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RPS: Cyberpunk 2077's E3 demo has weak gunplay and unimaginative stereotypes
- Thread starter derFeef
- Start date
We're talking about genre staples here tho, so no, "Hardcore racial stereotypes" are NOT a staple of Cyberpunk.
Cyberpunk is actually the media's and art's interpretation of post-humanist sociological theory. If you're interested in these topics you should immediately read Latour and especially Haraway's cyborg manifest, a milestone of post-feminist theory.
It's crazy this somehow made it into the game. I remember playing it at launch and being absolutely blown away they thought that was somehow a good idea. It's like they replayed Deus Ex (2000) and thought they had to go above and beyond the most egregious voice work in Hong Kong or it wouldn't be TRUE Deus Ex. Just awful.
I mean the hong kong brothel stuff is ALSO bad. Using Apocalypse Now as the vocal print for ALL of your Asian people is a bad look.
... and the fact that the Voody Boys in the soruce material are not even Hatians but white guys...
Someone at CDP must have felt really smart making them all Haitan.
Hmm ok super fuck no to this game. Like why even do this. Do they not like comprehend how egregiously racist this is?
Oh yeah I'm not trying to downplay that whatsoever, I really should've phrased that better.
It just strikes me as next to impossible to accidentally portray a character like that, which is where the tongue in cheek comment about them doing it intentionally as a throwback came from.
Man I want to play the game :(. It seems all this talk is not about the game but our evolving culture.
Imagine looking at the source material and saying, you know what, these mindless butchers being white is the actual problem here. Let's strip out the layer of commentary on messed up people in a dystopian society, and make it solely a gigantic racist stereotype.
Like, what? This is how you translate it? This is how you focus your time when writing in this setting? To devolve into r-rated Looney Tunes racism?
MAAAAAN, my enthusiasm & hype for this has deflated quite a bit - hearing things like this is just incredibly disappointing. I've still got a Collector's Edition pre-order locked in at Amazon, but I'm definitely inching closer & closer to a "wait & see" approach instead.
Don't just take one outlet's hot take as gospel: a lot of other spots said gunplay looked great, and thought the characterization was good.
Wait till you see it in August, everyone jumping on the bandwagon already it seems though.
Gunplay seems like Mankind Divided level, which was fine/great IMO.
It seems like folks are looking for things to shit on this game about. An RPG shotgun seems to have not changed.
Interesting to see if the game itself actual plays and looks as they say.
Interesting to see if the game itself actual plays and looks as they say.
Since this cyberpunk game world is full of xenophobia, bigotry, and stereotypes I'm just waiting for them to show me it directed towards white ethnic groups.
You brought up 'genre staples' and 'hardcore racial stereotypes'. Not to speak on their behalf, but that doesn't seem to be what they were asking.
Regardless, my issue is, you said that racism 'would not' be prominent in a transhuman society. While that's certainly one way to build your cyberpunk setting, one does not automatically negate the other. Given Science/Speculative Fiction is invariably about the present through the 'safer' lens of a speculated future, it is perfectly within its remit to deal with one, the other or both.
If you not going to discuss the subject matter why even bother?These are real and serious issues that need to be discuss.
According another person who saw gameplay demo Animals are multi-cultural gang with a lots of white guys getting turned into red mist by V.
I want to know about the gameplay graphics and framerate, and the specs of the PC it was running on this year.
I assumed the person in the other tweet was talking about the Voodoo Boys.
Wow this is troubling wtf. And after I had just congratulated their response in the trans ad thread I read this. FFS cdpr what are you doing?
No one here has seen the demo, it odd to jump to a bunch of conclusions. Its like a powder keg looking for blood.
We have one article. With no general contextual information saying that its about killing black gangs. Despite other reports, saying its not as it seems.
Voodoo Boys are V's (temp) ally in gameplay demo so he isn't killing them.
All other clearly problematic things aside which I won't further comment on as I feel others have provided plenty of good perspective on it, I just want to say...
It's not a good Deus Ex clone if the gunplay isn't complete garbage. So that's at least something working in this game's favor!
It's not a good Deus Ex clone if the gunplay isn't complete garbage. So that's at least something working in this game's favor!
User Banned (1 week): Dismissing concerns regarding racism in a sensitive thread. History of similar behavior.
Game looks so good, haters gonna hate. keep at it CDPR this game is going to sell millions and be so awesome. I have no doubt.
