doubt we’re going to see eye to eye on this. I’m not saying that Squall is unreasonable, I’m saying it’s easy to see why the presentation of his character is unapproachable to a lot of players seeing as we find out nothing about what makes him the way he is for a long ass time for a super shitty reason.
Actually you said he didn't understand he was abandoned. I just proved that wrong with the quote above.

You're completely exaggerating not only his behaviour but how long it goes on for. I can easily go over all of the moments that show Squall's struggles and growth and prove this myth he is a major asshole wrong.

Let’s be clear here. He’s as a-hole for like half the story but we can’t find out why because the GF made him forget. Him briefly referencing it for the first time after the Garden siege or having a cryptic dream doesn’t really change that.
No he isn't. He has plenty of growth and acts of kindness in both Disc 1 and 2.

The fact is you made a claim he doesn't understand his abandonment and you were wrong.

Also that "brief" scene is early on in Disc 2 and same with the dream scene where he clearly understands what is going on in that dream. Neither is at the halfway point in the game.

, he’s such a butt to his team that his teammates needed to be written as the biggest dumb-dumbs just so that when Squall facepalmed, the player would be like “yeah same bro what is up with those idiots?”
I would love to hear the frequency of how he is such an asshole to his teammates. The way you keep bringing it up makes it sound like the only time he changes is Disc 3.
 

deadbass

Member
Oct 27, 2017
238
I replayed FFVIII a few years ago and I was pleasantly surprised at how well-written and not-annoying Squall is. I'd kind of conflated his reputation with my own memories and it was nice to be proven wrong.
 

Syril

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,168
I would love to hear the frequency of how he is such an asshole to his teammates. The way you keep bringing it up makes it sound like the only time he changes is Disc 3.
From what I remember Squall is frustrated by his teammates very frequently but rarely if ever vocalizes it. He usually keeps his reactions to himself and maintains a professional if impersonal demeanor around them. The only time I can think of him actually losing it at any of them is when he tells Quistis to go talk to a wall after she spent the entire story up that point abusing her position over him to try to force him into a relationship.
 

Wazzy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,925
From what I remember Squall is frustrated by his teammates very frequently but rarely if ever vocalizes it. He usually keeps his reactions to himself and maintains a professional if impersonal demeanor around them. The only time I can think of him actually losing it at any of them is when he tells Quistis to go talk to a wall after she spent the entire story up that point abusing her position over him to try to force him into a relationship.
You're correct. He questions a lot of the actions of everyone around him but usually doesn't vocalize it unless it's crossing a line.

He does also snap at Rinoa over the failed kidnapping and unprofessionalism the forest owls are displaying but his reaction is understandable.