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Oct 25, 2017
22,378
DQ XI continues to baffle me at every turn. The pacing is just so.......weird

Like, I was just in the city with the haunted mural and got trapped in the mural. You meet a boss-like creature and escape into the real world. Then the game automatically takes you back to the town were you walk a couple of steps before meeting a character that basically says "Go back into the mural". What.....what was even the point of me getting out of the mural? Why all this?

Then the next bigger-ish quest, I go into a frozen city. Everybody is frozen solid. Except for one woman who is just standing there, reading a book. In the middle of a snowstorm, surrounded by frozen people. Nobody thinks this is weird. Then she casually mentions that she is the queen of the kingdom and is like "Go into the forest and kill a witch for me". And then you do that.

I don't know if this is just me but this is melting my brain. Like, really? This queen is just standing around, all by herself, outside, surrounded by frozen people and is reading a book. Wearing a dress. If it doesn't turn out that she is the witch I'm gonna loose my mind over this.

Such a weird, weird, weird, WEIRD game
 
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User requested account closure
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Oct 25, 2017
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Hehe me too! I just had to replay the Sega Saturn version from beginning to end all over again because of it.

0TAXmtV.gif
God I love the artstyle and cutscene direction in this game. I'm 25 hours into the PS1 version at the moment, otherwise I'd play it on the upcoming Switch remaster.
 

Ascheroth

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,648
I've played some more Shadowrun Returns. I think I'm a bit over the halfway point? (At the Universal Brotherhood now).
I'm having fun. The game doesn't look to be particularly long and is really linear with only a few optional things to do every now and then, but I don't mind, that's kind of what I want right now.
I like the setting and the story is pretty interesting too - but nothing outstanding. Which is pretty much true for the rest of the game as well. There's nothing really bad, but also nothing completely amazing, it's just consistently okay.
The additional party members are okay but only appear sporadically and there aren't many of them because you fill half of your team with dialog- and personality-less runners-for-hire, depending on what you need in any given mission.
Decking is a bit weird as it's kind of useless in combat - though I'm getting a lot of mileage out of the single combat ability the class has (an ability that marks an enemy and increases the accuracy of everyone attacking this target), haha.
Then there are the 'matrix' parts where only Deckers can enter and there you have your actual combat abilities. It feels a bit disconnected, but the few I entered so far gave me some advantages - as does the Decking skill itself now and then.
And as the game isn't that difficult my party usually carries my generally useless ass mostly effortlessly, so it's all good.
 

angelgrievous

Middle fingers up
Member
Nov 8, 2017
9,133
Ohio
God I love the artstyle and cutscene direction in this game. I'm 25 hours into the PS1 version at the moment, otherwise I'd play it on the upcoming Switch remaster.
Just do both : )

I was about 6 hours into a replay of the PS1 version when they announced the remake. I think I'm still gonna finish the playthrough though and then play it again on Switch, although, I would prefer it on the PS4 with trophy support but I'll take it either way.
 
Oct 27, 2017
488
Rabbit hasn't been effortposting this year, but Rabbit's effortposts got praised (thanks!) so here's a celebratory effortpost.

I've been intending to do these with games I've finished for the better part of this year and just wound up...not, but since I'd been so overwhelmingly positive about it on Discord while playing it and real time chat isn't the best place to write lengthy dissertations about game mechanics (though I try to brute force it all the time) this seems like as good a time as ever to start.

Labyrinth of Refrain: Coven of Dusk

Coven received pretty glowing praise when it released in Japan a couple years ago so I was rather anticipating it, but I really wasn't expecting it to be the complete package that it wound up being. While it's not without some relatively significant design issues that would severely hamper replays and render different players' experiences relatively samey, NIS has laid out a framework with Coven that, if pursued and refined as Disgaea has been, could lead to an incredibly successful line of DRPGs going forward. Please note in advance that the actual play experience of this game is stellar, and I'm going to go diving through the muck of actual systems design that doesn't necessarily have significant perceptible impact on the experience itself--just places where things could be more elegant or lead to more refined design or varied play experiences. Coven's The Good Shit and a joy to play, but nitpicky mechanics critique is just how I do.

