Rugby OT - First Try

CeeCee · Nov 29, 2017

Hello and welcome to the first ever ResetERA Rugby OT!

This OT is open for discussion of both codes, union and league. If you have any interest in the game you are most welcome to join us, regardless of experience or knowledge of the rules.

Feel free to suggest anything that you think should be added to the OT.

Six Nations Preview (courtesy of phisheep)

New home, new thread (thanks CeeCee), new year, new Scotland (!) ... here we go again!

Official tournament site here.

Fixtures

(All times GMT - add 1 hour for local time of matches played in France and Italy)

Sat 3rd Feb 14:15 - Wales v Scotland
Sat 3rd Feb 16:45 - France v Ireland
Sun 4th Feb 15:00 - Italy v England

Sat 10th Feb 14:15 - Ireland v Italy
Sat 10th Feb 16:45 - England v Wales
Sun 11th Feb 15:00 - Scotland v France

Fri 23rd Feb 20:00 - France v Italy
Sat 24th Feb 14:15 - Ireland v Wales
Sat 24th Feb 16:45 - Scotland v England

Sat 10th Mar 14:15 - Ireland v Scotland
Sat 10th Mar 16:45 - France v England
Sun 11th Mar 15:00 - Wales v Italy

Sat 17th Mar 12:30 - Italy v Scotland
Sat 17th Mar 14:45 - England v Ireland
Sat 17th Mar 17:00 - Wales v France

Outlook

Lots of injuries everywhere. It isn't exactly how many injuries that matter, but where they are. Scotland missing all their props and then some, Wales half-backs dropping like flies, England shorn of decent loose forwards. Can't remember what's going on with the other three, but probably more of the same. Nevertheless, it is shaping up to be a cracking tournament with England, Ireland and Scotland all in with a chance. Wales haven't yet got their attacking game sorted out, nobody knows what France will do, and we wait with bated breath to see if Italy can put all their winning 80 minutes of rugby into one game this year.

First Weekend

Wales v Scotland: Both sides will want to play expansively - it's how they win. Typically Wales start badly and improve as the tournament progresses, while Scotland are the other way round. The making of the match, provided Scotland's scrum holds up, will probably be in Scotland's excellent loose forwards versus the depleted Welsh centre. Too close to call but should be a cracking game.

France v Ireland: Ireland should have the taking of this one by about 10 points I reckon, especially if it rains. Counter-rucking and midfield possession should stifle French ambition by about halftime.

Italy v England: Well it should be England by 30+ points, but Italy have a habit of making England look pretty damn stupid from time to time. A game to be watched with the laugh track on if it is anything like last year.

KingSnake · Nov 29, 2017

Nice. Maybe having the most interesting upcoming games would be a good addition to the OP.

CeeCee · Nov 29, 2017

KingSnake said:
Nice. Maybe having the most interesting upcoming games would be a good addition to the OP.

Cheers, I will put up a selection a little bit later :)

schatuk · Nov 29, 2017

Might be worth people mentioning their affiliation (if any).

Long suffering Bristol (and England) fan here

Looking forwards to the chatter

gosublime · Nov 29, 2017

CeeCee said:
Hello and welcome to the first ever ResetERA Rugby OT!

This OT is open for discussion of both codes, union and league. If you have any interest in the game you are most welcome to join us, regardless of experience or knowledge of the rules.

Feel free to suggest anything that you think should be added to the OT.

To kick us off: is next year going to be Scotland's year in the six nations?

No.

Cheers for doing this! Will add it to watched threads!

Prediction for Six Nations

1. England
2. Ireland
3. Scotland
4. Wales
5. France
6. Italy

I can't see Scotland beating England or Ireland - they will play a very composed, controlled game that we aren't really equipped to play against. Really want to stuff Wales in the first game just to see Gatland's reaction though.

Would love a Six Nations Championship though - my colleagues would not even know how insufferable I can be...

CeeCee · Nov 29, 2017

schatuk said:
Might be worth people mentioning their affiliation (if any).

Long suffering Bristol (and England) fan here

Looking forwards to the chatter

Good idea! I'm a Saracens and Scotland fan.

Also an active referee :D

Soap · Nov 29, 2017

I can see Dcotland placing second, but I have a feeling England will place first. Wales are probably going to finish second from bottom given their recent performances.

Metalix · Nov 30, 2017

May be worth adding Sevens to the OP, as well? the women's circuit begins this Friday & men's on Saturday (I think) - both in Dubai. The world cup is next year in San Fransisco. Commonwealth Games Sevens on the Gold Coast (?) in 2018, too!