Destiny 2 100% has the best feeling gunplay out of any game there is IMO: all dev's should ape it: feels so good.
Why on earth would you assume I would defend either of those thngs? Especially in the context of this game and developer...
Well, we (generally) trust single reports on the game from people who saw the demo. I suppose one could argue this too is an issue, but who is going to bring that up unless it's in a thread like this?
Cyberpunk as a genre is less about the breakdown of society (that's more post-apocalyptic fiction's wheelhouse) and more about rampant corporatism and the impact of technology on human identity and society.
While it is possible for racism to exist in the genre, the complaint here is about how CDPR are portraying certain groups in a stereotyped way.
As long as [popular thing] sells, it's all good! Let's not think too much about things. Especially not things that don't bother me personally because the universe clearly revolves only around me. Forever.
Some people wear stupidity as a badge of honor, I've noticed.
What the fuck at that first tweet in particular.
But can that be seen or is it something that needs to be felt?
I would take a bet that this is not representative of what is actually happening. CDPR suddenly decided to make a genocide simulator.
Very very good point.
Pertinent as it gets in this case, think we need to all hold off until we play and feel it.
I actually remember thinking the gunplay looked just "ok" in the Destiny reveal trailers now that I think about it...hmm, great point!!
As a Haitian American, I am cringing at the eye-rolling gang name of "the Voodoo Boys." The tone of the tweet isn't doing me any favors either.
I think with a setting/game like the Witcher, there's a long leash of cultural representation. Like, the main character exists as a sort of pariah outside of society, so for him to be weird in some way ... questioning/mocking someone's behavior or doing something unacceptable by contemporary standards, I think there's greater leash there, you can try and dismiss it as "Well, the Witcher is a pariah who lives outside of society and so obviously he lacks social graces..." Also when it comes to a medieval fantasy world similar to Eastern/Slavic Europe, there's less opportunity to fuck something up.
Cyberpunk throws a wrench into that because if you inexplicably leave out other cultures from the game other than like ... white, eurocentric culture, then they'll rightly be criticized for not having any diverse representation in the game, but then if they do, then they actually have to do it well and the sort of cultural ignorance nearing on supremacy that pervades the community where CDPR develops in ... eh, they're entering touchy territory that they probably need to be better at. I'm not saying all Poles, Slavs, or what have you, are ignorant of other cultures or supremacists for their own, but ... as a Polish American, we've got some issues with both here.
I don't think CDPR is really willing to take cultural representation seriously, or willing to put in the work to make authentic representations that don't play up stereotypes. Given all of these "gaffes" they've had recently, I think they're on shaky ground and not putting in the work could make them persona non grata.
Cyberpunk throws a wrench into that because if you inexplicably leave out other cultures from the game other than like ... white, eurocentric culture, then they'll rightly be criticized for not having any diverse representation in the game, but then if they do, then they actually have to do it well and the sort of cultural ignorance nearing on supremacy that pervades the community where CDPR develops in ... eh, they're entering touchy territory that they probably need to be better at. I'm not saying all Poles, Slavs, or what have you, are ignorant of other cultures or supremacists for their own, but ... as a Polish American, we've got some issues with both here.
I don't think CDPR is really willing to take cultural representation seriously, or willing to put in the work to make authentic representations that don't play up stereotypes. Given all of these "gaffes" they've had recently, I think they're on shaky ground and not putting in the work could make them persona non grata.
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I guess we'll see. But i will say that Cyberpunk genre is going to get under a lot of peoples skin general speaking. Hopefully CDPR does take note.
Because the subject matter and the ways the genre explores so many underpinnings of future and modern society optics. Might be tricky.
Eh what? I can't like The game? Just cause some reporter didn't like the gun play or the dystopian setting with all its offensive stuff, I'm not going to stop liking what I see.
This game looks massive and awesome in every way
I think the hypothetical question here might be if minorities are depicted in traditionally racist ways while whites are depicted as "normal," though still horrible criminals. Then the it's not racist, everyone's shitty argument dies on the vine.
And even if it's equally balanced stereotyping, it's like "if the story is about the presence of racism in a chaotic dystopia, why are you making the characters racist caricatures instead of just being racist people? Why is this the language of your commentary?"
Note: I have no idea if this is going on in Cyberpunk. I haven't seen enough of the story.
No, people are angered by your dismissal of the transphobic and racist content in the game as "haters gonna hate'.