Before I get into that, let's clarify that Coven is one of those rare (and wonderful) The Last Remnant situations, where you lead several groups of characters into combat totaling a maximum of 15 active combatants. These groups are called Covens, and each Coven Pact is a loot item that allows one instance of that Coven per copy of the item. Covens allow for a fixed number of both active (up to 3) and support (up to 5) units, with slots often having positive or negative effects. They're also what determine the active skills the characters in the coven can use, with some skills requiring certain slots not be left empty (and with these slots often having negative effects as a tradeoff for more powerful skills). This means that some covens are more geared toward Donum (magic) use, some are for tanks, attackers, supporting, buffing and debuffing, or what have you.

Individual characters are an amalgamation of your usual stats as well as up to 12 passive skills. They can be reincarnated through multiple classes to restart from level 1 while carrying over skills, allowing for effective multiclassing. Characters themselves have no active abilities, only passives, but each class can use the majority of weapon types even if their class doesn't have any passives that especially support that weapon's use, so you can get a little creative with things. They can also be customized with one of two different optional stances intended for tanks (drastic boost to HP and defensive stats, and an inherent taunt effect) or damage dealers (massively reduced HP and luck but a bonus to weapon mastery ranks and offensive power), and several different stat growth patterns ranging from "every stat rises equally" to "extreme specialization in class-favored stats and F-rank growths in everything else" or anywhere inbetween.

Finally, each character is given equipment, which runs on a blizzard-like loot prefix and rarity system to determine the ultimate stats on the gear. Equipment falls like rain, has wildly varied stats depending on the prefix and rarity, and you can toss your garbage (which you'll have a lot of) into other items via item synthesis to offload it.

Covens are generally given a single command that applies to all units in the coven. Spells are cast collaboratively, averaging out relevant stats, and the attack command makes each unit attack in turn. From a systems design perspective this means you're actually better off looking at your five chosen covens as your "Characters," your characters as the "Equipment" that determines stats and what the unit does, and equipment as "Gems" slotted into the "Equipment" to tweak it. Once you're thinking from this angle, you begin to hone in on a couple of Coven's bigger design problems--namely, as with almost every equipment gemming system in the history of RPGs, the gems are way more complicated than their actual practical effect on combat would lead you to desire. Since you're dealing with over a dozen gear slots for every individual coven, and five covens, this means you're probably gonna be falling back on auto equip a hell of a lot because really, who has time for that crap? The randomized loot and synthesis systems have next to no practical effect on actual play of the game unless you get a notably broken legendary item with really good modifiers, everything else is just a haze of fillery cruft.

Perhaps more importantly, while Covens do come with quite varied effects and many of them are kind of interesting, the game gives you a number of Obviously, Overwhelmingly Optimal covens such as a pair you can obtain in mid-late game that'll inevitably be used through postgame that confer no negative effects and grant the highest tier of offensive spell for every element, a 70% HP heal for all active units, and an offensive self buff. Coven grants you a lot of options, and a lot of possibilities for extremely intricate customization, but in the end most players aren't going to make use of it. There's an incredible amount of potential for future games if the equipment system is streamlined (say, a single item per character with drastically more significant effects, rather than the haze that is managing several dozen pieces of gear across your team) and covens themselves are either made more customizable in their active skillsets or simply more balanced with less of the whole "blatantly obvious optimal choices in a sea of heavily penalized gimmicks" thing.

Now, in practice none of this really impacts the moment to moment play experience--Coven's a hell of a lot of fun--and the only real issue with the gameplay as you're playing it is that normal encounters are on the easy side, which means none of the resource management you'd expect from a DRPG. Luckily, since you're representing a bunch of necromantic mannequin soldiers being controlled by a witch, you're awfully concerned with her remaining Reinforcement Magic, used to summon the puppets at the start of the dungeon crawl, bolster the puppets in combat as desired, use various traversal skills, and teleport yourself out of the dungeons or set checkpoints. Additionally, your dolls can be very easily dismembered by crits (so can enemies, for the record, which is great). This sends their limbs flying and disables equipment slots while reducing max HP drastically. A crushed head will even render a doll's max HP 0 for the rest of the run, resulting in not so permanent permadeath. You can rebuild their bodies for a cost when you return to the witch's caravan at the end of a crawl. These mechanics mean that even if you're not managing your magic juice or HP very carefully, you've still got the requisite resource management necessary to keep DRPGs ticking.