I think we can down England at Murrayfield, could've done it last time in the 'burgh but not for Finn immediately booting the ball out after an intercept & the immense Billy Vunipola. Either way, can't be worse than this year's Calcutta Cup, oy.

gosublime said:
Really want to stuff Wales in the first game just to see Gatland's reaction though.

Would be too sweet.

SnakeyHips · Nov 30, 2017

gosublime said:
Really want to stuff Wales in the first game just to see Gatland's reaction though.

You most likely will. I'm Welsh and it's good that we've started letting new players get a play but it's time for Gatland ball to stop. Be interesting to see what happens with SA this weekend. I'm really like Scotland atm since they've improved immensely. I'm kinda betting on them winning the next Six Nations.

Also, you guys think Georgia will join the Six Nations either replacing Italy or making it a Seven Nations?

Nomad Blue · Nov 30, 2017

SnakeyHips said:
You most likely will. I'm Welsh and it's good that we've started letting new players get a play but it's time for Gatland ball to stop. Be interesting to see what happens with SA this weekend. I'm really like Scotland atm since they've improved immensely. I'm kinda betting on them winning the next Six Nations.

Also, you guys think Georgia will join the Six Nations either replacing Italy or making it a Seven Nations?

We'll get stuffed this weekend I think, we've lost all the English based players except Faletau, we're suffering from quite a few injuries, and most of the replacements aren't up to it.

If they were a rich country, or could bring anything to the table like TV income (though maybe World Rugby could subsidise their entry to broaden the game) then there'd be more chance of it happening. I wouldn't mind Georgia joining, Tbilisi is lovely(and cheap!), though I'm not sure they're good enough at the moment (bearing in mind the Wales team they played was second rate). Though they can only improve playing against better opposition 6 times a year.

CeeCee · Nov 30, 2017

Metalix said:
May be worth adding Sevens to the OP, as well? the women's circuit begins this Friday & men's on Saturday (I think) - both in Dubai. The world cup is next year in San Fransisco. Commonwealth Games Sevens on the Gold Coast (?) in 2018, too!

I think we can down England at Murrayfield, could've done it last time in the 'burgh but not for Finn immediately booting the ball out after an intercept & the immense Billy Vunipola. Either way, can't be worse than this year's Calcutta Cup, oy.

Would be too sweet.

Good idea, will add Sevens this evening!

schatuk · Nov 30, 2017

SnakeyHips said:
Also, you guys think Georgia will join the Six Nations either replacing Italy or making it a Seven Nations?

A lot to work through here. And an awful lot of politics.

I can't see either the players or the clubs being happy with an expansion to 7 teams and the inevitable lengthening of the tournament.

Do Georgia deserve a shot? IMO yes they do, based on performances over the last couple of years. Do Italy deserve to lose their spot permanently? Not really, so another approach is possibly called for.

Some sort of qualifiers for the sixth spot is probably a decent plan, with matches taking place during the prior autumn. I don't think there are enough genuine contenders for a full second division to be viable, but I'm interested in who others think could maybe have the resources to take part.

All in all it's a tricky one

Conrad Link · Nov 30, 2017

Our season just finished (New Zealand) but subbed for the continual global enjoyment! :D

Probably too harsh a critic but I was a bit disappointed in the All Blacks this year, I know we have had a million injuries/players out for various reasons etc but I just sense some of the 2nd/3rd string players we selected aren't quite up to it. If it wasn't for some awesome moments from a couple of our key guys still holding things together we could have been looking at a very different season result wise. The whole focal point of the year was to win the Lions Tour, they didn't achieve that, drawn series so not a loss either but still you can't really call that a successful year IMO. Hopefully they prove my issues wrong in the coming years ahead.

I know it's a logistical nightmare but I'm pretty sick of versing the other Southern Hemisphere counties all the time, I really wish we had a global season and we all got to verse everyone else way more consistently. That would take the shine of the World Cup though I suppose.

Anyway, go All Blacks!

Puroresu_kid · Nov 30, 2017

Super League - Wigan Warriors fan

Fav NRL team South Sydney Rabbitohs.

Expecting England to lose by 20 points on Saturday. Australia too good although England have a good defence they will be made to work extremely hard. Last 20 mins Australia will pull away.

Nomad Blue · Nov 30, 2017

schatuk said:
A lot to work through here. And an awful lot of politics.

I can't see either the players or the clubs being happy with an expansion to 7 teams and the inevitable lengthening of the tournament.

Do Georgia deserve a shot? IMO yes they do, based on performances over the last couple of years. Do Italy deserve to lose their spot permanently? Not really, so another approach is possibly called for.

Some sort of qualifiers for the sixth spot is probably a decent plan, with matches taking place during the prior autumn. I don't think there are enough genuine contenders for a full second division to be viable, but I'm interested in who others think could maybe have the resources to take part.