Coven has some of the best dungeon design I've seen in a DRPG in some time, and the aforementioned traversal skills are a big part of it. Among them is the ability to knock down walls--in some dungeons this means basically all of them, in others just specific ones, but it's used a bit differently in each location and it's fantastic. Sometimes there may as well be an entire second dungeon hidden inside the walls of the dungeon you access normally. There's even an instance where you find yourself traversing through frequent mazelike unmappable areas where nearly every wall is breakable and you can Dogi your way through the entire maze...if you have the Reinforcement to spare, which makes for a hell of an engaging crawl.

All of this, I mean, sure, it's a solid DRPG. We get an Etrian Odyssey game almost yearly, we're familiar with those. Where Coven really surprises is the narrative. Which I'm going to heavily praise and then barely talk about, because the way it rolls out is actually pretty great. Your primary protagonist is a misanthropic, miserable, world-hating, remarkably petty late-20s-to-30-something-ish witch with a prosthetic leg and cane. Her co-protagonist is her boundlessly happy and frequently mistreated child apprentice. She's not the world's best surrogate parent, but by god not only does she wind up sympathetic somehow (Coven is largely a character study and it's a VERY personal story) but their relationship--both the way it develops and how its existing layers are peeled back over the course of the narrative--is actually incredibly memorable and affecting by the end. It is... a ride, I'll say that much.

Coven probably won't be my Game of the Year this year, because what the hell even is 2018--or even September 2018 alone--but it might have been in a lesser year, and that came as quite a shock. Good on NIS for this one. Bring back toi8 for the next one. Soul Nomad's art would've been more fitting for the game's feel, I think. Also give the dolls ball joints next time. Thanks.

TL;DR:
Labyrinth of Refrain: Coven of Dusk is really good.

*Please note that Coven is subject to trigger warnings for less than delightful subject matter, most extremely multiple instances of heavily implied but never explicitly shown sexual violence, which is framed in an extremely non-titillating manner thankfully.
 
Last edited:

Seda

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,069
I've been meaning to play Coven for a while but hearing more and more detailed praise certainly has maintained that interest. Thanks for the write up.
 
Last edited:

Mr.Deadshot

Member
Oct 27, 2017
20,285
I am feeling a huge urge to play open-world-rpgs. I just love them. Still janking through Gothic 3, but this game comes to an end soon (I at least hope so, I might be not able to finish some quests ...). So I installed and modded Morrowind again. It's my fourth start of the game, basically playing it since release and always got at least half-way through the main-quest. Never finished it or any of the addons. Wish me luck ;)
 

Taborcarn

Member
Oct 27, 2017
891
Rabbit hasn't been effortposting this year, but Rabbit's effortposts got praised (thanks!) so here's a celebratory effortpost.

I've been intending to do these with games I've finished for the better part of this year and just wound up...not, but since I'd been so overwhelmingly positive about it on Discord while playing it and real time chat isn't the best place to write lengthy dissertations about game mechanics (though I try to brute force it all the time) this seems like as good a time as ever to start.

Labyrinth of Refrain: Coven of Dusk

Coven received pretty glowing praise when it released in Japan a couple years ago so I was rather anticipating it, but I really wasn't expecting it to be the complete package that it wound up being. While it's not without some relatively significant design issues that would severely hamper replays and render different players' experiences relatively samey, NIS has laid out a framework with Coven that, if pursued and refined as Disgaea has been, could lead to an incredibly successful line of DRPGs going forward. Please note in advance that the actual play experience of this game is stellar, and I'm going to go diving through the muck of actual systems design that doesn't necessarily have significant perceptible impact on the experience itself--just places where things could be more elegant or lead to more refined design or varied play experiences. Coven's The Good Shit and a joy to play, but nitpicky mechanics critique is just how I do.