All in all it's a tricky one

A second division with some kind of promotion/relegation/playoff would never happen, there's too much risk involved for the top sides if they had a one-off crap season, there's too much money at stake. The only thing i could see happening is an expansion. Possibly to two conferences of 4 teams, the 4 home nations, and then a 'continental' conference with France, Italy, Georgia and someone like Germany (I think there's some Billionaire chucking money at rugby there) or Russia. Though can see lots of problems with a setup like that.

What I think needs to happen more regularly though, is ALL the tier one nations playing tier 2 nations (and the odd tier 3 as money maker for them) every year, even if they put out their B teams.

schatuk · Nov 30, 2017

Nomad Blue said:
What I think needs to happen more regularly though, is ALL the tier one nations playing tier 2 nations (and the odd tier 3 as money maker for them) every year, even if they put out their B teams.

Couldn't agree more. It's imperative that the Tier 1s make some effort towards directing income towards the lower tiers and making themselves available for fixtures is probably the least politically contentious way of doing it.

CeeCee · Nov 30, 2017

Puroresu_kid said:
Super League - Wigan Warriors fan

Fav NRL team South Sydney Rabbitohs.

Expecting England to lose by 20 points on Saturday. Australia too good although England have a good defence they will be made to work extremely hard. Last 20 mins Australia will pull away.

Yeah, I think it'll be a rerun of what happened in the group game.

Friend Besto · Nov 30, 2017

Interested to read ERA's thoughts on whether Fifita was stripped or was it a loose carry in the league semi final Tonga vs England

30yearsofhurt · Nov 30, 2017

The tackler was attempting a tackle not a strip.

Puroresu_kid · Nov 30, 2017

Friend Besto said:
Interested to read ERA's thoughts on whether Fifita was stripped or was it a loose carry in the league semi final Tonga vs England

If it went to the video ref I think the try would of been given. The tackler knocked the ball out of his hand.

Tonga should of won. They had enough ball and field position just didn't have the quality in the halves.

Still huge tournament for them and the game game needs to capitalize on moments like this. Never a better time to invest more money for rugby league in Tonga.

Metalix · Nov 30, 2017

SnakeyHips said:
Also, you guys think Georgia will join the Six Nations either replacing Italy or making it a Seven Nations?

I think they'll have to be allowed to play in some capacity - they're playing too well to ignore, have a Uefa Category 4 stadium, what's not to like? I heard there was a lot of hand-wringing going on over travelling fans potentially not wanting to travel to Tbilisi being "less desirable" than say your Paris or your Rome. Bah, build it and they will come!

Friend Besto said:
Interested to read ERA's thoughts on whether Fifita was stripped or was it a loose carry in the league semi final Tonga vs England

Thought the English tackler grabbed Fifita's arm rather than dislodging the ball myself but didn't get a great look...

gir · Nov 30, 2017

Subscribed, went to all Ireland's Autumn Internationals and I am very confident ahead of the 6N! Bring it on scrubs

CeeCee · Nov 30, 2017

Wales team to play South Africa:

SnakeyHips · Nov 30, 2017

CeeCee said:
Wales team to play South Africa:

Yay to starting with Faletau. Shame Liam isn't playing though.

gir · Nov 30, 2017

will be a tight match, but if wales can't beat a weak RSA team then they have no chance in the 6N. Think they will squeeze through now that Gatland is back

Deleted member 31133 · Nov 30, 2017

Hoping for a Bath victory on Saturday!

Here are my six nations predictions:

1) England, but doubt it'll be a grand slam
2) Ireland
3) Scotland - been looking really good, especially against Australia.
4) Wales
5) France
6) Italy

gir · Nov 30, 2017

Also, feel like bragging, won first round of the ticket lottery for tickets to see Ireland vs Scotland in the 6N. After the Scottish and Irish results this Autumn, think this match is going to be a cracker!!

CeeCee · Nov 30, 2017

gir said:
Also, feel like bragging, won first round of the ticket lottery for tickets to see Ireland vs Scotland in the 6N. After the Scottish and Irish results this Autumn, think this match is going to be a cracker!!

I am very jealous, would love to be there for that match!

gir · Nov 30, 2017

CeeCee said:
I am very jealous, would love to be there for that match!

What would you give me old mate?

Conrad Link · Nov 30, 2017

I'm not sure what would have been given if they went upstairs to look at the Tonga try, but if the ref said no try (which we have to assume he would do considering he didn't even bother checking it) would they have enough to overturn it? Probably not.

Surely you check it though lol, just in case there was something super obvious you missed. Either way it was an exciting last 10min to a rather boring rest of the game though!

CeeCee · Nov 30, 2017

gir said:
What would you give me old mate?