Before I get into that, let's clarify that Coven is one of those rare (and wonderful) The Last Remnant situations, where you lead several groups of characters into combat totaling a maximum of 15 active combatants. These groups are called Covens, and each Coven Pact is a loot item that allows one instance of that Coven per copy of the item. Covens allow for a fixed number of both active (up to 3) and support (up to 5) units, with slots often having positive or negative effects. They're also what determine the active skills the characters in the coven can use, with some skills requiring certain slots not be left empty (and with these slots often having negative effects as a tradeoff for more powerful skills). This means that some covens are more geared toward Donum (magic) use, some are for tanks, attackers, supporting, buffing and debuffing, or what have you.

Individual characters are an amalgamation of your usual stats as well as up to 12 passive skills. They can be reincarnated through multiple classes to restart from level 1 while carrying over skills, allowing for effective multiclassing. Characters themselves have no active abilities, only passives, but each class can use the majority of weapon types even if their class doesn't have any passives that especially support that weapon's use, so you can get a little creative with things. They can also be customized with one of two different optional stances intended for tanks (drastic boost to HP and defensive stats, and an inherent taunt effect) or damage dealers (massively reduced HP and luck but a bonus to weapon mastery ranks and offensive power), and several different stat growth patterns ranging from "every stat rises equally" to "extreme specialization in class-favored stats and F-rank growths in everything else" or anywhere inbetween.

Finally, each character is given equipment, which runs on a blizzard-like loot prefix and rarity system to determine the ultimate stats on the gear. Equipment falls like rain, has wildly varied stats depending on the prefix and rarity, and you can toss your garbage (which you'll have a lot of) into other items via item synthesis to offload it.

Covens are generally given a single command that applies to all units in the coven. Spells are cast collaboratively, averaging out relevant stats, and the attack command makes each unit attack in turn. From a systems design perspective this means you're actually better off looking at your five chosen covens as your "Characters," your characters as the "Equipment" that determines stats and what the unit does, and equipment as "Gems" slotted into the "Equipment" to tweak it. Once you're thinking from this angle, you begin to hone in on a couple of Coven's bigger design problems--namely, as with almost every equipment gemming system in the history of RPGs, the gems are way more complicated than their actual practical effect on combat would lead you to desire. Since you're dealing with over a dozen gear slots for every individual coven, and five covens, this means you're probably gonna be falling back on auto equip a hell of a lot because really, who has time for that crap? The randomized loot and synthesis systems have next to no practical effect on actual play of the game unless you get a notably broken legendary item with really good modifiers, everything else is just a haze of fillery cruft.

Perhaps more importantly, while Covens do come with quite varied effects and many of them are kind of interesting, the game gives you a number of Obviously, Overwhelmingly Optimal covens such as a pair you can obtain in mid-late game that'll inevitably be used through postgame that confer no negative effects and grant the highest tier of offensive spell for every element, a 70% HP heal for all active units, and an offensive self buff. Coven grants you a lot of options, and a lot of possibilities for extremely intricate customization, but in the end most players aren't going to make use of it. There's an incredible amount of potential for future games if the equipment system is streamlined (say, a single item per character with drastically more significant effects, rather than the haze that is managing several dozen pieces of gear across your team) and covens themselves are either made more customizable in their active skillsets or simply more balanced with less of the whole "blatantly obvious optimal choices in a sea of heavily penalized gimmicks" thing.

Now, in practice none of this really impacts the moment to moment play experience--Coven's a hell of a lot of fun--and the only real issue with the gameplay as you're playing it is that normal encounters are on the easy side, which means none of the resource management you'd expect from a DRPG. Luckily, since you're representing a bunch of necromantic mannequin soldiers being controlled by a witch, you're awfully concerned with her remaining Reinforcement Magic, used to summon the puppets at the start of the dungeon crawl, bolster the puppets in combat as desired, use various traversal skills, and teleport yourself out of the dungeons or set checkpoints. Additionally, your dolls can be very easily dismembered by crits (so can enemies, for the record, which is great). This sends their limbs flying and disables equipment slots while reducing max HP drastically. A crushed head will even render a doll's max HP 0 for the rest of the run, resulting in not so permanent permadeath. You can rebuild their bodies for a cost when you return to the witch's caravan at the end of a crawl. These mechanics mean that even if you're not managing your magic juice or HP very carefully, you've still got the requisite resource management necessary to keep DRPGs ticking.

Coven has some of the best dungeon design I've seen in a DRPG in some time, and the aforementioned traversal skills are a big part of it. Among them is the ability to knock down walls--in some dungeons this means basically all of them, in others just specific ones, but it's used a bit differently in each location and it's fantastic. Sometimes there may as well be an entire second dungeon hidden inside the walls of the dungeon you access normally. There's even an instance where you find yourself traversing through frequent mazelike unmappable areas where nearly every wall is breakable and you can Dogi your way through the entire maze...if you have the Reinforcement to spare, which makes for a hell of an engaging crawl.

All of this, I mean, sure, it's a solid DRPG. We get an Etrian Odyssey game almost yearly, we're familiar with those. Where Coven really surprises is the narrative. Which I'm going to heavily praise and then barely talk about, because the way it rolls out is actually pretty great. Your primary protagonist is a misanthropic, miserable, world-hating, remarkably petty late-20s-to-30-something-ish witch with a prosthetic leg and cane. Her co-protagonist is her boundlessly happy and frequently mistreated child apprentice. She's not the world's best surrogate parent, but by god not only does she wind up sympathetic somehow (Coven is largely a character study and it's a VERY personal story) but their relationship--both the way it develops and how its existing layers are peeled back over the course of the narrative--is actually incredibly memorable and affecting by the end. It is... a ride, I'll say that much.

Coven probably won't be my Game of the Year this year, because what the hell even is 2018--or even September 2018 alone--but it might have been in a lesser year, and that came as quite a shock. Good on NIS for this one. Bring back toi8 for the next one. Soul Nomad's art would've been more fitting for the game's feel, I think. Also give the dolls ball joints next time. Thanks.

TL;DR:
Labyrinth of Refrain: Coven of Dusk is really good.

*Please note that Coven is subject to trigger warnings for less than delightful subject matter, most extremely multiple instances of heavily implied but never explicitly shown sexual violence, which is framed in an extremely non-titillating manner thankfully.

giphy.gif


I picked this up based on your recommendations, and it has moved solidly to a middle-upper spot of my back-log.
 

Valcrist

Tic-Tac-Toe Champion
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,685
Someone buy me Labyrinth of Refrain, I'm out of money.

Aeana would probably yell at me to finish DQ5 though. Don't tell her.
 
Oct 25, 2017
22,378
Alright, once again I need to know:
How far into DQ XI am I if something big just happened and I met a special lama.
Everybody tells me that the main story alone takes 70 hours but I've played for ~26 hours so far and did almost all of the first set of side quests.
I just....the main story can't POSSIBLY last for more than 40 hours from where i am right now, right? R-right?
 

Opa-Pa

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,810
Alright, once again I need to know:
How far into DQ XI am I if something big just happened and I met a special lama.
Everybody tells me that the main story alone takes 70 hours but I've played for ~26 hours so far and did almost all of the first set of side quests.
I just....the main story can't POSSIBLY last for more than 40 hours from where i am right now, right? R-right?
The thing is, the "post game" is literally the continuation of the main story, it even answers questions left unanswered regarding the main plot... But back to your question, you're about 60% in if you consider the first credits roll the 100%.
 
Oct 25, 2017
22,378
The thing is, the "post game" is literally the continuation of the main story, it even answers questions left unanswered regarding the main plot... But back to your question, you're about 60% in if you consider the first credits roll the 100%.

Alright, I'm a bit confused why it's called post-game when the story just continues, but that's exciting to hear
Thanks
 

MoonFrog

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,969
Alright, once again I need to know:
How far into DQ XI am I if something big just happened and I met a special lama.
Everybody tells me that the main story alone takes 70 hours but I've played for ~26 hours so far and did almost all of the first set of side quests.
I just....the main story can't POSSIBLY last for more than 40 hours from where i am right now, right? R-right?
Well, a lot depends on your approach. For me up until the "big event" I assume you are referring to was 50:01. From there to the main game end another 30 hours, so I got to the boss at ~80. I messed around with side content for a while and finished main game at ~88 hours. Then I beat post game boss at ~135 hours. A lot of that was doing miscellany. I've continued playing since then.

Others have finished the whole game in, say, 63 hours. Aeana did the Japanese version to the level of completion I'm currently at in 115 hours.
 