Anything you want :P

gosublime · Nov 30, 2017

SnakeyHips said:
You most likely will. I'm Welsh and it's good that we've started letting new players get a play but it's time for Gatland ball to stop. Be interesting to see what happens with SA this weekend. I'm really like Scotland atm since they've improved immensely. I'm kinda betting on them winning the next Six Nations.

Also, you guys think Georgia will join the Six Nations either replacing Italy or making it a Seven Nations?

I'm loving the way Scotland are playing at the moment - we won't win every match but we never did playing boring rugby, so what's the harm? Think we've got a nucleus of superb players - Hogg, Huw Jones, Watson, Gray, Russell and Price - who seem to enjoy playing rugby, even when they've done something stupid. Kind of like Toony.

As to Georgia, I've always said they should be allowed to play one of the AIs against the bottom team of the Six Nations - not for promotion or relegation yet but to see where they stand over a period of time - for example over a World Cup cycle.

gosublime · Dec 1, 2017

Big score for Glasgow - 40-16 against Cardiff. Helped by a sending off again though!

gir · Dec 1, 2017

was watching dragons vs ulster until the late late toy show came on, good match. Terrible handling and defending, but lots of tries

gosublime · Dec 1, 2017

Also good to see Edinburgh win 48-21 - Cockerill has been very good for them. Scottish rugby looking pretty okay at the moment!

Puroresu_kid · Dec 2, 2017

Australia starting to take control now.

CeeCee · Dec 2, 2017

England are fighting very hard and putting in a good performance, but I can't see them winning this.

Puroresu_kid · Dec 2, 2017

CeeCee said:
England are fighting very hard and putting in a good performance, but I can't see them winning this.

Wasting opportunities. Australia look tired but when England have have been in the danger zone they have put up the ball through bad passes or knock ons.

CeeCee · Dec 2, 2017

Puroresu_kid said:
Wasting opportunities. Australia look tired but when England have have been in the danger zone they have put up the ball through bad passes or knock ons.

Yeah, it's so so frustrating to watch.

MadAboutEwe · Dec 2, 2017

Scotland fans smelling themselves a bit too much at the moment. They have peaked, which is great for them but with Wales rebooting and Ireland doing a fair bit of tinkering, I don't think it's a given that Scotland will win in Cardiff and challenge for the title.

In terms of today, I'll take a scrappy win over the Boks. As always in the autumn we have been beset by injuries. Interesting to see what Parkes can do at this level.

I am fundamentally opposed to this 4th fixture.

Puroresu_kid · Dec 2, 2017

Thought Australia would be away by now. This is close, both defences very very good.

bobnowhere · Dec 2, 2017

What was that kick! They had two to the left.

CeeCee · Dec 2, 2017

England were so so close, but ultimately it's the not being clinical enough that has cost them.

MadAboutEwe · Dec 2, 2017

Astonishing lack of composure in their last 2 sets from England.

gir · Dec 2, 2017

Oh lads lads lads, league, really??

Puroresu_kid · Dec 2, 2017

If England had a better Number 7 they would of won. Gayle made some dumb decisions at key times.

gir said:
Oh lads lads lads, league, really??

Had to be one

gir · Dec 2, 2017

Not 100% sure if ireland has a league team, not even sure there is a 7s team

gosublime · Dec 2, 2017

MadAboutEwe said:
don't think it's a given that Scotland will win in Cardiff and challenge for the title.

Agree - it's a game that I can see going either way at the moment. I think a lot of the Scottish fans smelling of themselves (great phrase by the way, never heard it before) is a combination of the fact that we have been, quite honestly, dire for about a decade at least and that things are obviously changing for the better.

We messed up professionalism massively and played a very dour, boring brand of rugby that meant commentators always said we played with heart but lost games anyway. A few years ago, journalists were arguing that we shouldn't be in the Six Nations, there were joke articles about the last person alive who'd seen a Scottish try...it was awful.

We are better now and I honestly see us as being close to Wales - I think it'll be a tight match were I can see either team winning - my head says Wales due to home advantage.

The other aspect of the match is Gatland's Lions picks - a lot of Scottish fans want to beat Wales because of his choices for the tour - I don't think any of them were massively unfair (Launchbury not going is the one I actually think was an obviously poor choice but we had a surfeit of Locks) but it felt like Gatland used the English match to ignore our players, which he continued to do whilst on tour. That's why I think the Wales match is going to be bigged up by both sides - also that we all know that a win in the first match is important!

gosublime · Dec 2, 2017

Wales looking good at the moment - great first try! And second!

SA not looking good at all.

TheLinguist · Dec 2, 2017

That was almost a spectacular bottle job by the Welsh.

Rugby OT - First Try

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