Oct 25, 2017
22,378
Well, a lot depends on your approach. For me up until the "big event" I assume you are referring to was 50:01. From there to the main game end another 30 hours, so I got to the boss at ~80. I messed around with side content for a while and finished main game at ~88 hours. Then I beat post game boss at ~135 hours. A lot of that was doing miscellany.

Others have finished the whole game in, say, 63 hours. Aeana did the Japanese version to the level of completion I'm currently at in 115 hours.
I'm probably mostly going to focus on the main story the side content is not doing anything for me so far.
That's good to hear though, I like the game a lot even if I could write a way too long post about things that annoy me.
Also I love the look of it.
 

hemtae

Member
Oct 25, 2017
110
Well the dream is dead for the fuck you, suck my dick: Josh Sawyer's personal dream RPG experience historical game.
 
OP
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Whaaaaaat



Oh, I don't like this at all

Eh. I was just discussing this in the discord but to be honest, big platform holder/publisher money will potentially give Obsidian the resources they need to really shine. Their Achilles' heel has always been budget/project management/scheduling etc. With big bucks behind them, and assuming Microsoft treats them with the same respect that many of the Sony studios receive, they could end up putting out some really great stuff.

Of course that stuff will be Microsoft exclusive, but, well...that's kind of the name of the game with an acquisition like this.
 
Oct 25, 2017
22,378
Eh. I was just discussing this in the discord but to be honest, big platform holder/publisher money will potentially give Obsidian the resources they need to really shine. Their Achilles' heel has always been budget/project management/scheduling etc. With big bucks behind them, and assuming Microsoft treats them with the same respect that many of the Sony studios receive, they could end up putting out some really great stuff.

Of course that stuff will be Microsoft exclusive, but, well...that's kind of the name of the game with an acquisition like this.
Yeah, but the question for me is what kind of game they are going to make. MS isn't going to fund PoE 3 and I don't want to see Obsidian making Fable 4.

Obviously this is all preferable to a bunch of people loosing their jobs, that goes without saying.
 

Basileus777

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,197
New Jersey
Yeah, but the question for me is what kind of game they are going to make. MS isn't going to fund PoE 3 and I don't want to see Obsidian making Fable 4.

Obviously this is all preferable to a bunch of people loosing their jobs, that goes without saying.
What kind of games were they going to make without getting bought out? Probably whatever contract work they could manage to find to keep the door open. And I'm not sure POE3 is any less likely now under Microsoft.
 
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Yeah, but the question for me is what kind of game they are going to make. MS isn't going to fund PoE 3 and I don't want to see Obsidian making Fable 4.

Obviously this is all preferable to a bunch of people loosing their jobs, that goes without saying.
If I had to guess I would say Microsoft wants to groom a studio that can put out a Witcher 3 type of experience exclusive to Xbox. That's not based on any hard data/evidence and is purely armchair analyzing, but given that W3 is one of (maybe the?) best-selling RPGs of the generation, I wouldn't be surprised if Microsoft wants to bring a studio in-house that can deliver on that sort of critically and commercially successful WRPG style.

My opinion on this is colored by my CRPG preferences anyway though, I preferred Larian, Iron Tower, and Harebrained's recent CRPG output to Obsidian's. I'd like to see Obsidian return to the 3D console WRPG space which is where I felt they really exceeded.
 
Oct 25, 2017
22,378
What kind of games were they going to make without getting bought out? Probably whatever contract work they could manage to find to keep the door open. And I'm not sure POE3 is any less likely now under Microsoft.
I don't think PoE 3 would have ever happened regardless. PoE 2 didn't sell well enough for that.
I just would like to see more cRPGs, not less and this is a huge blow for my favourite genre.
 

Basileus777

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,197
New Jersey
I don't think PoE 3 would have ever happened regardless. PoE 2 didn't sell well enough for that.
I just would like to see more cRPGs, not less and this is a huge blow for my favourite genre.
It would have been a huge blow 10 years ago. Now I'm not sure it is. Obsidian's future was dim and while what will happen to them under Microsoft is a gigantic question mark, it probably gives them better odds of delivering another great rpg than the prior situation.
 
Oct 25, 2017
22,378
It would have been a huge blow 10 years ago. Now I'm not sure it is. Obsidian's future was dim and while what will happen to them under Microsoft is a gigantic question mark, it probably gives them better odds of delivering another great rpg than the prior situation.
Yeah, that's why I'm not totally pessimistic about this.
Hey, I'll take another Kotor 2 or New Vegas any day of the week.
It's just that the list of consistant, good cRPG developers was already incredibly small.
Now it's just Larian, Hairbrained and I guess inXile if I feel generous.
 

Deleted member 6137

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Eh. I was just discussing this in the discord but to be honest, big platform holder/publisher money will potentially give Obsidian the resources they need to really shine. Their Achilles' heel has always been budget/project management/scheduling etc. With big bucks behind them, and assuming Microsoft treats them with the same respect that many of the Sony studios receive, they could end up putting out some really great stuff.

Of course that stuff will be Microsoft exclusive, but, well...that's kind of the name of the game with an acquisition like this.
More money to the studio would have been interesting a few years ago. Now, their most talented employees are gone. Money won't automatically make their games better.
 

Basileus777

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,197
New Jersey
More money to the studio would have been interesting a few years ago. Now, their most talented employees are gone. Money won't automatically make their games better.
A stable financial situation and having way less risk of your project getting canceled a dozen times should make it a bit easier for Obsidian to keep talent and hire good people.
 

hemtae

Member
Oct 25, 2017
110
I think the Cain/Boyarsky project will be the high water mark of what Obsidian can accomplish with a Microsoft checkbook behind them.

CRPG wise I guess friendship is ended with Obsidian Larian is my new best friend.
 

Vault

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,593
As someone who has grown up playing Black Isle, Troika and Obsidian games through the years, it feels like the end of an era.

Now there's only European Studios to carry the CRPG torch.
 

Sinatar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,684
Nobody comes out of a Microsoft acquisition well. Lionhead, Ensemble, Bungie, Digital Anvil, FASA, Rare, etc... all fared very poorly after being bought by Microsoft.
 
Oct 25, 2017
22,378
Nobody comes out of a Microsoft acquisition well. Lionhead, Ensemble, Bungie, Digital Anvil, FASA, Rare, etc... all fared very poorly after being bought by Microsoft.
Ufff that list almost rivals EA's kill count.

Fuck man, Ensemble. God dammit.
Freelancer (Digital Anvil) was so damn good too.
Urgh...

Just.....let them at least make a new IP MS and don't give them Fable or god forbid force them to make a Halo or Gears RPG
 
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Oct 25, 2017
3,009
I have no great love for Microsoft as a company and I'm mostly just playing devil's advocate, but - while they did acquire and misuse a lot of studios in the past, with the severe lack of exclusives they had this gen I think there's a possibility they may approach their internal studios differently. They must know that things have to change fundamentally for them to remain viable in terms of meaningful exclusives, and I'm assuming if they have any sense they'll try to emulate Sony's process, including affording their teams more independence and resources.
 
Oct 25, 2017
22,378
I have no great love for Microsoft as a company and I'm mostly just playing devil's advocate, but - while they did acquire and misuse a lot of studios in the past, with the severe lack of exclusives they had this gen I think there's a possibility they may approach their internal studios differently. They must know that things have to change fundamentally for them to remain viable in terms of meaningful exclusives, and I'm assuming if they have any sense they'll try to emulate Sony's process, including affording their teams more independence and resources.

I mean, I'm hopeful at least. But I've also heard this way too often before.
I still remember when people thought Bioware could keep it's identity.
Man, it seems so long ago since I've been excited for a Bioware game.

Urgh, I really don't want to be a downer but...man it's been just two years since MS closed down Lionhead. There was no way to turn that studio around? It's just....odd to me that they would simply close down their own RPG studios and then buys another studio 2 years later.
 
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Kvik

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
889
Downunder.
I've played some more Shadowrun Returns. I think I'm a bit over the halfway point? (At the Universal Brotherhood now).
I'm having fun. The game doesn't look to be particularly long and is really linear with only a few optional things to do every now and then, but I don't mind, that's kind of what I want right now.
I like the setting and the story is pretty interesting too - but nothing outstanding. Which is pretty much true for the rest of the game as well. There's nothing really bad, but also nothing completely amazing, it's just consistently okay.
The additional party members are okay but only appear sporadically and there aren't many of them because you fill half of your team with dialog- and personality-less runners-for-hire, depending on what you need in any given mission.
Decking is a bit weird as it's kind of useless in combat - though I'm getting a lot of mileage out of the single combat ability the class has (an ability that marks an enemy and increases the accuracy of everyone attacking this target), haha.
Then there are the 'matrix' parts where only Deckers can enter and there you have your actual combat abilities. It feels a bit disconnected, but the few I entered so far gave me some advantages - as does the Decking skill itself now and then.
And as the game isn't that difficult my party usually carries my generally useless ass mostly effortlessly, so it's all good.

If you enjoyed SR, I can recommend playing Dragonfall and Hong Kong since it improves on the colourful characters and story front by a lot. The combat is also improved in the Director's cut edition, as long as you don't expect XCOM combat or anything.
 
OP
OP

Deleted member 419

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,009
Howdy all, for Spooktober we decided to change things up for the month for the RPG Club and focus on Horror RPGs as a whole (there aren't many of them, unfortunately). The thread is here, and the idea is that anyone can play a Horror RPG alongside anyone else who wants to delve into this niche, but generally very good, subgenre.

Personally, I'll be playing Parasite Eve, and then I'll check out Laplace's Demon.
 

Pooh

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,849
The Hundred Acre Wood
Hearing good things about Refrain from those here has definitely put it on my radar... now I just have to decide if it's on Switch or PC.

Is it good in bite-size pieces (can I play it in 30-minute chunks) or does it require a bit more time per session?
 

Aeana

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,922
Hearing good things about Refrain from those here has definitely put it on my radar... now I just have to decide if it's on Switch or PC.

Is it good in bite-size pieces (can I play it in 30-minute chunks) or does it require a bit more time per session?
Once you get access to the mud exits, which is a few hours in, you can set two down, exit through one, and use the other to return to exactly where you left off any time you want, for a penalty of accrued mana. This allows you to exit and save (and shop, etc.) any time you like. The game also has a suspend save that deletes upon load if you don't want to do that, though. So you can pick up and play in any chunks of time you have no problem.

I'm playing on PC, and it's an excellent version of the game.
 

Pooh

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,849
The Hundred Acre Wood
Once you get access to the mud exits, which is a few hours in, you can set two down, exit through one, and use the other to return to exactly where you left off any time you want, for a penalty of accrued mana. This allows you to exit and save (and shop, etc.) any time you like. The game also has a suspend save that deletes upon load if you don't want to do that, though. So you can pick up and play in any chunks of time you have no problem.

I'm playing on PC, and it's an excellent version of the game.

Thanks Aeana :D

I probably won't be able to get this until Q1 next year so we'll see how I'm feeling then. Glad to hear the PC version is a good one though.
 

Valcrist

Tic-Tac-Toe Champion
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,685
Well RPG friends, I'm at El Haven on the PS2 version of DQV. I'm really enjoying it! Also a little surprised at how strong a low level monster can be in your party. I have a Minidemon in my party at level 11 and he does just as much damage as the rest of my level 28-29 party. But man does he level up slow. I guess stronger monsters level up slow to make up for how good they are? I dunno.
 

MoonFrog

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,969
Yeah monster levels are kind of their own thing relevant to monster type and not immediately translatable.
 

Sarek

Member
Oct 27, 2017
466
Been replaying Pillars of Eternity while waiting for Pathfinder: Kingmaker patches. I've only played through PoE once before right after the release, and played WM1&2 right after they came out also.

This time I'm playing it on PotD difficulty and that alone has really made me appreciate the combat system a lot more. My first playthrough was on hard, and in retrospective it was too easy to ignore lot of the mechanics which made the combat feel dull and flavorless. The more challenging combat with the introduction of better itemization brought by the WM DLCs, and patches that improved the combat balance have changed my view of combat in this game from decent to actually really fun!

Overall too having the whole package of the DLCs, and patches available from the start has been great. Soulbound weapons, the improved stronghold management, additional companions, QoL improvements, etc. improve the game more than I expected. Overall if PoE at release was maybe a 3/5 game for me, it is now a solid 4/5.